Circuit Breaker Box in Childs Bedroom

[SummerLite]

Hello all you Brilliant and Creative minds, I'm hoping you can help with a Big problem.

My daughter just bought a older mobile home to save money on rent over the next few years. She bought the place while all the furniture was in place by the owner and after it was removed several problems where discovered. The biggest concern is the fuse box is located in one of the childrens rooms which is VERY small. That wall connects to the other childs bedroom! I'm going from website to website, trying to find shielding with many things said and not knowing what to do. I am very concerned and dont even know if anything can be done thats affordable. The bed is suppose to be at least 6 feet away, hopefully we have that but I'm not sure. Since the wires are in the wall, I thought some kind of aluminum or other type of metal sheeting may be useful on that part of the wall and also putting a special protective panel on the fuse box. I've read the box can be turned off at night but the kids want to spend time in their bedrooms so thats not practical all the time. And what about the refrigerator that would be turned off at night? And heat in the winter.

I am beside myself with worry! Years ago, I had another fuse box in a bedroom and called in a man from the electric company to check it with his meter and everything was said to be within "normal" limits. Perhaps this is something I could also do.

I found this site that offers a ceramic devise to place on the box but it looks a bit suspicious to me. Overblown claims perhaps. -http://emfblues.com/tri-pak/

If anyone has some good ideas I'd really appreciate it. Thanks

 

[LQB]

This kind of thing is hard to avoid in mobile homes Summerlite. The meter will likely be on the outside wall adjacent to the panel box.

Studies show that children are most at risk from the magnetic field.

The easiest thing to do is get a cheap gauss meter like this one:

http://smile.amazon.com/Cell-Sensor-EMF-Detection-Meter/dp/B0013P6ZJQ/ref=sr_1_1?s=hi&ie=UTF8&qid=1463265871&sr=1-1&keywords=cell+sensor

and measure the mag field around the room (ignore the RF sensor). Map out the area where the field is at .5mG or below. This living area is acceptable and you can block off the rest of the area around the panel box so the children cannot inhabit this space. The probe on this meter is single-axis so you have to rotate it around until you get the max reading. You will also want a load on the circuits, so turn some lights on and maybe the oven.

If the kids stay outside that area around the panel box, then the risk will be small.

There is nothing you can do to block the mag field.

Added: And while you're at it, check all other rooms - if mag fields are high, then there is likely a wiring error somewhere.

 

[SummerLite]

Wow! Thanks LQB! I am ordering that meter now. In the reading online I did, I saw nothing like you've mentioned. I'm so glad I asked. Maybe this wont be such a huge issue after all. Hopefully there is enough space in these tiny rooms to allow for safety. I'm also looking into protected extension cords (emf barriers in place) if that will be needed.

I'll also check the other rooms, a call to an electrician will be in order if something else is found. Hopefully the circuit breaker is wired properly.

Thanks again! That is something of a relief... hope it goes okay

 

[SummerLite]

Do you think a protective panel on the box itself would have any value?

 

[Kay Kim]

Hello LQB,
How about cover circuit breaker box with silk?
Is anybody think that might work?

 

[LQB]

Do you think a protective panel on the box itself would have any value?

Nothing will block the 50/60Hz mag field. Foil or metal plate will shield the electric field but the problem is going to be the mag field. If the meter is a radiating smart meter, then that is another problem.

 

[BHelmet]

Take a deep breath - there is always a way to improve things. Did you do a web search on (electro) magnetic shielding? It seems you need to measure the field with a gauss meter to determine just what you are dealing with and where it tapers off, then you can have a clue as to what kind of shield you need and how big it needs to be, and where it needs to be. One site said that where the field goes over 2.5 milli-gauss is where you want the shield. There are a lot of adhesive type foils that can go right on the walls and then maybe cover it with a wall hanging for aesthetics. There is some stuff called Giron that is woven and designed to reduce EMFs such as circuit breaker boxes. I must assume the breaker is on an outside wall? - if so there might be enough room to wrap some stuff around it .

One note - I think the fields are generated and intensified depending on what is 'turned on'. so, When you measure the gauss field, make sure you turn on the lights, appliances etc.

But, basically, the idea behind all this is that, while the magnetic field can not be eliminated, you can re-route it, via the shielding (which conducts the field better than the air), and thereby reduce its size so it hugs the wall/stays within the shield barrier. I also know there is electro-magnetic shielding paint although it is pricey but to cover a square meter it might not be too bad.

Here is a website that has a lot of info:

_lessemf.com

 

[LQB]

But, basically, the idea behind all this is that, while the magnetic field can not be eliminated, you can re-route it, via the shielding (which conducts the field better than the air), and thereby reduce its size so it hugs the wall/stays within the shield barrier. I also know there is electro-magnetic shielding paint although it is pricey but to cover a square meter it might not be too bad.

This is true for a static mag field but not so for a 50/60 Hz mag field. Distance from the source is a far better remedy.

 

[SummerLite]

Thank you BHelmet for that info, I'll look into it. And thanks again LQB. MORE to learn. Once I get my meter I'll know more of what I'm dealing with. I think this meter is a handy thing to have anyway. I'm going to be checking all kinds of things, appliances, etc. in my daughters home and mine as well as my sons.

This is true for a static mag field but not so for a 50/60 Hz mag field. Distance from the source is a far better remedy.

I assume a circuit box isn't a static field then.

Good news and I'm feeling so relieved. I went to the house this morning and there is no meter on the outside wall of the bedroom. The meter is out in the yard on a metal stand a good distance from the house and bedrooms and its not a Stupid meter! If they come to install one, its possible to decline that but I'm not sure. I'll need to check it out. At some point I'll probably need to deal with that somewhere. Also the little bedroom isn't quite as small as I imagined and the fuse box is in a recessed area in the open closet which allows for more distance.

I worried myself sick yesterday. It is such a shame we have to go to such lengths to protect our children. I'm the only one in my family who knows anything about EMF issues especially focusing on the sleeping area. I've tried to be informative for years with some success, but my kids think I'm something of a nut, fortunately they're open to what I say.
I've been thinking also how oblivious so many people are in general. Slap a smart meter on your house, no problem, eat all kinds of crap during your entire life then have all kinds of health problems in ones later years. Start having surgeries to have organs removed and end up on a bunch of meds. All the while wondering "How did it Happen? Thats life is the answer, and old age.

Thanks guys. The silk should come in handy somewhere.

My apartment building has the smart meters. Luckily for me they're at the other side of the building a good distance. But, there are 4 of them on my neighbors outside wall :(.

I also read on one site, all those wires going into the fuse box aren't a concern since they cancel out the field around them by being close together.

 

[LQB]

Good news and I'm feeling so relieved. I went to the house this morning and there is no meter on the outside wall of the bedroom. The meter is out in the yard on a metal stand a good distance from the house and bedrooms and its not a Stupid meter! If they come to install one, its possible to decline that but I'm not sure. I'll need to check it out. At some point I'll probably need to deal with that somewhere. Also the little bedroom isn't quite as small as I imagined and the fuse box is in a recessed area in the open closet which allows for more distance.

Good deal SL, having the meter separated from the house is very good. And yes, the panel boxes "should" be placed in areas of low-use living space. You will probably be surprised at the mag fields you measure in the vicinity of appliances when they are running (HVAC, stove, etc).

 

[SummerLite]

Today I measured the emf fields in my daughters new place. The levels are actually fine in the room with the circuit box, dropping off a short distance from the box as they should. There is a problem in the other childs bedroom next to this one. Its much smaller and I cant find a area for the bed that doesn't register 2-3mg, giving space for the charge coming from the other room. This reading is intermittent so isn't constant. The water heater is in a corner of this room separated by a wall. The wall behind the heater, part of the bedroom, seems to have the electrical charge running through it. The people who lived there before had their washer and dryer in this room and possibly rigged a socket to hook things up. This was seen when the appliances where removed exposing the socket box with wires. I only saw it once and mentioned it should be disconnected however it was covered up without being removed or anything done with it. I dont know what else is in that wall.

LQB, you mentioned .5mG or below is acceptable. Do you mean less then 1mg or 5mg? From my other reading its said, 1mg or less is acceptable. So, it looks like the wall needs to be taken down and the wiring needs to be worked on. I wonder if encasing the wiring in metal tubing would decrease the problem for this particular room. My daughters friend is the one working on the house. He has electrical, plumbing, construction experience but some holes in his knowledge base I'd say although he claims to be very experienced.

Any suggestions for me? I also mentioned the grounding for the house needs to be checked.

The GW filters look good and I will suggest this. The kids rooms will only need one considering the size. I wonder if the filter itself would clear up the problem in this room? I guess all this sounds pretty funky... I dont know anything about this stuff. The house needs quite a lot of work and is being done on a limited budget so totally redoing the electrical is out of the question. Yikes. :(

 

[MusicMan]

Hello Summerlite, I can appreciate your problem, and it won't be too easy to solve.

I liked your idea of putting the wiring into metal conduit.
You can get flexible conduit for difficult areas. Just make sure that the conduit is earthed at one end only, otherwise it will act as an aerial.

You can obtain mains filters to go between the supply and your mobile home which will take out any of the 'dirty electricity' on the line.
I recommend that you get a qualified person to do the work. Safety first.
Good luck.

 

[LQB]

Today I measured the emf fields in my daughters new place. The levels are actually fine in the room with the circuit box, dropping off a short distance from the box as they should. There is a problem in the other childs bedroom next to this one. Its much smaller and I cant find a area for the bed that doesn't register 2-3mg, giving space for the charge coming from the other room. This reading is intermittent so isn't constant. The water heater is in a corner of this room separated by a wall. The wall behind the heater, part of the bedroom, seems to have the electrical charge running through it. The people who lived there before had their washer and dryer in this room and possibly rigged a socket to hook things up. This was seen when the appliances where removed exposing the socket box with wires. I only saw it once and mentioned it should be disconnected however it was covered up without being removed or anything done with it. I dont know what else is in that wall.

LQB, you mentioned .5mG or below is acceptable. Do you mean less then 1mg or 5mg? From my other reading its said, 1mg or less is acceptable. So, it looks like the wall needs to be taken down and the wiring needs to be worked on. I wonder if encasing the wiring in metal tubing would decrease the problem for this particular room. My daughters friend is the one working on the house. He has electrical, plumbing, construction experience but some holes in his knowledge base I'd say although he claims to be very experienced.

Any suggestions for me? I also mentioned the grounding for the house needs to be checked.

The GW filters look good and I will suggest this. The kids rooms will only need one considering the size. I wonder if the filter itself would clear up the problem in this room? I guess all this sounds pretty funky... I dont know anything about this stuff. The house needs quite a lot of work and is being done on a limited budget so totally redoing the electrical is out of the question. Yikes. :(

The .5mG (less than 1) is the level that Prof Henshaw (and many others) suggest as a threshold (especially for children) and is derived from childhood leukemia epidemiology data/studies. Personally, I agree with this. Generally accepted threshold is 1-2 mG depending on the source. A 2-3mG reading throughout a room is high and indicates a possible wiring error (crossed ground/neutral, etc). The reading near sockets will be high, but drop off quickly with distance (since the wires must separate for connection to the socket).

If there is a wiring error, you should be able to identify the circuit by measuring mG near the walls - the offending circuit should be under load (current flowing in the circuit). The offending circuit may not be one associated with that bedroom - but runs in the wall to another part of the house. An easy way to get a good load on a circuit (that feeds sockets) is to just plug in a portable heater before measuring. Keep in mind that the wiring error can be in a circuit that only drives lights (and not sockets) - 3-way switches and dimmers are common sources of wiring errors.

If you can find the offending circuit, then a close look at that circuit's wiring should reveal the problem. Most electricians do not know to use a gaussmeter to find wiring errors.

Hope this helps SL.

 

[SummerLite]

Thanks MusicMan, I know you've had your own challenges with protecting your grandchildren...its a difficult situation. I hope thats improved for you.

"You can get flexible conduit for difficult areas. Just make sure that the conduit is earthed at one end only, otherwise it will act as an aerial"

How would you ground the conduit?

Dr. Mercola: http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2011/02/09/powerful-and-simple-tips-to-help-lower-your-emf-risks.aspx

"If you are constructing a new home or renovating one and the walls are being rebuilt you can install radiant barrier, which is a tough type of aluminum foil that will also very effectively screen out the EMF. This is what I did for my own bedroom.
At minimum, moving your bed so that your head is at least 3-6 feet from all electrical outlets. If you are constructing the walls you can put the wires inside pipes, which will virtually eliminate the fields that are generated in the room when the current runs through the wire".

LQB, thank you once again. In a wild spat of wishful thinking I had hoped you made a typo on that number . Do you agree with the quote above? I'm thinking the EMF field in that wall is coming from wiring connected to the water heater. It may not be faulty wiring but a strong field, going off and on when the heater draws power. If you agree with the quote, what type of pipe or radiant aluminum foil barrier would work? MusicMan mentions a flexible type of conduit.

There is also a outlet in the room I'd like to see disconnected. Any advise on that? I hope you dont mind me calling on your advise so much. Can you just come over here and help with this mess a bit? Only kidding, I know you dont live around here.

The biggest problem I'm having is my daughter being resistant to making the changes needed. She's mad at me for wanting to take down walls etc. We got in an argument about it. I'm giving her time to think about it and hopefully she'll come around. I will be speaking to her father and maybe he will get on board and help out. I'm adding extra work to what needs to be done and with more hands helping maybe she'll be accepting. I also need support. I see it as a very serious situation and I'm the only one with the knowledge. Fears have been arising that I may not be up to accomplishing the task. Another side is kicking in that has fierce determination.

 

[LQB]

Dr. Mercola: http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2011/02/09/powerful-and-simple-tips-to-help-lower-your-emf-risks.aspx

"If you are constructing a new home or renovating one and the walls are being rebuilt you can install radiant barrier, which is a tough type of aluminum foil that will also very effectively screen out the EMF. This is what I did for my own bedroom.
At minimum, moving your bed so that your head is at least 3-6 feet from all electrical outlets. If you are constructing the walls you can put the wires inside pipes, which will virtually eliminate the fields that are generated in the room when the current runs through the wire".

The above will work for the electric field - but not the magnetic field. Three feet distance from elec outlets (mag field) and from elec wires in the wall (elec field) should be fine. No need to tear into walls and replace wiring. But wiring errors must be fixed.

There is also a outlet in the room I'd like to see disconnected. Any advise on that?

You can bypass the outlet but don't try this unless you are sure that the breaker for this circuit is OFF. Better yet, get help from someone who is used to doing home elec work.