Any recommended psychics/spiritual readers?

[anart]

Truth Seeker, the answer to this would be "yes", naturally, but do you know that particular "psychic" personally? You can warn one about such things as a generality, but how many people really listen, unless they experience something for themselves?

The point of a network, ona.alicia is to warn each other when there is danger or a predator in the ranks. In this case, there is danger. The feedback given on psychics is objectively true. Just because it disturbs your sensibilities does not mean it is not objectively true.

There are many people in this world who prefer a comfortable lie to an uncomfortable truth. Perhaps you are one of them?

I don't have to meet each psychic personally to know this - by their fruit you shall know them, and taking money for a nebulous service that does no objective good (in almost all cases) is a rotten fruit. Also - just because one charging psychic out of ten thousand might be objectively good or beneficial does not mean it's wise to see psychics for anything other than not so cheap entertainment.

 

[anart]

I would also like to point out there that there is a difference between 'judgment' and 'objective input'. You stating that 'judgments' have been made is a paramoralistic statement. It's totally inapplicable since this has nothing to do with judgment, it has to do with truth. Making such statements is also emotionally manipulative because no one wants to be 'a judger'. So, perhaps taking a look at this from another viewpoint might really benefit you?

 

[truth seeker]

Anart has asked some good questions and I think it would be greatly beneficial for you to consider them.

Truth Seeker, the answer to this would be "yes", naturally, but do you know that particular "psychic" personally? You can warn one about such things as a generality, but how many people really listen, unless they experience something for themselves?

I'd think that you wouldn't necessarily do it for the many but for the few. By your own admission, you would want to know so this knowledge would be helpful to you. Isn't that worth the 'trouble'?

Also, how many people have met others personally and still have difficulty discerning what is best? We do it all the time in our dealings with others. This is why we network here. Because many eyes can see better than one.

Know that there's no judgement here. No judgement on Ryan. No judgement on psychics. No judgement on you or anyone who has ever gone to a psychic. I'm not just spouting some catchphrase. It's true. What there is here is objective feedback based on the concerns for the well being of others.

Some people do seem to only learn through direct experience but for me personally, I'd much rather lessen the amount of hard knocks in this life as much as I can. :)

 

[mkrnhr]

Where i come from, the traditional psychics do not ask fro money. It is said that if they ask for money they may loose their gift, and that they may attract dire consequences upon them and their family. I guess that they instinctively understand the dynamics of psychic energy and not to mess with. So the issue would be, what kind of energetic interaction do one has with a psychic who asks for money? If one does not know all the process and what one may lose by ignorance, it is better not to take the risk until one has sufficient knowledge and may choose on solid grounds.

 

[ona.alicia]

Hmmm...OK...once again, I am simply stating that people could have given a more "objective input" about an experience with something in order to help another (i.e. did you have experience with it personally, and if so, how did it affect you?); however there were hints of what I perceived as "judgementality" in some statements. If anyone wants to view that as an opinion of someone being "emotionally manipulative", as Anart put it, by spouting "paramoralistic statements", I refuse to get angry about this, as this is also an opinion. I agree networking is useful; there are many dangers in this world to negotiate...no qualms with that. I think having a forum such as this is wonderful. I think most are also in agreement that going to psychics is usually not ultimately beneficial to anyone's development, by these discussion posts. No, stating this doesn't disturb my "sensibilities" though as you know, I didn't agree totallly with the way some of these ideas were presented...and Anart, if I preferred, "a comfortable lie to an uncomfortable truth", I would not be reading this material or be on this board. What I am finding out is that when the way perceive something differs in a way that challenges the statements of some, it is not appreciated. That diminishes the individuality of how posts are interpreted, does it not? That is also beneficial to consider...

O.A.

 

[ona.alicia]

Sorry~~when the way I perceive... :P

*Coffee Break*


O.A.

 

[ona.alicia]

Where i come from, the traditional psychics do not ask fro money. It is said that if they ask for money they may loose their gift, and that they may attract dire consequences upon them and their family. I guess that they instinctively understand the dynamics of psychic energy and not to mess with. So the issue would be, what kind of energetic interaction do one has with a psychic who asks for money? If one does not know all the process and what one may lose by ignorance, it is better not to take the risk until one has sufficient knowledge and may choose on solid grounds.

Mkrnhr,

You make a great point; I have heard this myself, and I have also read that psychic could charge a "reasonable" sum of money, if this was the only way one made their living. This whole discussion got me thinking about Edgar Cayce. I read that when he tried to charge money for his readings, it gave him stomach pains and headaches. However, I also read somewhere else that he made money doing his "trance channellings". I have read about him a little through the years and know that he was considered fairly accurate and well respected in his field. Does anyone know how he made his living if it wasn't through his channellings?

O.A.

 

[Mountain Crown]

[quote author=ona.alicia]We all have our own realities and think ours is the correct one[/quote]

You may wish to examine the validity of this meme and how it affects your thinking, it weakens the ability to distinguish critical thinking from judgmental attitude.

 

[truth seeker]

Hey OA,

You said that you refuse to get angry about this. This suggests that you're fighting against feelings of anger. What has upset you?

It seems that you may feel that Ryan was ganged up on and have taken that personally - almost as if you feel that you were ganged up on. Is this the case?

 

[Nawd]

What is being answered is a question, and the answer to the original quesion is in this thread.

If you feel judged, or feel some (including myself) judged a profession or a gift, then that has also already been covered in this thread.

I guess at this point if you feel hurt in some way, or somewhat offended, or feel the need to 'stick up' for your views - maybe you can form another series of questions to yourself first, of why you are being offended in some way, or why you take this information personally? It's up to you for yourself, as always is the case and if you share your discoveries, we will all learn together.

And getting angry is ok to, so is 'trying to not be angry.' You are reacting for some reason, and that could be a good reason to explore your situation more if it's worth it for you.

Or as you stated, "that is also beneficial to consider...."

Edited for: a misspelling

Hmmm...OK...once again, I am simply stating that people could have given a more "objective input" about an experience with something in order to help another (i.e. did you have experience with it personally, and if so, how did it affect you?); however there were hints of what I perceived as "judgementality" in some statements. If anyone wants to view that as an opinion of someone being "emotionally manipulative", as Anart put it, by spouting "paramoralistic statements", I refuse to get angry about this, as this is also an opinion. I agree networking is useful; there are many dangers in this world to negotiate...no qualms with that. I think having a forum such as this is wonderful. I think most are also in agreement that going to psychics is usually not ultimately beneficial to anyone's development, by these discussion posts. No, stating this doesn't disturb my "sensibilities" though as you know, I didn't agree totallly with the way some of these ideas were presented...and Anart, if I preferred, "a comfortable lie to an uncomfortable truth", I would not be reading this material or be on this board. What I am finding out is that when the way perceive something differs in a way that challenges the statements of some, it is not appreciated. That diminishes the individuality of how posts are interpreted, does it not? That is also beneficial to consider...

O.A.

 

[anart]

Hmmm...OK...once again, I am simply stating that people could have given a more "objective input" about an experience with something in order to help another (i.e. did you have experience with it personally, and if so, how did it affect you?); however there were hints of what I perceived as "judgementality" in some statements. If anyone wants to view that as an opinion of someone being "emotionally manipulative", as Anart put it, by spouting "paramoralistic statements", I refuse to get angry about this, as this is also an opinion.

It's actually an observation, not an opinion. Are you sure you're not angry about it, because it reads as if you are.

I agree networking is useful; there are many dangers in this world to negotiate...no qualms with that. I think having a forum such as this is wonderful. I think most are also in agreement that going to psychics is usually not ultimately beneficial to anyone's development, by these discussion posts. No, stating this doesn't disturb my "sensibilities" though as you know, I didn't agree totallly with the way some of these ideas were presented...and Anart, if I preferred, "a comfortable lie to an uncomfortable truth", I would not be reading this material or be on this board. What I am finding out is that when the way perceive something differs in a way that challenges the statements of some, it is not appreciated.

That's not true at all. If it weren't for a vast number of different viewpoints, we'd never get anywhere at all. However, ALL that matters here on this forum are facts - data - the truth. We approach that in a myriad of ways, but that is always the key and the goal. Perhaps reading the thread on Opinions might help clarify?

That diminishes the individuality of how posts are interpreted, does it not? That is also beneficial to consider...

O.A.

Yes, I think reading the thread on Opinions might help you understand a bit more.

 

[ona.alicia]

Hi All,

I took Truth Seeker's, Dawn's and Anart's advice...I printed out this thread, stepped back, ate breakfast, re-read the thread as well as the suggested material, "Opinions".

To begin with, when I posted a reply to Ryan, I realize where I went wrong when I verbalized (so to speak) my "observation" that the psychic himself and the profession was being judged or "slammed" as I put it, instead of the sharing of an individual experiences of encounters with psychics. Due to that (my) statement, this whole avalanche of nonsense started; first, when Obyvatel asked to clarify what I meant by slammed. That set the tone for this discussion; I was simply stating to Obyvatel what I meant. R had stated in the initial post that he didn't know the psychic, but felt he was helpful and wanted to share his site. First thing Anart states, out of the gate:

"Hi AdonRy, your post sounds a lot like an advertisement, just so you know."

Now, I have no idea how Ryan felt about this, but that opinion or "observation", as Anart says it is, kind of put me off, as Ryan had already stated that he didn't even know the guy nor was he being compensated for mentioning it. Maybe Ryan shouldn't have mentioned it on the forum, but the way it was initially addressed put me on the defensive as I read it. That's when I noticed that SOME people were further questioning the psychic's credibility, making broad statements instead of sharing personal experiences as to why they think using a psychic is good/bad or whatever, and why they do or don't. I didn't want to blow off Obyvatel and that is why I answered, even though I didn't want to pursue this as far as it went. I was only sharing my personal experience that I have gone to psychics in the past and why I finally decided not to any longer participate.

All of a sudden, I'm having "opinions" and every one else is having "observations" and apparently my discernment is not valid because my words are not "objective input"; instead they are "paramoralistic statements", which is yet just ANOTHER "observation". Really?! If I am fighting against feelings of anger, as Truth Seeker theorizes, or "somewhat offended" as Dawn says, could this be why? What this boils down to is: I was never trying to make this thread about me, and was only answering Ryan's post. Simple as that. However I have and am taking everyone's observations and recommendations seriously, and am attempting to realize what is missing in ME that has precipitated these observations in others to begin with. Thank you for your input.

O.A.

 

[anart]

Hi All,

I took Truth Seeker's, Dawn's and Anart's advice...I printed out this thread, stepped back, ate breakfast, re-read the thread as well as the suggested material, "Opinions".

To begin with, when I posted a reply to Ryan, I realize where I went wrong when I verbalized (so to speak) my "observation" that the psychic himself and the profession was being judged or "slammed" as I put it, instead of the sharing of an individual experiences of encounters with psychics. Due to that (my) statement, this whole avalanche of nonsense started; first, when Obyvatel asked to clarify what I meant by slammed. That set the tone for this discussion; I was simply stating to Obyvatel what I meant. R had stated in the initial post that he didn't know the psychic, but felt he was helpful and wanted to share his site. First thing Anart states, out of the gate:

"Hi AdonRy, your post sounds a lot like an advertisement, just so you know."

Now, I have no idea how Ryan felt about this, but that opinion or "observation", as Anart says it is, kind of put me off, as Ryan had already stated that he didn't even know the guy nor was he being compensated for mentioning it. Maybe Ryan shouldn't have mentioned it on the forum, but the way it was initially addressed put me on the defensive as I read it. That's when I noticed that SOME people were further questioning the psychic's credibility, making broad statements instead of sharing personal experiences as to why they think using a psychic is good/bad or whatever, and why they do or don't. I didn't want to blow off Obyvatel and that is why I answered, even though I didn't want to pursue this as far as it went. I was only sharing my personal experience that I have gone to psychics in the past and why I finally decided not to any longer participate.

All of a sudden, I'm having "opinions" and every one else is having "observations" and apparently my discernment is not valid because my words are not "objective input"; instead they are "paramoralistic statements", which is yet just ANOTHER "observation". Really?! If I am fighting against feelings of anger, as Truth Seeker theorizes, or "somewhat offended" as Dawn says, could this be why? What this boils down to is: I was never trying to make this thread about me, and was only answering Ryan's post. Simple as that. However I have and am taking everyone's observations and recommendations seriously, and am attempting to realize what is missing in ME that has precipitated these observations in others to begin with. Thank you for your input.

O.A.

But, you see, 'O.A.' you are still missing the point. The thread didn't turn into something about you. Your reactions to the input you received did that, but only for you. What the point of all of the above is (all that you took offense to) is that people who charge money for psychic services are, by and large, doing so for the money and are no more insightful than anyone else who knows how to cold-read a person. Most professional salesmen are so good at that they rival your average 'psychic'.

If you re-read the initial post in this thread without your emotional input (your reaction) then you will see that it DOES read like an advertisement. My stating that was the statement of a fact and nothing more. It was not a personal attack, yet you took it as one. You appear to get personally offended rather easily, which, while not uncommon, isn't very helpful when attempting to communicate openly with other people. Let me state that again, so it is clear - what I wrote to Ryan was not a personal attack in any way whatsoever.

In fact, if you took your personal emotional responses out of this thread, you'd see that it is not a 'heated' thread in any way whatsoever. A person asked for input, they were given input and that's that. You were offended by that input, and thus read everything else with that same emotional tone and off we went.

It is, at the end of the day, an enormous waste of energy to be so personally offended by taking the things people write in the most offensive way possible when they are not meant that way.

 

[ona.alicia]

But, you see, 'O.A.' you are still missing the point. The thread didn't turn into something about you. Your reactions to the input you received did that, but only for you. What the point of all of the above is (all that you took offense to) is that people who charge money for psychic services are, by and large, doing so for the money and are no more insightful than anyone else who knows how to cold-read a person. Most professional salesmen are so good at that they rival your average 'psychic'.

If you re-read the initial post in this thread without your emotional input (your reaction) then you will see that it DOES read like an advertisement. My stating that was the statement of a fact and nothing more. It was not a personal attack, yet you took it as one. You appear to get personally offended rather easily, which, while not uncommon, isn't very helpful when attempting to communicate openly with other people. Let me state that again, so it is clear - what I wrote to Ryan was not a personal attack in any way whatsoever.

In fact, if you took your personal emotional responses out of this thread, you'd see that it is not a 'heated' thread in any way whatsoever. A person asked for input, they were given input and that's that. You were offended by that input, and thus read everything else with that same emotional tone and off we went.

It is, at the end of the day, an enormous waste of energy to be so personally offended by taking the things people write in the most offensive way possible when they are not meant that way.

Hi Anart and all,

I wanted to apologize for for any irritation or offense I may of caused anyone due to this thread and do agree that it is an enormous waste of energy as well as unhelpful to feel personally offended when attempting to communicate. I never thought that my statements were the only ones that mattered; however I was bothered by the way they were qualified by others. However, I'm not quite as offended as you may perceive, and am not taking everything the most offensive way possible. Like I stated before, I am considering this a learning experience and am treating your input as such. Thank you for your help...

Regards,

O.A.

 

[anart]

I wanted to apologize for for any irritation or offense I may of caused anyone due to this thread and do agree that it is an enormous waste of energy as well as unhelpful to feel personally offended when attempting to communicate. I never thought that my statements were the only ones that mattered; however I was bothered by the way they were qualified by others. However, I'm not quite as offended as you may perceive, and am not taking everything the most offensive way possible. Like I stated before, I am considering this a learning experience and am treating your input as such. Thank you for your help...

Regards,

O.A.

That's good to hear. We often are surprised at the way our comments are taken and understood by others, so it's always - always - educational to find out how we come across - most especially when we disagree with the impression others have of what we're doing/saying.