Descriptions of the "afterlife"/5th Density
- Thread starter Joe
- Start date
That's OK. I don't make things very clear sometimes myself.
Matthew
Jedi Master
Well, thank you for saying what I was trying to say in a way that was more readily comprehensible.
I have been really enjoying this thread and picked up "When did you ever become less by dying?" which I am half way through, purely on the strength of Joe's excellent OP. I also picked up "The Spirits' Book" too as that was very cheap on Kindle. This thread has given me much fruitful thought and it has come at a good time for me, personally.
Wandering Star
The Living Force
Session 28 August 1999.
Q: Anything in particular we should be watching for?
A: No. Be open to all possibilities.
Q: Are we on the verge of a) an alien invasion; b) a cometary impact; c) the appearance of a twin sun, a death star in our solar system?
A: Wait and see.
Q: I don't want to wait and see! (A) Wait and see! When it hits us, we will know! (L) Let me ask this....
A: What a glorious transition to 4th density STO. With maybe a quick stopover in 5th just to pick up a few things for the trip!
Q: Are you saying that we are getting ready for the Big Kahuna?
A: Only Don Ho knows for sure.
Q: What?!
A: Well, you did say "Kaahuna," yes?
Q: Okay, you have repeatedly, in the past year, alluded to something that we are supposed to be watching for, that we are supposed to 'enjoy the show,' and all that sort of thing. Now you have made this remark about 5th density, where 3rd density goes at death. Are you suggesting that a lot of folks are going to check out?
A: Maybe we were trying to Lighten things up a bit!
TO PICK UP A FEW THINGS FOR THE TRIP!
Let's see if I can put my ideas clearly.
The soul is "married" to the genetics when it is present.
A soul in 5D then finds the body and "connects". Life is developing and our personality is forming and growing. In that process, we may have done more or less to our soul. In each interaction we have chosen, either we have "flowed" or we have "forced" or been "contrary" to our being. (I think almost everyone will know what I mean).
That is to say, each time we will be more what our soul "is". The ideal would be to have an almost complete fusion at the end of the incarnation, but we will leave it for the Grand Masters. It is, I believe, the reference of the Urantia book to fusion with the divine spark that inhabits us.
If we are ready to continue to 4D, after death we will go to 5D, where we will "merge" with the rest of our being that we had not yet integrated into the incarnation, and with the full "luggage" we will continue our journey.
What happens if voluntarily, every time, and also with more and more knowledge, we ignore our soul?
The connection is broken and the energy obtained is separated. The luggage will never be claimed.
Ra (Law of One) says that the STS path is "separation". And he says, what is the first separation? The "I" of the "I". The STS soul does not have the help of its higher Self, because it has rejected it.
Also, this break with our soul is only achieved with a choice say "countercurrent" of 95%. Those who do not reach the level are not accepted in the "kingdom" STS and can meet their soul.
On the other hand, getting "flow" in harmony with our soul by 55%, is not easy, since it requires sacrifice. It's a (here would be a curse). And we do it simply because the other choice, the one that would make us be very happy, with great pleasure and comfort, observing it with attention, we see that it would be a life "useless".
Q: Anything in particular we should be watching for?
A: No. Be open to all possibilities.
Q: Are we on the verge of a) an alien invasion; b) a cometary impact; c) the appearance of a twin sun, a death star in our solar system?
A: Wait and see.
Q: I don't want to wait and see! (A) Wait and see! When it hits us, we will know! (L) Let me ask this....
A: What a glorious transition to 4th density STO. With maybe a quick stopover in 5th just to pick up a few things for the trip!
Q: Are you saying that we are getting ready for the Big Kahuna?
A: Only Don Ho knows for sure.
Q: What?!
A: Well, you did say "Kaahuna," yes?
Q: Okay, you have repeatedly, in the past year, alluded to something that we are supposed to be watching for, that we are supposed to 'enjoy the show,' and all that sort of thing. Now you have made this remark about 5th density, where 3rd density goes at death. Are you suggesting that a lot of folks are going to check out?
A: Maybe we were trying to Lighten things up a bit!
TO PICK UP A FEW THINGS FOR THE TRIP!
Let's see if I can put my ideas clearly.
The soul is "married" to the genetics when it is present.
A soul in 5D then finds the body and "connects". Life is developing and our personality is forming and growing. In that process, we may have done more or less to our soul. In each interaction we have chosen, either we have "flowed" or we have "forced" or been "contrary" to our being. (I think almost everyone will know what I mean).
That is to say, each time we will be more what our soul "is". The ideal would be to have an almost complete fusion at the end of the incarnation, but we will leave it for the Grand Masters. It is, I believe, the reference of the Urantia book to fusion with the divine spark that inhabits us.
If we are ready to continue to 4D, after death we will go to 5D, where we will "merge" with the rest of our being that we had not yet integrated into the incarnation, and with the full "luggage" we will continue our journey.
What happens if voluntarily, every time, and also with more and more knowledge, we ignore our soul?
The connection is broken and the energy obtained is separated. The luggage will never be claimed.
Ra (Law of One) says that the STS path is "separation". And he says, what is the first separation? The "I" of the "I". The STS soul does not have the help of its higher Self, because it has rejected it.
Also, this break with our soul is only achieved with a choice say "countercurrent" of 95%. Those who do not reach the level are not accepted in the "kingdom" STS and can meet their soul.
On the other hand, getting "flow" in harmony with our soul by 55%, is not easy, since it requires sacrifice. It's a (here would be a curse). And we do it simply because the other choice, the one that would make us be very happy, with great pleasure and comfort, observing it with attention, we see that it would be a life "useless".
Joe,
My answer was:
I now realize my reference was not what you were talking about. I just noticed the issue of 4D bases with some kind of a density elevator (which is "literally" an elevator and also mentions 5D). The whole chapter left me with more questions than answers and I think I got carried away trying to put pieces together.
It now seems to me that you were asking about whether 4D has a reincarnation cycle "through" 5D. The best I can come up with now is this one session.
Session 7 January 1995:
I may be wrong but it looks like 4D also goes to 5D/5th level for their next incarnation (and last?).
It does seem like that would be a good question to ask the Cs for clarification.
I really probably didn't understand your question clearly enough. If you meant reincarnate in a 4D variable physicality body that puts it in a whole different perspective.
I just wondered if 4D beings that 'die' go to 5th.
Matthew
Jedi Master
That is how I see it too. As I understand it 6D is the first stage where a soul does not need to go back to 5D. So in respect of Joe's question, where else would 4D go if not to 5D as it did when it was at 1D, 2D and 3D?
happyliza
The Living Force
I think that when 4Dsts go to 5D contemplation zone there are distince 'energy barriers' to protect the harmony of 5D. Also because entities are attracted to those of similar energies - affinities, even for STS, they are 'guided' to the 'lower realms/spheres' of 5D. The umbral/hellish places that their intentions/choices/actions fit them for.
At any time they can ask for help or 'repent' etc to rise to the the next sphere.
However, their lies and manipulations are evident in the 'energy' so they truly have to be genuine if they ask for forgiveness as all thoughts are transparent.
Those who have 'relatives' in such areas are permitted to 'visit' though only as part of a team,for their safety, should they wish to help 'encourage' them psychologically. Though I don't think it is quite as straight-forward 'encouragement' as we view it due to free will.
There are regular 'charitable' teams that visit lower areas to do all sorts of work - to our planet too - consistently.
There is much para 'technology' used for many different instances including 'buses' that are used like 'shuttles' to our world (though these could be purely psychological crutches for the recently departed who wish to visit their living families). As we also know that travel is purely by volition - thoughts/intention.
There is also the possibility that cities are created directly above the relevant city here on earth. This may well be done by those who have the persistent craving for the 'life/homes' they left behind. In fact it occurred to me that should that 'city' filmed in the sky in China not have been a fake, it would exactly represent what such mentally created cities would look like - nearly an exact replica.
Regarding how far from the ground 5th density is I recall two different descriptions. Firstly that the 'higher spheres' are approximately 7 miles above our planet. (This either from the Spirits Book, or Genesis).
Secondly, that T.C. Lethbridge in The Power of the Pendulum states:
I do wonder though about serious nuclear blasts here affecting other spheres or levels, as other realities seem to interpenetrate or be interspersed. Even if they are non-material. Perhaps why the C's mentioned in the negative about nuclear (if I am recalling correctly?).
At any time they can ask for help or 'repent' etc to rise to the the next sphere.
However, their lies and manipulations are evident in the 'energy' so they truly have to be genuine if they ask for forgiveness as all thoughts are transparent.
Those who have 'relatives' in such areas are permitted to 'visit' though only as part of a team,for their safety, should they wish to help 'encourage' them psychologically. Though I don't think it is quite as straight-forward 'encouragement' as we view it due to free will.
There are regular 'charitable' teams that visit lower areas to do all sorts of work - to our planet too - consistently.
There is much para 'technology' used for many different instances including 'buses' that are used like 'shuttles' to our world (though these could be purely psychological crutches for the recently departed who wish to visit their living families). As we also know that travel is purely by volition - thoughts/intention.
There is also the possibility that cities are created directly above the relevant city here on earth. This may well be done by those who have the persistent craving for the 'life/homes' they left behind. In fact it occurred to me that should that 'city' filmed in the sky in China not have been a fake, it would exactly represent what such mentally created cities would look like - nearly an exact replica.
Regarding how far from the ground 5th density is I recall two different descriptions. Firstly that the 'higher spheres' are approximately 7 miles above our planet. (This either from the Spirits Book, or Genesis).
Secondly, that T.C. Lethbridge in The Power of the Pendulum states:
I do wonder though about serious nuclear blasts here affecting other spheres or levels, as other realities seem to interpenetrate or be interspersed. Even if they are non-material. Perhaps why the C's mentioned in the negative about nuclear (if I am recalling correctly?).
Thanks for this thread, it is most enlightening. I wanted to post on a lot of the parts in the beginning, but didn't take notes so I'd have to go back and reread those parts. I want to comment on the recent mention of soul smashing, because every so often when that comes up I get worried about it.
I'll start off by saying that I have some Christian programming with fear of going to hell or soul death. And fear of being left behind and missing out. So it could be that, combined with low self-esteem that gets me worried about it. And also when I'm in a funky mood it makes me think about it.
It's hard to imagine not being you. If you were soul smashed, wouldn't there be no you to perceive it? And I wonder if you would get to say goodbyes like OP's do when they make the temporary stop in 5D before their second death.
I suppose materialists and OPs would fear death if they think they only live one life. But there are souls, and they are what count. So if there is the possibility of soul death, then that is the death you should fear, OSIT.
We have warnings about how to avoid physical death: 'danger: high voltage', 'don't poke the bear', 'caution: poison', etc. So I wonder what would be an indication of the risk of getting soul smashed? Or what do you avoid doing?
I wonder if you just die while in the body, or if it happens when you get to 5D? I've been meaning to post this in a private board and personalize it, but this is fine for now. I wonder if addiction or long term dissociation would put you at risk? I've had a dopamine problem for some years now and find I easily dissociate.
Well, I'm probably over worried but I thought I'd share my thoughts on it. On a more positive note, I sometimes think that it wouldn't matter. Because if you were going to be soul smashed, then you literally have nothing to lose. And everything you do matters even more.
I'll start off by saying that I have some Christian programming with fear of going to hell or soul death. And fear of being left behind and missing out. So it could be that, combined with low self-esteem that gets me worried about it. And also when I'm in a funky mood it makes me think about it.
It's hard to imagine not being you. If you were soul smashed, wouldn't there be no you to perceive it? And I wonder if you would get to say goodbyes like OP's do when they make the temporary stop in 5D before their second death.
I suppose materialists and OPs would fear death if they think they only live one life. But there are souls, and they are what count. So if there is the possibility of soul death, then that is the death you should fear, OSIT.
We have warnings about how to avoid physical death: 'danger: high voltage', 'don't poke the bear', 'caution: poison', etc. So I wonder what would be an indication of the risk of getting soul smashed? Or what do you avoid doing?
I wonder if you just die while in the body, or if it happens when you get to 5D? I've been meaning to post this in a private board and personalize it, but this is fine for now. I wonder if addiction or long term dissociation would put you at risk? I've had a dopamine problem for some years now and find I easily dissociate.
Well, I'm probably over worried but I thought I'd share my thoughts on it. On a more positive note, I sometimes think that it wouldn't matter. Because if you were going to be soul smashed, then you literally have nothing to lose. And everything you do matters even more.
In 'Darkness over Tibet', this question is adressed in the following terms:
I think the "Trying to put one's self on a level with the Creator" remark was interesting knowing that it perfectly describes the core of the enlightenment ideology that killed God and replaced him with the 'citizen' in all his materialistic and individualistic 'glory'.
Identity politics illustrates this tendency to deny 'natural and divine laws' and to replace them with diktats established by individuals.
I'll say there should be a kind of desire to get smashed or, at the opposite end, a desire to smash all. All of us might have thought of such possibilities either consciously or subconsciously at some levels of our STS experience. However, with a sufficiently strong STO tendency present, I think, such STS desires or possibilities will not come true. Free will rules after all. But our possible strong blockages on the path to STO can cause us to fear and experience getting smashed to this or that extent. So, I think the fear of getting actually/completely soul-smashed for someone with a sufficiently strong STO disposition relates more to fears about not being able to resolve some possible blockage(s). Being aware of this, to the extent this is actually the case, will help to take steps for resolving blockages.
I could be wrong, but my understanding from reading the Wave is that they do. There is also the interesting session 22 June 1996, where the following was discussed (apologies if this was already posted):
3Dstudent, to add to Pierre's remark, re-reading this session Session 9 June 2018 might be helpful in regards to your inquiries, it's right onto the soul smashing issue, becoming possessed by the prevalent beliefs system oriented towards postmodernism, and materialism. The core of it seems to be a denial of reality and having no capacity to appreciate anything higher than oneself. A great session in its entirety.
Fascinating accounts of Terminal Lucidity, Gaby. The question is, do morphine and sedatives possibly hinder that process and prevent one to carry a message at that stage? May it keep you wandering a bit more than needed? Although it helps you deal with pain, maybe it doesn't help in accepting the process? I don't know.
Fascinating accounts of Terminal Lucidity, Gaby. The question is, do morphine and sedatives possibly hinder that process and prevent one to carry a message at that stage? May it keep you wandering a bit more than needed? Although it helps you deal with pain, maybe it doesn't help in accepting the process? I don't know.
Wandering Star
The Living Force
The phrase "to break the soul" suggests the image of what we know here. In other words, something that breaks is no longer useful, it is broken.
But I think it's a choice. Some love light and others love darkness. Those who choose darkness "disconnect" from themselves. They are disconnected from their future selves and the soul (which is everything) is broken. But it is a choice and also involves a lot of experiences. They say that this path ends in a wall and some of us resound that this is true, but those who choose to "break the soul" and disconnect themselves in no case believe it. Until they arrive there and see it with their own eyes they will not accept it. And even in that case, some will continue firmly on that path even if they begin to perceive that their race decays.
But even in those cases, according to Ra (Law of One) any soul (in this case a part of the total soul) can choose to release the potential difference and change "instantly" to the STO path. The term instantaneous in spiritual terms can take some "time" from our perspective, equal to the difference between a quantum leap at the macrocosmic level and another at the microcosmic level.
Therefore, from my discernment we should not worry at all about the term "breaking the soul", because each one of us will be exactly where we want to be.
But I think it's a choice. Some love light and others love darkness. Those who choose darkness "disconnect" from themselves. They are disconnected from their future selves and the soul (which is everything) is broken. But it is a choice and also involves a lot of experiences. They say that this path ends in a wall and some of us resound that this is true, but those who choose to "break the soul" and disconnect themselves in no case believe it. Until they arrive there and see it with their own eyes they will not accept it. And even in that case, some will continue firmly on that path even if they begin to perceive that their race decays.
But even in those cases, according to Ra (Law of One) any soul (in this case a part of the total soul) can choose to release the potential difference and change "instantly" to the STO path. The term instantaneous in spiritual terms can take some "time" from our perspective, equal to the difference between a quantum leap at the macrocosmic level and another at the microcosmic level.
Therefore, from my discernment we should not worry at all about the term "breaking the soul", because each one of us will be exactly where we want to be.