Information Starter pack for our other selves.

[chaps23]

Its a very hard pill to swallow RyanX but to a degree I understand,

Watching those around you, Family/Friends not being able to help in the way that you want to, having them think your even a little wierd... If only I were Jesus. :P

I will try not to get so worked up in the future, as always I am still learning to try and look at things from other perspectives.. Hell, thats the whole reason I post things here in the first place! I value all your inputs.

I will attempt to put my energy elsewhere in the meantime. Maybe towards a Dietary Guide Book... :P

 

[Buddy]

Watching those around you, Family/Friends not being able to help in the way that you want to, having them think your even a little wierd... If only I were Jesus. :P

Well, I certainly know that feeling!

I will try not to get so worked up in the future, as always I am still learning to try and look at things from other perspectives..

How about another perspective: Your audience will most likely be cognitively unable (and indeed neurotically averse) to grasping the point of a starter pack.

People in general seem to be buried in a collective delusion grounded in partial cognitive shutdown. Neuroscience research has demonstrated many links between the pleasure-addiction-pain center in the brain and how the numbing effects of certain brain chemistry actions mask the felt consequences of personal traumas, physical and emotional pain, life in very boring social contexts, participation in all manner of harmful behaviors like addictions and repetitive stereotypical behaviors and thinking patterns, etc.

In addition to the neurochemical damping there is the subjectivity of logical distortions: the normalizations - the logical justifications and rationalizations endorsing this partial cognitive shutdown. Like, in the Wave's addiction chapter for example, where Laura describes an example of how a cocaine addict can normalize the trashy environment of his flop house highs.

Anyway, for people in the 2nd state of consciousness, as far as I know, there is not yet any "easy" path to the 3rd state (Self-remembering) which does not entail a discontinuous jump. What seems to be needed to make the jump is referred to as conscious shocks (G).

I've always thought that broadening the range of people who understood the unified rational/spiritual/Work model was a useful thing to do, but now I'm not so certain. And unless I'm mistaken, many people (even SoTT/inner circle) seem to be feeling the pressure to find that "additional shock" in G language.

Have you read this yet?

 

[anart]

chaps23,

The information on this forum is designed to help those who have already awakened.

While I agree with the bulk of your post, RyanX, I just want to point out one small thing. In the esoteric sense, there are very few people on this forum who have already awakened. Many have opened their eyes for a moment or two and are, from that, able to do more, but I think we're putting some horses before some carts here to state that this forum is for those already awakened. It is, in fact, for those struggling to awaken, and that is an infinitely difficult thing to do. I myself still have a long way to go.

I think you may have used the phrase from the standpoint of 'awakened to the idea that there is something wrong with this world' and, in that context, I'd agree - but since this is an esoteric forum, I just wanted to make that small clarification. :)

 

[no-mans-land]

I have some questions about this "starter pack" thing.

Its understandable that direct giving this kind information to those around you can be, in the worst scenario, harmfull, and most of the cases futile because no one really asked for it and if someone really ask, then he will find it in one way or another.

But its this "in one way or another" what maybe someone can use to spread the information?

Some times ago I put together a CD with a simple .txt file, only containing a few links to different parts of the cassiopaea organisation and some e-books (caricature of love, operation trojan horse, karla turner, ouspensky, political ponerology, the wave). No personal stuff like comments or something like that.

Now, the idea is to put copys of the CD just somewhere here and there, anonymous and without being seen, on the street, in a restaurant or wherever, maybe not plain visible, but for those with curious eyes to find.

The first question is; Is it legal in the first place to put those books, especially "The Wave" (online version) and "Political Ponerology" on a CD and throw them in the woods?

And the second one is; Fulfills this kind of strategy the principles of STO? The information is just given to the universe as a new possibility and I have no influence who will find it or what he will do with it. Or is it just wasted energy? Or am I missing something else?

 

[Mr. Premise]

Its a very hard pill to swallow RyanX but to a degree I understand,

Watching those around you, Family/Friends not being able to help in the way that you want to, having them think your even a little wierd... If only I were Jesus. :P

I will try not to get so worked up in the future, as always I am still learning to try and look at things from other perspectives.. Hell, thats the whole reason I post things here in the first place! I value all your inputs.

I will attempt to put my energy elsewhere in the meantime. Maybe towards a Dietary Guide Book... :P

Even Jesus wasn't honored in his own country. So think about what you're up against.

 

[mamadrama]

Even Jesus wasn't honored in his own country. So think about what you're up against.

Yeppers, remember this proverb?

For Jesus himself testified, that a prophet hath no honor in his own country.

 

[RyanX]

I think you may have used the phrase from the standpoint of 'awakened to the idea that there is something wrong with this world' and, in that context, I'd agree - but since this is an esoteric forum, I just wanted to make that small clarification. :)

Yes, this was what I meant. I apologize for not being clear on this point.

 

[Buddy]

Even Jesus wasn't honored in his own country. So think about what you're up against.

Yeppers, remember this proverb?

For Jesus himself testified, that a prophet hath no honor in his own country.

Honor? I don't know about chaps23, but Heck, I just wanted to know what real faith felt like. The verbal explanations I was getting didn't have the depth that I thought I could feel from that Teaching.

I think I wrote somewhere about an 'experiment' as a 14 year old. I sneaked into the woods wearing sandals and a sheet as a robe. I wanted to know if I could experience being centered in something 'not Bud' and to have nothing but heart and 'Truth'. In fact, at the time, I would have traded everything for quantum level access to the J man's knowledge and being. Being, so that I'd have the strength to withstand opposition. Knowledge, so that I would always know the right thing to say.

But then, I'm not unfamiliar with people thinking I'm a little weird... :)

 

[chaps23]

I have some questions about this "starter pack" thing.

Its understandable that direct giving this kind information to those around you can be, in the worst scenario, harmfull, and most of the cases futile because no one really asked for it and if someone really ask, then he will find it in one way or another.

What if that one way or another was from this information pack that I proposed to put together?

What if the universe has brought this idea to me to cater for this situation?...

There are alot of what if's associated with this I do realise but the fact is the information is out there if you look. I just hate to see friends and family get sucked up into a ball of disinformation then have them spread it to even more. I just wanted to step up to the mark and accomidate them with good scientifically reinforced data.

I have had a particular couple begin on some very wild journey's from the MMS miracle cure!!! and just a huge number of hoax's with electronic gadgetry and numerous other blatent disinfo.

Its dishartening to see... I just have it stuck in my head that I should be doing this (If not something else) for my fellow truth seekers. Maybe its ego.... Maybe not.

 

[Buddy]

There is no reason for you to have to watch someone get "sucked up into a ball of disinformation." For example, if someone you know becomes interested in the MMS hoax, all you have to do is ask "hmmm have you seen this yet?" and point them to the "good scientifically reinforced data".

That's what I do, but I try to be consciously in the moment with them with nothing preplanned (no starter pack). That leaves me open to more possibilities for spontaneous, in the moment and up to the moment interaction, if that makes sense. :)

If I'm doing something wrong, though, hopefully someone will chime in and let me know.

 

[Nienna]

There is no reason for you to have to watch someone get "sucked up into a ball of disinformation." For example, if someone you know becomes interested in the MMS hoax, all you have to do is ask "hmmm have you seen this yet?" and point them to the "good scientifically reinforced data".

That's what I do, but I try to be consciously in the moment with them with nothing preplanned (no starter pack). That leaves me open to more possibilities for spontaneous, in the moment and up to the moment interaction, if that makes sense. :)

If I'm doing something wrong, though, hopefully someone will chime in and let me know.

I think that this is the best way of "informing" people. You just plant the seed, and it is up to the individual whether to nurture it and let it grow.

We need to realize that everyone has their own lessons. We do not know what lessons they have to learn. It's not up to us to try to "save them" as we could be keeping them from learning their own valuable lessons. That's one of the reasons free will is so important and for us not to try to "save" people. They have their own lessons to learn in their own time.

This reminds me of a story that I read that Laura has written somewhere, where a couple goes to a psychic and asks about the child they were about to have. The psychic told them that the child was a going to be very special and end up doing great things. So when the child, a boy, was born, the parents did everything they could to protect it. Everything he did was watched very closely so nothing would happen to this boy. Giving him all the materials he would need to become educated on all things in order to learn what he needed to know to do great things. When he was very young, even though he was watched and kept "safe" he ended up being hit by a car and died. The couple went back to the psychic, very mad, and asked why this special child had died at such an early age? Had the psychic lied to them about their son, since he didn't live long enough to become that special person that was going to do great things? The psychic told them that the boy had decided to leave this plane and be born again as this couple never let the child do anything on its own and so it could not learn the lessons needed to become the person it was suppose to become. (Please realize that this is very much paraphrased and so details might not be accurate to the original story. But the meaning is there.)

So by trying to "save" someone, you really may be making it much harder for them to learn the lessons they have come here to learn. We are not all at the same place on the learning curve. We all learn, or not, the lessons that we have come here to learn. That is what free will is all about.

My 2 cents.

 

[stellar]

There is no reason for you to have to watch someone get "sucked up into a ball of disinformation." For example, if someone you know becomes interested in the MMS hoax, all you have to do is ask "hmmm have you seen this yet?" and point them to the "good scientifically reinforced data".

That's what I do, but I try to be consciously in the moment with them with nothing preplanned (no starter pack). That leaves me open to more possibilities for spontaneous, in the moment and up to the moment interaction, if that makes sense. :)

If I'm doing something wrong, though, hopefully someone will chime in and let me know.

I don't think you are doing anything wrong. I would like to share an experience of the last couple of days.

As I have mentioned in a couple of other posts I am an expectant first time grandmother from my youngest son and his lovely wife. In brief I am very concerned at their ignorance and choices of diet which would ultimately probably affect their and their child's health.

It has been on my mind for a long time and them knowing what 'I was into with my lifestyle' I have to say they have been respectful of my choices. Now...was I not doing the same? Apparently not!

I meditated through POTS for a clear message on what and if I should do anything more. The next day our son dropped in after work as he often does (we are a close family despite our differences in choices) and through our conversation about work, weekend plans etc he said there was something he has to ask of us (meaning me mostly). We (I) were scaring them with all the information that is discussed about needing to be informed when a new baby on the way ; about diet, health, vaccines, options for birthing etc. All these things were something that came up through our pevious discussions.

Now, for some reason it was not what they want to hear because it was ruining their experience. So he asked us not to speak of it anymore as it was not something they really want to think about!

Well...the message I asked for could not have been more clear How selfish I was to think I knew what was good for them. Maybe they need to experince their shock to awakening in a hard way.Being a loving mother I think I am was all well and good but I was not stopping at infringing on their free will. They did't actually ask for indepth info but were just being curtious in asking 'what's new in your world mum? :)

Needless to say I felt a little anger at the rejection overtones of his request in light of the fact that her mum (a nurse) is constantly advising of solutions based on pharma info which is apparently neither shocking nor dismissed . Actually, I felt more anger at the state of the world and how SO many are led astray from truth, and for that to include my family was/is heart wrenching. But it is what it is and I cannot make the choices form them, period.

So as painful as it is, I do accept that what I thought was helpful was not what they really asked for. And if they don't ask in future I will say nothing even if their whole world is going to hell with their diet and they come moaning about their issues. I will listen and probably say I am sorry to hear that. I will not add that they have been told about these possibilities in the past and it was their responsibility to look for the information.

If they choose to stick their heads in the sand, then so be it but I must forge on because it is what I CHOOSE for myself.

Anyway, just a small excerpt from my daily learning diary of life..........to be continued I'm sure. :P

 

[Lizziespreparetogovegan]

I have some questions about this "starter pack" thing.

Its understandable that direct giving this kind information to those around you can be, in the worst scenario, harmfull, and most of the cases futile because no one really asked for it and if someone really ask, then he will find it in one way or another.

What if that one way or another was from this information pack that I proposed to put together?

What if the universe has brought this idea to me to cater for this situation?...

There are alot of what if's associated with this I do realise but the fact is the information is out there if you look. I just hate to see friends and family get sucked up into a ball of disinformation then have them spread it to even more. I just wanted to step up to the mark and accomidate them with good scientifically reinforced data.

Hi Chaps23.

I'm inclined to agree with no-mans-land's view that giving information to those around you could be harmful in the worst scenario and infact this is more than likely going to be the case. I think generally trying to 'wake people up' is fraught with more difficulty than is initially apparent as people's motivations to discover truth vary wildly. Also, even if you do manage to stimulate some interest and provide people with a certain amount of information which they may even utilise beneficially, this is no guarantee that they will stay on the right track. In-fact it's extremely unlikely they will.

For example, one of the few members of my family who is open to the ideas here is my father in law. About a year ago, I started speaking with him about the topics here, the wave, psychopathy etc and found he was fairly receptive. But he essentially framed this information within his own common reference points. He'd heard of David Icke and felt the ideas sounded similar and had stumbled across a few videos on the internet which he felt were related and relevant. I sent him a link to 'The Wave' but he decided to pursue his own avenue of interest. ie watching a whole load of videos on youtube. Now when I chat to him he tells me that he thinks David Wilcock is a genius and that his information concerning China's imminent disclosure is the best info out there.

As the C's have said, false information is worse than no information so what I have done for this person is really nothing short of disastrous. My primary intent was not even to 'wake him up' but failure to employ 'strategic enclosure' has resulted in leading him up the garden path. So, in thinking about the subject of 'waking people up' I think we need to ask two questions: Why do we want to wake someone up and what are we waking them up to exactly?

The idea of a 'slow release' information pack assumes that if someone can be switched on to the fact that reality is not at all what they have been programmed to believe, this may eventually lead them to come here to the forum and attempt to discover real esoteric knowledge where the focus is on the importance of the work on the self.

For the vast majority, this is probably not the the case at all. There are likely countless folk around the globe right now who I term as having a 'fetish for conspiracy and the mysterious'. ie people who watch conspiracy videos, everything that project camelot releases, Alex Jones etc but have never taken a moment to look at themselves and their mechanical nature. Many such people are partially interested in aspects of the truth but are also wowed and fed by the idea of having information that others don't. I'm sure many of these people feel that they are in a process of 'awakening' but they are not in the true sense. They have certain information that others do not but most have no knowledge of themselves. So I suppose the issues regarding sending the links in your original post are that you may merely create more 'conspiracy fetishists' who chase their own tail all the way to thinking David Wilcock is a prophet. Personally, I'd say you'd be better off sending people the EE program and/or the dietary findings on this forum which could benefit them in a more profound way.

Aswell as the free will issue which has been mentioned by others, perhaps what Gurdjieff has said in ISOTM regarding the materiality of knowledge is also relevant, particularly the parts which I have put in bold:

"But first of all another thing must be understood, namely, that knowledge cannot belong to all, cannot even belong to many. Such is the law. You do not understand this because you do not understand that knowledge, like everything else, is material. It is material, and this means that it possesses all the characteristics of materiality.

"One of the first characteristics of materiality is that matter is always limited, that is to say, the quantity of matter in a given place under given conditions is limited. Even the sand of the desert and the water in the sea is a definite quantity. So that, if knowledge is material, then it means that there is a definite quantity of it in a given place at a given time.

"It may be said that, in the course of a certain period of time, say a century, humanity has a definite amount of knowledge at its disposal. But we know, even from an ordinary observation of life, that the matter of knowledge possesses entirely different qualities according to whether it is taken in small or large quantities. Taken in a large quantity in a given place, that is by one man, let us say, or by a small group of men, it produces very good results; taken in a small quantity (that is, by every one of a large number of people), it gives no results at all; or it may even give negative results, contrary to those expected.

Thus if a certain definite quantity of knowledge is distributed among millions of people, each individual will receive very little, and this small amount of knowledge will change nothing either in his life or in his understanding of things. And however large the number of people who receive this small amount of knowledge, it will change nothing in their lives except, perhaps, to make them still more difficult.

"But if, on the contrary, large quantities of knowledge are concentrated in a small number of people, then this knowledge will give very great results. From this point of view it is far more advantageous that knowledge should be preserved among a small number of people and not dispersed among the masses.

"If we take a certain quantity of gold and decide to gild a number of objects with it, we must know, or calculate, exactly what number of objects can be gilded with this quantity of gold. If we try to gild a greater number, they will be covered with gold unevenly, in patches, and will look much worse than if they had no gold at all; in fact we shall lose our gold.

"The distribution of knowledge is based upon exactly the same principle. If knowledge is given to all, nobody will get any. If it is preserved among a few, each will receive not only enough to keep, but to increase, what he receives.

I think this quote is a very interesting one. In my opinion, the quantity of people on this forum is telling of the quality of the knowledge in terms of the above quote. It seems that of all the people in the world with the potential to find the information here, less than 3 and half thousand have signed up to this forum and of those, perhaps less than a quarter are regular contributers. It's evident that many of the people on the forum have spent years, even decades in some cases looking for answers and then many more years assimilating these answers into their consciousness. ie, there has been alot of effort just to 'get here'. So we have to ask really what the value is in passing certain information to people who may not want it, have made no effort to seek it and may use the info to confuse and delude themselves? I hope this doesn't come across as being harsh. I certainly have moments of wanting to tear my hair out when I see the lies people believe but these are my thoughts, FWIW.

 

[meta-agnostic]

I would agree that trying to put together a package to try and "wake someone up" is not likely to be successful and has the potential to do more harm than good.

However, I have to wonder how giving away Dot Connector issues factors in as a strategy. I've been doing this from time to time with people I know well enough and have had conversations with indicating they may be interested in such matters. A lot of disparate information is in each of those issues, along with ads for The Wave, 9/11, Ponerology, High Strangeness, etc. Isn't this sort of more-or-less proselytizing the whole point of the Dot Connector?

Of course they can just flip through it casually and read the articles they like while ignoring the rest. That's part of what makes it great, but with all the ads and website links it certainly seems designed to catch the eye of people who are looking.

 

[vinny]

However, I have to wonder how giving away Dot Connector issues factors in as a strategy. I've been doing this from time to time with people I know well enough and have had conversations with indicating they may be interested in such matters. A lot of disparate information is in each of those issues, along with ads for The Wave, 9/11, Ponerology, High Strangeness, etc. Isn't this sort of more-or-less proselytizing the whole point of the Dot Connector?

Of course they can just flip through it casually and read the articles they like while ignoring the rest. That's part of what makes it great, but with all the ads and website links it certainly seems designed to catch the eye of people who are looking.

You can have a copy 'lying around', on your coffee table for example, if it is visible and piques someone's curiosity they can take a look, without any pressure or anticipation on your part. Someone is more likely to take it seriously if they think it was their idea to read it in the first place.