jobs vs. The Work, homelessness & WANDERERing

Ok, I understand your point. However we don't live in an STO world, we live in an STS one and the way I understand it is the only way to graduate is to learn all the lessons and help those who are asking. Sharing information in order to teach others about the world we live in now. If nobody worked in this world, sott would not exist. The QFG would not exist. Many of Laura et al's books probably wouldn't be published. The funding it takes to gather the information for these books (from what I've read) is phenomenal. We are so spread out over the globe most projects would probably come to a grinding halt because in this world we need money to survive, to participate in almost anything because of the people in power. We need to work to fund all the projects aimed at teaching and sharing the truth here and now.
 
Alada said:
tohuwabohu said:
lainey] I think the point is that having a job proves that we are capable and willing to make conscious efforts to look after ourselves and be able to give a little of what we have worked hard for away to those who need it. Isn't that perhaps more in line with what I can only speculate is STO thinking? Conscious efforts and sacrifice?[/quote] I try to explain as best as I can to help you understand. Having a job and doing your duties are two different things. STO being has only duties. Thus in this world you might have both. This is tricky to explain so I will make an example. Say you live in a STO world. [...][/quote] The thing is as others have mentioned said:
[...]Now try to imagine what would happen if someone would force you to do something else. Not only you would not be able to make you your duties toward the one infinite creator but also the work that is required to be done in a job would not be done efficiently. You might do the job perfectly but it will cost you a lot of precious energy. And on top of that you will feel really sad that you could not be with the one inifnite creator working side by side on your duties.

If you can understand this what I tried to convey then you can also understand that there is no sacrifice involved. Of course it is free will of anyone to make sacrifices but will it help anyone? The 4D is density where the law of love should be understood. And some 4D beings will sacrifice themselves if they see there is a distress call made by other selves. They are doing it with the intent to help which is in accordance with the law. Nontheless they are not wise enough to see that what happened to the otherselves was part of a lesson for them. Thus they were prevented to learn.

There’s a whole lot of wishful thinking/imagination going on here. I don’t know that we can claim to know or understand anything useful about how or what happens at 4D. Not that it has much to do with the practical questions of dealing with what IS, right here and now in 3D.

If your interest is in being ‘at one with the infinite creator’, how do you reconcile the fact that the creator has placed us wherever we find ourselves within creation?

We each find ourselves faced with a certain set of lessons – what IS. To deny/make wrong the reality of what IS would suggest that we think the creator is wrong to place us where we are (3d reality in this case) and we are right, know better. That the lessons of 3rd density do not/should not apply to us.

Surely, to deny/make wrong the reality of what IS, suggests that we think we know better that God Himself what ought to be!
We must have posted at the same time sorry for repeating. I think we are on the same page here. I totally agree that to assume what is going on and what it takes to be "up there" is some serious wishful thinking.
 
If your interest is in being ‘at one with the infinite creator’, how do you reconcile the fact that the creator has placed us wherever we find ourselves within creation?

First of all the one infinite creator did not place me anywhere, it was my wish to come here and help. There are many that came here to help from other densities. There are also residents that belong to this density and for them this enviromnent is natural and having a job is natural and it is all about the lessons. Nonetheless for those who came from other densities this is not the case. Even though they do not belong here they have to adapt temporarily for the STS world but they can not work at full potential. I should stress that aligning yourself with STO is not wishful thinking, it is reality for some and it is a fairy tale for others.

I would say that for those who came to help a very helpful would be STO environment. An STO bubble in this STS world so to say. But the STO bubble can only be created by STO aligned beings. Nonetheless it is not possible to be STO aligned and still have a job and live in confines of this STS world. Thus a forefront had to be created by those who volunteered. And it is only logical to support the forefront by any means necessary. For if those brave souls succeed then we all succeed.
 
Thus even infringing free will of the self would result in loss of polarization. And the job itself does it by its rigidity. For STO being every day is different and the duties are different. Thus such being is flexible and does what needs to be done and not what some boss thinks is important.


You make the assumption that STO work is different every day, when there is no basis for that. Work is STO when an STO being chooses to work. Whether that work is "interesting" or "flexible" is not necessarily relevant to the STO being depending on his or her circumstances. An STO being would proudly work at McDonalds if that happened to be the best option for him or her at the time. They'd even listen to the Boss and do everything that was asked of him or her, to make life easier for all others around. Demanding "interesting" or "creative" work for its own sake is an STS attitude, because you're putting subjective and imagined requirements and needs ahead of other more practical considerations.

Also. In saying you worry about violating your self, you make the assumption that you have a Self. It is a long and arduous process to acquire a permanent I. Until then, we are just collections of associations and programs that have been passed on to us accidentally and intentionally by our (epi)genetics and environment. To me it is nonsensical to speak of respecting the self's free will when, really, we have no will and no self.

The way to acquire a Self is through the self-discipline, which you get by enduring intentional discomfort and dislikes. One I sets an intention, and the other i's that come and go carry it out, whether they want to or not. Let's say I intend to work to earn the money needed to buy books, pay rent, and make donations to charities. When I get up in the morning the I that intended to work may be gone and replaced by a lazier i, who does not feel like working. Two things could happen. My lazy i may decide not to listen to the I of the past and quit work, or it may grudgingly carry out the order and go to work. A person who chooses the former has no will and no self, because he is entirely at the mercy of his moods, the astrology of the day, his digestion, what he read in the news that morning, his mother-in-law's moods, et cetera. A person who chooses the latter is on the road to acquiring a self, since through teaching his little i's to obey another I in the past, they learn to be subordinate. If a Self chooses to manifest in someone, it will manifest in the latter man and not the former, since the Self can do and achieve nothing in a person who is an entirely mechanical slave to external circumstance. There is no self without self-discipline, and work is useful because in addition to money we also have opportunities to learn discipline. In general the more unpleasant our little i's find things in life, the more opportunities we have to discipline those i's and train them to obey the true Self, if and when it begins to act through us.

Reading In Search of the Miraculous by Ouspensky, or Strangers to Ourselves by Timothy Wilson would help provide insight into the tricky issue of what a self and a will truly is.
 
tohuwabohu said:
If your interest is in being ‘at one with the infinite creator’, how do you reconcile the fact that the creator has placed us wherever we find ourselves within creation?

First of all the one infinite creator did not place me anywhere, it was my wish to come here and help.

Seriously!? Do you have any idea how self-important that sounds?

tohuwabohu said:
There are many that came here to help from other densities. There are also residents that belong to this density and for them this enviromnent is natural and having a job is natural and it is all about the lessons. Nonetheless for those who came from other densities this is not the case. Even though they do not belong here they have to adapt temporarily for the STS world but they can not work at full potential. I should stress that aligning yourself with STO is not wishful thinking, it is reality for some and it is a fairy tale for others.

This reads as if you ascribe 4d STO qualities to yourself, that certain things do not apply to you, and anyone who says anything you don’t particularly like to them you ascribe mere 3rd density qualities, they are beneath a being such as yourself.

Seriously!? Do you have any idea how self-important that sounds?

tohuwabohu said:
I would say that for those who came to help a very helpful would be STO environment. An STO bubble in this STS world so to say. But the STO bubble can only be created by STO aligned beings. Nonetheless it is not possible to be STO aligned and still have a job and live in confines of this STS world. Thus a forefront had to be created by those who volunteered. And it is only logical to support the forefront by any means necessary. For if those brave souls succeed then we all succeed.

Where is the data to support the above statement highlighted in bold?

To me it seems unhelpful to think in terms of bubbles, unless that is we use the notion of bubbles as a way to characterise errors our in thinking. Sometimes we see or even seek out or wish for separation, division between levels and things, we live in our own little bubbles (“you can create worlds and dwell within”), whereas it might be more fruitful to learn to see the interconnectedness of things I think. That we are part of a living, pulsing, ever-branching system, where every part in some way touches an effects the other parts.

The thought of connectedness becomes all the more important if we are interested in aligning with and STO path I think, we have to learn how to pop the bubbles between ourselves and reality, between ourselves and others on the same path. Bubbles / separation have an STS / wishful thinking flavor in this context it seems to me, that might be just my interpretation though.

You seem like a sensitive person tohuwabohu, but it reads as if you’re ignoring/shutting out some pretty obvious things that are part and parcel of being here and learning how to grow and evolve because of that sensitivity. None of us like very much the lessons of 3d, but here we are. If we ignore or shut them out we become nothing but a ‘dream of the past” as the Cs have pointed out, so best learn how to deal with what IS. None of us can afford to ignore the though lessons just because we don’t ‘like’ them, we can’t afford to waste time and just wishfully think our way to the next level.

It brings to mind this very straightforward message from the Cs:

Session 29 June 1996 said:
A: You see, my dear, when you arrive at 4th density, then you will see.

Q: (L) Well, how in the heck am I supposed to get there if I can't "get it?"

A: Who says you have to "get it" before you get there?

Q: (L) Well, that leads back to: what is the wave going to do to expand this awareness? Because, if the wave is what "gets you there," what makes this so?

A: No. It is like this: After you have completed all your lessons in "third grade," where do you go?

Q: (L) So, it is a question of...

A: Answer, please.

Q: (L) You go to fourth grade.

A: Okay, now, do you have to already be in 4th grade in order to be allowed to go there? Answer.


Q: (L) No. But you have to know all the 3rd density things...


A: Yes. More apropos: you have to have learned all of the lessons.

Q: (L) What kind of lessons are we talking about here?

A: Karmic and simple understandings.

Q: (L) What are the key elements of these understandings, and are they fairly universal?

A: They are universal.

Q: (L) What are they?

A: We cannot tell you that.

Q: (L) Do they have to do with discovering the MEANINGS of the symbology of 3rd density existence, seeing behind the veil... and reacting to things according to choice? Giving each thing or person or event its due?

A: Okay. But you cannot force the issue. When you have learned, you have learned!
 
I find this post very interesting. This is a topic that I myself have been dealing with for about a year, seriously. My husband and I have talked extensively about the slavery of a job (formal working) and about wages especially when our parents tell us how they "back in the day" could pay for rent, food, school, and still save money. Where as now-a-days the cost of things is so great, that there is no fiscally possible way for us to do this and not be in debt for years- at least.

There are a few things I want to talk about in this post.
1. What we are doing- or what we see as the solution
2. About a book, and a lifestyle that many seem to forget- but in fact is actually how we got to where we are.
3. Doing something that feels- and is- right (in my opinion of course) and the opportunity to actually grow as an individual.


1. My husband and I have struggled greatly with working and this "absolving of responsibility" - mainly because we do feel the responsibility of our decisions. We cannot separate ourselves from our jobs- what ever impact we are having we are actively and consciously choosing it. SO, what we have done is waited to find jobs that we can feel decent in going to (mine informing people about birding and selling products based on that) and my husbands as a lifeguard (in which he can and has saved lives). So, we are now stuck at our jobs for months of time now. One of our solutions to saving money was getting a cheap old motorhome. It cost us $500 and we have to fix it up, but the work is enjoyable- seeing our house improve- and we no spend nothing on rent, our main cost. Now the crap wages that we are making we can actually save most of, except for food (though we pick up road killed deer, which saves a lot of money meat wise, and is substantially healthier and tastes better). The one thing we refuse to give up is eating organic. Our health and our bodies are our only ones, and our place with money is only temporary. And being as we eat organic- it costs more.
What we are doing with our money is saving up to buy land in a place that is cheap, beautiful, away from "modern" society. Alaska. Near the coast where it's warmer. And this brings me into number two.

2. One thing that always confuses me is this "me vs. nature" thing that is so present in modern society. People- millions of them- used to live completely off the land, lives that were bountiful. There is a book called GRANDFATHER, written by a man named TOM BROWN JR. that I believe everyone should read. That book if nothing more is something to think about. But for me it was inspiring, and on some level, life-altering. The one chapter that I in particular want to address is about when Grandfather first ever saw a city- back in the 1920's- Chicago.
But first some background on Grandfather. Grandfather Stalking Wolf was an Apache native taken into the desert mountains of the SouthWest, by a few of his elder tribe, when he was just a boy. This was during the time when all native peoples were being put on reservations, and being striped of their ways of life for thousands of years. His people wanted him to have an opportunity away form that, up living off the land. Grandfather became a master scout, a prophet (as some would call it), and ultimately a great wanderer. He wandered from the tundra of Canada, to the Amazon jungle, from the West coast, to the East coast. That's just a snippet of his background.
Grandfather first saw Chicago as he was wandering East, and was told by spirit that he needed to head towards the lights, rather than his usual away. So as he did he scoped out what he was getting into, knowing that if he got caught it could mean his life. He made it into the heart of Chicago one night and encountered a homeless man. They were quick friends, though they spoke different languages. Grandfather's greatest observation (to me) is that he saw how these people left their own, with nothing, no food, no water, nothing. No skills to survive without a job. He was appalled that people left their own in this state, and that people lived that way at all. He soon taught the man over some time how to build a proper shelter, gather food, water, fire, and make his own clothes. Everything that he needed to know he taught him. This homeless man would tell other homeless people about Grandfather, and would bring them to their camp. As the camp grew they went farther into the woods, where they would go undetected. After Grandfather had taught them everything they needed to know, he moved on, continuing to to wander.
This story is amazing to me for many reasons... I myself have studied and developed some survival skills. They are simple and yet, forgotten skills that are essential if anyone wishes to not be dependent upon modern day society in anyway. Because even though you, cheezemurda49, choose to not directly participate in modern day slavery, others do, and give you money, which they got actively from their owners, and through their slavery.
People used to and some still do live full, happy, healthy, abundant lives in the deep woods where we never see them. They live in balance with the Earth, on a level that many of us will never see. And this bring me to number three.

3. There is a movement that many know and participate in, and many that have never heard of or thought was possible. It's the primitive living skills movement. First, I am not fond of the negative connotation that comes with the word "primitive". On many levels "primitive living" is so much more advanced than the modern world. How many of you can make a fire without modern tools? Without flint, steel knives, or fire to start? Just using what's in nature? That to me is advanced- there is no dependency to be anywhere if you can create all that you need anywhere you are- ultimate FREEDOM. There are many schools that are teaching these skills- greatly in part of Grandfather taking it upon himself to passing down his knowledge of the Earth to Tom Brown Jr. and him to Jon Young and so on and so fourth. One school is WAS (Wilderness Awareness School) in Washington state, near the Olympic peninsula area. And their are many others in California. The school that I attended- surely led by destiny- is called TWIN EAGLES WILDERNESS SCHOOL. They changed my life drastically in the best way I could have ever imagined. It was the most fun and most challenging year of my life. From trips like the Snow Cave Expedition, to our three day survival with nothing but the clothes on our backs, to making our own wooden longbows. Myself and my school mates, have nothing but great things to say about this journey. Just the amount of personal growth and knowledge that I have about myself is incredible. And the community and the way that people take care of each other is also amazing. People actually accept me for who I am, all of my shadows and all of my life. SO through all that ranting about how amazing Twin Eagles is, if this is something that interests you, learning primitive living skills, and personal growth, I have attached a link at the bottom.

Ultimately, what I want to do with this post is just inform people, you all, about the possibilities. I completely agree withmost if not all the things that cheezemurda49 has talked about. And I just wanted to bring another perspective into it. PLEASE respond and tell me what you think. I am curious how this comes across to people.

_http://www.twineagles.org/outdoor-adventure-camp.html
 
I think survival skills are great to have and plant a seed of confidence in you that permeates through every level of your existence. That Grandfather book looks like a good read!

However, if you have survival skills, why not plant a garden and then you don't have to rely upon a USDA rubber stamp of approval and pay for foods which may or may not be grown in much the same manner as it's non organic analog? Not to mention that organic does not speak to the industrial practice of monoculture crop production nor does it eliminate pesticides....just changes the brands available.

And if you have survival skills, why not hunt, fish or trap rather than rely on roadkill? One does not have to scavenge in order to secure protein, not to mention that if you live in an area with nut bearing trees like walnuts, you could spend a half a day picking and shelling nuts.

While I understand the need to escape to wild places, which is why I moved from where I lived to where I'm at now, and living closer to the land is certainly an admirable pursuit, I don't think that being able to do the work is precluded by geographical location. One can grow a garden and gather nutrient dense food in an urban centre, and make pilgramages into the woods for hunting or camping trips or survival skills or what have you. Especially if you have difficulties finding a good job in an urban centre, unless you have some blue collar aptitude, I don't really recommend moving to a smaller centre. These centres generally rely upon each other to a greater extent and the exchange of goods and services is much more dependant on what you bring to the table if you don't have money. So, apart from your 'primitive' survival skills, your low paying wage jobs and your ability to scavenge, I would hope you're skilled in other ways that will help you contribute to your chosen community.

Now, back to the slave, owner situation which keeps on surfacing. I don't know if I am serving my own interests here, but it occurs to me that I would take people who were in positions where they are trading unskilled labour for a paycheck a heck of a lot more seriously and empathize with them more if they didn't refer to their positions as slavery. While in one part of your argument you suggest you are locked in by an owner, you then proceed to explain your circumstances through an internet connection from somewhere you likely have freely accessed. You are not a slave, stop perpetrating that myth, it does a grand disservice to those who actually are and were, and you'll get little sympathy from me. Why would you spend so much time learning skills that would serve you only in a catastrophic situation, when you could shift focus and learn a marketable skill that would yield you better wages in the world we live in now?

Again back to the trades...perhaps that is why America is in such dire straits...the conditioning that shifted people away from blue collar work towards 'professional' jobs in the past forty years has created a condition whereby people refuse to do the blue collar work and expect high paying jobs when they leave the university which told them that they'd have them. The lie is that there are no good jobs in the US right now....there are. Millions of them, in fact. People have become baby soft, don't want to get their hands dirty or earn their stripes not by paying their way to a degree, because let's face it, that's what a bachelors is these days, but by engaging in an apprenticeship. You're not a slave if you're in a 40 hour a week job, there is opportunity around you, you just have to open your eyes, cast off the illusions you've created about our economic system, and get to work.

You'll probably feel like you're spinning tires for a while, but you'll eventually wear that ground down to a surface that'll give you traction. Just keep your foot on the gas, don't burn yourself out, but realize that it is you in the driver's seat, no one else.

And welcome to the forum! I'm also a newbie here, finding my way.
 
naturenut,

Has it is your first post it is recommended on this forum to make an introduction in the newbies section.

Also if you find organic food is expensive you may want to look at the Life Without Bread and the Ketogenic Diet threads.
 
Dylan-
I am currently living in an area where it was -9F last night, and because of such, cannot have a garden at this point in time. It is something that I plan to do in the future, but first comes the land, amongst many other parts in order to be able to have a fully functioning and producing garden. There are definitely plans for it in the future! I also agree that buying organic food doesn't always mean that it's nearly as good as growing your own, but I believe it to be a better option than the sterile pesticide and herbicide soaked GMO's.
Roadkill to me is such an underutilized resource in my area. There is at least one roadkill deer everynight/day on a 10 mile stretch of road. Plus it's free! Where as tags cost money. And the roadkill here get put into the landfill which I think is ridiculous. I also do not live somewhere with nut bearing trees. I live in a place that is a very tough zone. My husband and I plan to move to a place that would better provide for things that we need to build our own house, hunt, gather, and what not. The average lowest temperature where I am living, during the winter, is -40F. As you can imagine the growing season is minimal. And the amount of trees and plants that are hardy enough to withstand the temperatures is also minimal. We haven't had a hard time finding jobs, so much as finding a job that isn't something we hate. And I know that it's a frame of mind, but I don't like doing jobs that are fulfilling things that people can do for themselves but just don't.
The slavery that I am talking of is really debt. Not my job, I can leave my job and not come back if I choose, which I do. The part that I don't like is that someone else decides when I work and when I don't, they tell me what and how to do most things. Debt is the real issue. I went to college for a year and have debt from it now. $5,000 of it. Where I am with a wage that I can make being an "unskilled" worker is not much $10/hour if I'm lucky and don't do construction or work in North Dakota. The issue is making enough money to pay off that loan, pay for rent, electric, food, and propane. Fortunately, my husband and I have found a way to not have to pay for rent. By buying a motorhome for cheap and fixing it up. The other issue, and the reason why I have learned these survival skills, is that I don't like, agree, or support our current marketplace. I utilize it- for now- yes, but I do not agree with it. I would rather live in a way that is simpler and closer to the earth, rather than getting a degree in business and working in a cubical. The world we live in now- I also believe will end within my life time- or rather the world we live in now will change into something drastically different. What? I don't know. But I feel that something is bound to change. (Just look at history for examples.)
I am fully aware and grateful for the opportunity around me, I believe that sometimes I come off more pessimistic than I actually am. And i also know that because of the world we live in I have many more opportunities than I would if we didn't have our economic system, and if I didn't live in the US. It is the reason that I get to travel and experience so many cultures so easily. And I also will get a bachelor's degree, just in something that I feel I can use in my everyday life, not just if I go to work. I choose to live my life as I want it to be. Unwavering or bowing down to the pressures of this fake culture around me.
Thank you for your response! I enjoy discussing things of this nature.
 
Martfotai said:
Mal7 said:
I am sure that homeless people do look after each and share food. My own feeling about this particular video is that it is fake, and the homeless man is an actor. I think the whole story is likely to have been scripted by the video maker. I could be wrong though.

I think he very likely thought the man would buy liquor with the money and was genuinely touched when he didn't -- he did later go up to the man and say "I feel like I should apologize." Fake? Perhaps, but I think not -- it's too out of character compared to his other 'projects.' Also, when they are speaking toward there end and the homeless man is telling his story, there are literally a dozen cuts to edit the video. That's a nice touch if it's really scripted. How sad we live in a time where we even have to question.

There have been some news stories about whether the video of the homeless man being given $100 is what it seems. One person claims to have seen Josh Paler Lin parked outside the liquor store, and that Thomas was driven there in the same car as Josh Paler Lin. A man claiming to be Thomas' brother has also talked to the media:

_http://losangeles.cbslocal.com/2014/12/31/was-heart-tugging-viral-video-of-generous-homeless-man-all-a-hoax/

A follow-up video has also been made by Josh Paler Lin, in which Thomas is put up in a hotel and given a makeover.
 
Interesting thread.

I haven't been able to post as much as I wanted in the last couple of months exactly because of that - a new job ...

Reading through this thread though I was a little surprised how many here defend the "job and work world as it is". This doesn't mean I agree with what Cheese said, but there is little doubt that we do live in an environment that tries to enslave us (not only through jobs), and has partially already succeeded to do so - debt came up in a previous post, for example. Of course this is not the old kind of slavery with whips and chains, but a newer, tricky one, where the "slave" does not even see he is being enslaved, but actually is manipulated into wanting to be part of the system (on many levels).

Using difficult work situations to WORK on oneself is a good option, but nevertheless one shouldn't lose sight of the big picture - what is really going on - covered in many articles on SOTT, too.

Naturenut, thanks for posting.

M.T.
 
I hope naturenut does well on her path, and wish her the best. As one who fits the description of those who 'defend the job and work world as it is,' I would like to take this opportunity to do a little 'splainin.

I have been grappling with the nature of our reality for the greater amount of my adult life. Some days I still feel like a child wandering alone in the wilderness, vaguely aware of the dangers of such an enterprise, yet curious nonetheless. I started my search young, always fascinated by history and I remember being quite drawn to the Grail stories and medieval history in particular. I found myself studying the works of Teodor Adorno, Hannah Arendt, Max Horkheimer, Naomi Klein and Ellie Wiesel (to name a few) in high school and their insights produced in me a desire to study philosophy, religion and politics in university for a time. This was also about the same time as the movies of the Matrix series came out, and I refer to them because they provide a useful allegory to our reality.

I come from a middle class family, and my mother raised me on her own until I was about three, when she met the man who would become my stepfather. He wrote his masters in social work after achieving a bachelors in philosophy. My mother is an avid reader, and many conversations I remember in our household were of a political or philosophical nature. It was during my rebellious, hormone driven late teenage years which also coincided with the 9/11 attacks that the matrix, for me, began to become apparent. I became disenchanted with my studies in university, noting that there was a clear manipulation for people to conform and tow a certain ideological line that I really wasn't equipped to explain, yet felt the wrongness of it deeply. I dropped out, an began to work several different jobs to get by. My life was blessed with the support of family, yet there are events, like 9/11, that happen in a family that make you question the foundation of your identity.


For example, my uncle committed suicide when I was about 12. I was never directly informed that it was in fact suicide, and to this day none of my family has ever felt the need to inform me and I believe it was and is at the behest of my mother, who I assume felt the need to protect me from this information from a motherly place. While I understand that decision, it occurs to me that that level of deception is far more unhealthy than confronting and being open and engaging a dialogue would have been. Because, once I sussed it out through piecing the puzzle together an the sometimes loose tongues of my family, the result is that I carry a bit of a grudge regarding that deception. I feel I deserve to know the truth, and if someone willfully blinds me from it for their own purposes, it is not an ideal situation to say the least.

Then, when I was studying in university, my grandmother with whom I spent much time with growing up as my parents both worked away at their middle class jobs, she passed and this impacted me. Probably because the resulting drama spelled the end of my stepfather and mother's relationships. So, I was 19, my parents were divorcing, my grandmother had recently passed, and I was cluing in to the fact that my family had hidden a fairly important piece of information away from me which robbed me of my ability to understand the reality of a major event in my young life. The stress got to me, I dropped out as I had mentioned, and began to pursue blue collar work as I had now observed the results of two people with professional jobs or educational backgrounds who were very close to me basically implode and given that they encouraged me to pursue a professional education to become a lawyer or a teacher, and being that I was young and rebellious, it seemed to make sense to me at the time.

However, as I began to do the blue collar labour jobs; I worked as a sous chef, a security guard and a landscaper, I always had the deeper philosophical yearning somewhere just under the surface. I did the menial manual tasks, and noted the type of treatment that workers typically receive and the type of lifestyle one can attain if one allows themselves to be imprisoned by these types of jobs in heirarchical employment with larger businesses. But, I was also personally troubled by depression at times, and by substance abuse and several relationships that didn't end well. I finally found a great mentor, who taught me the trade I ply now, and the relationship I have with him is still one I treasure.

He challenged my pride, my ego, my work ethic and taught me how to be a swinger of birches. He taught me of the value of trees yet also taught me that this world will have you kill something beatiful and ancient because someone wishes to obviate themselves of the necessity of raking leaves a couple of times a year. He moulded me into a competent arborist, and gave me the tools I needed to do it on my own. However, these days are also ones I recall being quite void of the pursuit of truth, because I would come home so danged tired that it would be dinner and bed without much energy left for the seeking.

I met a wonderful woman, and we started a family. We moved away from the city I was born in and ended up in a beautiful valley where we have built a home and I've started a business with the skills and knowledge gained from deciding to spurn the path my family was leading me down and pursued something different. I'm now at the point where I feel that there is a clear path out of the mire and burden imposed by the predatory financial system and can see a path to freedom. But, I'm encumbered with a some business debt, a mortgage (no it does not escape my notice that the Latin root for mortgage is death grip) and aware of the nefarious and nebulous tentacles of the matrix, the system of control that seeks enslave us and extract energy from us like the pods containing humans in the matrix. And I'm aware our eyes have had woollen blinders and our activities coerced to conceal from us true meaning of our collective potential as something other than lunch.

I've been there, felt the crushing weight of financial responsibility and the absurd necessity to exist within the control system of the matrix. I have three beautiful boys to raise and a wife and a home to support and maintain, and some days it feels like a really heavy load to bear. But, my experiences have taught me that while we are food, and energy for parasites that we cannot control, we don't have to see from the same lens. While we are busy working away at a debt that was incurrd only because someone had enough money to lend and laws allow them to rent that money out and some days that makes me want to scream, I still have the knowledge that bearing that heavy load and allowing those parasite to feed, doesn't mean I'm a slave. I'm aware of the control system, I have a strong back an business model that allow me to make the most of my time away from home and I have a plan for financial insulation that will one day allow me to more freely pursue the work.

But I am not a slave, while I may not have been in complete control of all the events in my life and the way in which they have transpired, I am in control of the way in which I react. I have used that to build a life and taken control of my own destiny through self employment, but yes there are somedays in which I feel the weight of it all. Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere, a wise man once said, and I feel the suffering of my brothers and sisters suppressed and repressed around this rock.

Did not Gurdjieff say that those who were weak in life would also be weak in the work? We all have a hard road to travel, but the way we respond to the obstacles and challenges we face is what defines us. We have control over those instances, or at least we ought to, and the way we face those moments every minute of everyday is the standard by which we will be judged. I hope I live up to the expectations of my children, yet know I fail them as well. I know this world can be perceived as a quagmire, yet I feel we have to keep our chins up and carry on.

So yeah, I don't agree with the current paradigm of the economy, but that doesn't much matter. I have mouths to nourish, and a better future to build for them, so I buckle down, sacrifice time, energy, blood, sweat and tears and I know, that when life presents me with an obstacle, it is an opportunity to act rightly and overcome, not an insurmountable barrier.
 
Minas Tirith said:
Interesting thread.

I haven't been able to post as much as I wanted in the last couple of months exactly because of that - a new job ...

Reading through this thread though I was a little surprised how many here defend the "job and work world as it is". This doesn't mean I agree with what Cheese said, but there is little doubt that we do live in an environment that tries to enslave us (not only through jobs), and has partially already succeeded to do so - debt came up in a previous post, for example. Of course this is not the old kind of slavery with whips and chains, but a newer, tricky one, where the "slave" does not even see he is being enslaved, but actually is manipulated into wanting to be part of the system (on many levels).

Using difficult work situations to WORK on oneself is a good option, but nevertheless one shouldn't lose sight of the big picture - what is really going on - covered in many articles on SOTT, too.

Naturenut, thanks for posting.

M.T.
I don't think anyone is defending "job and work world as it is." We're just saying that it IS. And we're here where it is. And that's our starting point. No one is saying that it is a good thing, but mastering the situation as it is can be a lesson and an opportunity for discipline and doinig the Work. It's like what the Cs said when they told Laura back in the nineties about VISA, 666, and the Mark of the Beast needed to buy and sell. She asked them if there was a way to sidestep that and they basically said not unless you want to starve.
 
Mr. Premise said:
I don't think anyone is defending "job and work world as it is." We're just saying that it IS. And we're here where it is. And that's our starting point. No one is saying that it is a good thing, but mastering the situation as it is can be a lesson and an opportunity for discipline and doinig the Work. It's like what the Cs said when they told Laura back in the nineties about VISA, 666, and the Mark of the Beast needed to buy and sell. She asked them if there was a way to sidestep that and they basically said not unless you want to starve.

That's a good point.

I was never very enthusiast to get a job. But after I get my diploma and have made my military service it didn't seems there was any other solution so I did through out my long habit of video gamer and get the first job I founnd. It was not so unpleasant until I managed to do my job as perfectly as I could. Then I quit to get a job that seems more pleasant but less well paid. Then an uncle proposed me to do some delivery in Paris, France capital. So i did quit my countryside and that was quite a challenge and what an experiment !

After around 2 years I realised I was quite unhappy with this job and I had my first "revelation" that led me to be kind with all my co-worker and that has put me in a joyful attitude that finally made me quit the job. It seems like it was the time to quit and I did follow my instinct.

After some months of something that looked like real freedom I had almost no money left and found some seasonal jobs here and there. Little by little I found myself working all year long again but I had managed to be peaceful during the working day. And at some point I again fell myself too much in that "freedom" state to be able to stay in this routine of getting up every morning. So I quit my job again in a very abruptly manner.

During all those years I had perpetuate a kind of film addiction and had buy a lot of dvds. The idea of making a living by selling dvds has grown slowly and someday I finally decided to create my own little enterprise. Now I feel more free as I can more or less choose the time when I work for the money.

But I am steel very much in the system as I sell through amazon and more often than not to people with big income and who knows what they do to get the money ?

In the end I guess we will get more away from the system when we will have managed to make small communities as independent as it is possible and someday perhaps these little communities shall make arise a new form of society.

My2cents
 
I was having an interesting encounter yesterday. I needed to get out to clear my head so to say, nonetheless I was still pondering about what this thread is about. You know the jobs, homelessness, STO, STS and so on. Well so I was just walking outside thinking about all this stuff when seemingly out of blue a man appears in front of me and he is like 'What time is it?' And I am like 'I dunno I have no watch on me'.

The man looked rugged like some kind of homeless man. And of course he was not interested in knowing time of the day but rather was willing to have a chat. I am not into coincidences thus I was viewing it as an opportunity given by the universe to learn something. Thus I accepted the offer to chat. I learned that he is not homeless, he has a house and also a job, nonetheless his wage is so low that he cannot make a living without begging for money. And that he did. I was there with him for like 10 minutes and he asked for money like 6 people in that time. Someone gave him few bagels but he didn't know what to do with them so he gave them to me and then he pretended that we have only bagels and nothing to eat with them and continued to bother all passing poeple. He was clearly not interested in food but only in money so he can buy himself some booze. He told me this himself! He also told me about how he conned the pastor into giving him some wine and some poor guy to give him his phone and so on. He was simply trying and if someone was willing to give him anything he accepted and when not, nothing happened because there is lot of other people.

Well he was then like ok let us get some beer because it is cold outside. Well I am not that much into beer but I was wiling to learn some more thus I accepted his offer. We went to some pub and he was like 'I really should not tell you this but I will anyhow'. And he started to telling me how he was conned many times and even robbed. And that he was even smuggling drugs and other things. So his point was that pople were not fair to him so why should he be any better towards them. So he is making living by conning people and robbing them. Nonetheless he was not some petty criminal that threatens someone. He could be compared to the snakes in suits because he was clever. He told me one sentence and repeated it to me like three times so I can understand and I saw that he knows what he is talking about. It was this: 'I can only rob people who allow me to rob them.' Of course I can understand because this is STS statement of the law of free will. Therefore he knows about the law and acts in such manner that he does not violate the law. Therefore he does nothing 'bad'. He simply takes advantage of the goodness in the people nonetheless he does not call it goodness but he calls it stupidity. I argued that that is pretty selfish but he told me that he is doing all the people a favor because he teaches them a lesson. And I was like 'Say what???'. In his world V. Bridges would be some kind of saint because he was trying so badly to teach others some lessons. DUH! That is some pretty much twisted rationale. Even if that would be the truth his intent was telling me pretty much something else. He was thoroughly STS but something in him was like a random number generator therefore it is possible that he could act also inadvertently in STO manner.

I sensed that it was his duty to show me his perspective, how he sees the world and all other people and also I was aware that there was some chance that he could convert me. And well I could understand pretty well that he despises people and sees them like some pathetic stupid beings that he can con to do anything for him. And then he reach into his pockets and put on a table a tobacco and cigarette paper and with all seriousness asks "can you roll one for me?" And I was like 'Really? Is this guy serious?'. I mean he did exactly what cheezemurda49 described earlier. And I told him that I see that his hands are ok so why he cant roll himself one. And he started to make all kind of excuses and then asked me two more times and my answer was clear no. Thus he stood up and murmured something in the sense that 'you made me do it' and started to ask people whether they can roll one for him. And after he found someone who was willing he came back to me with victorious grin in his face meaning something like 'See? I can always find someone.' And even offered me the cigarette. In this case I rejected.

It was interesting to see that he was able to roll himself the cigarette but he was unwilling. It was like it was some kind of law for him. The more I opposed to the idea of rolling a cigarette for him the more he was unwiling to do it himself. It was like some kind of battle. Obviously he sees the people like some cows that he can milk whenever he wants. He can rob them of money or energy or of time you name it. And why should he do anything himself when there are plenty of people willing to do it for him. Every time he cons someone to do something it is like a small victory for him. I bet that if he would roll the cigarette himself he would not enjoy it because if someone else will do it for him, the cigarette tastes like victory. He is simply like a spoiled brat who takes advantage of his parents because they allow him to do it. This guy was not interested to do anything for anyone even not for himself. He is a leech. And even though I perfectly understand what he is doing and why, I am not in agreement. Well his path might be suitable for someone who really wants to be STS. The guy was even offering me to go with him to con some people. But at this point I had enough so we parted ways.

I understand that if someone asks people for money and they will give it to him then he inevitably realizes that he does not need to do anything and he can comfortably live off of the people. This is what I saw when I looked at that man. He had no responsibility whatsoever and simply was wandering without any aim like a ghost. He is not giving to this world anything. Well except for those 'lessons'.

And this is the mode of operation of pretty much all STS types. They simply try and see if they can con you. And if not they will find someone else but not without trying it on you few more times. Or on every opportunity. Even in the job this is the same. You or your work might be used in STS way without you realizing it making you a part of some STS plan.

I was thinking that if all people would unite and were not willing to do anything for such types, they (STS) would wither away because they are simpy unable to do anything. They can only con people and that is all. There would be not even fight because they would die of starvation or something.

Well what can I say I learned a lesson and it took me the rest of the day to digest it somehow. The more I am thinking about it the more it makes me sad. And I really did not mean someone like this guy when I meant that having no job is better (well he even has a job and it didn't help him). I meant honest people who are working on the self and care about others. But of course he was right when he tells that one should not trust anyone. At least not in STS world. The situation is different when one is among his/her brothers and sisters.

But I do not want to throw the baby out with the bathwater because I am sure there are some unfortunate people who simply lost home and have nowhere to go. I even knew one woman who was homeless but she worked on herself and could even partially control her mind. Of course she used this ability of hers to manipulate others but now she is a successfull psychologist and lives with her sister and her cats. And she has a job and continues to manipulate her clients :D. So I guess there is some way for anyone.
 
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