Tigersoap said:
Mada, would you please explain which scenes makes you think it could all be a dream ?
Thanks for this question, Tigersoap, it prompted me to look more closely at the film and compare it with the script, which I found here http://www(dot)imsdb(dot)com/scripts/American-Psycho(dot)html. All the script quotes that follow are taken from that source.
I briefly wondered if I ‘should’ have spent my time discussing something 'real' but I do think that film is a major mechanism for mind control and it is worth deeply dissecting some films, as a vaccine against control methods. Films featuring characters we are supposed to consider as psychopaths are increasingly common and I think we need to carefully weed out the truly psychopathic behaviours from the disinformation, within the same character if necessary.
A clue:
Bateman loses his cool and gets nervous very easily, even starting to sweat, especially when he is being interviewed by the detective. That is not behaviour associated with psychopaths, in my understanding.
The give-away scene:
After Bateman has literally chewed up one prostitute under the sheet, the second girl runs out of the apartment. Bateman, covered in blood, pursues her, naked but for tennis shoes, wielding a chainsaw. She hammers on the apartment doors, screaming. There is no-one else around and to me the scene has a strange atmosphere, like a dream. It is however very likely that no-one
would answer their door to a screaming woman, accompanied by the sound of a chainsaw, in the middle of the night.
As she is running down the stairs, Bateman drops the chainsaw down the stairwell, past several flights; it impales and kills the fleeing girl at the precise instant she is crossing the open space at the bottom of the well. Consider, what is the exact statistical likelihood of that happening?
The whole sequence is so
grand guignol that it stood out like a red flag for me. Bateman is the central character of the film, and one way to understand the psychological symbolism of a film is to consider the events in the film as a journey through the inner life of that character. Symbolically, the two prostitutes represent aspects of Bateman's inner feminine. The first he eats alive and the second he chases into the basement of his unconscious and kills with a weapon that has the shape of a phallus.
Tigersoap said:
Is it the one where Bateman comes back to the appartment of the guy he killed to discover everything has disappeared ?
That's another clue. It suggests that Bateman doesn't have a very strong grip on reality, and maybe never even went to the apartment, which is now up for sale.
Just before the final scene, we see Bateman's secretary leafing through his private journal and finding pictures of terrible violence, mostly to women, which in itself doesn't prove that Bateman actually did those things, or that he is a psychopath. But it does create, once again, the association between sexualised violence, murder and psychopathy.
Another clue:
In the closing scene, Bateman sees his lawyer in a bar; the lawyer does not know who Bateman is.
BATEMAN
So, Harold, did you get my message?
Carnes lights a cigarette, stalling. Then laughs.
CARNES
Jesus, Davis. Yes. That was hilarious. That was you,
wasn't it?
BATEMAN
(Waving smoke out of his face)
Yes, naturally.
CARNES
Bateman killing Owen and the escort girls? Oh that's
fabulous. That's rich...
Carnes, the lawyer, thinks Bateman is someone else called Davis, and that this Davis left the message about Bateman's killing spree as a joke.
CARNES
(Sighing)
Davis. I'm not one to bad-mouth anyone, your joke was amusing.
But come on, man, you had one fatal flaw: Bateman's such a dork,
such a boring, spineless lightweight, that I couldn't fully
appreciate it. I wasn't fooled for a second. Now, if you'd said
Price, or McDermott...Otherwise, it was amusing. Now, let's
have lunch or dinner or something. Hilarious, Davis. A killer.
Is that the way psychopaths are generally perceived? They are generally described as having a magnetic charisma, as being charming, glib and not easily forgotten.
BATEMAN
What are you talking about? Bateman is what?
CARNES
Oh Christ. He can barely pick up an escort girl, let
alone...what was it you said he did to her?
Male psychopaths don't seem to have that kind of difficulty with women, quite the opposite in fact.
BATEMAN
Now, Carnes, listen to me. Listen very, very carefully. I killed
Paul Owen and I liked it. I can't make myself any clearer
CARNES
But that's simply not possible.
[...]
BATEMAN
Why not, you stupid bastard?
Carnes stares at him.
CARNES
Because I had dinner with Paul Owen twice in
London...just ten days ago.
So, a killing that Bateman thought he had carried out could not have happened. That's what the script says, but, in the film, Carnes the lawyer actually says, 'Because I had dinner with Paul
Allen twice in London...just ten days ago.' So, not only does the lawyer not know who Bateman is, he thinks that Bateman is referring to Paul Allen. I only noticed this by comparing the script to the film.
So, there are clues suggesting Bateman's extremely fragile grip on reality, and there are also clues suggesting he really is psychopath, creating his own reality as he goes along. Confusion and disinformation.
BATEMAN (V.O.)
There are no more barriers to cross.
Do psychopaths really think in terms of barriers? They are 'reaction machines' that simply go for what they want; no thought of barriers. Bateman is talking about inner psychological barriers OSIT.
BATEMAN (V.O.)
all the mayhem I have caused and my utter indifference toward it,
This line is not in keeping with Bateman's nervousness in the presence of the detective. If he was truly indifferent, he would have handled the detective without so clearly being nervous.
BATEMAN (V.O.)
My pain is constant and sharp and I do not hope for a better
world for anyone.[...]
This sounds like he's referring to emotional pain and psychopaths do not feel emotional pain. But...
In fact I want my pain to be inflicted on
others.[...]
This does seem to be the attitude of psychopaths.
But even after admitting this, there is no catharsis.
Psychopaths do not want catharsis. This line suggests to me that Bateman wants catharsis, and presumably he wants it because he thinks he's in need of it.
Catharsis: The process of bringing repressed ideas and feelings to consciousness and expressing them. A release of emotional tension, as after an overwhelming experience, that restores or refreshes the spirit.
Psychopaths don't think like that. They have nothing to cathart, no emotions or tensions that need to be released, and they do not need to restore or refresh their spirit after a killing, for example.
I gain no deeper knowledge about myself, no new knowledge can be extracted
from my telling.
This does sound like a psychopath. They can't gain any deeper knowledge of themselves because there is no deeper self of which to gain knowledge.
The voice over at the end of the film nicely sums up all the ambiguities and contradictions that have gone before. I was left with the impression that Bateman is a complete nothing and the film describes his internal fantasy world that he has created to compensate for his inner emptiness. In my post I should have described it as such, instead of using the word' dream'. I apologise for my lack of clarity.
I do take your point though, Tigersoap, and I can see how you arrived at your conclusion. The film has an enigmatic, multi-layered quality, intended by the director, and this leaves it open to different interpretations. Perhaps this is one of those media productions which attempts to show psychopaths in a more favourable light. Or, all the subtle and confusing clues have been placed in this film with the intention of teaching people to look for subtle clues, to separate the milk from the water.
Tigersoap said:
The movie is constructed as to show how every one of these persons is so self-centered, shallow and not paying attention to what's outside of them that someone like Bateman will go unnoticed even if strong clues are given.
Definitely so. If you take the other characters as aspects of Bateman, they are all reflections of his essential shallowness. Since Bateman has eaten or killed his inner feminine he has lost access to his emotional life which could have shown him how empty and shallow he really is.
I haven't read the book, so can't comment on the film's faithfulness to the original story. But, film and novel are two very different art forms, and directors often change the essential meaning of their source material. So, it could be that the novel really does describe a true psychopath, but I still don't think that the film does. However, there is no doubt that American Psycho is enigmatic and confusing, just like life really, and one can only work out what is going on by paying close attention to all the clues presented to the viewer.
American Psycho has been structured as very subtle disinformation on the subject of psychopaths, leaving the viewer with the idea that, 'They're just like us, but damaged,' or, 'I can relate to that'. Everyone can relate to the need for catharsis at times, nervousness when being interviewed by a detective, and so on.
Confusing, deceptive and dangerous. OSIT.
**Edited to include a reply to Irini's post above**
Irini said:
I think my mask of sanity is about to slip
Anyone can say that - it doesn't mean or logically follow that the film is about a true psychopath.
Irini said:
I am including the trailer to make sure we talk of the same one.
American Psycho
Christian Bale as Patrick Bateman
Directed by Mary Harron
Based on the novel by Bret Easton Ellis
Lions Gate Films
. Again:
