Chang's issues with female police officers

[Athena]

The paragraph that has everyone fired up, was me relating an incident that took place sixteen years prior to my dealings with this officer.I was merely attempting to offer some background that I thought was relevant to this one officer (BTW, I've never met her). The msg I was trying to convey existed without the rape issue, and it was included only because it was part of the story. I wish I hadn't included it now, because somehow, its taken on a life of its own. I honestly don't see how its inclusion makes me 'callous'. I was repeating what was in the newspaper, although I left out some of the more gruesome parts, and paraphrased it, within the parenthesis. I don't, in any way, condone violence, although I'm starting to wonder if I've somehow become blind to its effect, due to all the violence I've been exposed to, and forced to experience.

First off, her getting raped is not relevant to your story ,to understanding her competency as a P.O., nor to anyone able to think logically and objectively. But, it does seem to be relevant to you which is says much about your thinking and perception of reality (women in particular). Also, there is the fact that you selectively, deliberately, paraphrased the details of the incident in order to support your perception of this woman. You might want to read the trial minutes Laura just posted and see if you can spot the glaring differences between your story and the the official one.

Now, unless I am completely mentally retarded, that second bold-faced line up there seems to be two contradictory statements separated by a comma, and another insight into your inner landscape.

Police, like employees in other professions, are often fired when they disobey company policy. Evidently I could have written that paragraph differently, but it is what it is, me relating events that I read in a newspaper. As I mentioned before, I've never met her, and only spoke with her once, for less than ten minutes. I do have ill feelings towards her, because of her inability to do her job, and how that has effected me. I would feel the same towards a male officer, had he performed so poorly.
Chang

Dude, you seem to have a vendetta against a woman whom, by your own admission, you have never even met! You have not offered any proof of any real failings of hers, only what you consider to be flaws. And that takes us back to your intro post:

[quote author=Chang]
Somewhere along the line, I met this young lady who sounded great, listening to all her abilities and stuff, but after awhile I found out it was all in her head. She had some serious problems. For starters, she was raped by her uncle when she was 13, or 14. Its sad, she really had some wonderful qualities, and she was really quite intelligent. But evidently rape really takes a toll on a person, especially a youngster. She was a bit more promiscuous than I could handle, so we separated, and got back together more times than I care to count. She was a pathological liar, and man, DO I HATE LIARS![/quote]

You really do seem to disdain rape victims, which is extremely pathological. What is up with that?

 

[Chang]

Laura,

"If I was so inclined, young and in good health, I think I'd make one heckuva police person! Especially if, in this theoretical situation, I'm allowed to keep all I know about psychopathy in my head!"


I completely agree, as a matter of fact, at this very moment I believe you would blow the doors off of at LEAST 90% of the officers I've met here in Maine.

And in response to the article you found about Trooper Gardner's attack, that was pretty close, as it had some of the same wording of the original newspaper clip. As a matter of fact, the description of her attack was probably taken from the clip I first read, but there was a bit more about that episode, and non of the legal wranglings.

But while reading it, I remembered why I first brought it up. Her attacker was a sociopath, but she failed to recognize it. She suffered the consequences. The same thing happened to her when she spoke to my neighbor the sociopath, he schmoozed her, but it's ME that is STILL suffering from her mistake. That was the main point I wanted to make. Obviously I failed...

Thanks So Much For Your Time!!!

Chang

 

[anart]

But while reading it, I remembered why I first brought it up. Her attacker was a sociopath, but she failed to recognize it. She suffered the consequences.

You are still blaming the rape victim! It's actually unbelievable... At this point I'm beginning to wonder if you are capable of empathy for other human beings or if you are only concerned about yourself and your own troubles?

 

[Path27]

To extend what anart quoted above, this is what stood out to me when I read this just now:

But while reading it, I remembered why I first brought it up. Her attacker was a sociopath, but she failed to recognize it. She suffered the consequences. The same thing happened to her when she spoke to my neighbor the sociopath, he schmoozed her, but it's ME that is STILL suffering from her mistake. That was the main point I wanted to make.

What the what?

Also, you seemed to be really happy to get some attention from Laura, but you didn't acknowledge any of the other recent posts that others have written. I think Athena asked a really good question here:

You really do seem to disdain rape victims, which is extremely pathological. What is up with that?

Seems like a good question to me -- what's going on there?

 

[Chang]

Re: Chang's issues with female police officers (Anart)

Anart,

"Your posts in this thread certainly indicate that you have a lower opinion of women than you do of men. Otherwise, why mention gender at all?"

I don't think I have a lower opinion of women than men. My original statement was Females Don't Make Good Cops! After reading one of Gonzo's thoughtful posts, I believe I stated that I had been mistaken, that there were SEVERAL male cops that really sucked as well. I think my initial feeling that females made bad cops, was because of what Trooper Gardners incompetence has done to me. She let someone that attempted to MURDER ME, ON MY FRONT LAWN, IN FRONT OF MY WIFE, get away with it. She found no wrong-doing on his part. As a matter of fact, I spoke to one of the rescue workers that was present when Vicky went to their house to question them. The rescue worker was NOT a law officer, but around the same age as Vicky, and when I spoke to this rescue worker, asking if anything seemed awry, the reply was that it was too obvious to miss. And just for the record, the rescue worker was female, and I really like her.

" P.S. If someone who was supposed to protect you failed miserably, involving an incident that was nothing short of Attempted Murder, would you tend to respect this person, or have feelings of contempt?

I wouldn't mention their gender, nor would I blame it on their gender. You did. See the point?"

You didn't answer my question, and there was NO mention of gender in that sentence. Do you see MY point?

 

[ScarletBegonias]

But while reading it, I remembered why I first brought it up. Her attacker was a sociopath, but she failed to recognize it. She suffered the consequences.

You are still blaming the rape victim! It's actually unbelievable... At this point I'm beginning to wonder if you are capable of empathy for other human beings or if you are only concerned about yourself and your own troubles?

I'm virtually speechless, but I've been following this thread and would like to speak up. Chang, you generalized cops in the "need help finding an article" thread even though cops helped John Clarke write the book that you thanked me for typing the quote to. Now you've generalized women based off of your own personal observations and some study one person did.

Then in this comment above you appear to be claiming that the cop should've had some magical powers to be able to spot out psychopaths even when Dr. Robert Hare HIMSELF says it's difficult to spot psychopaths after decades of research and writing books. It appears to me that you must have done extremely little to no research on psychopathy so far or else you would not have made this statement.

But "she suffered the consequences" because "she failed to recognize it." I find these statements extremely offensive on behalf of myself and everyone with empathy.

 

[anart]

Re: Chang's issues with female police officers (Anart)

Anart,

"Your posts in this thread certainly indicate that you have a lower opinion of women than you do of men. Otherwise, why mention gender at all?"

I don't think I have a lower opinion of women than men. My original statement was Females Don't Make Good Cops!

Are you aware that the above two sentences directly contradict each other?

It's quite remarkable, actually, the way you twist things to remain 'right' and refuse to even try to see yourself as you are.

You didn't answer my question, and there was NO mention of gender in that sentence. Do you see MY point?

No, Chang, I don't. I see a man with some serious problems in this thinking and his perception who is very willing to blame other people not only for their tragedies but, also, for his own troubles. I see a man who is apparently incapable of seeing anyone other than himself and who is focused only and always on his own troubles, and if he can get in a insult in on women while he's at it, he's more than happy to do so. I see a man who takes no responsibility for the troubles in his life, blaming everyone else for their attitude, when his attitude is terrible. That's what I see. It's actually quite chilling.

 

[EGVG]

Re: Chang's issues with female police officers (Anart)

Anart,

"Your posts in this thread certainly indicate that you have a lower opinion of women than you do of men. Otherwise, why mention gender at all?"

I don't think I have a lower opinion of women than men. My original statement was Females Don't Make Good Cops!

Are you aware that the above two sentences directly contradict each other?

It's quite remarkable, actually, the way you twist things to remain 'right' and refuse to even try to see yourself as you are.

You didn't answer my question, and there was NO mention of gender in that sentence. Do you see MY point?

No, Chang, I don't. I see a man with some serious problems in this thinking and his perception who is very willing to blame other people not only for their tragedies but, also, for his own troubles. I see a man who is apparently incapable of seeing anyone other than himself and who is focused only and always on his own troubles, and if he can get in a insult in on women while he's at it, he's more than happy to do so. I see a man who takes no responsibility for the troubles in his life, blaming everyone else for their attitude, when his attitude is terrible. That's what I see. It's actually quite chilling.

Something to add, he seems not get what he's saying, and what you are saying, maybe he can't see what the important subject is here. I mean look at the tittle of the thread, he is clueless!! Really chilling.

 

[Buddy]

...if I've learned anything, its that police are not required to be intelligent. They pretty much ask that they have a High School Diploma, or a G.E.D. and that they can do 30 push-ups without busting a major artery. If they have a pissy attitude, their supervisors see that as a plus. And, I can tell you from personal experience, that females do NOT make good police officers. We've had to deal with three female State Troopers, and each one is less competent than the next. As a matter of fact, the oldest, who somehow became a Sgt, is absolutely brain dead.

Don't know what it's like anywhere else but in South Georgia it's different. I am a certified police officer and have been since 1991 and have my registered PBLE number to prove it. Though I haven't worked in the field for over 17 years, it's not something you lose unless convicted of a felony.

Where I come from, police ARE required to be intelligent because an officer has to be able to speak and relate equally well to drunks as well as the 'smartest' white-collar professionals. Officers are also required to think for themselves because when they go to court, judges tend to give less slack to a trained police officer who "knows better" than to an ordinary citizen. I personally had to have a high school diploma and clean criminal record and I'm certain that applies to most of them. As for physical training, there was calisthenics and such, but I personally had not run/jogged so much in my life since my boot camp days as I did at the police academy.

Pissy attitudes are not requirements for the position. Instructors are allowed pissy attitudes towards recruits, but as a military-type hierarchy with matching ranks, such attitudes are not well tolerated from the lower levels.

Women make excellent police officers. If they can pass the minimums like anyone else, they graduate as sharp-shooters on the range, PPCT (pressure point and control tactics) and monadnock (police baton) certified and with other accomplishments and awards to their credit. They are also generally the most empathetic and helpful officers I've ever known - to citizens as well as "the brethern".

Admittedly, some male and female officers come out of the academy all gung-ho and have to be reined in by their agency when they report for duty, but most graduate with a profound new respect for people, procedures and "the law" in general.

That's the two main types of police officers that I have experience of and I don't recognize your description in anyone I've ever known or heard about.

 

[Chang]

Re: Chang's issues with female police officers (Athena)

Athena,

You stated:

"First off, her getting raped is not relevant to your story".

Yes, and if you re-read the first paragraph of your post, you will see that I said my point existed WITHOUT the rape incident.

"Now, unless I am completely mentally retarded, that second bold-faced line up there seems to be two contradictory statements separated by a comma, and another insight into your inner landscape"

So I repeat something out of a newspaper, opine that it sounds 'over the top', and then reveal that it was in a newspaper, so I SUPPOSE it could have happened. I think you might be reading too much into that. I'm not saying you're mentally retarded, but YOU DID BRING IT UP. That could be interpreted as an insight into YOUR inner landscape. Do you actually read the stuff you write?

"Dude, you seem to have a vendetta against a woman whom, by your own admission, you have never even met! You have not offered any proof of any real failings of hers, only what you consider to be flaws."

Babe, I don't think I have a vendetta against anyone, but I'm not real pleased with some of the incompetent law officers that have inadvertently caused me much pain and suffering. Is it OK that I feel that way? A psychologist said it was, would you like his number? Maybe he could address that 'mental retardation' issue you mentioned about yourself.

And I clearly stated I never met her. I spoke to her for ten minutes, and realized she was not very intelligent. Then, later on, I waited two and a half months for her to figure out if a sociopath was guilty or not. She said he wasn't. It took a judge 40 minutes to find that she was wrong. Does that tell you anything? I'll type a little slower if you'd like.

"You really do seem to disdain rape victims, which is extremely pathological. What is up with that?"

I have nothing but sympathy for rape victims. If I said anything close to that, please show me. You may have a reading comprehension issue to go along with that mental retardation thing you mentioned.

"Somewhere along the line, I met this young lady who sounded great, listening to all her abilities and stuff, but after awhile I found out it was all in her head. She had some serious problems. For starters, she was raped by her uncle when she was 13, or 14. Its sad, she really had some wonderful qualities, and she was really quite intelligent. But evidently rape really takes a toll on a person, especially a youngster. She was a bit more promiscuous than I could handle, so we separated, and got back together more times than I care to count. She was a pathological liar, and man, DO I HATE LIARS!"

I met a lady who told me a lot of things about herself that I later found out were false. She had some problems. SHE knew that, her COUNSELOR knew that, and made a special appointment for me to attend a session with her so he could tell me that. She (and her counselor) told me she was raped. My next words are 'ITS SAD, SHE REALLY HAD SOME WONDERFUL QUALITIES, AND SHE WAS QUITE INTELLIGENT" Please tell me Athena, does that really sound like I have disdain for rape victims? I really felt sorry for her, she had been robbed, and part of her whole life was taken from her. If that sounds like I have disdain for rape victims, then I might suggest you pursue that mental retardation issue YOU mentioned. I then mention that she was promiscuous, which is not uncommon for victims of rape, would you agree? I mention that she was a pathological liar. Do you think I made that up? I'll get you her phone number if you think I'm lying. I do hate liars. I hope thats OK with you.

If I sound upset, that would be because I am. You are twisting things around to suit you're warped little idea's about me, that are NOT true. Do you disdain men?

 

[Chang]

Re: Chang's issues with female police officers (Anart)

Anart,

"You are still blaming the rape victim! It's actually unbelievable... At this point I'm beginning to wonder if you are capable of empathy for other human beings or if you are only concerned about yourself and your own troubles?"

I am blaming a cop that I feel is incompetent. Other police officers see it, and indirectly, a DISTRICT COURT JUDGE proved it. Why is it that you can't see it?

Do YOU hate men?

 

[anart]

Re: Chang's issues with female police officers (Anart)

Anart,

"You are still blaming the rape victim! It's actually unbelievable... At this point I'm beginning to wonder if you are capable of empathy for other human beings or if you are only concerned about yourself and your own troubles?"

I am blaming a cop that I feel is incompetent. Other police officers see it, and indirectly, a DISTRICT COURT JUDGE proved it. Why is it that you can't see it?

No, that is not what you are doing. I and the others here can see very clearly what you are doing. You cannot. What does that tell you?

Do YOU hate men?

Not in any way, shape or form. I do, however, have issues with people who come to this forum and behave in a pathological manner, as you are doing. Deflection and accusing others of what you, yourself, are doing is pathological. Your selection and substitution of data in your responses in this thread is also pathological. Your stark contradiction in consecutive sentences is also a semantic behavior noted in pathologicals. In short, there are a lot of clues in this thread that evidence pathological behavior on your part.

I'm not saying that you are definitely pathological, but I am saying that your behavior is. With each post, it becomes more clear - blaming others, absolutely zero ability to self-examine or consider that you are wrong. It's all right here in black and white.

So, the question becomes, are you willing to look at that or not? If not, this forum is not for you and you would be much better off spending your time elsewhere.

 

[Gonzo]

Chang,

Your predator and your ego are beating you. Will you take a stand? Allow me to throw a bone to your wounded ego crying out for validation in the hope you can tuck it away for a bit and see a little more clearly.

It is horrible that you experienced what you did at the hands of not only pathological neighbours but the very person you trusted to protect you. On top of that, you have received many other wound that, to this day, are controlling you. I feel for you. But it's time you lay down your load and start healing. You need to let the pain go before you can start healing.

Take a breath. Exhale.

If you could re-read your initial statements you will see where you revealed certain aspects of your thinking. The predator, that will do anything to remain hidden, is telling you that you messed up, you put your foot in your mouth again. Don't fall for it. Look objectively at what you have written. Try to see it from the perspective of those who don't know you. Find the areas that reveal a horrific truth about yourself and sit with it. Feel it burn. Pay attention to your thoughts but don't interact with them, just observe. Note whatever sensations occur. Acknowledge them without dwelling on them. Breathe.

You recognized a few areas but gave them casual mention instead of noticing their deeper ramifications. What is being asked of you is extremely difficult but equally rewarding.

Can you find the trail of the predator, the areas he wanted you to justify? Those are the areas that require your attention. You know you're on to something when the predator makes you feel hurt and gives you justifications (they just don't understand, I didn't express myself clearly, are some of my predator's favorite lines).

We all have programs and we are here to expose and neutralize them. What we learn here has to be applied. Otherwise, this is merely a discussion forum for mental masturbation.

You have been asked some poignant questions and as hard as it is, try to deal with them. Allow your ego to get hurt. Allow the mask to slip.

No one here would be spending this much energy pointing things out if you weren't worth it.

Gonzo

 

[Chang]

Re: Chang's issues with female police officers (Everyone)

Hey there, you may not know who I am, but I'll tell a story about what happened to me today.

I woke up this morning and had coffee, as usual. Well, there was something that was unusual. I felt like I had been dropped off on the island where Lord Of The Flies took place.

So after coffee, Todo and I went for our morning walk. I love Todo to pieces, he is the most precious dog I've ever met, and I've had dogs since I was five.

Most of our walk is on property my wife and I own, yet I no longer leave my house without a 9 mm Glock at my side. I've added the pistol as part of my walk ever since the SECOND time I was attacked on my own property, by the same PSYCHOPATH.
As a matter of fact, I wear it when I mow the lawn, because of the Monster Next Door. You might think you understand how I feel, but you don't. Not until it happens to you. Part of my life was taken away that day I was pummeled on our front lawn.

And one of the scariest things that happened that day was the look on my wife's face, when I was finally able to extricate myself from the lawn. I was afraid she was going to have a heart attack. I was nearly killed, and she watched these two monsters beating me like I was Rodney King at an LA Police Rally.

So anyway, Todo and I went for our walk, little Fee Fee (I guess that would be Fifi for you lucky folks in France) Fee Fee is an amazing little Maine Coon Cat, she is like an angel to Jackie and I. Her mother Foo Fee usually tags along, but she stays back closer to our home. I think of her as our Gate Keeper. she's a gray cat, probably part coon, and as much as I love her, I'm afraid of her, she is so powerful.

So we walk about a quarter mile, turn around and walk home. Today, as we approached the camp road we live on, there was a blonde lady staring at us, from atop the knoll. She lives in the Crack House, where the Monsters Next Door live. Where they party. Where they sell drugs. Where he abuses his girlfriends daughter.

But it wasn't that I saw a lady that scared me, it was the fact that she was going to start calling me names, like oh so many times before. Or she might just flip me the bird. Or....she might call the police and tell them a lie. Its happened at least twenty times, if it happened once. My stomach felt sick, I started panicking, and I hurried home. We made it home safely, and I fed Todo, same as always. But during that panicky period, I remembered what Dr Mierhofer told me. When I first met him (he's the psychologist) I told him my doctors said I was suffering from PTSD. We spoke for a while, and he said its not PTSD, you are facing the trauma on a daily basis. PTSD is what happened to the young men that were shipped to Viet Nam, and came home and were unable to function as young men anymore.

He came to the conclusion that the only solution was for me to move away, or, ideally, for the Monster Next Door to move away. I felt brave, "I'm not moving" I told him. I mentioned this to Jackie, and she felt the same way. Well, the long and short of it is, I want to move. No, I have to move. Jackie's still not real fond of the idea, but she see's the writing on the wall. The one big reason she's not fond of moving, is I built our new home around a garden. Its circled with large rocks. Jack's got some Irish in her, she loves rocks (so do I) she even built a beautiful rock wall at our last place (the house the sociopaths are renting). She was lifting rocks I couldn't think about lifting. I helped her once or twice, and was nearly crippled, trying to keep up with her. She's 5'-5" and maybe 115 lbs.
Back to the garden, its a pretty large area, with a crushed stone walk down the middle, small stone stackings she's made, that defy gravity. She has a few gnomes, a statue of one of the Saints (the one that looked over the animals) and a neat little vegetable garden off to the back of the left side. She loves to garden. Its her passion, her therapy. And its completely surround with large rocks. But she's willing to give it up, to avoid the harassment, the terrorizing, the constant stealing of our belongings. The last thing they stole was the outboard motor off of our boat. The police ask them if they take it, they say 'no', case closed. Same thing with the three cats they murdered. Suffice it to say, the list of wrong-doings is endless, and we know it won't stop.

So back to the PTSD, after feeding Todo, I head to my computer, and googled 'PTSD'. Then I realized what was going on, or at least I think I did. Here's part of what I found:

PTSD can occur at any age. It can follow a natural disaster such as a flood or fire, or events such as:

Assault

Domestic abuse

Prison stay

Rape

Terrorism

War


PTSD

Last reviewed: March 5, 2011.

Post-traumatic stress disorder is a type of anxiety disorder. It can occur after you've seen or experienced a traumatic event that involved the threat of injury or death.
Causes, incidence, and risk factors

PTSD can occur at any age. It can follow a natural disaster such as a flood or fire, or events such as:

Assault

Domestic abuse

Prison stay

Rape

Terrorism

War

For example, the terrorist attacks of September 11, 2001 may have caused PTSD in some people who were involved, in people who saw the disaster, and in people who lost relatives and friends.

Veterans returning home from a war often have PTSD.

The cause of PTSD is unknown. Psychological, genetic, physical, and social factors are involved. PTSD changes the body's response to stress. It affects the stress hormones and chemicals that carry information between the nerves (neurotransmitters).

It is not known why traumatic events cause PTSD in some people but not others. Having a history of trauma may increase your risk for getting PTSD after a recent traumatic event.


Symptoms of PTSD fall into three main categories:

1. "Reliving" the event, which disturbs day-to-day activity

Flashback episodes, where the event seems to be happening again and again

Repeated upsetting memories of the event

Repeated nightmares of the event

Strong, uncomfortable reactions to situations that remind you of the event

2. Avoidance

Emotional "numbing," or feeling as though you don't care about anything

Feeling detached

Being unable to remember important aspects of the trauma

Having a lack of interest in normal activities

Showing less of your moods

Avoiding places, people, or thoughts that remind you of the event

Feeling like you have no future

3. Arousal

Difficulty concentrating

Startling easily

Having an exaggerated response to things that startle you

Feeling more aware (hypervigilance)

Feeling irritable or having outbursts of anger

Having trouble falling or staying asleep

You might feel guilt about the event (including "survivor guilt"). You might also have some of the following symptoms, which are typical of anxiety, stress, and tension:

Agitation or excitability

Dizziness

Fainting

Feeling your heart beat in your chest

Headache
==========================================================

I experience, or have in the past, more than a couple of these symptoms, but while I was trying to respond to all the posts yesterday, more than once I was accused of having no empathy. As some of you may remember, after thinking about it, I wrote that I was probably 'desensitized' to the point that it was true, I may not be able to feel some things, and sure enough, under Symptoms, the second category is AVOIDENCE, and the first symptom under AVOIDENCE, is this:

"Emotional "numbing," or feeling as though you don't care about anything"

So perhaps I did learn a thing or two about myself, and I think I learned a thing or two about human nature. And its not too far removed from the "Lord Of The Flies" scenario that I mentioned earlier.

I really think people were feeding off the frenzy of each other, 'Paper Sharks' if you will. People were saying things that I was surprised to see, here at SOTT.

Things were being mis-interpreted, repeated so many times they appeared to be true, even if they weren't (Joseph Goebbels Effect).

I was seeing things from Super Moderators that I was actually shocked by.

But the one thing that kept me going, was from the one lofty soul amongst us:

"Chang, you need to be reading "Caricature of Love"."

No judgements rendered, no name-calling. Just something being offered that would help me move forward. Could anyone ask for anything more?

Chang

 

[ScarletBegonias]

But the one thing that kept me going, was from the one lofty soul amongst us:

"Chang, you need to be reading "Caricature of Love"."

No judgements rendered, no name-calling. Just something being offered that would help me move forward. Could anyone ask for anything more?

Chang

And now you are generalizing the members of this forum. So, did you order the book Laura said you "need" to be reading?