Get out of US?

[cholas]

Dant and All,
For those who KNOW personally that it's best to leave the u s, maybe it's time to gather strength and GO!
Granted, not ALL are feeling/knowing this, but for those of you who question your presence in the STS-centro, it's NOT as hard to leave as your mind might dictate. REALLY.

The security/money/job fears are likely self-created as, from what I've experienced/heard/read there are many opportunities readily availablein many areas.

I do understand that NOWHERE is"SAFE", but the more time/flexibility/opportunity we have to do The Work, the better, no?(imo anyway).

For example:
Though the housing crash is in full swing, here in coastal/central Mexico, there are condos going up everywhere and the economy is (albiet falsely imo) moving right along. MANY folks have relocated(from the u s and Canada) and gotten involved in a myriad of buisnesses. You ain't gonna get rich, but there is generally good internet access and a person could easily support the family OUTSIDE the u s.

I really don't think it's that difficult for those of you who NEED to exit now to do so. Drop the "security blanket" maybe? I'm guessing it'll work for those who need it.

 

[NORDIC HEALER]

Thank you cholas....you have a very natural, easy, and simple way of saying what others, and myself included, have struggled somewhat to clarify. Since it's impossible to know everything that could befall you down the road following a choice, you do the best you can with what you do know now...and then...like the Ancient Rune...you take that... 'Leap Of Faith'

... Life is All an Adventure anyway.

...If you need to go...GO...

 

[Z...]

Close enough to have markets and far enough to grow food and not be in the middle of total mayhem.

Hmm, But what guaranties do you have that you wont be attacked and robbed of your goods when delivering it to the market ;), if we are talking about the collapse of civilization I would imagine total anarchy - Mad Max style

 

[Mr. Premise]

I'm not talking about guarantees. There are no guarantees.

There are other alternatives between "total anarchy" and "total clampdown," maybe.

Also we were talking about the Russia in the 1990s articles. (Legal Alien and Dmitri Orlov). Orlov said that you had in those days to make some unusual "friends" among the local toughs for security. I think there was also an image of grandmothers with shotguns on lawn chairs staying up all night guarding the garden. ;)

Close enough to have markets and far enough to grow food and not be in the middle of total mayhem.

Hmm, But what guaranties do you have that you wont be attacked and robbed of your goods when delivering it to the market ;), if we are talking about the collapse of civilization I would imagine total anarchy - Mad Max style

 

[Ruth]

I guess I'm not really sure why anyone would want to survive an upcoming calamity, whether that be an incoming space rock, or a country that seems to be sliding further and further towards STS ruination (not this is in any way isloated to the US, it is obviously a whole planet thing and from that point of view there probably can be no escape...).

Then I got to thinking, maybe the drastic reduction in human population being 'scheduled' (or even recognised/engineered as extreemely likely to occur) at some point in the future by the STS heirachy, signals the 'end' of the harvest, rather than its begining. Perhaps we are currently being 'harvested' for our negative emotions now and not at some time in the future, but right at this minute. If this is the case, why is everyone so 'hellbent' (or worried) on living NOW? Its not a nice place to be, but I suppose it adds to the overall collection of negative energy there for 'harvesting'.

There doesn't seem to be much we can actually do about the lamentable state of affairs of this planet. At least not directly and perhaps not at all (if nobody else wants us to help them 'see' or change). So, perhaps the only thing we can do is to take responsibility for ourselves and work interanally at our ouw ability to 'see' as well as helping others (thus becoming STO) and.... nothing much more...

There's no doubt we live in a compromised place. I'm just not sure how much we can do to affect it.

 

[PepperFritz]

Perhaps we are currently being 'harvested' for our negative emotions now and not at some time in the future, but right at this minute. If this is the case, why is everyone so 'hellbent' (or worried) on living NOW?

Probably the same reason that they're not all committing suicide en masse -- because on some level they know we are all here on earth at this place and time by choice and for a purpose, and are therefore driven to complete the tasks and/or lessons they have set themselves -- such as learning how to stop producing "negative emotions" on demand for those who are here to "harvest" them.... or building a more STO-based society in a post-catastrophe world... or helping others to die when the inevitable comes... or being a beacon for those who seek to wake up to objective truth... or dying like a dog in the street in order to appreciate the futility of an STS life... or experiencing extreme suffering in order to attain wisdom, or compassion... the possibilities are endless....

Perhaps the instinct for physical "survival" is a pre-loaded third-density program designed to keep humans in "school" no matter how challenging the curriculum gets....

 

[Mark7]

I wonder how, (or if), what manifests as "instinct for physical 'survival'" in our 3rd density STS time/world would manifest itself in a 3rd density STO time and/or world. What would an "instinct" for "etherial" survival in 4th density STS look like and would it have a mirror reflection in 4th density STO?

 

[Renaissance]

I wonder how, (or if), what manifests as "instinct for physical 'survival'" in our 3rd density STS time/world would manifest itself in a 3rd density STO time and/or world. What would an "instinct" for "etherial" survival in 4th density STS look like and would it have a mirror reflection in 4th density STO?

Since 4th density is unknowable, its probably better to just focus on things we can know in 3D. Dabrowski has some interesting material on how this instinct changes as developmental levels progress.

The instinct of self-preservation.

On a primitive level, i.e. in our terminology, on the level of primitive integration, the instinct of self-preservation is easily excited. It is frequently brutal and is not corrected through observation or self-observation. A primitive individual exhibits uncontrollable fear or aggressive tendencies, is not always able to foresee the result of his behavior, and is unable to act in harmony with the interests of others.

On a somewhat higher level, that of unilevel disintegration, we observe a weakening in the cohesion of the self-preservation instinct. The symptoms of such weakening are, for instance, hesitation, weaker aggressiveness, ambivalent behavior, and initial stages of syntony.

On a higher level, as in the first phase of multilevel disintegration, we observe weakening of the primitive levels of the self-preservation instinct through inhibition. The instinct of self-preservation is now being organized into a hierarchical order of values; it is extended to embrace the family, relatives, friends, regional groups, nation, and the whole mankind.

On a still higher level, that is at the stage of organization of multi-level disintegration, primitive forms of the self-preservation instinct are separated from its more highly developed forms. The primitive forms are subject to gradual elimination. The self-preservation instinct is now more intent on the preservation of more permanent higher personality traits. The development of these traits is accomplished in cooperation with the instinct of self-perfection. In this way the self-preservation instinct becomes broader even to include deep patriotic feelings or care for the preservation and development of cultural achievements of mankind.

On the highest level accessible to investigation, that is on the level of secondary integration, the instinct of self-preservation becomes a function of personality; it protects and promotes those traits which in the course of inner development appeared as qualitatively immutable values. The instinct of self-preservation gradually merges with the dynamism of self-perfection, with the feeling of communion with all people, and even all living creatures.

 

[Mark7]

Since 4th density is unknowable, its probably better to just focus on things we can know in 3D.

That seems reasonable. We hardly understand certain aspects of 3rd density or even 2nd density. It may not be such a good idea to ponder what 4th desity would be like, at least too much.

I am not familiar with Dabrowski - looks interesting, I followed the link back to the LKJ post. Part of your exerpt sounds a bit like Mouravieff in Gnosis I, (Mouravieff's shocks and Kabrowski's disintegration - relationship?), but that's just from a quick read. Thanks for the post.

 

[Renaissance]

I am not familiar with Dabrowski - looks interesting, I followed the link back to the LKJ post. Part of your exerpt sounds a bit like Mouravieff in Gnosis I, (Mouravieff's shocks and Kabrowski's disintegration - relationship?), but that's just from a quick read. Thanks for the post.

Dabrowski's Theory of Positive Disintegration has remarkable similarity with Gurdjieff's Fourth Way. I'm working on a post that goes into this in detail and will put it up very shortly. Dabrowski had an interest in Gurdjieff's work (as can be seen in these notes
from a Dabrowski conference). This is incredibly interesting because Dabrowski was also a big contributer to the Political Ponerology study, which always seemed to have a Fourth Way influence.