Anart said...
I'm not sure if this will add to this conversation or throw it horribly off track, but here goes...
It has been my personal experience that I could not learn to give all when asked (service to others) and be externally considerate until I met people who could do the same. It started with this group of people and after a few years of gaining so much while giving so little, I realized that the only way I could balance and progress was to give as much as I had gained.
Because I was receiving so much - I could give so much, and there was a balance (or a working toward balance) that allowed it to not be a situation in which one gave until there was nothing left of them.
Because I was being replenished, there was always more to give. This continues to this day.
Yes... I it is wonderfully pleasant isn't it??? It's like..oh yes... this is what that is supposed to look like. It does help immensely having found you all. And I am compelled to contribute even though I know right now my contributions are sort of shot gun like, pretty noisy and scattered.
I had spent my entire adult life to this point giving to others until there was nothing left of me. I gave most strongly and fully to those who took the most with nothing sent back in my direction because I learned in childhood that this was 'love'. It almost killed me - literally.
My point is that 'service to others' - in its real sense (at the 3D level) works when all involved are giving. Of course, not all give in the same way - and children are an exception.
I think the point is to have enough awareness to realize when serving is really just draining oneself and when it is actually nurturing oneself to give, because when serving is nurturing, then it is Real. Hopefully that doesn't confuse matters more.
I can absolutely relate to the above. It doesn't confuse.
I suppose, at some point I need to write a long post on the family or rant board about this because it is the most challenging aspect of my life right now. It's just the standing up and getting naked in front of everyone that I am sort or resisting. I have been with this man for almost 15 years and while recently I have seriously considered divorce, after researching the effects on my three small children I can't in good conscience divorce at this time. So, since I've made my choice I
must figure out how to be in this relationship in a realistic way and somehow manage to meet some of my own needs. Still, after plowing through four or five of the psych books and related material I can say that he is not a psychopath nor a narcissist. However, his father falls into both those categories so there is a lot of wounding he is carrying. I am sure some of the attraction I hold for him is in the role of Great Universal Mother. That said he frequently asks me to be more vulnerable, I find that very difficult to stand within when he can't be trusted to take care of me or our children, he can't even take care of himself. Anyway he requires a lot, though he appears to be very self sufficient. Nonetheless, I always feel incredibly drained. The next book on the list is Unholy Hungers.
He is open to having discussions on these topics but has a very low tolerance for any kind of conflict and will just shut down if the conversations becomes too intense. He also isn't too keen on my 'obsession with knowledge', he prefers belief or faith, anything to avoid the ugly horror of reality. In all regards he goes through life pretty happy, a hell of lot happier than I am to be sure, his glass is always half full. Unfortunately, I am frequently the one pouring the water.
Anyway I have to figure it out, since I am only about halfway there and looking at a minimum of another ten to fifteen years. Some days I just get so tired it's hard to keep doing the work that has to be done, the physical work, the emotional work, the spiritual work.
I do appreciate everyone here on this forum, it does help.
Buddy wrote
I mean that the idea of 'right' in that context as being questionable in the sense that you may, on occasion, have to 'stand up' and ask or demand your basic rights/equality of service to the family, etc. Certainly, people often follow the path of least resistance, and relationships do require an ongoing effort, and if one party senses an easy road to getting what they want from you, or anyone else, they will take that road. That, in effect, makes the issue of 'right' moot in that context, because then, action will be required to bring things into balance so that one person is not the feeder of everyone else.
Yes..that is very helpful. I think I will just need to have more conversations along that line. He does try. I just feel so much older I guess, even though he is nine years older than I am. If I read these books he will sit down with me and let me talk about them
and if there are nuts and bolts suggestions then he is pretty good at putting those things into practice. I think therapy could be useful if it was very nuts and bolts, very practical. Which makes since at this point for us to figure out a workable structure for the relationship.
Sometimes what is right is that which requires considerable effort that one would rather not have to put out, yet is necessary for one's growth or continued committment to a particular 'choice'. There would be no disadvantage to this, as in such a situation, everyone would benefit. Like going to work when one would rather lay out, finish a needed project when one doesn't feel like it...that sort of thing.
Yes. I choose this.. so perhaps just more effort is required. Within that I am clear that no amount of wishful thinking is going to turn this man into my soul mate or create a colinear relationship but he isn't a bad man. Just because iron isn't gold doesn't mean iron isn't good and useful.
And so I need to continue to choose what I choose. I think though I may need to grieve certain things for a while, and then I will have clearer eyes to see what needs done next.
thank you I will continue reading.
