Malaysian Airlines Flight 17 Crashes in Ukraine

[thorbiorn]

Thanks to all the posters and commentators of the latest disclosures, I also found it mentioned on _https://dninews.com/article/leaked-documents-ukrainian-air-forces-shot-down-mh17-confirms-conspiracy-and-guilt It is a sad story which also offers an opportunity for some people to learn quite a lot about the reality we now live in.

 

[thorbiorn]

First off, I want to apologize for not having rechecked whether the BBC YT-video was still active. I simply assumed it should be since its front image still shows up in Reply #593.

Many thanks then, voyageur, for your thorough breakdown of what was on offer in this documentary. It finely concurs with my memory about the BBC version I saw on YouTube when it was still available, and it also follows neatly the article of Mike Rudin you linked to.

So, a year later and really no new facts or perspectives presented. Just a rehash of old materials. What a pity.

Are you referring to parts of this video, which at the time of posting has 110 views, but was posted in August of 2014 with the title "BUSTED! BBC Deleted Video Showing Witnesses Reporting MH17 Was Shot Down By Ukranian Fighter Jets!"

http://<iframe width="560" height="...1A" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Findes også her fra den 28. juli 2014: _https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sa_R2NA1txc

 

[Palinurus]

No, not very likely I would say.

The video you mention now was first signaled by lostinself in Reply 248 on July 2, 2014 with a transcription in English.

Under the https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sa_R2NA1txc video you also linked to, we can read:

http://www.globalresearch.ca/deleted-...
Deleted BBC Report. “Ukrainian Fighter Jet Shot Down MHI7″, Donetsk Eyewitnesses
The Catastrophe of #MH17: #BBC in the Search of the “#BUK” – The Video Report Deleted by @BBC

By Global Research News
Global Research, July 27, 2014

The original BBC Video Report was published by BBC Russian Service on July 23, 2014.

In a bitter irony, The BBC is censoring its own news productions.

Why did BBC delete this report by Olga Ivshina?

Is it because the BBC team was unable to find any evidence that a rocket was launched in the area that the Ukrainian Security Service (“SBU”) alleges to be the place from which the Novorossiya Militia launched a “BUK” missile?

Or is it because every eyewitness interviewed by the BBC team specifically indicated the presence of a Ukrainian military aircraft right beside the Malaysian Airlines Boeing MH17 at the time that it was shot down?

Or is it because of eyewitness accounts confirming that the Ukrainian air force regularly used civilian aircraft flying over Novorossiya as human shields to protect its military aircraft conducting strikes against the civilian population from the Militia’s anti-aircraft units?

Highlights of Witness statements (see complete transcript below)

Eyewitness #1: There were two explosions in the air. And this is how it broke apart. And [the fragments] blew apart like this, to the sides. And when …

Eyewitness #2: … And there was another aircraft, a military one, beside it. Everybody saw it.

Eyewitness #1: Yes, yes. It was flying under it, because it could be seen. It was proceeding underneath, below the civilian one.

Eyewitness #3: There were sounds of an explosion. But they were in the sky. They came from the sky. Then this plane made a sharp turn-around like this. It changed its trajectory and headed in that direction [indicating the direction with her hands].

The British BBC documentary of early May 2016 now re-transmitted in Canada is 59 mins. long as per Reply #593.

Not having that one at my disposal ATM, it's impossible for me to ascertain whether this latest 2016 documentary did re-use any clips from the 2014 report they themselves pulled back and censored, but I find it extremely improbable given the conflicting narratives of both. However, it's not completely impossible, provided they used some testimony just to debunk it.

 

[thorbiorn]

No, not very likely I would say.

The video you mention now was first signaled by lostinself in Reply 248 on July 2, 2014 with a transcription in English.

Under the https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sa_R2NA1txc video you also linked to, we can read:
[...]

The one I posted link to was probably the same as the one mentioned on RT, at least what is translated in English corresponds well with what is said in Russian:

Censorship or error? Internet criticism for BBC removal of MH17 report
Published time: 25 Jul, 2014 11:01
Edited time: 25 Jul, 2014 11:03
BBC Russian has come under fire from internet users after deleting its report on the MH17 crash for not meeting ‘editorial values.’ The reporter questioned says that local militia fired the missile, with locals talking about Ukrainian army planes.
The report on the Malaysian plane tragedy by BBC Russian correspondent Olga Ivshina was released on July 23.She interviewed local witnesses who told her that they saw military aircraft in the sky before the incident.

“And there was another aircraft, a military one, beside it [the Malaysian plane]. Everybody saw it,” said one witness.

“It was flying under it [the Malaysian plane], we could see it. It was going underneath the civilian one,” added another.

The report contained a soundbite of an SBU official, saying that the aircraft was shot down by a Buk missile.

“This was a BUK M1 system which shot the aircraft down. It came to Ukraine early in the morning on the 17 July. It was delivered by a tow truck to the city of Donetsk,” Vitaly Naida said.

“After that, it was redeployed from Donetsk, as part of a column of military equipment, to the city of Torez, to Snezhnoye, and to Pervomaisk.”

Ivshina also tried to find a place depicted on photos provided by Ukraine’s Security Service (SBU) which, in their opinion, prove that the Boeing was shot down by a Buk missile system by self-defense forces. She found the place which she assumes is the spot based on landscape characteristics.

“It must be noted that, in an area where fighting continues almost unabated, there is a coalmine and also the Saur-Mogila memorial nearby. It turns out that the smoke could have been coming from any of these locations,” she says in her piece to camera.

Ivshina claims she didn’t see any traces of Buk missiles and says that neither did the local residents.

In the meantime, the commander of local self-defense forces in the city of Snezhnoe, in the Donetsk Region told Ivshina that they have no weaponry capable of shooting down a jet fighter flying at high altitude.

“They [Kiev troops] use these civilian aircraft to hide behind,” he told Ivshina. However, he added that if self-defense troops had such a weapon, then they would have tried to down the jets.

In the meantime, the piece doesn’t draw any conclusions about who was behind the plane crash.
Report which didn’t meet “ the editorial values of the BBC”

As soon as the report was published on the BBC website, it was immediately deleted. “Document is not available” said the page.

The video of Ivshina’s report, released on YouTube, was repeatedly deleted, according to YouTube users.

“Video Deleted YouTube,” read the description.

The deleted page immediately sparked the attention of social media. The report itself wasn’t deleted. The bloggers and twitter users accused the BBC of censorship.

“Why are they [BBC] deleting this video?” wrote one YouTube user. “They [BBC] are standing for democracy and the freedom of speech or those who deleted the video, don’t need truth?”

On Thursday, Yan Leder, a managing editor from the Russian service at BBC explained that the report was removed as it contained “ mistakes.”

He added [_http://www.bbc.com/russian/blogs/2014/07/140724_blog_editors_bbc_story_rework.shtml] that the report had “imperfect structure” and “incomplete compliance of the editorial values of BBC.”

“Unfortunately in this case the report wasn’t submitted to BBC standard editorial analysis. As a result, there were several omissions [in the report],” he added.

According to Leder, the correspondent should have asked the witnesses “specifying questions” in response to their accusations and include “ experts’ opinion in her report.”

“That’s why we are modifying the material so that it would (sic) meet the editorial standards of BBC.”

Leder added that Ivshina’s report will soon be published on the BBC website.

However, the explanations from the BBC Russian chief apparently didn’t satisfy readers.

The bloggers believe that the reasons for removing the article might have been the interviews with local witnesses, who said that the Kiev military were using civil jets as cover, and the statements from self-defense forces who say they don’t have missiles capable of hitting targets at high altitude.

“I have been with you [BBC] for 15 years and that case is disgusting,” said one user.

Another criticized the BBC of being biased.

Yet another reader queried what specifying questions should the women have been asked? They had simply stated that they had seen a military jet near the Boeing? The reader went on to assert that if these interviews are deleted as a result of these corrections, then the BBC will be guilty of non-professionalism and weakness.

 

[angelburst29]

I tried to locate a working copy of the BBC video you are interested in - all copies, re-uploads and 3rd party video's have been scrubbed. I scanned the "Comment" section in each of the sites I found the video but any copies came up blank. So, there is definitely something on the video that is damaging to the one's behind this Flight 17 incident. It's not surprising, that the two Dutch journalist had all their equipment, notes and video's confiscated at the airport.

To our advantage, this thread has documented the timely developments and news reports, as they became available. They may scrub a video or two, which is unfortunate but in doing so, they also draw attention to themselves and what they might be hiding? The whole truth will come out sooner or later.

 

[Palinurus]

The one I posted link to was probably the same as the one mentioned on RT

Yes, that was my impression as well, thorbiorn.

I tried to locate a working copy of the BBC video you are interested in - all copies, re-uploads and 3rd party video's have been scrubbed.

Thank you for your trouble, angelburst29. A pity it didn't bear fruit.

The way I see it, voyageur or someone else in Canada who has access to the Canadian BBC website should have a look whether the 2016 documentary they recently aired is still available for viewing and eventually downloading by locals. If it is, it should be downloaded ASAP to have a copy saved for this network. Then we could analyze it again for the parts that probably could explain the scrubbing. That might be our last chance to get a clear picture of this specific situation, I think.

 

[Possibility of Being]

If you are looking for the BBC documentary made by Mike Rudin and first broadcast on 03 May 2016, it's here:
https://rutube.ru/video/2daa4e79f26c621de588589aa5c0409f/

 

[Palinurus]

Ah, brilliant PoB ! That's the one we were looking for. It had to be somewhere...

Thanks for finding it.

 

[angelburst29]

If you are looking for the BBC documentary made by Mike Rudin and first broadcast on 03 May 2016, it's here:
https://rutube.ru/video/2daa4e79f26c621de588589aa5c0409f/

That's Super! Great find, POB!

 

[Possibility of Being]

:) you're very welcome

For the record, to have it all in one place: the video made by a Russian BBC journalist in 2014, removed from the BBC website, changed, re-uploaded and removed again (in Russian only)

original version:

https://rutube.ru/video/96a6927519f8a1c10fb8bb3751744fc0/

edited version:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RA2GfthOyz8

Summary of differences, as described at
_http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.fr/2014/07/no-bbc-video-removal-scandal-afterall.html

Reader Jacob Dreizin, a US citizen who speaks Russian and reads Ukrainian, went over the original and now re-posted videos and it appears the BBC was telling the truth all along [not really!].

From Dreizin

... I have reviewed the original version side-by-side with the new one. And I can see what she's talking about. The new video still has all the eyewitness ladies that everyone has focused on.

The new video removed a somewhat irrelevant lecture from the VItalii Naida, the Ukrainian counterintelligence chief. Instead, it has a Ukrainian official claiming that no combat flights take place over rebel areas, followed by a local resident making a mockery of that claim.

It also has a segment where a BBC aviation expert is quoted as giving his rebuttal to a rebel's claim that Ukrainian warplanes have used civilian flights as cover.

The expert says that while he can't rule it out, it seems very unlikely to him, for various technical reasons. However, I don't think he quite understands precisely what the interviewees are saying.

 

[Palinurus]

Thanks again, PoB.

I've watched all three videos now. The original 2016 documentary showed exactly as I remembered it.

The two other videos are puzzling to me, mainly because I cannot understand what is being said as I don't know the languages.

The edited version on YouTube is about twice as long as the original version on rutube and I get the impression that, due to the inserted materials, the edited version is more in line with the 'official' Western narrative than the retracted original initially was. That´s only a first impression, though.

The witnesses in these clips did not show up in the 2016 documentary as far as I could see. At least, I did not recognize any of them.

FWIW.

 

[Oxajil]

Thank you for the links, PoB! :)

The edited version on YouTube is about twice as long as the original version on rutube and I get the impression that, due to the inserted materials, the edited version is more in line with the 'official' Western narrative than the retracted original initially was. That´s only a first impression, though.

Perhaps some people from BBC were not happy with what the witnesses were saying (that a 'military airplane' was present as well, and 'two explosions' were seen). Maybe they added some bits (for example, the Ukrainian official "claiming that no combat flights take place over rebel areas") to counter what these eyewitnesses said, and as you said to keep the main 'storyline' in favor of the Western narrative.

 

[Palinurus]

Thanks Oxajil for confirming my suspicions.

 

[Palinurus]

Archiving the final vote on the EU-Ukraine treaty in the Senate today -- against the whishes of referendum voters who in majority (61%) rejected the treaty, the Senate approved it:

http://www.dutchnews.nl/news/archives/2017/05/dutch-senate-approves-ukraine-treaty-juncker-welcomes-important-signal/

 

[Palinurus]

SOTT now carries a Sputnik article about the upcoming visa free traveling opportunities for Ukrainians into Europe:

https://www.sott.net/article/352424-Europe-bracing-for-flood-of-illegal-Ukrainian-migrant-workers