Don't you think a predestined action is something you are not aware of?

[Color]

Seems you are so afraid of becoming Messengers of the new age ;)

? ?

sorry, but I lost you within this remark...
Can you explain what you meant with that?

Thanx

Alice

 

[Adaryn]

So apparently there are several groups developing several conduits.

These conduits seem to allow 3D entities to move towards 4D STO. We might assume that those conduits are bilateral and once the frequency is strongly anchored in our 3D earth it might also allow the intervention of 4D STO into this 3D realm.

So a group of 4D STO candidate might also play a "cavalry" role, preparing the ground for the intervention of the "heavy artillery"

An interesting quote :

Q: (A) We were several times told that "help is on the way." What kind of help?
A: When you begin to expand the potential network you will rattle a lot of bushes.
Q: (L) The thing that concerns me is that I am nervous about such ideas. Generally speaking, such approaches generally lead to an organization which then leads to codification, which then leads to all kinds of problems. You can't keep it personal and simple. Bigger networks, means more people, means more opportunities for twisting and distortion and problem. There is just so much potential for people becoming involved who do not have the same intent we have, who don't have the intent the group has, and just a whole host of things that come to mind here. When you start getting big, you can't give enough attention to everything. For now, we take care of everything ourselves. We protect the group so that they can gather their awareness; they are making extraordinary progress; and how can you do that on a larger scale?
A: At some point there will be those among your group who will step forward and accept the mantle of teacher. Your role as teachers of teachers is one that may produce the balancing energy needed for the STO harvest to be plentiful indeed. Perhaps you should relax and not be afraid of the child you have borne taking its first step out in the world. There are many teachers in your group. Each of them will awaken to their mission destiny profile as appropriate.

My understanding of "intervention", or more accurately, "help": conduit would be developed by a group of people with the right frequency, then a bridge would be created allowing direct contact with 4D STO. Which for me doesn't mean at all that anybody's going to save us or anything like that. I just see it as a possibility – for people with the right frequency, reached after much Work on themselves – of direct networking and sharing with 4D STO as we are doing here on this forum. The C's didn't come out as saviours ; they did help Laura to See and awaken. They provided inspiration, and she did the Work. She showed us that maybe, other people can do it too. And thus get "help" (from themselves in the future) AFTER much cleaning. See this thread
This is my personal understanding now, which of course might be wrong.

 

[anart]

Undertand what you mean, you are looking carefully to each word the others use, but this word means to: To come, appear, or lie between two things.

Actually, Alice is merely understanding the basic concepts.

Some of you have adopted a way of thinking correlated with certain keywords and an alarm system skips when listening them

And you appear to have a cup that is full - and an understanding based on your own subjective interpretations, flavored with a 'new age' twist of savior-ship and dreaming.

If you only see the words you will not receive the message, If I only think of you as Alice will not see the truth

If you, ana, misunderstand everything due to dreaming, you will receive any message you choose, but it will not be the truth.

Seems you are so afraid of becoming Messengers of the new age ;)

It seems that ana is quite invested in some newage ideas, and due to this fact is having difficulty understanding basic concepts and understandings. It seems time to put some sacred cows out to pasture, ana - and at least consider that you are fundamentally misunderstanding things.

 

[ana]

Seems you are so afraid of becoming Messengers of the new age ;)

? ?

sorry, but I lost you within this remark...
Can you explain what you meant with that?

Thanx

Alice

Alice I mean, it seems to me that in some way you confuse spirituality with new age way of thinking.

Possibly as Anart said in his last message I'm understanding based on my own subjective interpretations, flavored with a 'new age' twist of savior-ship and dreaming, but if it's the main problem, the way Anart has to show truth is not precisely enlightening as it seems he prefers to underestimate others if they cannot see what he knows.

It seems time to put some sacred cows out to pasture, ana - and at least consider that you are fundamentally misunderstanding things.

 

[anart]

Alice I mean, it seems to me that in some way you confuse spirituality with new age way of thinking.

Perhaps you could take the time to explain your understanding of the difference?

Possibly as Anart said in his last message I'm  understanding based on my own subjective interpretations, flavored with a 'new age' twist of savior-ship and dreaming, but if it's the main problem, the way Anart has to show truth is not precisely enlightening as it seems he prefers to underestimate others if they cannot see what he knows.

Not at all, it simply does not serve you or anyone well if misunderstandings (or an apparent lack of understanding) are not pointed out.  If one is here to learn, then that becomes clear - if one is not, then that also becomes clear.  Anart is not a 'he', by the way - just for clarity's sake...

 

[Color]

Alice I mean, it seems to me that in some way you confuse spirituality with new age way of thinking.

Interesting remark. Maybe this quote from Cass could help, putting some light
into this discussion:

Q: (L) But I asked if there were any interacting with Earth...

A: And we are answering that question. We have chosen to
take this opportunity to put things into better focus for you,
and we are hoping that these messages will be heard by
others, and not just you. While YOU may understand these
concepts perfectly well, not all do. Certainly you know that?
Therefore, that is why we are giving this information. Now, to
answer your question: Are there any beings who reside in the
vicinity of Sirius who are positively oriented, or STO as it
were, again it is difficult to answer that because we do not
know how to define the "vicinity of Sirius." But, if you mean
within a light year or so of Sirius, as you measure distance,
then we can say there are no such beings in that area in 3rd
density. But that leaves open 4th through 6th density. So, you
see, as you already know, but we wish to reinforce this, there
is so much to contemplate here that it is laughable when those
around you refer to certain areas or star systems and claim
that there are beings from here or there or wherever, and that
their objective is this or that or the other. Because if you knew
the TRUE nature of the universe, of All of the universe, of all
possible realms, you would also know that any and all things
are possible, and, in fact, DO exist! You must NOT forget
this.

Q: (L) So, in other words, these people are right?

A: All of these people are right, and all of these people are
wrong. Because it is silly to point to some section of the sky,
to ascribe any area as being the "Home" of this that or the
other.

Q: (L) But what if that is, in fact, the case? The Orions live in
some star system in Orion, right?

A: So are you.

Q: (L) Well, we aren't living there now!

A: That's not the point. If you were to stay in 3rd density and
view your star, which you know as the sun, from another
point in your galaxy, it would appear to be a part of the Orion
system. Would it not?

Q: (L) Probably.

A: Well, now perhaps you are beginning to understand what
we are talking about??? At one level, and in one sense.

Q: (L) Well, how do these beings get here crossing such vast
reaches of space?

A: As we have told you, there are seven levels of density
which involves, among other things, not only state of being
physically, spiritually and etherically, and materially, but also,
more importantly, state of awareness. You see, state of
awareness is the key element to all existence in creation. You
have undoubtedly remembered that we have told you that this
is, after all, a grand illusion, have you not? So, therefore, if it is
a grand illusion, what is more important, physical structure or
state of awareness???

Q: (L) State of awareness?

A: Exactly. Now, when we go from the measuring system,
which of course has been nicely formulated so that you can
understand it, of density levels one through seven, the key
concept, of course, is state of awareness. All the way
through. So, once you rise to a higher state of awareness,
such things as physical limitation evaporate. And, when they
evaporate, vast distances, as you perceive them, become
non-existent. So, just because you are unable to see and
understand has absolutely no bearing whatsoever on what is
or is not possible. Except within your own level of density.
And this is what almost no one on your current level of
density is able to understand. If you can understand it and
convey it to them, you will be performing the greatest service
that your kind has ever seen. Think about that for a moment.
Let it seep into your consciousness. Analyze it. Dissect it.
Look at it carefully and then put it back together again.

Q: (L) What is it that limits our awareness?

A: Your environment. And it is the environment that you have
chosen. By your level of progress. And that is what limits
everything. As you rise to higher levels of density, limitations
are removed.

Q: (L) What creates this environment of limitation?

A: It is the grand illusion which is there for the purpose of
learning.

Q: (L) And who put the illusion into place?

A: The Creator who is also the Created. Which is also you
and us and all. As we have told you, we are you and vice
versa. And so is everything else.

Q: (L) Is the key that it is all illusion?

A: Basically, yes.

Q: (L) So, essentially...

A: As we have told you before, if you will be patient just a
moment, the universe is merely a school. And, a school is
there for all to learn. That is why everything exists. There is no
other reason. Now, if only you understood the true depth of
that statement, you would begin to start to see, and
experience for yourself, all the levels of density that it is
possible to experience, all the dimensions that it is possible to
experience, all awareness. When an individual understands
that statement to its greatest possible depth, that individual
becomes illumined. And, certainly you have heard of that.
And, for one moment, which lasts for all eternity, that
individual knows absolutely everything that there is to know.

Q: (L) So, you are saying that the path to illumination is
knowledge and not love?

A: That is correct.

Q: (L) Is it also correct that emotion can be used to mislead,
that is emotions that are twisted and generated strictly from
the flesh or false programming?

A: Emotion that limits is an impediment to progress. Emotion
is also necessary to make progress in 3rd density. It is natural.
When you begin to separate limiting emotions based on
assumptions from emotions that open one to unlimited
possibilities, that means you are preparing for the next density.

Q: (L) What about Love?

A: What about it?

Q: (L) There are many teachings that are promulgated that
Love is the key, the answer. They say that illumination and
knowledge and what-not can all be achieved through love.

A: The problem is not the term "love," the problem is the
interpretation of the term. Those on third density have a
tendency to confuse the issue horribly. After all, they confuse
many things as love. When the actual definition of love as you
know it is not correct either. It is not necessarily a feeling that
one has that can also be interpreted as an emotion, but rather,
as we have told you before, the essence of light which is
knowledge is love, and this has been corrupted when it is said
that love leads to illumination. Love is Light is Knowledge.
Love makes no sense when common definitions are used as
they are in your environment. To love you must know. And to
know is to have light. And to have light is to love. And to
have knowledge is to love.

Possibly as Anart said in his last message I'm understanding based on my own subjective interpretations, flavored with a 'new age' twist of savior-ship and dreaming, but if it's the main problem, the way Anart has to show truth is not precisely enlightening as it seems he prefers to underestimate others if they cannot see what he knows.

Anart is a lady, not 'he' ;) That aside, I'm at loss with finding any 'better' explanation then provided in above quoted transcripts...


Alice

 

[Adaryn]

Possibly as Anart said in his last message I'm understanding based on my own subjective interpretations, flavored with a 'new age' twist of savior-ship and dreaming,

I don't think you sincerely consider this as a possibility at all, even though you write 'possibly'. You just sound very offended by Anart's answer. Question is are you willing to take some emotional distance and really, sincerely, begin to consider the possibility Anart might be spot on, that she (and other members here) see things about you (from your posts) that you don't see?

Your posts do have a new age touch :

If you only see the words you will not receive the message, If I only think of you as Alice will not see the truth

Words carry a meaning, it's the words who convey the message. How am I supposed to understand the message if I don't consider the words? By "feeling" the poster's intentions? But impressions/feelings are subjective and unreliable.

 

[christx11]

Hello everyone, Xman,
{TRIMMED}

And while can see now that i took these lines in a different context than the one they had, it seemed to me at the time, that Ana's use of the phrase "Someone with the Nordic Heritage" was quite restricting to the possibility there are might be many people and with other than Nordic heritage that might stand up to Archetype mentioned, and i wanted to comment on that. ? wanted to say that if we are to be helped with our own consent in a true STO manner, then we should continue working with ourselves as both ends of that "communication" are equally important.

So, i guess due to this mis-understanding i was trying to make a pointless point that it might be better to be equally open between the two possibilities (one vs many) that appeared to "split" out of my subjective comprehension of Ana's post. My incomplete knowledge of the full context of the transcripts together with these little "details" i just mentioned made me -for the shake of having a more percipient conversation- take the "side" of the possibility of the existance of "many" during my arguement. My original use of the word "saviour" (in quotes) was made with a sense of humour and i actually said:

But without being able to tell for sure if A "saviour" is on the way right now, and if i was allowed to choose, i would certainly prefer for US to save our own selves this time, just for once, just for the shake of variety... Let alone that we are running out of proper real-estate for new temples lately. All the good places are taken...

So the "frolicsome" mood of mine is evident here IMO, even though it does not appear to be very successfull in the occasion ;)

I agree with you that Ana seems to carry some of her own preconceptions here of what is STO / STS and the role of Nordics and other things. I wasn't trying to support Ana as much as I was trying to say such a scenario was possible, there could be an individual who helped to facilitate the creation of a group in a non-breaching of free will way and that in and of itself I did not see as a savior type of thing. And there could be several.

And yes, I also think it is limiting as Ana has focused on just a couple aspects here she wanted to emphasize. The C's sessions do make it clear in many places that Laura's work (individual and group) is only one developing conduit, meaning there are others. And even the references to one's of STO profile and dark and light sides of some Nordics is in a more than "one" context from the sessions. And I do not recall anything restricting STO profile to only Nordics.

Ana does seem to attach the idea that this person written about in the book 'If she can hold her place in the gates of time.' is "Someone with the Nordic Heritage". At least it comes off that way.

Ana also seems to have some strong preconceptions about who or what Jesus perhaps is or is not. I think Ana is missing a ton of information on psychopathy and self-work. She seems to be good at little quips that don't quite fit without a larger understanding of things, and a lot of religious undertones come through.
{TRIMMED}

{TRIMMED}
i was not asking YOU directly or saying these words as your opinion of course, rather than presenting a notion so as to make a point which is also to be examined. Thus i should probably start by saying "When we say that this person....etc" to make this point more evident, and not "you say" because when this is taken literally can appear as my own interpretation of what you said, while it was ment more like a rhetorical question.

Anyway, i think too that no contradiction exists :), and i feel that i have used enough "space" to explain my point for now before i really start spliting hairs. Points taken ;)

Thank you Xman for the time spent on your post in reply to mine, and the all others for your patience.

Got it. And I understand better now also. Thanks for putting up with my little back in the air a bit also.

 

[John G]

My understanding of "intervention", or more accurately, "help": conduit would be developed by a group of people with the right frequency, then a bridge would be created allowing direct contact with 4D STO. Which for me doesn't mean at all that anybody's going to save us or anything like that. I just see it as a possibility – for people with the right frequency, reached after much Work on themselves – of direct networking and sharing with 4D STO as we are doing here on this forum. The C's didn't come out as saviours ; they did help Laura to See and awaken. They provided inspiration, and she did the Work. She showed us that maybe, other people can do it too. And thus get "help" (from themselves in the future) AFTER much cleaning. See this thread
This is my personal understanding now, which of course might be wrong.

A word for what 4D STO has been doing here before any bridging is "observing" and for what the Cs have done since bursting on to the scene with Laura is "hinting". I think of 6th density and beige berets like Jesus and even the universe itself as perhaps curving the universe a little to improve the quality of our lessons a bit after getting an "asking" that lets the answering be up to the universe. The curving could be from hints or more behind the scenes things. STO also has a battle going on with STS that can effect us too regardless of our "asking". As for the "find a Nordic", I would say they might provide more real time higher bandwidth hints than 6th Density. Some hints can be more direct than others as one can tell from listening to the Cs. The curving of the universe can perhaps seem like a predestination thing but it is I think just the universe responding to the lessons you learn with some more tailored to you lessons. Even the "programmed" lessons aren't going to kick in unless you reach the appropriate point in your learning. Even bad programming must be a lesson of sorts since all there is is lessons.

Just a couple weeks ago the "find a Nordic" thing was so far burried back in my mind I had basically forgot about it, but I just recently read about it again while looking for Nordic Covenent stuff to review (for obvious current events reasons). When I first came here to this forum people started popping out of the woodwork and it really seemed like I had made it on to some kind of watch list. I mentioned most all of it here on this forum. One person I didn't mention cause I knew him a little since he works at the school where my wife teaches. I started seeing him everywhere and it was a little creepy but I was on edge back then anyways. He didn't say much other than once he asked me about what I used to do back when I worked at IBM and once when I was with my wife he mentioned that he had been running in to me a lot and something was said that caused my wife to say that I'm quiet and don't say a lot. He had also mentioned to my wife that he and his wife attended the same engagement encounter as us (twelve years ago) though we don't remember anybody from it, I didn't even live here then, only my wife did, I didn't move here until six years ago. After I got more comfortable with reality he kind of went back to the back of my mind with a label of potential CIA informant or something but nothing to be really worried about, I had stopped seeing him so much too. Well for some strange reason when I read the "find a Nordic" thing again it popped into my mind that I might have this guy totally wrongly labeled, he could be a Nordic for all I know.

Adding to that quick thought, I was late dropping the kids off earlier this week so I had to park in the lot to walk them into the school and he pulls into the spot right next to me with his kid to walk her in (she happens to be in my wife's class this year). He doesn't look Nordic so i'm not sure why I'm not just sticking to CIA or synchronicity (I've had lots of synchronicity with people I think about in my life). But there was the idea that there are three variations of Nordics and I think that is what made me think about him actually. What would the variations be? Tall Blonde, red-head, and what some dark haired Nordic (since he has dark hair). Well I eventually found the Saami (he very much has the build and look of one), which are briefly mentioned on this forum (under Sami and Laplander) and on a disinformation site related to Nordic aliens. I searched his last name and Saami too and creepily found his actual website but it's not too creepy cause it was just a page of flags, one of which was the Saami one. Anyways it is hard to believe a 4D STO Nordic could actually pose with a family so for now I'm just filing it as an interesting research lesson.

 

[Laura]

Ana, remember: New Age rhymes with sewage - and that's what most of it is.

Since this is a cassiopaean forum, I don't think you will object if I quote the Cs. If you do not agree with the information, you are welcome to visit another forum where the information is more to your liking.

30 July 1994

Q: (L) Is there any way we can prevent Orion abductions?
A: No.
Q: (L) Why?
A: It would interfere with universal law of free will and service to self.
Q: (L) But we don't want to be abducted. Can't we stop it?
A: Not likely. They have more power than you.
Q: (L) Well then, why can't you help us?
A: Would interfere in natural progression of your race and theirs. Jews called upon us to save them - could not. And natives of your land from your race - could not stop that either. Natural progression, see?

5 December 1994

A: Please understand, we are not here to lead you by the
hand, because, that would interfere with your free will,
which is how you learn, which is how you progress.

27 December 1994

Q: (L) Back to my question. Now, at one point in the
transcript of past sessions you said that you could not
help the Jews or the Native Americans who called upon you,
and yet, you say that when we call on you that you can
help us. What is the difference?
A: Did not say that, review transcript now!
Q: (L) Well, what I remember is that I asked if our race
was going to be wiped out by the Lizzies and the answer
was "Maybe." And then... well, I'll get it out now...
okay, it says here; "We don't want to be abducted, can't
we stop it?" And you answered: "Not likely, they have more
power than you." Then I asked: "Why can't you help us?"
and you answered: "Would interfere in natural progression
of your race and theirs. The Jews called upon us to save
them and we could not. And the natives of your land
called upon us and we could not save them from your race.
We could not stop that either. It is natural progression,
see?" And then I asked: "Are we going to be wiped out by
aliens as part of this natural progression?" Answer:
"Maybe..." Okay, so, in a sense, the question related
specifically to stopping abductions and you said no, you
could not stop that and you said that you could not save
the Jews or the Native Americans because it would
interfere in Natural Progression... yet you said you could
help us individually if we called upon you for help...
What is the difference?
A: We cannot interfere to help, knowledge protects, ignorance
endangers. You can help yourselves to gain knowledge, we
can be the "conduit."
Q: (V) So, that is a misinterpretation on all our
parts of what this help might or might not be?

4 March 1995

(T) Okay. We are missing a key topic or
issue, here, that's true.
A: 4th level STO!
Q: (L) Is that the title of the topic?
A: You have only thought of 4th level STS.
Q: (L) Ahhh! What Susan was talking about, we need to ask
about the good guys.
A: They are the only ones who can help you defend yourselves
against 4th level attack!!!! We give you information
which is invaluable in nature, but remember we are 6th
level STO, Beings of light, and on this density level
there simply is no interference with free will no matter
how detrimental to you!!!
Q: (T) 4th density STO beings can actually help in a
meaningful way! We knew there was both sides, but we
never asked. We have been concentrating on the Lizards.
(S) Yeah! There are 16 groups on both sides, and noboby
has ever asked... (J) And by concentrating on the Lizards,
we have been feeding their f______energy. (F) Their damn
energy. (J) Their damn energy. (T) That DARN energy!
Who are these 4th density STO beings that we need to
contact? Obviously we need to talk to them because they
can talk to us. Sixth density "Us" can't. A: Orion
Federation.
Q: (L) And who are the members of the Orion Federation? A:
Not yet.
Q: (L) What can you tell us? (T) The Orion Federation is
4th density?
A: You have asked us to protect you, it is important for you
to understand that we are beyond that!
Q: (L) We understand that. (J) I understand that. (T) We
understand that you, at 6th density, can't interfere with
free will on either side. But, the Orion Federation...
A: First, incorrect thought patterns which have become
imbedded must be purged before you can move onto next
subject.
Q: (J) It's like: D__ must be purged before she can come back
into this group, she must get rid of her incorrect thought
patterns. We have incorrect thought patterns that must be
removed also. (L) What are they, Freddy? (F) Don't ask
me. Ask them. (J) Well, they're not going to tell us
that. (T) Why not? Let's ask. (F) Yeah, if they are not
goint to tell us, they will tell us that they are not
going to tell us. (T) What are the incorrect thought
patterns?
A: That we protect.
Q: (T) Well, you said that Knowledge protects. You have been
providing knowledge. (J) Uh uh. (T) No?
A: Indirectly.
Q: (J) They are not really giving it to us, they are helping
us to draw it out of ourselves.
A: We are providing invaluable information which becomes
knowledge, but you are under attack, therefore, you could
maybe use some direct power from the same density as the
attack is coming from.
Q: (F) But, until you have total knowledge... (L) You don't
have the kind of power we are talking about needing.
(F) Right. We would would need 500,000 pages of
transcript to have that kind of knowledge, to get to that
point. (L) Okay, what is the phone number of the Orion
Federation? (S) Laura! (T) That's what I was going to
ask. [Laughter.] (L) How do we get ahold of them?
A: Off the hook!

27 Jan 1996

Q: (L) How do we get assistance from higher realms?
A: By asking and...
Q: (L) What is the limit to the kind of assistance we can
receive?
A: Limit?!? We live within a realm that includes no such
thing!!!
Q: (L) Well, the 'angel thing' is pretty big nowadays. There
are an awful lot of angels running around. My first
thought was: 'what better way for the bad guys to deceive
than to appear as angels.'
A: Not true!!! STS CAN appear as entities incorrectly
perceived as "angels," but if it is really a sixth density
being, incorrect perception is not possible.
Q: (L) I don't understand. There are a LOT of beings who
deceive people. They produce phenomena, they do any
number of things including making people 'feel good,' have
dreams, and all that. What do you mean that incorrect
perception is not possible? It happens all the time!
A: No.
Q: (L) Well, what is the story here?
A: Your perception abilities are short-circuiting due to
vibrational interaction.
Q: (L) If you there is anywhere in you a question about what
you are perceiving, then that question is an indication
that all the rest of what you are perceiving could be
false?
A: Part of the equation.
Q: (L) So, if it is really a 6th density being, it will blow
you away to such an extent that there is NO question?
A: Yes.
Q: (L) Now, what is the other part of the equation?
A: Well, why do you question us? First of all, you question
us because the communication is limited at this point...
you are not yet prepared for stronger envelopment.
Q: (PZ) So, I should continue to pray?
A: All goes to 6th density.
Q: (PZ) Okay, let's say that I have a little child who is
dying of leukemia, and I am praying with everything in me,
and the child dies anyway. I don't get it. What's the
deal here?
A: Wrong. If child dies, that is your lesson profile.
Q: (PZ) Well, why isn't my lesson profile with this
particular situation that is going on in my life right
now, why isn't it continuing? I thought that maybe I need
to...
A: Is it over yet, Pat?
Q: (PZ) No, it isn't over yet, but...
A: So, what is your question, if it is not yet concluded?
Q: (PZ) Can you feel what I am thinking?
A: Yes.
Q: (PZ) So, why do I need to ask?
A: Because we never interfere with free will.
Q: (PZ) If I continue to pray, things will continue to get
better?
A: Things will stay on their intended course.
Q: (PZ) Are you telling me that my life has been predestined?
A: No. If you continue to pray, there is no chance of your
lessons being interrupted or deferred. Clarify.
Q: (PZ) Well, that sounds like it is going to continue, it is
not going to stop.
A: No, clarify means to solidify your understanding of the
answer.
Q: (PZ) Well, I don't understand. (L) I think it is pretty
clear that the things you are experiencing are part of the
lessons.
A: Whatever that is... i.e.: que sera sera.
Q: (PZ) But then, we are back to predestiny?
A: No, lessons.
Q: (PZ) Well, how many damn lessons do you have to get?
A: As many "damn" lessons as you need!
Q: (S) What about the prayers that are directed to Jesus?
A: Jesus is one of us in "special service" sector.
Q: (L) Like a "green beret?"
A: No, more like a "beige beret."
Q: (L) What is a 'beige beret?'
A: Just our term.
Q: (PZ) Well, I have just always wondered if this praying
business is a bunch of malarkey. (L) Oh, no. (PZ) If I
pray a rosary, I am praying to the Virgin Mary. Who is
she? Where is she?
A: "She" is here too.
Q: (PZ) Does that prayer go directly to her and does she then
send you out to do whatever?
A: She is not really a she. And when you write to "Ann
Landers," does she really see it?

4 May 1996

Q: (TK) Well, it seems like there is another side that is
trying to prevent them from gaining control. (L) Well,
from what I understand, the only thing the good guys are
able to do is, because of free will, they have to wait to
be asked for help, and the only they thing they can really
do is give information. (F) Well, this is valuable if
used by the right people at the right time. (TK) You have
to come up with the right questions, too. You have to
have enough information to be able to come up with the
right questions. I am sure the information is there. You
have one group with all these people underground and they
want to take over the planet. This group likes being 4th
density - they don't want to advance. They want to block
advancement. Then, you have the group that want to
advance, they want the natural order to proceed. This
negative group wants to stay there and keep everyone they
can there. (L) And because they deplete themselves and
diminish in numbers, they keep having to supply their
needs and existence. (TK) If, by some odd chance, the
earth is the only place where people come to advance, then
sooner or later it is going to stop, if these other guys
take over, then it will just stop... implode. (TH) I
know! The earth is a 4th density theme park! (L) We
already thought of that... we all have an 'E' ticket ride!
(TK) Obviously we have the information, but we haven't
really dug deep enough so that we don't know the questions
that we need to ask. Is this true?
A: No.
Q: (TK) Is what I was saying close to the truth?
A: Yes. Total truth is elusive.
Q: (TK) So, what I said was the gist of what is going on
here. So, we have to figure out what we are supposed to
do so that the earth can be maintained...
A: You will do what you will do.
Q: (TK) This is true.
A: Do you, in general, control 2nd density beings on earth?
Q: (L) Yes.
A: So, what is "fair" about that?
Q: (L) Nothing.
A: Okay, so what is the difference?!?!???
Q: (TK) So, basically, we control 2nd density, and 4th
density controls us. There are the good guys and bad
guys. (L) And we will do what we will do. Either we
choose to align ourselves with the good guys, or with the
bad guys.
A: It's up to you.
Q: (TK) However, if too many people themselves with the bad
guys, then the balance tips in their favor, and there is
no more advancement, so there has to be education so that
people will know...
A: Tom, you are close, but you are missing the point.
Q: (L) What is the point?
A: The point is, there "has to be" nothing. You will do what
you will do. You choose. We have told you this
repeatedly, but you still suffer from self-centered
perspective.
Q: (TK) Everybody is worried about themselves. They all want
to be saved and not worry about others.
A: More to the point, everybody in an STS realm views
themselves as somehow "special, chosen, or protected."
This is simply not so!!
Q: (TK) What is going to happen, is going to happen. The
people...
A: The body does not matter. It is the soul that either
progresses or digresses, just ask Sandra!
Q: (L) Did Sandra progress or digress?
A: Open.
Q: (L) So, in other words, we could just sit around and live
our lives and have a good time and not worry about a damn
thing. Is that the point?
A: No.
Q: (L) It's our choices?
A: Yes.
Q: (TK) The point is it's going to happen...
A: But, nobody is there to intervene on your behalf as many
would like to believe.
Q: (L) So, we are here on this planet, and we will either
make it or we won't, just like Dorothy and Toto in Oz,
based on our own ability to figure it out, to overcome the
odds, the witch, monkeys and soldiers... (TK) Maybe what
they are trying to do is give people the information, or
make the information available so that people can make the
choice, do they want to stay...
A: We are not "trying" to do anything. We are here to answer
questions if asked. We cannot interfere.
Q: (TK) Yes, the non-interference idea is pretty clear and
understandable. So, they cannot interfere...
A: And, even when we answer, you may not believe, it is up to
you!
Q: (L) So, we are really on our own!
A: You always have been, and so have we, and all others,
too!!

I think all of the above should be pretty clear. If you choose to believe otherwise, then you are just in the wrong bar.

 

[christx11]

Undertand what you mean, you are looking carefully to each word the others use, but this word means to: To come, appear, or lie between two things.

The word has several meanings and as it was used your definition does not fit. Your definition is the use of the word as an "obstruction" - like: The big oak tree intervenes with the view of the lake. This is passive without any effect on either side of the things that it comes between.

That is not how the word was used.

Of course we try to look at how words are used. Words have many meanings. Words and communication are two different things. The same word can be used in different contexts and mean totally different things. Words can also be used for manipulation, where their meaning is one thing but the intent of the communicator is the total opposite.

Those who help...Aren't they between two different realms even if they know the truth

I am not even sure of what you are talking about. Who is "Those who help"?
Without understanding what you mean by "Those who help", the second part of your question cannot be answered.
Why would "they between two different realms" ?
We are helping one another here. We are not between two different realms.

What does "even if they know the truth" have to do with it?

Some of you have adopted a way of thinking correlated with certain keywords and an alarm system skips when listening them

No. We try to understand what a person is saying. What a person is saying and the words they use are often not the same thing. It is called discernment. Words and how they are used often show a person's programming and psychological dispositions. It takes a lot of reading of psychology books and networking and discussion and pain to see those things in oneself and others. But it is possible to make some headway on these things and begin to clean your own mental and psychological makeup from these programs. Unfortunately or fortunately, one of the side effects is that it becomes easier to see these things going on in others once you know the program. And each person may be at a different level of understanding and a different level of being able to see these things as we try to help each other.

If you only see the words you will not receive the message, If I only think of you as Alice will not see the truth

This is one of those little new age quips that has little or no meaning without a specific context. It is useless self talk (ego) that makes the speaker of the words feel like they know something. It is just reinforcing the self.

If you have an understanding of my previous paragraph that starts with, "No. We try to understand what a person is saying.", what we do here is precisely to discern the message (real meaning) hidden in the words, because the words a person uses and how they use them often show a person's programming and psychological dispositions, (and I would add - that they often cannot see themselves).

Discerning the crux of what is going on is much more difficult than words and definitions and even how they are used.

For instance, a person can come to this forum and their first post starts out with what appears to be a compliment to Laura or to forum members. But later in the post this person tells us how they are let down by the way we do some specific thing, such as "I hold this place in such high regard. But I was amazed at your views on such and such...."

Well the words and their definitions aren't a problem. But the words are being used to manipulate. The introductory compliment was not a compliment. It was a tool to get something that the poster wanted. Technically the words and the definitions and even the way they were used were all fine - it was a compliment. But when you discern the manipulation that the compliment was just a tool (flattery to get what the poster wanted), well discernment (seeing) turns the compliment into a lie by the poster.

Figuring out what someone is saying then (discerning the real meaning), is more than just words and definitions, it is also psychology and intentions. So trying to see anothers programs such as this is a big part in examining what people and posters such as yourself are really saying and trying to do.

Your statement - "If you only see the words you will not receive the message", is in actuality what we are doing and that is figuring out what really is being said. It isn't just about receiving the message. It is about figuring out what the message really is because words and definitions are just the gloss of true meaning. And there in lies the crux of the matter of each of our spiritualities.

And there is so much more, that this only touches the surface of it.

Seems you are so afraid of becoming Messengers of the new age ;)

This is another nonsense quip. No one here is interested in becoming "Messengers of the new age". We are here to try and figure out how and why we ourselves are so messed up and if there is any way we can help one another to become "not messed up". If doing by example is what you mean by "Messengers", then maybe there is a message in there somewhere about the responsibility of each individual to change their own nature. But it does not have anything to do with "becoming Messengers of the new age ".

The more you post the more it seems you have some kind of preconceived notions here of what this place is about, what the C's are about, what the WORK is about and so far it seems those views you hold are pretty much off the mark.

If you want to understand better what these things are about, a good place to start would be with the psychology materials listed in the recommended reading thread and then perhaps participating in discussing some of what you have read.

Recommended reading list - http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=4718.msg31032#msg31032

 

[Pierre]

Apologies for having added confusion to this complex topic.

Thanks to the previous posts, it seems clear that the bottom line is the Work. One has first to get rid of his programs, buffers, beliefs and lies. Then the higher centers can work properly without being overhelmed by lower centers noise. This awakening allows some connections with higher/future self.

Keeping in mind the fundamental respect of free will, "help" was definitely a more appropriate word than "intervention" in order to qualify the STO approach.

 

[Adaryn]

Regarding the extracts quoted by Ana and the issue of potential 'STO help', here are very interesting clues given by Laura some time ago:

Q: ....But, I do think that there is somebody in the world whose role that
is, and I would like to know if that is somebody we are supposed to be
looking for, or that we are going to find this person?

A: Perhaps you shall find, or perhaps they will find you!

Q: Well, it kind of takes the burden off my shoulders. I think that somebody
who does something like that is never useful for anything again. Somebody
who does such a thing is like a sacrifice. They have to give their life up
for others to act as this transducer and it fries all their circuits. Can
you comment?

A: No.

Q: Am I correct that somebody who does this is basically sacrificing
themselves and they get fried in the process?

A: In some instances.

Q: But, it is true that we are looking for somebody who will stand in the
gates of time and act as a bridge?

A: Maybe. You shall see...

Now, we have two funny answers:

In answer to the assumption that it is true, we get "perhaps you shall find,
or perhaps they will find you!"

In answer to the question "is it true" we get "maybe, you shall see..."

Now, consider the above along with this:

Q: Our little egroup discussion list is growing. Everyone is talking about
the Wave: what does it mean, what is it, when is it coming, how are we going
to be able to tell, and so on. I have been collecting the material and
getting it in shape. I have been learning a lot as I go along as well. It
isn't finished, but as I go along, I do have some questions. We would like
to have a little bit of a clue about the progress of the wave. I would also
like to know if this Wave is sort of like the recompiling of a computer
program, with the universe as the program? What is the progress, and is it
going the recompile the program of our universe?

A: So many questions rolled up into one. But, one way it might go is that
all of a sudden, everything that ever was is new, everything that IS is new,
and everything that will be is new. Programs change, oh we suppose, what an
awesome event indeed!

Q: Is it important for the information about the potential making new of
everything and the awareness of the state of the planet as it is now, or the
state of the universe, be shared and spread so that as many people as
possible will be aware at the point of the arrival of the wave so that it
makes it more likely that beneficial changes will occur, that the universe
will change in a positive way? Or is that simply not even important. It will
change the way it is going to change no matter what anybody does?

A: Closer to 2nd criterion.

Q: In other words, we are doing what we are doing, and it doesn't really
matter what we are doing. The Wave will happen, everything will change,
become new, and that's that?

A: What matters most is what others are doing, have done and will do.

Q: Who are these others that it matters most what they have done, are doing
and will do?

A: Program rewriters, i.e. you and us in the future.

Q: So, what we have done, what we are doing, what we will do - WE - is
important? I think that I missed something. I thought you said that what we
were doing simply didn't matter.

A: You are/will be others.

Q: Okay, how is what we are doing now helping or hindering this process?

A: No help/hinder, just is.

Q: So, this has all been done before? It's a foregone conclusion how it is
going to turn out? It's a done deal?

A: No Laura, stop your linearishness!

Q: I don't understand. Is what we are doing making a difference?

A: What is "time?"

Q: Time is an illusion. (A) Is doing also an illusion?

A: If you are thinking in linear "time" terms.

Q: In other words, the best way for an STO future to manifest is for us not
to anticipate that ANYTHING we do will matter. Because, if we are
anticipating that what we do will make a difference, it won't. It is
wanting. (A) I can't stop thinking that my working is going to be useful!
(L) I can't stop what I am doing either because it is what I DO. It is being
ME. We have to stop anticipating. We do what is in us to do without
expecting it to matter.

A: And you do it because you are directing you to do it from another plane
of existence where you know the score. Where you are on your present
awareness plane, you are largely, though not completely, scoreless and
clueless.

Q: So, it is from another level of reality that we create THIS reality?

A: Close.

Q: How much input do we have from this level of reality regarding the
creation of a future reality, and I use the term "future" loosely, but
meaning "future" as we perceive it from this reality? How much input?

A: About as much awareness as a small child does when contemplating how to
fly the plane they are riding on.

Conclusion:

In answer to the assumption that it is true, we get "perhaps you shall find,
or perhaps they will find you!"

In answer to the question "is it true" we get "maybe, you shall see..."

And then, the key:
But, one way it might go is that all of a sudden, everything that ever was
is new, everything that IS is new, and everything that will be is new.
Programs change, oh we suppose, what an awesome event indeed!

What matters most is what others are doing, have done and will do.
Program rewriters, i.e. you and us in the future.
You are/will be others.

And you can then understand: "perhaps you shall find, or perhaps they will
find you!"

i.e. You are/will be others.

And then, there are the following clues:

Q: ... And, how come I am always the one who gets assigned the job of
figuring everything out?

A: Because you have asked for the "power" to figure out the most important
issues in all of reality. And, we have been assisting you in your
empowerment.

and

Q: ... (BRH) Is there any way I can contact you guys directly?

A: Well, Devin, only if you present yourself into the presence of these 3rd
densities here. Remember, their request was hard earned, and one of them has
been channeling throughout this incarnation, much to his detriment. Those
neighborhood kids usually do not respond favorably to psychic awareness, now
do they? Another one here has literally turned the world upside down in
search of the greatest truths for all of humanity, much to her potential
peril. And the third one here had to endure almost unimaginable hardships
and tests of stamina in order to realize his destined path of bringing your
3rd density realm to the brink of 4th density transitional adjustment. So,
the path is open to you. Wanna follow?!?

Is any of the above TRUE?

Who knows? As Ark likes to quote: those that follow that part of themselves
that is great, become great men; those that follow that part of themselves
that is small, become small men...

Many are called, but few are "chosen" ... that is, they do not choose to
take up the burden and become a good workman with no thought of reward, just
simply to be a good workman.

I know that is hard for a lot of people to understand: to do with no thought
of reward, simply because the job is there and you don't see anyone else
doing it and you do it because you can. Nearly all people do everything
they do for some reason, even if it is just to be acknowledged. That
predatory mind we have whispers all kinds of things to us when we are
thinking about why we do what we do.

The true test is: what do you do and continue to do in the face of
overwhelming obstacles when nobody would fault you for giving up? When the
pressure is on and you have absolutely NOTHING to gain from continuing, and
yet you keep going, step after weary step, because to do otherwise would be,
to your being, unthinkable. Giving up simply is not an option.

Oh, sure, you might pretend to give up as a strategic maneuver, but anyone
who knows you well, observes you closely, only sees that you have changed
your strategy.

In the end, it is only results that count. And as each day passes, all of
us move to meet ourselves in the future... to become that other self, that
new self... and for me, it seems that this other self, this Higher self is
one that CAN stand in the gates of Time and Bridge worlds. If that is what
is needed. We don't know. It's a pretty theory and story and may have some
value one day. What is important, however, is what we do NOW with the work
in front of us to do. If we don't do what we can NOW, then we will never
become what we can BE.

 

[ana]

Ok , many reasons to start working, I have many preconceived ideas..., so I will read carefully what you advise me and try to read as much as possible this material Laura.

Anart,.... Apologies (again a preconceived idea), nice to meet you, thanks as you are the one who most impacted me and strongly remove my conscience

Well thank you all, I hope I can continue having your support to learn and unlearn many things...

 

[Laura]

Ana, I think that all of us faces this at one time or another: the fact that "belief" changes nothing. In fact, if you look at "belief," you realize that it is all projected onto something "out there." It is, essentially, an "exoskeleton."

Now, if we hypothesize that it is true that approximately 50% of all humans do not have the higher centers of soul individuation, it becomes understandable why they would seek to "believe" in some higher power that is outside of themselves. Somehow, they KNOW that this is more or less true FOR THEM. In a sense, they are little more than human animals. Have a look at this article on sott.net to get an idea of what I am talking about in more practical terms: http://www.sott.net/articles/show/163349-Moral-Endo-skeletons-and-Exo-skeletons-A-Perspective-on-America-s-Cultural-Divide-and-Current-Crisis

For those that have the potential access to the higher centers, for those that can be Twice Born, there is a clear understanding that the "Kingdom of Heaven" is WITHIN. There is nothing "out there" that is going to haul your buns out of the fire or save you.

Now, imagine the world divided into these two kinds of people. Then, imagine psychopaths creating religions for the animal humans to follow so as to be able to control them and get them to do their bidding. You then end up with exactly what we have on the planet today. Have a look here to see this dynamic in play:
http://www.sott.net/articles/show/166397-Joel-s-Army-The-Rise-of-The-New-Storm-Troopers
http://www.sott.net/articles/show/165994-The-Dominionism-Apostasy-The-Despoiling-of-America-by-Christianity-turned-Evil
http://www.sott.net/articles/show/167137-Why-Is-Palin-Such-a-Good-Liar-For-God-

On the other side, the 50% with potential soul individuation, you have a lot of people who have been simply brainwashed by the psychopathic side, or deliberately made ignorant. Many people with higher center potential move away from mainstream religions and into the "New Age" because they feel instinctively that there is something "more." Did you really think that the psychopaths would not have anticipated that; that they would not have created the movement just to entrap those who were dissatisfied with the simplistic, absurd philosophies of mainstream religions that really only work on the truly "animal humans"?

Think again. There is a COSMIC COINTELPRO deception for about everyone.

It's time to wake up for all of those with the potential to do so. And what does it mean to wake up? Gurdjieff says:

"To begin with, let us take the well-known text about the seed which must die in order to be born. 'Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone; but, if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit.'
"This text has many different meanings and we shall often return to it. But first of all it is necessary to know the principle contained in this text in its full measure as applied to man.

"There is a book of aphorisms which has never been published and probably never will be published. I have mentioned this book before in connection with the question of the meaning of knowledge and I quoted then one aphorism from this book.

"In relation to what we are speaking of now this book says the following:

" 'A man may be born, but in order to be born he must first die, and in order to die he must first awake.'

"In another place it says:

" 'When a man awakes he can die; when he dies he can be born.' "We must find out what this means.

" 'To awake,' 'to die,' 'to be born.' These are three successive stages. If you study the Gospels attentively you will see that references are often made to the possibility of being born, several references are made to the necessity of 'dying,' and there are very many references to the necessity of 'awakening'—'watch, for ye know not the day and hour . . .' and. so on. But these three possibilities of man, to awake or not to sleep, to die, and to be born, are not set down in connection with one another. Nevertheless this is the whole point. If a man dies without having awakened he cannot be born. If a man is born without having died he may become an 'immortal thing.' Thus the fact that he has not 'died' prevents a man from being 'born'; the fact of his not having awakened prevents him from 'dying'; and should he be born without having died he is prevented from 'being.'

"We have already spoken enough about the meaning of being 'born.' This relates to the beginning of a new growth of essence, the beginning of the formation of individuality, the beginning of the appearance of one indivisible I.

"But in order to be able to attain this or at least begin to attain it, a man must die, that is, he must free himself from a thousand petty attachments and identifications which hold him in the position in which he is. He is attached to everything in his life, attached to his imagination, attached to his stupidity, attached even to his sufferings, possibly to his sufferings more than to anything else. He must free himself from this attachment. Attachment to things, identification with things, keep alive a thousand useless I's in a man. These I's must die in order that the big I may be born. But how can they be made to die? They do not want to die. It is at this point that the possibility of awakening comes to the rescue. To awaken means to realize one's nothingness, that is to realize one's complete and absolute mechanicalness and one's complete and absolute helplessness. And it is not sufficient to realize it philosophically in words. It is necessary to realize it in clear, simple, and concrete facts, in one's own facts. When a man begins to know himself a little he will see in himself many things that are bound to horrify him. So long as a man is not horrified at himself he knows nothing about himself. A man has seen in himself something that horrifies him. He decides to throw it off, stop it, put an end to it. But however many efforts he makes, he feels that he cannot do this, that everything remains as it was. Here he will see his impotence, his helplessness, and his nothingness; or again, when he begins to know himself a man sees that he has nothing that is his own, that is, that all that he has regarded as his own, his views, thoughts, convictions, tastes, habits, even faults and vices, all these are not his own, but have been either formed through imitation or borrowed from somewhere ready-made. In feeling this a man may feel his nothingness. And in feeling his nothingness a man should see himself as he really is, not for a second, not for a moment, but constantly, never forgetting it.

"This continual consciousness of his nothingness and of his helplessness will eventually give a man the courage to 'die,' that is, to die, not merely mentally or in his consciousness, but to die in fact and to renounce actually and forever those aspects of himself which are either unnecessary from the point of view of his inner growth or which hinder it. These aspects are first of all his 'false I,' and then all the fantastic ideas about his 'individuality,' 'will,' 'consciousness,' 'capacity to do,' his powers, initiative, determination, and so on.

"But in order to see a thing always, one must first of all see it even if only for a second. All new powers and capacities of realization come always in one and the same way. At first they appear in the form of flashes at rare and short moments; afterwards they appear more often and last longer until, finally, after very long work they become permanent. The same thing applies to awakening. It is impossible to awaken completely all at once. One must first begin to awaken for short moments. But one must die all at once and forever after having made a certain effort, having surmounted a certain obstacle, having taken a certain decision from which there is no going back. This would be difficult, even impossible, for a man, were it not for the slow and gradual awakening which precedes it.

"But there are a thousand things which prevent a man from awakening, which keep him in the power of his dreams. In order to act consciously with the intention of awakening, it is necessary to know the nature of the forces which keep man in a state of sleep.

"First of all it must be realized that the sleep in which man exists is not normal but hypnotic sleep. Man is hypnotized and this hypnotic state is continually maintained and strengthened in him. One would think that there are forces for whom it is useful and profitable to keep man in a hypnotic state and prevent him from seeing the truth and understanding his position.

"There is an Eastern tale which speaks about a very rich magician who had a great many sheep. But at the same time this magician was very mean. He did not want to hire shepherds, nor did he want to erect a fence about the pasture where his sheep were grazing. The sheep consequently often wandered into the forest, fell into ravines, and so on, and above all they ran away, for they knew that the magician wanted their flesh and skins and this they did not like.

"At last the magician found a remedy. He hypnotized his sheep and suggested to them first of all that they were immortal and that no harm was being done to them when they were skinned, that, on the contrary, it would be very good for them and even pleasant; secondly he suggested that the magician was a good master who loved his flock so much that he was ready to do anything in the world for them; and in the third place he suggested to them that if anything at all were going to happen to them it was not going to happen just then, at any rate not that day, and therefore they had no need to think about it. Further the magician suggested to his sheep that they were not sheep at all; to some of them he suggested that they were lions, to others that they were eagles, to others that they were men, and to others that they were magicians.

"And after this all his cares and worries about the sheep came to an end. They never ran away again but quietly awaited the time when the magician would require their flesh and skins.

"This tale is a very good illustration of man's position.

"In so-called 'occult' literature you have probably met with the expression 'Kundalini,' 'the fire of Kundalini,' or the 'serpent of Kundalini.' This expression is often used to designate some kind of strange force which is present in man and which can be awakened. But none of the known theories gives the right explanation of the force of Kundalini. Sometimes it is connected with sex, with sex energy, that is with the idea of the possibility of using sex energy for other purposes. This latter is entirely wrong because Kundalini can be in anything. And above all, Kundalini is not anything desirable or useful for man's development. It is very curious how these occultists have got hold of the word from somewhere but have completely altered its meaning and from a very dangerous and terrible thing have made something to be hoped for and to be awaited as some blessing.

"In reality Kundalini is the power of imagination, the power of fantasy, which takes the place of a real function. When a man dreams instead of acting, when his dreams take the place of reality, when a man imagines himself to be an eagle, a lion, or a magician, it is the force of Kundalini acting in him. Kundalini can act in all centers and with its help all the centers can be satisfied with the imaginary instead of the real. A sheep which considers itself a lion or a magician lives under the power of Kundalini.

"Kundalini is a force put into men in order to keep them in their present state. If men could really see their true position and could understand all the horror of it, they would be unable to remain where they are even for one second. They would begin to seek a way out and they would quickly find it, because there is a way out; but men fail to see it simply because they are hypnotized. Kundalini is the force that keeps them in a hypnotic state. 'To awaken' for man means to be 'dehypnotized.' In this lies the chief difficulty and in this also lies the guarantee of its possibility, for there is no organic reason for sleep and man can awaken.

"Theoretically he can, but practically it is almost impossible because as soon as a man awakens for a moment and opens his eyes, all the forces that caused him to fall asleep begin to act upon him with tenfold energy and he immediately falls asleep again, very often dreaming that he is awake or is awakening.

"There are certain states in ordinary sleep in which a man wants to awaken but cannot. He tells himself that he is awake but, in reality, he continues to sleep—and this can happen several times before he finally awakes. But in ordinary sleep, once he is awake, he is in a different state; in hypnotic sleep the case is otherwise; there are no objective characteristics, at any rate not at the beginning of awakening; a man cannot pinch himself in order to make sure that he is not asleep. And if, which God forbid, a man has heard anything about objective characteristics, Kundalini at once transforms it all into imagination and dreams.

"Only a man who fully realizes the difficulty of awakening can understand the necessity of long and hard work in order to awake.

"Speaking in general, what is necessary to awake a sleeping man? A good shock is necessary. But when a man is fast asleep one shock is not enough. A long period of continual shocks is needed. Consequently there must be somebody to administer these shocks. I have said before that if a man wants to awaken he must hire somebody who will keep on shaking him for a long time. But whom can he hire if everyone is asleep? A man will hire somebody to wake him up but this one also falls asleep. What is the use of such a man? And a man who. can really keep awake will probably refuse to waste his time in waking others up: he may have his own much more important work to do.

"There is also the possibility of being awakened by mechanical means. A man may be awakened by an alarm clock. But the trouble is that a man gets accustomed to the alarm clock far too quickly, he ceases to hear it. Many alarm clocks are necessary and always new ones. Otherwise a man must surround himself with alarm clocks which will prevent him sleeping. But here again there are certain difficulties. Alarm clocks must be wound up; in order to wind them up one must remember about them; in order to remember one must wake up often. But what is still worse, a man gets used to all alarm clocks and after a certain time he only sleeps the better for them. Therefore alarm clocks must be constantly changed, new ones must be continually invented. In the course of time this may help a man to awaken. But there is very little chance of a man doing all the work of winding up, inventing, and changing clocks all by himself, without outside help. It is much more likely that he will begin this work and that it will afterwards pass into sleep, and in sleep he will dream of inventing alarm clocks, of winding them up and changing them, and simply sleep all the sounder for it.

"Therefore, in order to awaken, a combination of efforts is needed. It is necessary that somebody should wake "the man up; it is necessary that somebody should look after the man who wakes him; it is necessary to have alarm clocks and it is also necessary continually to invent new alarm clocks.

"But in order to achieve all this and to obtain results a certain number of people must work together.
"One man can do nothing.

"Before anything else he needs help. But help cannot come to one man alone. Those who are able to help put a great value on their time. And, of course, they would prefer to help, say, twenty or thirty people who want to awake rather than one man. Moreover, as has been said earlier, one man can easily deceive himself about his awakening and take for awakening simply a new dream. If several people decide to struggle together against sleep, they will wake each other. It may often happen that twenty of them will sleep but the twenty-first will be awake and he will wake up the rest. It is exactly the same thing with alarm clocks. One man will invent one alarm clock, another man will invent another, afterwards they can make an exchange. Altogether they can be of very great help one to another, and without this help no one can attain anything.

"Therefore a man who wants to awake must look for other people who also want to awake and work together with them. This, however, is easier said than done because to start such work and to organize it requires a knowledge which an ordinary man cannot possess. The work must be organized and it must have a leader. Only then can it produce the results expected of it.