Limitless

[luke wilson]

Recent paranoia about missing obvious things has made me re-read Laura's and Andromeda's comment and zoomed to some parts of the movie.

Just re-watched the beginning and listened to his words,

He says,

I have come this close to having an impact on the world, and now the only thing I would have an impact on, was the side walk.

I am not sure if this qualifies as 'help the world be a better place'.

Just before saying those words, he watched his neighbour get shot. Look at his face, any emotions that some guy has wrongly died because of him? I can't see any.

Also a thought that came to my mind, in his super intelligence level during the movie, he should have realized that in order to make the world a better place, assuming this was his goal, he would need people to be better, truly better. The funny thing is that he had the solution which by the end of the movie he had managed to perfect i.e. no side effects. Why not give this to other people e.g. starting with the lady who helped him when he was on the edge of sanity, his ex-wife. I am sure he could think of some elaborate way to spread the genius around whilst remaining anonymous (if he cared about personal security) and thus make the world truly remarkable. I could envision an ending where all over the world, geniuses are popping up all over the place, finding cures to all sorts of diseases, standing up to tyranny, speaking the truth, over turning the system of oppression, doing remarkable things etc etc...

 

[Laura]

It's part of his internal monologue in an early part of the movie that reveals that he wants to more or less sort out the problems of the world. And then, at the end, when the industrialist wants to "own" him, he lets the guy know that, "nope", isn't gonna happen - I'll be making political decisions without being "owned." And the reason he had this freedom from psychopathic control was because he was smarter, "50 steps ahead" of the guy.

It probably helps to have subtitles turned on, otherwise, you might miss a few things considering the amount of stuff they had to carry forward in the plot in a limited amount of time.

The Cs have told us often enough that our potentials are "limitless" if we could only use our brains for what they were given to us for. This movie is a rather interesting example of that.

Notice how one of the first things he did when he "got smart" was "clean up his environment" because a smart person wouldn't live like a slob. That was like a big infusion of "information" into the situation, bringing order and countering entropy. How many people live completely disordered lives because they don't apply their brains to the most simple things that they could affect in their environment.

The movie is a metaphor for a set of principles. Don't try to overdraw it.

 

[Luis Miguel]

Thinking about some of the responses here and in other movie threads, it occurs to me that many people who have been sickened by the soulless and heartless aspect of our society, are sometimes turned off by cunning and overt intelligence, seeing it as cold or inhuman. Some even see narcissisticly wounded people as psychopaths. (Someone suggested at some point that Scarlet O'Hara from Gone with the Wind was a psychopath.)

I agree, avoiding a black and white thinking is the clue here IMO, one most contextualize moment to moment, again, as Laura has said: 'There's good, there's evil and there's the specific situation that determines which is which' as the vision of moral and immoral from G:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1TWAjBU9mz0

Of course, it's just a movie and many can come with different "readings" or interpretations if you give too much importance to certain details and create other narratives from there, but I think that the main aspects are pretty cool and make you think. And IMO it doesn't really matter if the "help to build a better world" idea - I saw it that way - wasn't very clear, but if you consider it, you'll get a lot of interesting things from it.

An important scene IMO is when he jumps from the cliff - Castaneda's like metaphor -, and there, floating, contemplating the sunset he says: 'And then I began to form an idea. Suddenly I knew exactly what I needed to do, it wasn't writing, it wasn't books, it was much bigger than that - his objective to help to build a better world, as L and Andromeda pointed out - but it would take money to get there' -a mean-. Right there you notice that the money wasn't his aim, it was beyond that.

He used the pill as a tool to fulfill a greater objective and he was the only successful one, and it was funny that all the others that had selfish aims died - "With great power, comes great responsibility" . And all his mistakes and suffering were actually used to develop new strategies that get closer to his objective (forbearance and timing? :P).

Also, it's curious that you really never know where does that pills came from, and they just happen to appear in a very low point in the life of the protagonist.

It was funny that the pathological guy that took the pills, Hank Atwood, was only playing monopoly, using the pill for his own selfish ends, getting richer and richer. That was his objective and he was focused on it, and he didn't had the forbearance to see what was coming ahead -wishful thinking-.

Also, he dealt just fine with his own petty tyrants as Van Loon and the Russian (?) guy, for example, he knew that the angry Russians might visit him and he was prepared for it, the severed hands of his bodyguards (that they killed) in the safebox was a proof of it, or that was my perception.

It came to mind the concept of eclipsing realities and the ideas about different realities explained in Laura's K&B videos, he had opportunities to choose selfish, pathological paths but he always kept his aim in mind, planning everything and being aware of what could lead him closer to it or just the opposite.

And related to that expanded perception of reality idea this Cs' comment came to my mind:

"All events are synchronous when perception becomes a catalyst for learning".

Well, I'm rationalizing great deal here , but it was indeed very useful and fun to watch that movie.

Edit: added an important missing comma :P.

 

[Luis Miguel]

It's part of his internal monologue in an early part of the movie that reveals that he wants to more or less sort out the problems of the world. And then, at the end, when the industrialist wants to "own" him, he lets the guy know that, "nope", isn't gonna happen - I'll be making political decisions without being "owned." And the reason he had this freedom from psychopathic control was because he was smarter, "50 steps ahead" of the guy.

It probably helps to have subtitles turned on, otherwise, you might miss a few things considering the amount of stuff they had to carry forward in the plot in a limited amount of time.

The Cs have told us often enough that our potentials are "limitless" if we could only use our brains for what they were given to us for. This movie is a rather interesting example of that.

Notice how one of the first things he did when he "got smart" was "clean up his environment" because a smart person wouldn't live like a slob. That was like a big infusion of "information" into the situation, bringing order and countering entropy. How many people live completely disordered lives because they don't apply their brains to the most simple things that they could affect in their environment.

The movie is a metaphor for a set of principles. Don't try to overdraw it.

Indeed! it has a lot of juice :D.

 

[luke wilson]

I suppose the movie had many layers.

Out of curiosity what led to the château watching it? The movie on first viewing got slated by many. I watched it a couple of years ago, thought it was somewhat cool but didn't take the esoteric meaning from it. From Andromeda's comment it also appears that some had misgivings about it until they got to listen to what I suppose a different group had to say. Just asking out of curiosity.

 

[Joe]

Out of curiosity what led to the château watching it?

The mention of it on this thread.

 

[H-KQGE]

I re-watched this yesterday due to the comments here (SAO, Ark's sott piece initially) by Laura & Andromeda & I agree. I must've forgotten most of that movie because I was wondering what Andromeda was talking about ("cold calculating decision-making, cunning") especially the blood drinking part, (!) & yes he was using his brain in a pretty dumb way at the start, but he did get in to trouble (knew the brother-in-law was a dealer before & just accepted the line about FDA approval) & he spent most of the movie escaping from it.

He didn't seem like a psychopath or anything to me, he was just struggling & this enabled him to grow (when he finally came up with the plan, BEFORE he told his on-off girlfriend which sounded junkie-like, given his previous look, behaviour & subsequent change) which was obviously good. What was disturbing was the rate with which he was dosing & not eating or sleeping, whilst subjecting himself to a cacophony - sights & sounds (strobe lights in clubs, alcohol) & the repeating disorienting "tunnel" effect ( I think he referred to them as blackouts - walking 20 blocks with no memory of how he got there) which was nuts.

But watching it again reminded me of how inspired I felt watching it the first time (yes really) apart from the excitement of a movie in Hollywood doing this, I remember those little bits (the landlords wife- "she didn't stand a chance") where he had super focus on seemingly extraneous details which were of course relevant. At the time (upon its release) I was thinking along the lines of Sherlock Holmes & "thinking with a hammer" which he perhaps, took to another level (lacking broader knowledge & spiritual insight) & I wonder how a truth-seeking person would do if they took one of those pills.

Would they be able to do the research, hoovering-up (all?) the available data online & off-line & distilling it in a few days & finding the secret history of the world? I wonder...

He definitely stated that that he wanted to change things. "Time somebody shook-up the free world & got things done." President, CEO were some of the things he considered to bring about change. It's important to consider that as far as the movie goes, he needed a huge amount of capital to move forward, as well as his drive (compulsion?) - "If I didn't move forward I felt as if I would explode."

Altogether I thought the movie worked on both levels, the deeper & the superficial, with the struggle & imminent danger vital. Also finding a lab tech (& apparently owning a lab later) to study the chemistry & "iron-out" the kinks was clear thinking (for $2million!) & weening himself off of it was crucial to his development. I was pleased second time around to see him "stick it" to DeNiro at the end, especially impressive was the little predictive display ("seeing"?) ;) as opposed to the conversation in Italian with the waitress (manipulating his ex somewhat, "I'm a little intimidated" - cue bedroom scenes) & other social fun & games.

Actually, the only thing I didn't catch ( including my original viewing) was the role of Atwood's lawyer, Atwood's wife, & the knife-wielding driver. I know Atwood also took "NZT" as well as plenty of others, (and in the beginning the protagonist assumed he was the only one using, then reality bit him on the wotsits) but it seemed Atwood didn't want anyone else using, which is how he blindsided DeNiro. Anyways, I'm glad to have seen it again.


Added: from IMDB

Throughout the production it was called "The Dark Fields." The same name of the book on which it is based.

&

Near to the end of the movie we see Eddie has written a novel called "Illuminating The Dark Fields", a resemblance to the novel "The Dark Fields" by Alan Glynn on which this movie is based.

 

[hiker]

The movie really made an impression when I saw it during its initial run (watched it again now). I didn't then quite pick up all the nuances in relation to Work that have been discussed here, but several bits and pieces in the story stroke a chord. Even though the guy had the pill to help him "see the light", things like the importance of acquiring information, paying attention and observing your surroundings, improving and evolving yourself, were hinted at. And the way how the protagonist came into his own in the end was very uplifting: a "new JFK", who would very likely outsmart the plotters and assassination attempts :)

An amusing side note: seeing the movie I speculated that maybe the clear headed feeling the guy had after taking the pill, would be somewhat similar to that of the feeling one has after doing a full program of EE :)

Notice how one of the first things he did when he "got smart" was "clean up his environment" because a smart person wouldn't live like a slob. That was like a big infusion of "information" into the situation, bringing order and countering entropy. How many people live completely disordered lives because they don't apply their brains to the most simple things that they could affect in their environment.

This is a point that really spoke to me seeing the movie. I have to admit that I tend to "forget myself" and let the flat become disorderly. It is simply astonishing, the positive effect taking control of the surroundings and cleaning the flat, has on the "atmosphere" in your home, on your focus and general well being!


The director, Neil Burger, has made another excellent and interesting movie, The Illusionist.
A review from imdb:

I am a long time fan of the old theatre magicians and have been fascinated by the wave of spiritualism that swept both continents around the turn of the last century. This movie plays off those real life happenings, with the added twist of court and political intrigue. The movie is lush - as a period piece should be - with terrific performances from a true ensemble cast. Edward Norton has the charismatic gaze that makes you believe in every thing he does. Jennifer Biel is tragic and compelling as a woman trapped by society and dubious duty. Paul Giamatti - who seems to be in every other movie these days - is wonderful as a conflicted man unsure of whom he serves. Rufus Sewell, as the Crown Prince Leopold, is that man, and he embodies the boo-hiss villain. Vain and driven, he is larger than life and not one to cross, as the illusionist comes to find out. The music of Philip Glass fits the scenes and add just the right amount of tension. Plus the horses are very old world with large hooves and a heck of a lot of presence. A compelling and beautiful film.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0443543/

 

[Scottie]

I liked it.

As for his desire to become president to effect change, well... imagine JFK on NZT.

I always try to rethink things when I hear myself saying, "Oh, that would never happen in the real world! It was so unrealistic!" because if anything is ever going to change, I think we need at least two things:

1. Awareness of how things normally work in the "real world"
2. The conviction that we can do our part to effect change

That's a fine line to walk, because no one knows what effects their actions may have, but we all have a pretty good idea of where things are probably headed if we take no action (or maybe no different actions).

Then again, we can be totally wrong about where things are headed, either because we are not aware enough, or because something changed/shifted.

So, I end up concluding that it's best to just leave things wide open.

But, that's also a fine line to walk, because it is then easy to just fall into, "Everything's open! We're saved! I don't have to do anything!"

Thus, constant, ever-vigilant awareness of everything seems to be the real key.

 

[lilies]

In the commentary audio for Limitless too, director Neil Burger tells us this is the screen adaption of Alan Glynn's book, The Dark Fields. It is said the movie turned out to be a lot better, thanks to talented script writer Leslie Dixon, who apparently took a lot of artistic license, saw the potential in the (possibly) mediocre work bought in a second-hand bookshop and wrote the material for an enjoyable film. Director Neil Burger did a top-notch job by bringing together excellent actors and creating professional imagery plus hiring a competent musician to create the soundtrack.

After re-watching the film now I see why Limitless may elicit in some a certain urge to critique here. The cause of upset might be the (mirroring) messages this film is trying to send. Life of Eddie (like his apartment is in total chaos), but after NZT everything changes.

One of the most educative points I found is the skillfull display of regression - so aptly parallels the mind-transforming paleo/keto/heavy metal detox process vs. carbs-guzzling - when the protagonist doesn't take the pill and spends time having regular mind, instead of operating in the four-digit IQ zone.

First scenes, the protagonist is like me years ago, toxin-filled, haven't heard about detox, tired all the time, gobbling up carbs, stumbling in a perpetual brain fog.

We have recipes now after all the suffering & research, they are available in a couple of threads here. Works a lot slower and takes many months to really kick in. We got ideas too. Possibilities are opening up on the horizon. We might be going "senator", like Eddie.

 

[seek10]

I watched it yesterday and is a interesting movie. Starts with hero's book project of his idea of better society, but it enters the path of NZT out of desperation( How worse it can be than now). drug continues with sister-in law comment of 'works best if you are already smarter' before his death. What I liked the most is his tweaking the formula to remove the dependency, while continue to produce and the ending dialogue with Robert DeNero. Blood drinking part is just another desperate move as he just before decided to not to commit suicide, (How worse than before can it be mindset). It's like 'person who is fully in water feels less cold than than a person who is in half water'. Other things are -Things are moving so fast and he is navigating the world as best he can, he knows didn't have control over every thing and committed to not making mistake of "thinking that he is the smartest".

whether he will be able to make any difference to the world, I was not optimistic, though I do surely hope for it. how many times we thought 'If only this can happen, every thing will be all right'.- Money, Information from end less self help and new age books/products , external love, good health, political ism's, Rulers (JFK,Bhutto and so many other movements) etc. Rabbit hole goes deeper,deeper and gardener(or his smart minions) continue to tweak to make us squirrel, at best occasional rabbit. Good part of the movie is he never seems to be stop watching/analyzing/make best of his abilities while maintaining the emotionality and still loves his girl friend.

This reminds me of the novel 'replay' where hero continue to repeat his life between years 18 to 45 or 47 (over and over ) with full knowledge of past life's and making decisions based on the past. Initial life time starts with craving for money, sex , then morphed in to altruistic exposing JFK murder and getting the heat, then to sort of new age existence, then to love, and finally to carving of coming out of replay to have normal existence.

 

[person21]

I watched the entire movie on my phone and kind of liked it, but looked into it more online and people were saying Bradly Cooper wasn't using I think 80% of his brain, but around 20% lol. Too bad theres that new movie with Scarlett Joansan that basically copies the same concept, but instead she has superpowers this time.

 

[luke wilson]

Hi,

Just to let you guys know. This has now been made into a TV Show.

It picks up things from where the movie stopped but this time we follow a different character. The original main character is still there, now a politician.

I personally don't like the new show as it is a bit to light hearted and to jokey i.e. the supposed serious situations aren't serious at all that it pretty much leaves you disengaged. It's also quite mundane. Its basically been reduced to a cop drama.

Nonetheless, it's up and running if anyone wishes to check it out.

 

[Woodsman]

I met a guy who was very moved by this film; he had previously spent a few years completely frying and scrambling his brain using lots of drugs and easy-way solutions. He adored, "Limitless" using it as an excuse to justify his continued self-destruction and wishful thinking. He'd do internet research and go into drug stores to request all kinds of exotic prescription drugs from wary pharmacists (who denied him). To outside observers, he was a complete mess who hurt the people around him, lost his job due to being totally brain-fried and disassociative. He struck me as being just another one of those, "Higher consciousness through LSD and Mushrooms" zealots.

I was both fascinated and disturbed by this movie. It was fun to watch the protagonist be Super, but the implications of the message in terms of media and population impact were spooky.

It struck me as the embodiment of the American Dream and Wishful Thinking writ large: "Success and getting to play Hero without having to do any work". -The protagonist used technology developed by scientists (who had studied and worked hard off screen), which was subsequently stolen from them, and then used to Win at life." It seemed like another spin on the old slavery game to me, in particular, the American version, where the end user is only vaguely aware that he is living on the sweat of others. Like somebody eating a chocolate bar, blissfully ignorant of the people used to make it.

The folks I've met who really do "Win at Life" had to work really hard over the course of many years, make difficult choices and sculpt themselves into effective tools. They paid heavily through applied suffering. They didn't get a free lunch in the form of a pill.

In the "Matrix", the blue pill represented a choice; was taken only once and it didn't make any of the changes for Neo. -Neo may have had fighting skills downloaded into his brain for "free", but at the cost of being ripped out of his dream life and into a world of painful truth. (And this is an apt metaphor for people who start to download Truth into their minds; it's like being given awareness kung-fu; you are literally given the tools needed to move effectively through situations which regular people are dominated and destroyed by). And also metaphorically like real life, even with these new skills, Neo still got his butt kicked -a lot- until he'd worked on himself appropriately. It took three films and a great deal of suffering and hard choices to finally "Win". In "Limitless" by contrast, the drug was everything, and the main struggle was over who got to control the chemical supply line in order to keep on "Winning".

I think this movie was largely a pipe-dream deception with a spoonful of truth to help the pharmaceuticals go down.

And that being said...

It *does* also remind me of the Castaneda books, where Don Juan regularly blasted Carlos out of his mind with Peyote and other powerful narcotics. When he later described the dangers of the damage this may have caused, Carlos asked in horror, "Why did you do that to me?" -The response was (paraphrasing) essentially that Carlos was too stupid to have broken through the awareness wall without explosives.

I suppose, as happens with most messages, the filter of the observer will take from it what fits with their vibration. People seeking to better themselves through Work will see and benefit from the relevant messages, and the drug store cowboys will Yipee-Kye-Yay all the way to hell.

 

[axj]

Hi,

Just to let you guys know. This has now been made into a TV Show.

It picks up things from where the movie stopped but this time we follow a different character. The original main character is still there, now a politician.

There is also quite a twist on the original character from the movie (played by Bradley Cooper). In this TV show he is basically portrayed as a kind of high-functioning psychopath who threatens the protagonist not to reveal a secret or else he would let him die more painfully than he could imagine.

Then there are scenes where the father of the protagonist is threatened for the same reason.