Independence Day and 911

[Laura]

We just watched ID4 for the umpteenth time and I noticed something I never
noticed before.

When the prez and his people are evacuating the white house, there is a
scene where Jeff Goldblum looks at his computer which is counting down how
many minutes they have left, and the numbers are 9:11. The next time you
see it, it is just a couple seconds before 0:0 and then, the blast comes and
you see all these buildings coming down like the WTC.

Well, I looked on the net and there were a couple of places that talked
about the fact that when the camera pans over the destruction of New York,
the WTC is about the only thing still standing.

But I didn't find anybody who mentioned this weird thing about the numbers
on the computer in that scene.

We only have it on an old VHS tape. Can somebody get a screen shot of that
or tell me that I'm nuts and I didn't really see it.

 

[OCKHAM]

ID4 and 911

It's on the tube [AMC- American Movie Channel] tonight although I don't particular care for the con-mericals.

I'll watch and see if it has been swiped off the television version, and if not I'll take a picture of it. I'll have to be quick draw on that. Somebody probably has a DVD they could scan also.

 

[Mark]

ID4 and 911

Here's the clip on YouTube showing the clock at 9:11

http://youtube.com/watch?v=x9w1QkB4Yyk

 

[Mark]

ID4 and 911

Screen capture:

 

[anart]

ID4 and 911

The background sort of looks like the Matrix code running - the YouTube video brings up the 9:11 and the deserts of Iraq being one of the areas shown with people initially seeing the craft - curiouser and curiouser...

 

[Mark]

ID4 and 911

The above YouTube video is available in AVI format (plays in WinAmp, Windows Media Player, and maybe other media players) at this url below (10MB) - it'll supposedly be there for about 1 day before it is automatically deleted:

http://www.zamzar.com/getFiles.php?uid=158920463280643070&targetID=diNtAEGEb41PudJ72yg_ZXA_I_I

A bit more about this 'coincidence' is here:

http://memritv.org/Transcript.asp?P1=945

11/17/2005 Clip No. 945
Iranian Filmmaker and Commentator Nader Talebzadeh: 9/11 Footage Appeared in Movies from the 80's and 90's. The Aliens in "War of the Worlds" Are Muslims

Following are excerpts from an interview with Iranian filmmaker Nader Talebzadeh. The Iranian News Channel (IRINN) aired this interview on November 17, 2005

Talebzadeh: After Samuel Huntington's article was published... The American government wanted this article to shape a certain trend. In an interview, Fred Halliday said about Huntington: "I would give Samuel Huntington an F for his article." This article is that superficial. [...]

The most famous symbolic work in this field is Independence Day, which was made prior to the events of 9/11. Imagine: Hollywood makes a film that becomes a blockbuster and the box-office hit of that year. In this film there are aerial attacks on the skyscrapers of Manhattan – the same city where the events of 9/11 took place... The film's escape scene, which takes place in Wall Street, Manhattan, closely resembles the (9/11) footage shown on CNN. Just like... The footage... Even before the event, we were shown footage of it. The famous American director, Robert Altman, said in an interview: "I am sure this 9/11 film was made in advance, and that people saw it in movie theaters before it took place." He was referring to Independence Day.

Before this – 15 or 16 years ago – the film The Man who Saw Tomorrow was made. Orson Wells was the narrator. This film was aired millions of times on TV, and it is still broadcast in many languages. [...] This film is a documentary depicting the end of the world. In this film too, the Twin Towers and the Manhattan skyscrapers are attacked. So that makes twice. Once was 16 years ago... 18... or maybe not... If we say 1980, then it is twenty-something years ago. W were shown this film. Everyone saw the Manhattan skyscrapers being attacked by missiles or flying objects. In this film they had the audacity to say that the attack would be carried out by Muslims – that there would be an attack by apocalyptic Muslims, and that this would be the third anti-Christ. Today, they are afraid to talk this way. They talked like this back then, when many events had not yet occurred.

[...]

The War of the Worlds is Spielberg's most recent work. It is also a blockbuster... A box-office hit... This film is also a metaphor. It doesn't explicitly say Islam and Muslims, but the monsters that attack planet Earth are, in fact, Muslims. This is their ideology... They have come from another planet...They are alien... In Independence Day they came from the sky, while in The War of the Worlds they came from beneath the ground. They've always been here among us, but we never saw them. They were beneath the ground and suddenly emerged, and they have extraordinary strength.

NY Sun calls it a conspiracy theory here:

http://www.nysun.com/article/25048

Top 10 Conspiracy Theories

By STEVEN STALINSKY
The MEMRI Report
December 28, 2005

A Saudi journalist, Mshari Al-Zaydi, wrote about the "disease" of the Arab press blaming others for the Arab world's misfortunes in a London-based newspaper, Al-Sharq Al-Awsat, on November 20. "This huge obsession among some Arabs and Muslims regarding conspiracy theories and the belief that the world is lurking in wait to pounce on us, as if the world has no worries other than cooking up plans, policies, and moves in order to realize one objective only: to eliminate Islam, Muslims, and Arabs," Mr. Al-Zaydi wrote.

The following are the top 10 conspiracy theories of 2005:

10. An Iraqi Shiite imam, Jalal Al-Din Al-Saghir, gave a sermon on December 16 that was broadcast on Al-Furat TV. He called Al-Jazeera "a TV channel known to be guided by the Mossad and ... whose purpose is to damage ... Islamic interests."

9. On a program that aired September 30 on Hezbollah-backed Al-Manar TV, the director of Sweden's Radio Islam, Ahmad Rami, (who was found guilty of incitement against Jews and served time in prison) discussed Jews in the West who "have 100% complete control of the media, political parties, trade unions, and publishing houses."

8. Saudi Arabia's Al-Majd TV interviewed a Jordanian lecturer, Sheik Ahmad Nawfal, about Jewish history on November 13. "David and Solomon were among our [Muslim] ranks. If Solomon had a temple, we would be worshipping Allah in it. We would not be worshipping idols and polytheism in it, like they do," he said. "There is no indication that a temple existed there."

7. Following the December 6 C-130 plane crash in Iran, the Iranian Student News Agency quoted the secretary-general of the Association of Muslim Journalists, Parviz Esmaeili, blaming, "U.S. state terrorism." Rambling about American sanctions on Iran, Mr. Esmaeili called on, "all the heads of state in the world" to discuss at international meetings this "plane crash and similar incidents over the past two decades [in Iran] as evidence of the U.S. technological crimes."

6. Mr. Esmaeili went on to tell ISNA that if the attacks of September 11, 2001, were investigated, the probe would show that the perpetrators were "the U.S. government and not phantom players like Al Qaeda." Other programs on Iranian TV devoted to the attacks included French author Thierry Meyssan's August 30 interview with Jaame-Jam2 TV and a November 17 interview with an Iranian filmmaker, Nader Talebzadeh, on IRINN TV.

5. Arab TV has also been rampant with September 11 conspiracies, including Al Jazeera's series "The Truth Behind 9-11," which was widely viewed throughout September, and a retired Egyptian general, Muhammad Khalaf, on Al-Mihwar TV on September 11 of this year detailing the American government's "secret plan" first developed in 1999 by "Bush senior."

4. Books on conspiracies continue to be popular throughout the Middle East. One devoted to the Bush family was the topic of a November 11 interview on Syrian TV featuring Syrian cleric Mohammad Said Ramadhan Al-Bouti: "Bush ... the grandfather of the current American president ... wrote a book about the life of the Prophet Mohammed. In this book, which was published in 1831, he says: 'As long as the Muslims' empire is not destroyed, God will not allow the return of the Jews to the homes of their fathers.'"

3. On December 14, the Syrian state owned daily Teshreen wrote about a book called "The Balance of Horror in an Open War," by Abdul Majid Ammar. It includes an analysis of the "Zionist entity and the conspiracies it hatched against the Arab nation in order to achieve its sinister expansionist plans."

2. Following the December 12 assassination of a Lebanese member of parliament and a leading anti-Syrian writer, Gibran Tueni, Iran's foreign minister, Hamid Reza Asefi, was quoted as saying it was "in line with ... the Zionist regime." A Teshreen headline on the story read, "Israeli Factor Should Not Be Dropped." On December 18, Al-Seyassah quoted Syria's information minister, Mahdi Dakhlallah, as saying, "Tueni was in debt and was killed by his debtors."

1. Many Arab writers have attacked Detlev Mehlis, the lead U.N. investigator of the assassination of a former Lebanese prime minister, Rafik Hariri. Mr. Mehlis's mother has been accused of being a prominent Zionist, as the Syrian judicial Web site Al-Nazaha reported on November 17. The deputy editor of the Egyptian government daily Al-Gumhouriyya, Abd Al-Wahhab 'Adas, reported November 12 on his mother's "major role in bringing Jews from Germany to Palestine" and that "Mehlis's mother was killed on the Golan Heights by Syrian sniper fire."

Mr. Stalinsky is the executive director of the Middle East Media Research Institute.

 

[dant]

ID4 and 911

Uh,

I have the DVD version and I watched the time when the countdown was shown on the Presidential Plane as Goldblum flipped the laptop open. The time started around 9:12, then through 9:11 and and around 9:10:??, the scene changed away. Later, but still on the plane, the laptop showed 0:00:00, Goldblum said something, and that's when the attack scene started blowing up Washington DC and the various buildings there including the White House and so on. A later scene starts with the date as "July 3", the dimmed out, then shows the saucer moving in the background with the twin towers in the foreground, burning like a candlestick.

The oddity might be that 9:11 is between 9:12 and 9:10 and *might* hint of 9/11? It is speculative, but maybe it is meant to be that way.

But, what are the ODDS of displaying 9:11:01 "time" in the countdown sequence from 9:12 down to 9:10 in in a movie made 1996 that coincided with the 9/11/01 event?

Coincidence?

[Sorry Anart, I was adding details before I saw your reply...]

 

[anart]

ID4 and 911

The oddity might be that 9:11 is between 9:12 and 9:10 and *might* hint of 9/11? It is speculative, but maybe it is meant to be that way.

What caught my eye last time I watched it, which, oddly enough was like a week or so ago, was that the 'countdown shot' starts half way through 9:12, then shows all of 9:11, then cuts at 9:10 - 9:11 was the only full second shown - for a full second - it certainly seemed to highlight 9:11 - now, the question might be, why would it have been meant to be 'speculative'? Why was it there at all?

The movie was filmed over 5 years before the 9/11 event - so if it was just a coincidence, then it's a mighty odd one, considering the scenes that follow. If it wasn't a coincidence, then, perhaps, the 'deep level operators' who project out ideas to the creative types in Hollywood certainly did their job well. Perhaps.

 

[OCKHAM]

ID4 and 911

What caught my eye last time I watched it, which, oddly enough was like a week or so ago, was that the 'countdown shot' starts half way through 9:12, then shows all of 9:11, then cuts at 9:10 - 9:11 was the only full second shown - for a full second - it certainly seemed to highlight 9:11 - now, the question might be, why would have been meant to be speculative? Why was it there at all?

What are the odds of that? I don't see it as coincidence.

There are some real strange propaganda orientated suggestions in the film. The president's wife refers to him as a liar twice in the film, and I believe a third time as she is dying. Is this getting us used to a president who lies?

Here is the canon shot fading into the next scene.

 

[OCKHAM]

ID4 and 911

Here is another speculative point. If the viewer is told the month and day as 9/11 without it being a coincidence, how does the viewer know the year of the attack? Or for that matter, how does the viewer know what 911 means when seeing the film before 2001?

Later in the film you are possibly told the year. As soon as the virus capability is discovered, a Morse code signal is sent out. In the scene showing those receiving this signal, a translation is posted on the screen with the words, “The attack will begin in 5 hoursᾠ. [or years] 1996-2001

This is the only time this type of phrase is posted on the screen.

Here’s another point that should be considered. If this were made up as to show signals to those who would only discover them after the fact, then their purpose may only be that they are used as a debunking method on those aware individuals who notice such things. This is possible because they only make sense after the fact, so debunking you becomes simple.

It almost seems like a form of torment on those who would be the most intuitive. If this is the case, they may only be to distract you and torment you at the same time.

 

[anart]

ID4 and 911

It almost seems like a form of torment on those who would be the most intuitive. If this is the case, they may only be to distract you and torment you at the same time.

Interesting. Why would you consider it a torment? Could it not be a marker or a verification of all we've been learning - of the true nature of the matrix/hyperdimensional manipulation? Could it not be seen as some small sign that all we've been discovering might not just be theoretical? Just curious why you would think it torment - do you think anything could have been done if we had known? We are chickens/cows/mice - those who do these things are our farmers - could we have stopped them? Just wondering. I'm also confused about the 'debunking you becomes simple' - perhaps I am just misunderstanding.

 

[OCKHAM]

ID4 and 911

You're right, I am now thinking it may not be torment, and here is why. And the debunking may not fit either because of this shot. If we are looking for clues, this may help.

I don’t know how I got this shot, but this can also be checked with screen shots and other methods for validity.

As Jeff loads the virus roger, there are numbers showing that look similar to the times of the attack. The ones next to the word execution are 09-0:45. The one in the text is 08:24drgn. I wonder if drgn means dragon.

Someone please check the times and compare. If these times are correctly matched to something, then there may be a primer or something somewhere in the beginning of the film that tells the viewer how to decode the message, and there may be more to this than meets the eye.

Anart, I don't see it as a marker as of yet. It may be that this work is good and helps us to think, I agree with what you say in that sense. Good night.

 

[Keit]

ID4 and 911

It seems that director of this movie (Roland Emmerich) made other quite "insperational" movies and series like Stargate and Day after tomorrow...Hmm...
He was also a producer of "The Thirteenth Floor".
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000386/

And what about obvious jewish connection in the movie?

 

[seek10]

ID4 and 911

C's seems to be saying that forces behind the Independence Day Movie are both STO and STS, for their time travel capability they are aware of this 9/11 event . Though, I didn't understand the symbology of keeping WTC alone other than visual pillar structure to visually intensify destruction.
--------------
Q: (L) All right, last week, when we shut down for the night we had asked a question about the movie ID4, Independence Day, and we were told to ask
further questions about this, so that gives us a clue that there might be something significant there. Does anybody remember what the question was that I asked?
(T) Is there any significance to the ID4 movie?
A: Sure.
Q: (L) What was the primary intention of the makers of this movie? The primary message that they attempted to convey?
A: Infuse thinking patterns with [planchette swirled a few times here] concept of aliens.
Q: (L) They intended to infuse thinking patterns with concept of aliens... was there any particular slant on aliens, per se, that was seen as desirable in the making
of this movie?
A: Slant?
Q: (L) Slant, in other words, did they wish to present them inaccurately to confuse people, to present them as something to be feared and fought against, or to
make them appear so completely erroneous, so that when actual aliens do appear, that they will not be perceived as negative?
A: Infuse.
Q: (L) Infuse. Just the concept, the concept of aliens in general. OK...
A: Part of a larger project.
Q: (L) And what is this project?
A: Called "Project Awaken."
Q: (L) And who is behind, or in charge of, this project?
A: Many.
Q: (L) Who are the primary group, groups or individuals? I'm sure you're not going to give us individuals, but just the grouping.
A: Thor's Pantheum.
Q: (L) And what is Thor's Pantheum?
A: Sub-select trainees for transfer of enlightenment frequency graduation.
Q: (L) What is enlightenment frequency graduation?
A: Think!
Q: (L) Enlightenment frequency graduation... so, sub-select trainees...
A: Self explanatory.
Q: (L) Well, is this group STS or STO?
A: Both.

 

[Z...]

ID4 and 911

when was this session ?