Iceland volcanic ash alert grounds UK flights

[The rabbit]

Q: (L) So, the events and circumstances of our lives, individually and collectively, can indicate where we are on this learning cycle? And we are asking to have things told to us, or revealed to us about things which are, in themselves, the necessary lessons? And it would be virtually useless to be told about them since they must be experienced?
A: Partly correct. If you want hints, then hints shall we give. But, if you are looking for a "road map?," forgetitski

I don't know if it is important but i was rereading this fragment and it just struck me that the last ford "forgetitski" might be acctually a hint.
Majority of polish surnames male declination ends with -ski. Maybe it is a clue about a Polish male book author or witness , I dunno

Maybe i´ve missed something here , but regarding forgetitski , i see it as there would be no road map because everything would be covered in snow , hence no visible roads.

So forget it , ski .

 

[Joe]

I wonder what's the benefit from this new hysteria. New volcanic-ash-proof engines? I mean, there are no vaccines to sell, no naturist-scanners to sell, what's the point?
Every year there are sand storms (maybe the particles of sand are around the same size as the particles of ash) and the planes still fly.

Here's Craig Murray's take on it all:

Volcanic Ash - Crying Wolf Again or Real Threat?

Former UK Ambassador Craig Murray

There is a danger that the stage has been reached when we automatically disbelieve the government when it warns of a great danger. I believe, for example, that climate change is a great danger. Quite a lot of my friends, however, are dubious partly because the government is pushing it. Consider the really major government scares of the last few years - things which were supposed to result in the death of millions - which proved to be nothing like the threat alleged. SARS, avian flu and swine flu all come instantly to mind.

And what about the most ramped threat of all, the War of Terror, said by Tony Blair to be an "existential threat" and by John Reid to be a threat "On the scale of World War 2". There is an absolutely clear history of governmental over-exaggeration of threat, but also that governments have no difficulty in finding backing for this fear-mongering from government scientists and both techincal and inter-governmental international bodies.

There are always virologists, vulcanologists and security experts willing to go on TV and tell us we are all doomed (oh, and can they get a bigger research grant to combat the threat). So when the government promotes a big threat, I am conditioned to scepticism, even before British Airways flew a jumbo jet around for hours yesterday with the Chief Exec on board (after similar incident free test flights by other European airlines).

It turns out that the repeatedly quoted occasion when a BA flight lost power in all four engines due to volcanic dust, was a case of flying right through the plume close to the volcano in Indonesia. When you think about it, the fact that you can do something as extreme as that and nobody be hurt, is comforting rather than worrying.

As for widely dispersed ash, I have been wondering how Indonesia and Hawaii and Sicily ever manage flights. Why was there not a massive whole continent air lockdown after the vastly greater ash flown out by Mount St Helens? As a society we have become risk averse to an unrealistic degree. We seem to spend our lives in a permanent state of cringe. Perhaps the ash really is too dangerous: but I see no reason to automatically believe the government on the subject.

 

[Peam]

Earlier on this evening about 7.45pm to 815pm. The atmosphere gradually became strange. The sun was on the horizon as the sky developed a cloudy, billowy, low lying Smokey atmosphere which seemed to be drifting in from north/northwest. The direction of Iceland from my vantage point, Yorkshire uk. I could smell what I can only describe as a strong dusty, stone dust type of fusty smell. The atmosphere was full of it. I could even taste it in my nostrils and felt it on my face. When we got home I felt the need to get a wash to try to get rid of the fustiness, it was so strong

After that it quickly moved on, and later the sky seemed to be clear and the stars were out.

I don't know for sure if this was due to the Iceland volcano and some sort of atmospheric downdraft, but if it was, it's effects came pretty much down to ground level in this area today.

Now I'm just wondering whether the stretching out of this whole 'no flying' thing really is a test by the powers that be to see how much people will tolerate. Sort of lead them to the brink of frustration then pull the plug and reinstate the flying. Pavlov's dogs style. Any volcanic ash in the air just being a ruse.

 

[Breton]

I wonder what's the benefit from this new hysteria. New volcanic-ash-proof engines? I mean, there are no vaccines to sell, no naturist-scanners to sell, what's the point?
Every year there are sand storms (maybe the particles of sand are around the same size as the particles of ash) and the planes still fly.

Here's Craig Murray's take on it all:

Volcanic Ash - Crying Wolf Again or Real Threat?

Former UK Ambassador Craig Murray

There is a danger that the stage has been reached when we automatically disbelieve the government when it warns of a great danger. I believe, for example, that climate change is a great danger. Quite a lot of my friends, however, are dubious partly because the government is pushing it. Consider the really major government scares of the last few years - things which were supposed to result in the death of millions - which proved to be nothing like the threat alleged. SARS, avian flu and swine flu all come instantly to mind.

And what about the most ramped threat of all, the War of Terror, said by Tony Blair to be an "existential threat" and by John Reid to be a threat "On the scale of World War 2". There is an absolutely clear history of governmental over-exaggeration of threat, but also that governments have no difficulty in finding backing for this fear-mongering from government scientists and both techincal and inter-governmental international bodies.

There are always virologists, vulcanologists and security experts willing to go on TV and tell us we are all doomed (oh, and can they get a bigger research grant to combat the threat). So when the government promotes a big threat, I am conditioned to scepticism, even before British Airways flew a jumbo jet around for hours yesterday with the Chief Exec on board (after similar incident free test flights by other European airlines).

It turns out that the repeatedly quoted occasion when a BA flight lost power in all four engines due to volcanic dust, was a case of flying right through the plume close to the volcano in Indonesia. When you think about it, the fact that you can do something as extreme as that and nobody be hurt, is comforting rather than worrying.

As for widely dispersed ash, I have been wondering how Indonesia and Hawaii and Sicily ever manage flights. Why was there not a massive whole continent air lockdown after the vastly greater ash flown out by Mount St Helens? As a society we have become risk averse to an unrealistic degree. We seem to spend our lives in a permanent state of cringe. Perhaps the ash really is too dangerous: but I see no reason to automatically believe the government on the subject.

Some comments below his article might offer possible valid thoughts on the matter too, although I am still somewhat perplexed at the heavy handed approach of shutting so many airports for so long and so far away from the volcano:


--the problem is not specifically that volcanic dust is dangerous - it is that airlines are not equipped to detect when they are flying into the dust. I don't think anyone is suggesting that small concentrations of the dust is dangerous, it's that pilots have no way of knowing when they could be approaching areas where there is significantly more dust in the atmosphere.

-- To be fair Craig, it's not your regular volcanic ash. This is different because the eruption has happened beneath a glacier, causing the ash to contain tiny particles of glass, which is the real problem for jet engines.

--Finnish fighter jets have accumulated volcanic ash in their engines, http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/2010/04/16/340727/pictures-finnish-f-18-engine-check-reveals-effects-of-volcanic.html

 

[Niall]

Sort of lead them to the brink of frustration then pull the plug and reinstate the flying. Pavlov's dogs style.

Yep, I think we can take it to the bank that TMI is being applied here, regardless of the dangers of volcanic ash/dust to jet engines.

With what the C's said about the consortium's designs to shut down air travel, the huge spike in airport and airplane related incidents, as well as the airport security hysteria, I wonder if the volcanic eruption was an opportunity to stimulate a reaction to banning air travel.

 

[anart]

-- To be fair Craig, it's not your regular volcanic ash. This is different because the eruption has happened beneath a glacier, causing the ash to contain tiny particles of glass, which is the real problem for jet engines.

--Finnish fighter jets have accumulated volcanic ash in their engines, http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/2010/04/16/340727/pictures-finnish-f-18-engine-check-reveals-effects-of-volcanic.html

I think that all volcanic ash contains 'glass' - which is merely silica, so I don't think it has anything to do with the volcano being underneath a glacier, fwiw.

 

[Eboard10]

Sort of lead them to the brink of frustration then pull the plug and reinstate the flying. Pavlov's dogs style.

Yep, I think we can take it to the bank that TMI is being applied here, regardless of the dangers of volcanic ash/dust to jet engines.

With what the C's said about the consortium's designs to shut down air travel, the huge spike in airport and airplane related incidents, as well as the airport security hysteria, I wonder if the volcanic eruption was an opportunity to stimulate a reaction to banning air travel.

Their timeline for this event to occur was 8 months I believe which is still a few months from now. It could be that the volcanos big brother Katla will erupt causing the whole european air space to be closed down, hence most international flights to be suspended.

 

[Ollie]

Sort of lead them to the brink of frustration then pull the plug and reinstate the flying. Pavlov's dogs style.

Yep, I think we can take it to the bank that TMI is being applied here, regardless of the dangers of volcanic ash/dust to jet engines.

With what the C's said about the consortium's designs to shut down air travel, the huge spike in airport and airplane related incidents, as well as the airport security hysteria, I wonder if the volcanic eruption was an opportunity to stimulate a reaction to banning air travel.

Their timeline for this event to occur was 8 months I believe which is still a few months from now. It could be that the volcanos big brother Katla will erupt causing the whole european air space to be closed down, hence most international flights to be suspended.

And guess who might just trigger that into happening!!!

 

[mkrnhr]

"Big brother Katla".. green language?
Seems the message of the PTB to population is : We care about your safety in case of danger. look, we closed european airports and lost a lot of money by precaution to protect you. So you are sure we will tell if any danger is coming to you.
Damage control?

 

[Breton]

-- To be fair Craig, it's not your regular volcanic ash. This is different because the eruption has happened beneath a glacier, causing the ash to contain tiny particles of glass, which is the real problem for jet engines.

--Finnish fighter jets have accumulated volcanic ash in their engines, http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/2010/04/16/340727/pictures-finnish-f-18-engine-check-reveals-effects-of-volcanic.html

I think that all volcanic ash contains 'glass' - which is merely silica, so I don't think it has anything to do with the volcano being underneath a glacier, fwiw.

I thought the reader's comment about glass was off, since it seems all ash has silica as you say. But could the ice make any difference compared to other volcanoes? For now I cannot see how it could, but maybe I just need more data.

It will be interesting if this action amounts to the PTB taking an opportunity to apply pure transmarginal inhibition as this possibility was pointed out in this thread.

 

[Windmill knight]

Sort of lead them to the brink of frustration then pull the plug and reinstate the flying. Pavlov's dogs style.

Yep, I think we can take it to the bank that TMI is being applied here, regardless of the dangers of volcanic ash/dust to jet engines.

With what the C's said about the consortium's designs to shut down air travel, the huge spike in airport and airplane related incidents, as well as the airport security hysteria, I wonder if the volcanic eruption was an opportunity to stimulate a reaction to banning air travel.

Their timeline for this event to occur was 8 months I believe which is still a few months from now. It could be that the volcanos big brother Katla will erupt causing the whole european air space to be closed down, hence most international flights to be suspended.

And guess who might just trigger that into happening!!!

Or perhaps they will keep the Eyjafjallajokull card under the sleeve, so any time they want to shut down flights, they will declare that the volcano just erupted again, or is about to, or the wind changed or whatever, and even though you cannot see any ash, better to be safe than sorry so flights will be suspended for a couple of days.

If they were hoping to shut down air travel entirely for a significant period of time, I think they miscalculated big time. It's actually kind of funny to see the hysteria and contrast it with the growing skepticism from the people. I've overheard a few conversations on the street, and for what I've seen in Facebook, lots of people are quite cynical and annoyed about the ban. The belief that it was 'for our safety' seems to be eroding rather fast. (That's my impression anyway.)

If this was indeed a miscalculation and not a test, then they are indeed making mistakes out of desperation. According to the Cs, their desperation is related to what this group is doing - something which I find hard to believe, but what do I know - so perhaps it is no coincidence that they tried to pull this trick shortly before Laura making a public appearance in the Nexus conference.

Their timeline for this event to occur was 8 months I believe which is still a few months from now. It could be that the volcanos big brother Katla will erupt causing the whole european air space to be closed down, hence most international flights to be suspended.

I think it's safe to count it as a hit for the Cs already; timelines are just approximate. They did say it wouldn't be a total ban all over the planet, and added that it wouldn't last long, so it applies quite accurately. I was quite impressed because I don't remember any time ever that flights were grounded in several countries at once and for so many days. In fact I kept thinking that the prediction couldn't be right - yet here it is! What are the odds??

 

[atiil]

It will be very interesting to see how long they will they allow this to continue. They have put themselves in an interesting predicament, if the volcano continues to erupt for many weeks and economies start to really feel the strain, at what point do they suddenly say, Oh it's now ok to travel. The justification to allow flights while the volcano is still pouring millions of tons of ash into the atmosphere will be very interesting. They have created a situation where people may just refuse to travel if they think they are in potential danger, governments will have to come up with a watertight justification to allow air travel while this volcano is so active, which could be months.

Just wondering whether this is a good time to add a little something to the atmosphere and maybe test a few things!!!!

 

[un chien anadolu]

I hope that this won't effect crop circle observations since the season is about to begin.

 

[dannybananny]

It sounds like some sort of experiment is being done, from when do they care for people's safety, they want only profit but if there isn't real threat from ash then it's hundred per cent something going on because they wouldn't lose million of $ for nothing! What fell to my mind maybe it's some preparation for something in the future so they want to test similar situation to cover it up. Didn't C's said that some areas with bases are going to end up in 4D and there would be a cover up, this could maybe be a drill for that (if they have technology to create earthquakes and similar catastrophes) or something else!

Seems the message of the PTB to population is : We care about your safety in case of danger. look, we closed european airports and lost a lot of money by precaution to protect you. So you are sure we will tell if any danger is coming to you.
Damage control?

I think the media is enough to convince people they are "concerned" about them.

 

[Niall]

Towards the end of this article it's mentioned in passing that the images of the enormous red ash cloud we see flashed across the media is based on computer models' predictions! They're not based on radar or satellite or any apparent means of direct observation, they're based on predictions made by computer models! First they convinced people that a cooling world is actually warming... are they now making blue skies black with ash?!

http://www.sott.net/articles/show/207188-Airspace-lockdown-could-last-weeks-ash-cloud-is-being-measured-by-computer-models

It also describes 20,000 ft as a "high altitude" for jumbo jets on long-haul flights i.e. to beat the "ash cloud" they have to fly above it. Does that sound very low for any jet plane to be cruising at? Vulcan?

It also says these Lufthansa jets are the first to traverse the UK's skies since the lockdown, yet forum member Alphonse saw planes overhead in the UK on Sunday and Monday.