John Keel and Operation Trojan Horse

[Skipling]

Thank you to all who have been recommending the works of John Keel here. I have just picked up this book and "Our Haunted Planet" and am slowly getting into each. What an author, and what a tremendously deep thinker. And also, courage under pressure. I wish I'd got into these books years ago.

Already, regarding the ultra-terrestrial hypothesis (which is as near as dammit to the reality of the phenomenon, imo) I have a wondering question; the "pay off" of the megalith builders as alluded to by Laura in SHOTW. What do you all reckon then; are our "ancestors" now ultra-terrestrials themselves? I suppose it ties in with the concept of density progression, and the kind of minds capable of such a theorised civilisation would surely have been ready to graduate, be it for good or ill of course. ;) After all, if their civilisation vanished, where did they go? I recall reading something about people being "zapped" at Stonehenge also in the transcripts, but that could mean anything so I won't presume.

Sorry if I'm just adding to the noise here but this question popped up pretty swiftly reading this thread today.

It's rather discouraging to me, also, to know that Rich Dolan, knowing Keel and his work, having read the Cs, still believes in the technology schitck and disclosure.

Bewildering is the word. Dolan's working on a book with the author of the old tv series "Dark Skies" at the moment. Now, I watched this series recently. It is distinctly underwhelming. I want to call it something worse but manners preclude me. Sounds to me like he's off on a jolly vector of false optimism. Where he gets his optimism from I don't know. However, I wouldn't discount the possibility of there being so much more to this phenomena in breadth and scope than has currently been explored. 3d reality has a many and varied eco-system, technology too. Well, what about 4d reality? A hyperdimensional jungle I would propose, with its own stratification, or pecking order. And hopefully some force to balance the psychopathology....hence my question regarding our "ancestors"!

I can't wait to get further into this book though, I'm sure to discover much more. Thanks again for a fine recommendation!

 

[Lorraine]

Hi Lorraine,

Here's your link : http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=10917.msg190449#msg190449

Have a look here and go to the SMF Bulletin Board Code and look for "Insert Hyperlink".

Hi Gandalf,

Thanks for your help :)

 

[Lorraine]

Lorraine- I have been reading it just online - I did not download it. I just tried now to download it and it said that it was in the arhcive and I would have to pay a fee to download it
( 9.00 ) for one month. Did you pay for this and your computer crashed?

So it seems scribd is now charging for copyrighted material.

Hello EmeraldHope,

Yes I did pay a fee and intended to get it printed on another computer, I find I can concentrate better with a hard copy, my eyes go funny reading from a screen. I'm looking forward to dig deeper into his book

 

[Approaching Infinity]

Just watched a really good talk by John Keel here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y6BI6ktTp9w

It's in MIBs, and he talks about underground race myths, possible reanimated corpses, oddities surrounding Vietnam casualties, and other kinds of weirdness! As usual, Keel is erudite AND funny!

 

[Skipling]

I am now over 200 pages into this work and it is quite superb! The rational part of my mind has been conscious of the hyperdimensional nature of the phenomenon for many, many years, but it is always a good refresher to read someone such as Keel, explaining the correlations between the old fairy sightings, goblins, demons, spirits, ghosts...and then the airships and the strange varieties of beings operating them. It really does appear that they are transmogrifications of energy, which can influence observers in accordance with the nature of their perception, thus to either influence (control via deception or delusion) or terrify them. This all ties in so well with Laura's hypothesis and also Jacques Valle's. So many cases of people throughout history being basically stalked and haunted by these damn things! Or the vainglorious ones succumb to narcissistic delusion and create religions. "Chosen Ones" indeed!

Plus it explains the C's concept of window fallers to a tee, vis-a-vis the expectations of the witnesses. Hence the need to create a scene, a trend, a belief system to prime the potential audience. The fact that Keel almost implies a human element in this priming is the most sinister. But then psychopaths run the world, so why should that even remotely surpise me? Maybe I'm off on this, but I thought that it was implied, although Keel clearly thought that men in power were basically incompetent. Maybe that's why he came across as jolly? If he'd been introduced to the subject of ponerology his take might have changed...and yes, I see the immense tragedy of his passing in this.

As a response to Approaching Infinity (yes, he's so chilled out, relaxed and humorous as a lecturer!) with your good link, here's one for an interview with Jacques Vallee, although for copyright reasons the first part of eleven cannot be listened to. I thought this was a great interview, and with three Vallee books now in my "to read" pile, this was a decent introduction to the man behind the control system hypothesis. I have never agreed with this concept more than I do these days, pennies have been dropping everywhere.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B-8u7ExQXrQ&p=B835684B4200ACB2&playnext=1&index=31

A rigorous, no-nonsense approach, with objective data analysis, and finally some care for the poor people who suffer these experiences. The psychological effects on people's lives, myself included. It was great to hear a scientist talk like that. And an end to the whacky spaceship cosmic crew theory, which has been peddled to death to discredit research into the entire phenomenon. Although, as Vallee says, we cannot discount that being potentially a part of the phenomenon in some way too, but without the data....

 

[Laura]

All of the above observations from the work of Keel which are, I believe, confirmed by the collection of data that Dolan pulled together if it is looked at with a broad perspective, make it even more curious that Dolan has bought into the "ufo cadillac on the White House Lawn" trip. He did say something to me once, when he was here, that was a big red flag: when I described the nature of cyclic catastrophes and that we were probably facing one, he visibly reacted with shock and horror and said "well, if that is the case, what's the point of anything?" words to that effect. He really wants - needs - to believe that human beings are in control, that it is all mechanical, that somebody in the "rogue government" really does have our best interests at heart, and these somebodies have come out of the woodwork to tell him - Rich Dolan - the truth and set his mind at ease.

 

[aragorn]

Reading Laura's post above suddenly brought to my mind a memory from childhood. At about the age of 10, I believe, I used to go to the little library in our school in almost every intermission we had, and read the books they had on UFOs. The books weren't many, maybe 3 or 4 and I can't remember the names (and some were in English so I couldn't understand much), but I do remember how extremely exciting it was - looking at those pictures and all! At some point I started reading also the books in the parapsychology section. Reading these made me scared so that's when I stopped visiting the library.

The 'vibes' I get from Dolan resemble 'match' my childhood UFO-excitement and enthusiasm. I see a 'young boy' who is looking for adventure. I could very well be off here, but I get the sense that Dolan's prime motivator for investigating the UFO phenomenon isn't about finding the truth, even though he may think it is. It feels more like he is doing it because it brings excitement, meaning and interesting people into his life. Just like me sneaking into that school library - taking a peek (okay, he's done quite a lot more than that!), getting excited, and then returning to my safe every day life. Not really letting it 'sink in' and changing anything inside.

ADDED: Sorry little off topic here, but writing this, I suddenly remember that some years from that time I was reading those books on UFOs some friends and I did an experiment with an ouija board. I think we did this two or three times, using a big piece of paper and a glass turned upside down. At first everyone were accusing all the others of moving the glass, but when it came clear that none of us were doing it (consciously) we got pretty scared. It was just too spooky to continue that experiment. Thank god for that, who knows what kind of damage we would have done to our selves, being only 14 or 15.

 

[dannybananny]

Hello EmeraldHope,

Yes I did pay a fee and intended to get it printed on another computer, I find I can concentrate better with a hard copy, my eyes go funny reading from a screen. I'm looking forward to dig deeper into his book

If you upload book or books you can download books for free, no need for paying fee, I did that with Eight tower.

The 'vibes' I get from Dolan resemble 'match' my childhood UFO-excitement and enthusiasm. I see a 'young boy' who is looking for adventure. I could very well be off here, but I get the sense that Dolan's prime motivator for investigating the UFO phenomenon isn't about finding the truth, even though he may think it is. It feels more like he is doing it because it brings excitement, meaning and interesting people into his life. Just like me sneaking into that school library - taking a peek (okay, he's done quite a lot more than that!), getting excited, and then returning to my safe every day life. Not really letting it 'sink in' and changing anything inside.

From my perspective it looks like he is only scratching the surface not going really deeper about all that question and he can't go deeper because he abides strictly to scientific materialistic methods, I didn't read his book and could be wrong here but from his lectures it seemed he spoke mostly about sightings not so much about abduction stories and encounters, multidimensional realities like Keel did, Dolan didn't take that really seriously. It's interesting that he was shocked by what Laura said because he had that lecture on deep underground and deep underwater bases, so I wonder does he thinks that it's build for us?

 

[Skipling]

It's interesting that he was shocked by what Laura said because he had that lecture on deep underground and deep underwater bases, so I wonder does he thinks that it's build for us?

Yeah, it probably is, in the Hansel and Gretel sense of it. "We can save you, finally now you see! We simply had to keep this quiet". Welcome to a hyperdimensional concentration camp! Give me an expedition tent and a puffer jacket please...

He did say something to me once, when he was here, that was a big red flag: when I described the nature of cyclic catastrophes and that we were probably facing one, he visibly reacted with shock and horror and said "well, if that is the case, what's the point of anything?" words to that effect. He really wants - needs - to believe that human beings are in control, that it is all mechanical, that somebody in the "rogue government" really does have our best interests at heart, and these somebodies have come out of the woodwork to tell him - Rich Dolan - the truth and set his mind at ease.

It's not beyond the boundaries of possibility that some factions within the higher echelons are like an anti-SG fifth column, but with the track record that the secret intel organisations have with those informed, and that's both the known and the unknown groups, would you ever want to give them, even a breakaway faction, the benefit of the doubt?

 

[Skipling]

I haven't had a proper look at this bloke's site yet, but there are tons of photos of secret British bases on there. Apparently he's been featured in the Daily Mail, which is the paper of choice for un self-conscious Basil Fawlty's in the UK, for those unaware overseas, so I won't get carried away. However, there are some pretty grim looking aerial photos on here. The title of the web page suggests cointelpro, but the pictures are very sinister. I am going to give them a good lookover now, but here's the link anyway.


http://www.secret-bases.co.uk/secret.htm

I'll see if I can find out who this Alan Turnbull (the page author) is too, fwiw.

 

[JonnyRadar]

It's not beyond the boundaries of possibility that some factions within the higher echelons are like an anti-SG fifth column, but with the track record that the secret intel organisations have with those informed, and that's both the known and the unknown groups, would you ever want to give them, even a breakaway faction, the benefit of the doubt?

Hi Skipling, what do you mean by "fifth column?"

 

[Skipling]

Just a faction within a faction, the analogy was crude actually; for instance see the original V miniseries. There are lizard beings portrayed as being against their own race's agenda who collaborate with the human resistance, so that was the kind of thing I was getting at. In that series they actually were referred to as a fifth column.

So, a faction within a faction, with competing objectives and goals, so in this theorised case working covertly against the pathocrats. It is stretching things to an absurd level, but that is the only thing that could be getting Dolan excited about a perceived exposure. If I've misinterpreted the term and concept, I apologise.

 

[Laura]

It's not beyond the boundaries of possibility that some factions within the higher echelons are like an anti-SG fifth column, but with the track record that the secret intel organisations have with those informed, and that's both the known and the unknown groups, would you ever want to give them, even a breakaway faction, the benefit of the doubt?

Yeah, I don't think the idea of an anti-SG fifth column is very likely though, I think, Rich is putting his eggs in that basket. As I wrote in an article, Schwaller de Lubicz and the Fourth Reich

It's one thing to pursue conspiracy theories and to find them and track them and think that there are some very naughty folks here on the Big Blue Marble. It's an altogether different thing, after one has tracked enough of these theories, to come to the realization that they are all just different parts of the same elephant, and that the critter is really thousands of years old. When that fact smacks you in the face, either you run screaming in denial, or you begin to step back from the truly BIG picture, the global-millennial picture, and you see that there is a very stinky rat somewhere. Having arrived at that point, you realize that such a conspiracy could not be created or sustained by human beings - at least not alone. And then you have to face the most difficult task of all: asking yourself who or what could be behind it?

Having asked that question, you realize that you simply cannot answer it unless you open your mind to a whole constellation of possibilities that you would formerly never, ever, in your wildest dreams have considered. Then, if you work very, very hard, you may discover the "truth" that they want you to believe.

If you work very, very hard and are very, very lucky, you will realize that you need help, and you will seek this help based on the knowledge you have acquired that such help can and does exist - only we generally do not have access to it because we are too easily duped and manipulated - then you might begin to learn the rules of communicating with higher levels of consciousness than our own. Having learned the rules by doing your homework, you just might be able to ensure that your "source" is not just another "evil magician." At such a point, following such an approach, there is some hope of sorting out the mess. But it isn't easy, and it can't be easy. If it was easy, it would have been done hundreds or thousands of years ago and the world would not be in the state it is in today.

 

[Laura]

Hi Skipling, what do you mean by "fifth column?"

See: The Fifth Column

The Fifth Column. Emilio Mola Vidal, a Nationalist general during the Spanish Civil War (1936-39), originally coined the term. As four of his army columns moved on Madrid, the general referred to his militant supporters within the capital as his "fifth column," intent on undermining the loyalist government from within. So the fifth column is a group of secret sympathizers or supporters of an enemy that engage in espionage or sabotage within defense lines or national borders.

 

[JonnyRadar]

Just a faction within a faction, the analogy was crude actually; for instance see the original V miniseries. There are lizard beings portrayed as being against their own race's agenda who collaborate with the human resistance, so that was the kind of thing I was getting at. In that series they actually were referred to as a fifth column.

So, a faction within a faction, with competing objectives and goals, so in this theorised case working covertly against the pathocrats. It is stretching things to an absurd level, but that is the only thing that could be getting Dolan excited about a perceived exposure. If I've misinterpreted the term and concept, I apologise.

See: The Fifth Column

The Fifth Column. Emilio Mola Vidal, a Nationalist general during the Spanish Civil War (1936-39), originally coined the term. As four of his army columns moved on Madrid, the general referred to his militant supporters within the capital as his "fifth column," intent on undermining the loyalist government from within. So the fifth column is a group of secret sympathizers or supporters of an enemy that engage in espionage or sabotage within defense lines or national borders.

Ah, I see. Thanks for the clarification :)