@Bluegazer, as you noticed yourself that Grok gave an opposing answer later on. This is why I stopped interacting with it on esoteric matters. It’s a good research tool but can easily draw incorrect conclusions based on the data given. It cannot fill gaps in data with actual facts because it does not know what is truthful and what isn't.
So, my post was intended to inform and help bring some factual observations into the picture to your and other's benefit as India is a bit of an enigma to westerners and very few can provide an unbiased insider view. I'll expand now from my last post.
If I continue on the main theme of this thread, I think it’s important to not place too much emphasis on the Kiwifarmer article as the author does not understand the root causes of the said behaviour. To understand the Indian psyche, we need to take a detour to history a little bit first.
Around 1947, when the Britishers finally left India, the place was in complete tatters with no real economy or gold reserves. There was some roading and railways infrastructure that the Britishers built but even that needed to be developed further to support growth. Immediately after, riots followed between Hindus and Muslims which included mass rapes and beheadings, ultimately which led to a significant part of India being carved to create Pakistan, leaving people in both nations in a state of utter strife, poverty and strong grudges.
The Indian government that formed after took a lot of inspiration for USSR from various exchanges and visits etc and ended up implementing a very communist style form of governance disguised as democracy. This placed a lot of power in the hands of the public servants and govt bureaucrats which stifled all private entrepreneurship. So, for the 1st generation who graduated from colleges post-Independence, the only opportunity to earn a living was to apply for a public servant role. They could not borrow from banks or seek private investment to create a fertile ground for their ideas. And there was/is a strong competition and tough barriers to getting employed in the government sector. So, it was basically a dead-end for a majority of fresh graduates. The smart ones then headed to USA and never looked back, which created another avenue of success for the young aspiring Indians. I will come to this point later.
The government jobs promise lifelong security and pensions. India doesn't have a western style pension system as they can't afford it so, most retirees are on their own when they can't work anymore and at the mercy of their children to look after them. A government job helps immensely in such scenario and becomes the main life goal for the young people to chaise, constantly reinforced by their parents and the society. India also adopted USSR type education system with a very rigid and difficult curriculum which does not take into the account the day-to-day challenges people face. To do well in studies and graduate from such system is only achievable if you are prepared to sacrifice your social life, are good at rote learning and prepared to put in 12 hours a day into studies. Getting into a government job requires one to graduate with good scores and then also ace the entrance test, before being considered for a position. Suffice to say, majority of people who succeeded in this particular avenue have poor social skills, have no sense of hygiene or physical fitness and are someone you wouldn't want to marry your daughters to.
Government salaries in India were ok at the inception of the system and provided enough for someone to get into housing and support a family. But, as inflation happened, the salaries did not increase with CPI. The typical Indian government employee in most cases is actually a very poor person when only his/her salary is considered. And this, after the person had to make so many sacrifices to get the job in the first place. So, the person then does what is required to create avenues of money. Take an example - There is a government employee responsible for allocating funds for new road works. Since, they are on a pittance salary, there is temptation to dip into the money that they are controlling. So, firstly, they will release a tender for civil works to be done. The tender is advertised as a fair process but given only to either their relative who has setup a civil company for the said purpose or someone else who gives them a bundle of cash, handed over under the table, so to speak. Next, the contractor who gets the tender awarded will use poor or less material to build the road, but invoice for the full to get the funds. The contractor paid bribery to get the tender so, have to recover costs from somewhere. The road will collapse during the next monsoon season, and the cycle repeats again, this time funds allocated for road maintenance are siphoned.
In other cases, other government officers will use the power of their office to hold off on signing big projects unless handsome bribes are paid. Expand this out to all government sectors and the services they provide and what you get is a highly corrupt system where the core Infrastructure needs of the populace are never met. The roads are never built properly or maintained, lack of sewerage, public toilets, rubbish bins, rubbish collection, electricity, drinking water, river and canals maintenance - everything is broken in a fundamental way. But the government employee is milking it rather handsomely and building up posh houses. There are audits but the auditors are in the scheme too and get bribed into silence by the same operators in the system.
One hardly gets fired from a government job and there is no performance management. So, there is no onus or motivation to do their job properly and engage in societal good. If one tries to be good, then the system flushes them out pretty quickly or prevents career progression relegating the person to a low paying clerk job on a shitty desk in the corner. The latter also cops it badly from their family for being so honest and bring poverty and misery upon them. The system, by design, rewards laziness and reprimands honest hard workers. It’s a perfect place for the petty tyrants to congregate who enjoy unlimited power. It also ends up corrupting the good-minded workers due to survival needs. Regardless, the society suffers and works to avoid government contact and dependence as much as they can. Everything operates as a black economy which lowers the govt tax collection, forcing them to borrow for running the most basic services, which is never spent on improving those services, ultimately feeding the negative loop. Doesn't this sound similar to what's happening in Ukraine and a few places in USA!!
All of the above is well known to the Indian society, which is why government jobs, no matter how small with pittance salaries, are highly sought-after and young people give up everything to get there. Once someone makes it, they become instant heroes in their communities and hometowns. The relatives' attitudes change instantly, and enterprising fathers begin lining up outside the house to marry their daughters, no matter how ugly the person is. A life of utter comfort awaits with a subservient wife (i.e. a sexual slave) who dare not raise her voice to her husband. In such marriages, there is no romance, and bedtime is often short and quickly done with. Much of the Indian society has been shaped under this system where there is a lack of creativity and value for human affairs and relationships. A young boy (in particular), begins their life being constantly told to study hard and ignore everything else. he is expected to graduate with good scores and crack the exams to gain the government job. If he does not succeed then he is worthless, have brought shame to their parent’s name (not upholding their Izzat/honour) and might as well commit suicide. The latter part is not said out loud but impressed upon indirectly by the societal pressures.
Another avenue does exist, which has become lot more sought after in the last 25-30 years, which is to head overseas, preferably USA/Canada on temporary visas with a view to gain permanent residency i.e. the Green Card by whatever legal or illegal means i.e. jugad. Indian parents now expect their kids to aim for a government job first and if unsuccessful, take-out big loans and send them overseas as students. In the last 20 or so years, it’s not just students but young professionals have managed to sneak in off the back of outsourcing/offshoring boom. In the case of students, at least their moral compass would not be fully formed, and they could integrate better in the western culture, but the latter simply don't. They are already married with young children and well attached to their way of living.
But why do Indians act the way they do?
Let’s look at something as simple as maintaining hygiene and civic sense. Where I grew up, there was no sewerage and or rubbish collection. If we went into the town, there were no rubbish bins in the public spaces. So, I just learned to do what one would do - chuck it in in a corner public space where others have thrown litter too. I mean, I couldn't just carry it around in my pocket. I couldn't even take it home. In such public areas, generally, there would be some poor kids from the lower caste trawling through the rubbish eating all the food scraps and separating rest into metal/plastic etc which they could sell to a metal shop for some loose change. In a way, they would take care of the rubbish heap, and nothing would truly go to waste. At home, we would just lob it over the fence into the bush which was behind our home. Everyone just adapts and does one thing or another but ultimately, it’s all thrown into a public space. Overtime, this becomes quite normal and elevates to people just throwing stuff out the car windows whilst driving - there is some enjoyment and even a sense of exhilaration derived from such actions. Overtime, this behaviour becomes internalised, and people don't even take notice that they are doing it and polluting the roads and the public spaces. Now, what do you think is going to happen if these people end up in western countries and are out and about in the public spaces when no one is watching? Asking them about their civic sense is like scolding a dog for licking his behind publicly. The dog will be bewildered naturally.
Let’s look at the tribalism which is seemingly connected to honour. The tribalism does exist and is due to the various castes and classes within castes. Also, because, the Indian government and associated services including law enforcement are in full corruption mode, people then need to form and maintain strong tribal groups even in urban settings to protect themselves from harm, both from other groups and the government itself. This is OK and manageable when operating within India but when overseas, there is another factor that comes into play - racism; both internal and external. Having suffered under the Britishers for 200 years, Indians still harbour grudges and deep hatred for the white-skinned foreigners. This is partially the reason why white women will get stared at all day and likely raped in broad daylight in India with no repercussions for the perpetrators. The system will tacitly look the other way. So, when Indian professionals work abroad in white-dominated firms, they automatically assume that they will be subjected to racism, even if it doesn’t there. Any positive criticism of their work or behaviours will be seen as blatant racism too. This activates the tribal mode whereby they will wait for their day to come when they have worked their way to a higher position of power. Hence why, we hear stories of Indian managers stacking the ranks with more Indians, handing out contracts to Indian-owned firms and such. At a sub-conscious level, without even realising it so, they are playing out the revenge against the Britishers. There is a whole cultural and religion angle too where Indians think of their culture and religions as superior to western ones and by extension, consider the not so submissive white women to be not respect-worthy and there to be taken however way they deserve it, given their manners and way of dressing up etc.
Being brown-skinned and oppressed under the British rule have made Indians hate themselves too. The internal racism is rampant, and an Indian would rather be white, if some magical medical invention can get them there. This naturally leads to self-loathing and self-hatred, projected out as hatred of other Indians. Yes, despite the tribalism, Indians are not cohesive and resent each other. They will also play the victim card readily, similar to the blacks in USA. And that should explain some of the behaviours being observed.
Now, how does that play into the loosh economics and OP representation.
I believe C's stated that there is a 50:50 split between OPs and souled beings therefore, India will be expected to have at least 700 million OPs (out of 1.4 billion population). That's a huge number and in the company of so many OPs and burdened by a corrupt system, a lot of souled individuals will be completely asleep too, appearing as OPs or worse than OPs. That comment assumes that someone knows the tell-tale signs of an OP as I don't think I am an expert in these matters. The constant chaos of life in India assaults the senses to no end. You really have to be present there physically to understand what I mean by that. There is no respite for the mind and no real privacy of thoughts. There is some freedom due to lack of govt action and that has its benefits i.e. it prevents nanny state formation. There is real suffering of the body and mind i.e. lessons so, it’s a good place to wash karmic debt in a hurry. All of that amounts to abundance of organic loosh. The country is also heavy on vegetarianism which is a good thing for the 4D STS overlords. There is, I think, enough loosh being produced that it’s better for India to not play any role in geo-politics and world wars as those things can also unite Indians to a common action which would reduce the loosh-production.
Also, it’s probably not OP-central as one may posit and perhaps not as psycho-heavy as other nations like USA or UK. There is not a lot of power on offer for a psychopath to succeed so, their numbers would be slightly lower in India in terms of per capita. The tribalism has it benefits i.e. it forces a pseudo cohesion i.e. a community within the extended family members which, in turn, can buffer the toxic effects of loveless marriages on children growing and can also keep dangerous elements in check. Vigilante justice occurs regularly and that can be a good thing sometimes, in the absence of delayed justice by the system. But, overall, I sense that it has gotten more worse than better in the last 20 years and Indians under the tighter hand of Hinduism are heading to their doom.
I may write some more later but feel free to critique and ask any follow up questions.
So, my post was intended to inform and help bring some factual observations into the picture to your and other's benefit as India is a bit of an enigma to westerners and very few can provide an unbiased insider view. I'll expand now from my last post.
If I continue on the main theme of this thread, I think it’s important to not place too much emphasis on the Kiwifarmer article as the author does not understand the root causes of the said behaviour. To understand the Indian psyche, we need to take a detour to history a little bit first.
Around 1947, when the Britishers finally left India, the place was in complete tatters with no real economy or gold reserves. There was some roading and railways infrastructure that the Britishers built but even that needed to be developed further to support growth. Immediately after, riots followed between Hindus and Muslims which included mass rapes and beheadings, ultimately which led to a significant part of India being carved to create Pakistan, leaving people in both nations in a state of utter strife, poverty and strong grudges.
The Indian government that formed after took a lot of inspiration for USSR from various exchanges and visits etc and ended up implementing a very communist style form of governance disguised as democracy. This placed a lot of power in the hands of the public servants and govt bureaucrats which stifled all private entrepreneurship. So, for the 1st generation who graduated from colleges post-Independence, the only opportunity to earn a living was to apply for a public servant role. They could not borrow from banks or seek private investment to create a fertile ground for their ideas. And there was/is a strong competition and tough barriers to getting employed in the government sector. So, it was basically a dead-end for a majority of fresh graduates. The smart ones then headed to USA and never looked back, which created another avenue of success for the young aspiring Indians. I will come to this point later.
The government jobs promise lifelong security and pensions. India doesn't have a western style pension system as they can't afford it so, most retirees are on their own when they can't work anymore and at the mercy of their children to look after them. A government job helps immensely in such scenario and becomes the main life goal for the young people to chaise, constantly reinforced by their parents and the society. India also adopted USSR type education system with a very rigid and difficult curriculum which does not take into the account the day-to-day challenges people face. To do well in studies and graduate from such system is only achievable if you are prepared to sacrifice your social life, are good at rote learning and prepared to put in 12 hours a day into studies. Getting into a government job requires one to graduate with good scores and then also ace the entrance test, before being considered for a position. Suffice to say, majority of people who succeeded in this particular avenue have poor social skills, have no sense of hygiene or physical fitness and are someone you wouldn't want to marry your daughters to.
Government salaries in India were ok at the inception of the system and provided enough for someone to get into housing and support a family. But, as inflation happened, the salaries did not increase with CPI. The typical Indian government employee in most cases is actually a very poor person when only his/her salary is considered. And this, after the person had to make so many sacrifices to get the job in the first place. So, the person then does what is required to create avenues of money. Take an example - There is a government employee responsible for allocating funds for new road works. Since, they are on a pittance salary, there is temptation to dip into the money that they are controlling. So, firstly, they will release a tender for civil works to be done. The tender is advertised as a fair process but given only to either their relative who has setup a civil company for the said purpose or someone else who gives them a bundle of cash, handed over under the table, so to speak. Next, the contractor who gets the tender awarded will use poor or less material to build the road, but invoice for the full to get the funds. The contractor paid bribery to get the tender so, have to recover costs from somewhere. The road will collapse during the next monsoon season, and the cycle repeats again, this time funds allocated for road maintenance are siphoned.
In other cases, other government officers will use the power of their office to hold off on signing big projects unless handsome bribes are paid. Expand this out to all government sectors and the services they provide and what you get is a highly corrupt system where the core Infrastructure needs of the populace are never met. The roads are never built properly or maintained, lack of sewerage, public toilets, rubbish bins, rubbish collection, electricity, drinking water, river and canals maintenance - everything is broken in a fundamental way. But the government employee is milking it rather handsomely and building up posh houses. There are audits but the auditors are in the scheme too and get bribed into silence by the same operators in the system.
One hardly gets fired from a government job and there is no performance management. So, there is no onus or motivation to do their job properly and engage in societal good. If one tries to be good, then the system flushes them out pretty quickly or prevents career progression relegating the person to a low paying clerk job on a shitty desk in the corner. The latter also cops it badly from their family for being so honest and bring poverty and misery upon them. The system, by design, rewards laziness and reprimands honest hard workers. It’s a perfect place for the petty tyrants to congregate who enjoy unlimited power. It also ends up corrupting the good-minded workers due to survival needs. Regardless, the society suffers and works to avoid government contact and dependence as much as they can. Everything operates as a black economy which lowers the govt tax collection, forcing them to borrow for running the most basic services, which is never spent on improving those services, ultimately feeding the negative loop. Doesn't this sound similar to what's happening in Ukraine and a few places in USA!!
All of the above is well known to the Indian society, which is why government jobs, no matter how small with pittance salaries, are highly sought-after and young people give up everything to get there. Once someone makes it, they become instant heroes in their communities and hometowns. The relatives' attitudes change instantly, and enterprising fathers begin lining up outside the house to marry their daughters, no matter how ugly the person is. A life of utter comfort awaits with a subservient wife (i.e. a sexual slave) who dare not raise her voice to her husband. In such marriages, there is no romance, and bedtime is often short and quickly done with. Much of the Indian society has been shaped under this system where there is a lack of creativity and value for human affairs and relationships. A young boy (in particular), begins their life being constantly told to study hard and ignore everything else. he is expected to graduate with good scores and crack the exams to gain the government job. If he does not succeed then he is worthless, have brought shame to their parent’s name (not upholding their Izzat/honour) and might as well commit suicide. The latter part is not said out loud but impressed upon indirectly by the societal pressures.
Another avenue does exist, which has become lot more sought after in the last 25-30 years, which is to head overseas, preferably USA/Canada on temporary visas with a view to gain permanent residency i.e. the Green Card by whatever legal or illegal means i.e. jugad. Indian parents now expect their kids to aim for a government job first and if unsuccessful, take-out big loans and send them overseas as students. In the last 20 or so years, it’s not just students but young professionals have managed to sneak in off the back of outsourcing/offshoring boom. In the case of students, at least their moral compass would not be fully formed, and they could integrate better in the western culture, but the latter simply don't. They are already married with young children and well attached to their way of living.
But why do Indians act the way they do?
Let’s look at something as simple as maintaining hygiene and civic sense. Where I grew up, there was no sewerage and or rubbish collection. If we went into the town, there were no rubbish bins in the public spaces. So, I just learned to do what one would do - chuck it in in a corner public space where others have thrown litter too. I mean, I couldn't just carry it around in my pocket. I couldn't even take it home. In such public areas, generally, there would be some poor kids from the lower caste trawling through the rubbish eating all the food scraps and separating rest into metal/plastic etc which they could sell to a metal shop for some loose change. In a way, they would take care of the rubbish heap, and nothing would truly go to waste. At home, we would just lob it over the fence into the bush which was behind our home. Everyone just adapts and does one thing or another but ultimately, it’s all thrown into a public space. Overtime, this becomes quite normal and elevates to people just throwing stuff out the car windows whilst driving - there is some enjoyment and even a sense of exhilaration derived from such actions. Overtime, this behaviour becomes internalised, and people don't even take notice that they are doing it and polluting the roads and the public spaces. Now, what do you think is going to happen if these people end up in western countries and are out and about in the public spaces when no one is watching? Asking them about their civic sense is like scolding a dog for licking his behind publicly. The dog will be bewildered naturally.
Let’s look at the tribalism which is seemingly connected to honour. The tribalism does exist and is due to the various castes and classes within castes. Also, because, the Indian government and associated services including law enforcement are in full corruption mode, people then need to form and maintain strong tribal groups even in urban settings to protect themselves from harm, both from other groups and the government itself. This is OK and manageable when operating within India but when overseas, there is another factor that comes into play - racism; both internal and external. Having suffered under the Britishers for 200 years, Indians still harbour grudges and deep hatred for the white-skinned foreigners. This is partially the reason why white women will get stared at all day and likely raped in broad daylight in India with no repercussions for the perpetrators. The system will tacitly look the other way. So, when Indian professionals work abroad in white-dominated firms, they automatically assume that they will be subjected to racism, even if it doesn’t there. Any positive criticism of their work or behaviours will be seen as blatant racism too. This activates the tribal mode whereby they will wait for their day to come when they have worked their way to a higher position of power. Hence why, we hear stories of Indian managers stacking the ranks with more Indians, handing out contracts to Indian-owned firms and such. At a sub-conscious level, without even realising it so, they are playing out the revenge against the Britishers. There is a whole cultural and religion angle too where Indians think of their culture and religions as superior to western ones and by extension, consider the not so submissive white women to be not respect-worthy and there to be taken however way they deserve it, given their manners and way of dressing up etc.
Being brown-skinned and oppressed under the British rule have made Indians hate themselves too. The internal racism is rampant, and an Indian would rather be white, if some magical medical invention can get them there. This naturally leads to self-loathing and self-hatred, projected out as hatred of other Indians. Yes, despite the tribalism, Indians are not cohesive and resent each other. They will also play the victim card readily, similar to the blacks in USA. And that should explain some of the behaviours being observed.
Now, how does that play into the loosh economics and OP representation.
I believe C's stated that there is a 50:50 split between OPs and souled beings therefore, India will be expected to have at least 700 million OPs (out of 1.4 billion population). That's a huge number and in the company of so many OPs and burdened by a corrupt system, a lot of souled individuals will be completely asleep too, appearing as OPs or worse than OPs. That comment assumes that someone knows the tell-tale signs of an OP as I don't think I am an expert in these matters. The constant chaos of life in India assaults the senses to no end. You really have to be present there physically to understand what I mean by that. There is no respite for the mind and no real privacy of thoughts. There is some freedom due to lack of govt action and that has its benefits i.e. it prevents nanny state formation. There is real suffering of the body and mind i.e. lessons so, it’s a good place to wash karmic debt in a hurry. All of that amounts to abundance of organic loosh. The country is also heavy on vegetarianism which is a good thing for the 4D STS overlords. There is, I think, enough loosh being produced that it’s better for India to not play any role in geo-politics and world wars as those things can also unite Indians to a common action which would reduce the loosh-production.
Also, it’s probably not OP-central as one may posit and perhaps not as psycho-heavy as other nations like USA or UK. There is not a lot of power on offer for a psychopath to succeed so, their numbers would be slightly lower in India in terms of per capita. The tribalism has it benefits i.e. it forces a pseudo cohesion i.e. a community within the extended family members which, in turn, can buffer the toxic effects of loveless marriages on children growing and can also keep dangerous elements in check. Vigilante justice occurs regularly and that can be a good thing sometimes, in the absence of delayed justice by the system. But, overall, I sense that it has gotten more worse than better in the last 20 years and Indians under the tighter hand of Hinduism are heading to their doom.
I may write some more later but feel free to critique and ask any follow up questions.
