Computational modelling of the companion star and its interaction with Sol

[Pierre]

I personally think that the 56 % is too much.

I think you're right about that.

Evidently, somehow Pierre got stuck on a faulty and obsolete assumption in this matter, and apparently didn't notice the number of about 3.4% given in the January 30, 2010 session -- which amounts to the latest answer the C's have given on this subject that I'm aware of. It's a pity his book also carries this faulty number, while it easily could've been corrected before printing.

Yes. This is a mistake of mine. I missed the 3.4% number mentioned in a 2010 session.

 

[tohuwabohu]

I personally think that the 56 % is too much.

I think you're right about that.

Evidently, somehow Pierre got stuck on a faulty and obsolete assumption in this matter, and apparently didn't notice the number of about 3.4% given in the January 30, 2010 session -- which amounts to the latest answer the C's have given on this subject that I'm aware of. It's a pity his book also carries this faulty number, while it easily could've been corrected before printing.

Yes. This is a mistake of mine. I missed the 3.4% number mentioned in a 2010 session.

Thank you for clarifying that for me. I was using the 3.4% in all my simulations so I was horrified that everything was wrong. The results are quite interesting. When I have time during christmas I will put the results together and post it.

 

[tohuwabohu]

I also think that a large companion can be ruled out since the WISE mission did not find it in 2013. It could detect objects as cool as 150 Kelvin.

3% of the solar mass means that the companion would be about 30 times as massive as Jupiter.

According to Wikipedia:
"The theoretical minimum mass a star can have, and still undergo hydrogen-1 fusion at the core, is estimated to be about 75 times the mass of Jupiter, while fusion of deuterium can occur at masses as low as 13 Jupiters."

_http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jupiter_mass

Well what I think is that the companion trajectory might be very close to the plane of ecliptic so even if it would be detectable it might be obscured by the kuiper belt.

A good question is, why do the planets orbit around the sun exactly in this plane and not some other.

Another thing that is interesting are the trajectories of the satellites that were sent out of the solar system. Namely Pioneer 10, Pioneer 11 and Voyager 1 and 2.

Pioneer 10 was sent in one direction alone thus it is clear that whoever sent it there knew that there is something there that is perhaps incoming and also knew exact position of the object of interest so the trajectory could be exactly calculated for a close flyby.

On the other hand Pioneer 11 together with Voyager 1 and 2 were sent in opposite direction. Thus there is something outside the solar system that was interesting enough to send three satellites. Moreover the exact position of the incoming object was not known at that moment. Why else would they send three satellites? Everyone knows that if you want to triangulate any position, you need at least three reference points. So that's why. According to the spread of the satellites they needed to cover a vast area. But I am sure they already have the position. And I bet that the next satellite will be directed toward the object for some visual contact and measurements. With high probability it is already on its way.

Of course no one tells anything. NASA is still telling that they are interested in the kuiper belt objects or in heliopause or whatever. And perhaps they are not even lying because if the companion is already grounding the current then it has to interact with the heliosphere.

 

[axj]

Well, the C's already gave its approximate position:

Q: (A) […] First, about this companion star: where is it now; which part of the zodiac?
A: Libra Constellation.

They also said that it comes as close as the orbit of Pluto - though whether it already happened during the Maunder Minimum or now is the other question.

After some research about the trajectory of the four probes relative to the constellations, here is what I found:

Pioneer 10 is flying towards the constellation Taurus:

Pioneer 10 is heading in the direction of the constellation Taurus. _http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pioneer_10

Pioneer 11 is flying towards the constellation Scutum, which is above Sagittarius:

Pioneer 11 is heading in the direction of the constellation Scutum. __http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pioneer_11

Voyager 1 is flying approximately towards the star Gliese 445 in the Camelopardalis Constellation, with this particular star being above the constellations Virgo and Leo:

Though it is not heading towards any particular star, in about 40,000 years, it will pass within 1.6 light years of the star Gliese 445, which is at present in the constellation Camelopardalis. __http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voyager_1

Voyager 2 is flying approximately towards the star Ross 248 in the Andromeda Constellation, which is above to the constellations Aries, Pisces and Aquarius:

Voyager 2 is not headed toward any particular star, although in roughly 40,000 years it should pass 1.7 light-years (9.7 trillion miles) from the star Ross 248. _http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voyager_2

So it looks like Pioneer 10 and Voyager 1 are flying on two different sides somewhat towards Libra where the companion star is supposed to be while the other two probes are going in opposite directions.

 

[axj]

As Psychegram posted in another thread, there may be a simple reason why WISE did not find the companion star:

An additional piece of perhaps-relevant information, passed to me by a friend who specializes in infrared observations of outer solar system objects: apparently, most people who study WISE data cut the field at a Galactic longitude of +- 15 degrees (I imagine this is to avoid overcrowded images in the Galactic plane). This a fairly big chunk of sky, so if Nemesis is currently in the Galactic plane it wouldn't be surprising that it was missed. I actually rather doubt it's in the sample of identified brown dwarves, as the rather high proper motion of such a close object should have leapt out of the data.

Libra seems to be close to the Galactic plane, though not exactly.

And there were actually a few very cold sub-brown dwarves discovered by WISE in Libra. One in particular is pretty interesting:

_https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WISE_1541-2250

It was considered to be 9 light years away at first, but then it was corrected to 18 light years. I'm wondering if an approaching companion star could have such an elongated orbit that on close approach it may appear to move slower in relation to Earth, so that the apparent motion (parallax measurement) may give wrong results regarding its actual distance.

 

[psychegram]

Nice to see this project moving along. I'm looking forward to the results from the updated simulations.

As Psychegram posted in another thread, there may be a simple reason why WISE did not find the companion star:

An additional piece of perhaps-relevant information, passed to me by a friend who specializes in infrared observations of outer solar system objects: apparently, most people who study WISE data cut the field at a Galactic longitude of +- 15 degrees (I imagine this is to avoid overcrowded images in the Galactic plane). This a fairly big chunk of sky, so if Nemesis is currently in the Galactic plane it wouldn't be surprising that it was missed. I actually rather doubt it's in the sample of identified brown dwarves, as the rather high proper motion of such a close object should have leapt out of the data.

Libra seems to be close to the Galactic plane, though not exactly.

And there were actually a few very cold sub-brown dwarves discovered by WISE in Libra. One in particular is pretty interesting:

_https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WISE_1541-2250

It was considered to be 9 light years away at first, but then it was corrected to 18 light years. I'm wondering if an approaching companion star could have such an elongated orbit that on close approach it may appear to move slower in relation to Earth, so that the apparent motion (parallax measurement) may give wrong results regarding its actual distance.

Indeed, Libra is not exactly in the Galactic plane, however it is certainly within 15 degrees of the Galactic plane. Thus, if Nemesis is indeed there, it would have been missed by the WISE map.

As to WISE 1541-2250, and possible effects of the orbital motion on the distance determination, separating out trigonometric parallax from proper motion is pretty straightforward so I doubt the astronomers involved got that wrong. My guess is that their distance to the star is quite accurate.

 

[axj]

Indeed, Libra is not exactly in the Galactic plane, however it is certainly within 15 degrees of the Galactic plane. Thus, if Nemesis is indeed there, it would have been missed by the WISE map.

Well, the WISE survey did find three brown dwarves in Libra:
_https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_brown_dwarfs#WISE

That list may also be a good place to check whether WISE discovered any brown dwarves that were directly in the Galactic plane. I have no idea how to do that, since the Solar plane (ecliptic) is tilted towards the Galactic plane and the data on that list refers to the "celestial plane" of the tilted Earth.

 

[axj]

Okay, I think there is a simpler way to check whether the WISE mission found any brown dwarves in the Galactic plane: on the image I posted above you can see which constellations are located in the Galactic plane and the list of objects found by WISE includes the constellations as well.

So the constellations in the Galactic plane are:

Scorpius (2 objects found)
Sagittarius (1 object)
Serpens Cauda
Aquilla (1 object)
Sagitta
Delphinus (1 object)
Vulpecula (1 object)
Cygnus
Lacerta
Cassiopeia
Perseus (4 objects)
Auriga (2 objects)
Gemini (3 objects)
Canis Minor
Monoceros (2 object)
Canis Major (3 objects)
Puppis (2 object)
Pyxis (1 object)
Vela (1 object)
Antila (1 object)
Carina
Centaurus
Crux
Musca
Circinus
Triangulum Australe (1 object)
Norma
Lupus
Ara
Corona Austrina

So it does look like the WISE mission found objects within the Galactic plane as well. This in turn suggests that the companion star must be cooler than 150 K - which was the limit which could be detected by the WISE infrared sensors.

 

[mkrnhr]

There was a paper in 2005 (in my memory serves me well) that argued that Nemesis is likely to be close to the ecliptic because the angular moment of the solar system is stable according to observation. There is a guy from Italy who established theoretically the upper limit for Nemesis mass from some anomalies detected in Saturn orbit and other considerations but his calculation were hard to follow. The ecliptic crosses the galactic plane of course but I wonder as well if astrometry (through parallax) is the best way to identify a (relatively) fast moving object.

The parallax method uses Earth's orbit (+ the altitude of the satellite) as a baseline. The measurements at both ends of this baseline are separated by six month though. If the object is slow enough, the distance should be accurate and the proper motion after a few revolutions should be okay too. However, if the object has an important proper motion (relatively to the distant stars) then maybe the measurement delay may introduce some bias. I don't know honestly if this question is taken into account so I have to search for some literature on the subject. In every observing technique, the most important to know is the assumptions of the model and its domain of accuracy. OSIT

 

[mkrnhr]

Another "random" thought that may be either relevent, or utter nonsense (more likely lol).
When interpreting data, we operate within a definite framework. In Astronomy, the framework is 3D reality and most often, nonelectric "empty" space. Most importantly, we automatically think of physical reality as devoid of consciousness/information as an underlying, and yet unassuming unconscious assumption.

Until there is some practical reality someday to gravitational waves, all we see of the outer space is what and how photons at whatever wavelengths arrive and how they are detected, etc. We see what the universe allows us to see in other words.
Now to give an analogy, on a hot day, the ground is heated by the sun and a strong gradient of temperature builds up in the air right above it. Light that travels almost parallel to the ground is strongly refracted, which gives the mirage effect. Light from other directions, especially the one whose propagation is parallel to the temperature gradient is as usual. Thus, there is a certain privileged direction where we have a bizarre optical distortion because of the nature of the medium. Now suppose that the solar system is in a discharge mode with Nemesis. We can imagine a connecting thread, straight or otherwise, making the connection between the objects. The question one could ask is how does light propagate in the direction of that thread. Does it cause some optical distortion that makes any object observed in that direction fall below detection threshold? If it is the case, than maybe we have a blindspot in that very particular direction.

The thing is that as a planet with so much density of consciousness (at least in potential), it is possible that the universe offers us with a special treatment such as that we cannot extrapolate from systems we observe from the outside (any double star system) to what we can see from the inside. The image of the fish in the ocean comes to mind. Solar eclipses and other "coincidences" may be a way to remind us that we indeed occupy a special place in the "local?" universe.

To draw more from mythology, if we take the story of Atlantis literally, how come such a civilization that conquered the solar system couldn't anticipate what happened? One possibility is the above-mentioned possible blind-spot, another possibility is transdimentional phenomena. For instance, it is very possible that a cycle-ending cometary bombardment would be caused by a certain ratio X of comets from 3D, and another ratio from comets that suddenly emerge from elsewhere. Same with Nemesis. One component of its behaviour could be 3D physics, and another part could be from (3+n)D physics. Since the Wave is "realm merging" of some sort, which is hard to describe/model/predict/define etc., the only rational (not logic) approach to the thing would be that: If we see Nemesis, there is a possibility that it is there, but if we don't see it, it doesn't mean that it isn't there, it just means that there is a possibility that it isn't there, which implies a possibility that it is there. Since the rules of the games are blurred, and the rules of the known cannot be applied with certainty to the rules of the unknown, it's only a matter of conjecture.
OSIT FWIW

 

[Mr. Premise]

Another "random" thought that may be either relevent, or utter nonsense (more likely lol).
When interpreting data, we operate within a definite framework. In Astronomy, the framework is 3D reality and most often, nonelectric "empty" space. Most importantly, we automatically think of physical reality as devoid of consciousness/information as an underlying, and yet unassuming unconscious assumption.

Until there is some practical reality someday to gravitational waves, all we see of the outer space is what and how photons at whatever wavelengths arrive and how they are detected, etc. We see what the universe allows us to see in other words.
Now to give an analogy, on a hot day, the ground is heated by the sun and a strong gradient of temperature builds up in the air right above it. Light that travels almost parallel to the ground is strongly refracted, which gives the mirage effect. Light from other directions, especially the one whose propagation is parallel to the temperature gradient is as usual. Thus, there is a certain privileged direction where we have a bizarre optical distortion because of the nature of the medium. Now suppose that the solar system is in a discharge mode with Nemesis. We can imagine a connecting thread, straight or otherwise, making the connection between the objects. The question one could ask is how does light propagate in the direction of that thread. Does it cause some optical distortion that makes any object observed in that direction fall below detection threshold? If it is the case, than maybe we have a blindspot in that very particular direction.

The thing is that as a planet with so much density of consciousness (at least in potential), it is possible that the universe offers us with a special treatment such as that we cannot extrapolate from systems we observe from the outside (any double star system) to what we can see from the inside. The image of the fish in the ocean comes to mind. Solar eclipses and other "coincidences" may be a way to remind us that we indeed occupy a special place in the "local?" universe.

To draw more from mythology, if we take the story of Atlantis literally, how come such a civilization that conquered the solar system couldn't anticipate what happened? One possibility is the above-mentioned possible blind-spot, another possibility is transdimentional phenomena. For instance, it is very possible that a cycle-ending cometary bombardment would be caused by a certain ratio X of comets from 3D, and another ratio from comets that suddenly emerge from elsewhere. Same with Nemesis. One component of its behaviour could be 3D physics, and another part could be from (3+n)D physics. Since the Wave is "realm merging" of some sort, which is hard to describe/model/predict/define etc., the only rational (not logic) approach to the thing would be that: If we see Nemesis, there is a possibility that it is there, but if we don't see it, it doesn't mean that it isn't there, it just means that there is a possibility that it isn't there, which implies a possibility that it is there. Since the rules of the games are blurred, and the rules of the known cannot be applied with certainty to the rules of the unknown, it's only a matter of conjecture.
OSIT FWIW

Interesting! Sounds like a question for the Cs.

 

[tohuwabohu]

There was a paper in 2005 (in my memory serves me well) that argued that Nemesis is likely to be close to the ecliptic because the angular moment of the solar system is stable according to observation. There is a guy from Italy who established theoretically the upper limit for Nemesis mass from some anomalies detected in Saturn orbit and other considerations but his calculation were hard to follow. The ecliptic crosses the galactic plane of course but I wonder as well if astrometry (through parallax) is the best way to identify a (relatively) fast moving object.

This is what I am thinking also, because if the companion would be inclined to the plane of ecliptic, the planets would be all over the place. Yet they are almost perfectly aligned in a plane. Except for Pluto of course but there may be other influences.

I think I have read similar paper on the mass limit. It was stated there that if the mass would be more than 4,2 % of the Sun, it would have been detected long ago. They have compared the database of known objects and put a limit on the expected apparent magnitude.

 

[tohuwabohu]

So it does look like the WISE mission found objects within the Galactic plane as well. This in turn suggests that the companion star must be cooler than 150 K - which was the limit which could be detected by the WISE infrared sensors.

I think that in this regard Harrington was onto something. He published few articles but he was looking for Planet-X, which is in my opinion the cometary swarm with 3600 year period. He pinpointed the location of the "body" in the southern skies in the region of Scorpius. Shortly after he was terminated.
So this only confirms that his theory was valid and the governmental body was not happy about it. This was back in 1992.
I would say that not everything that gets discovered is going public.

 

[tohuwabohu]

Another "random" thought that may be either relevent, or utter nonsense (more likely lol).
When interpreting data, we operate within a definite framework. In Astronomy, the framework is 3D reality and most often, nonelectric "empty" space. Most importantly, we automatically think of physical reality as devoid of consciousness/information as an underlying, and yet unassuming unconscious assumption.

Until there is some practical reality someday to gravitational waves, all we see of the outer space is what and how photons at whatever wavelengths arrive and how they are detected, etc. We see what the universe allows us to see in other words.
Now to give an analogy, on a hot day, the ground is heated by the sun and a strong gradient of temperature builds up in the air right above it. Light that travels almost parallel to the ground is strongly refracted, which gives the mirage effect. Light from other directions, especially the one whose propagation is parallel to the temperature gradient is as usual. Thus, there is a certain privileged direction where we have a bizarre optical distortion because of the nature of the medium. Now suppose that the solar system is in a discharge mode with Nemesis. We can imagine a connecting thread, straight or otherwise, making the connection between the objects. The question one could ask is how does light propagate in the direction of that thread. Does it cause some optical distortion that makes any object observed in that direction fall below detection threshold? If it is the case, than maybe we have a blindspot in that very particular direction.

The thing is that as a planet with so much density of consciousness (at least in potential), it is possible that the universe offers us with a special treatment such as that we cannot extrapolate from systems we observe from the outside (any double star system) to what we can see from the inside. The image of the fish in the ocean comes to mind. Solar eclipses and other "coincidences" may be a way to remind us that we indeed occupy a special place in the "local?" universe.

To draw more from mythology, if we take the story of Atlantis literally, how come such a civilization that conquered the solar system couldn't anticipate what happened? One possibility is the above-mentioned possible blind-spot, another possibility is transdimentional phenomena. For instance, it is very possible that a cycle-ending cometary bombardment would be caused by a certain ratio X of comets from 3D, and another ratio from comets that suddenly emerge from elsewhere. Same with Nemesis. One component of its behaviour could be 3D physics, and another part could be from (3+n)D physics. Since the Wave is "realm merging" of some sort, which is hard to describe/model/predict/define etc., the only rational (not logic) approach to the thing would be that: If we see Nemesis, there is a possibility that it is there, but if we don't see it, it doesn't mean that it isn't there, it just means that there is a possibility that it isn't there, which implies a possibility that it is there. Since the rules of the games are blurred, and the rules of the known cannot be applied with certainty to the rules of the unknown, it's only a matter of conjecture.
OSIT FWIW

Interesting! Sounds like a question for the Cs.

Definitely. The answer to a question how long it takes for the companion to arrive was 0 to 14 years which means, if taken in general terms, that any event can happen right now out of blue. This suggests we are part of a multidimensional (multidensity) space.
Of course we can take into account only the 3D influences and even then not all of them because that would require all embracing knowledge.
So it might be as well that we will not see it coming until it is too late. But we can still make some very approximate prediction based on the manifestation of the companion in this physical plane.

 

[The Mechanic]

So it does look like the WISE mission found objects within the Galactic plane as well. This in turn suggests that the companion star must be cooler than 150 K - which was the limit which could be detected by the WISE infrared sensors.

I think that in this regard Harrington was onto something. He published few articles but he was looking for Planet-X, which is in my opinion the cometary swarm with 3600 year period. He pinpointed the location of the "body" in the southern skies in the region of Scorpius. Shortly after he was terminated.
So this only confirms that his theory was valid and the governmental body was not happy about it. This was back in 1992.
I would say that not everything that gets discovered is going public.

As far as I now termination doesn't prove validity of information. Sometimes the ptb eliminate someone who was promoting disinformation just because then people believe what the person said to be true, because he was eliminated. This has happened in the past, I remember a ufo researcher which this was done to.