Nightmare

[Mr.Anderson]

I don't necessarily mean you need to read about all the terrible details, but be in touch with your feelings about your worst case scenario. I think that fear is the only power the beast has over you. I could be wrong, but I think you have as much power as you think you do. But that may only be in 4D where, I think, there will be a "level playing field."

 

[Mrs.Tigersoap]

It seems to work for me to face the fear when it is necessary, but for me it has been important to pick my battles, and don't expose myself to this when I feel at an disadvantage in regards to control of self. (...)I try to read/learn about this stuff in portions only when I feel in control over my emotions, and won't be surprised or shocked by what I learn.

I understand what you are saying, but in this case, my feeling is less based on fear than disgust. When I read details about what happens to these kids, I'm first and foremost appalled, disgusted, angry and totally flabbergasted that there are people with a mind so sick that they come up with these things, and that we share the earth with people doing that kind of stuff. And I don't think that any amount of reading, documentary watching or staring at the beast will change that fact and how it makes me feel: it is abominable.

 

[HiThere]

I understand what you are saying, but in this case, my feeling is less based on fear than disgust. When I read details about what happens to these kids, I'm first and foremost appalled, disgusted, angry and totally flabbergasted that there are people with a mind so sick that they come up with these things, and that we share the earth with people doing that kind of stuff. And I don't think that any amount of reading, documentary watching or staring at the beast will change that fact and how it makes me feel: it is abominable.

I agree that it is tempting to let one's disgust and anger run free when learning about all these things. For me, my disgust will usually get the best of me and lead to my feeling angry about the state of the world, but this feeling of righteous anger is unproductive and destructive when it manifests in situations where there is no hope of obtaining concrete results towards correcting what is wrong, in my view.

Usually my anger then develops into frustration and even more disgust, which can turn into an evil circle: I allow myself to feel this anger and disgust and it leads me to daydreaming of what I would have done if I was there; and that rarely is of any use to me or anyone else.

Therefore I try to be in a headspace where all my emotions are in check before I take in this kind of information, and I stop if I feel that I am slipping into emotional response. This is the only way I feel able to learn more about these matters without experiencing what seems to be a significant lowering of my frequency.

And the other side of my anger is often fear, and when that manifestes I share Mr Andersons view :

...be in touch with your feelings about your worst case scenario. I think that fear is the only power the beast has over you.

Facing this fear gives a sense of control and acceptance of this world's atrocities; It is not my job to save the world; that would be a serious violation of the other incarnations' free will. All one can do is trying to make a difference in the evil situations one comes in personal contact with, and the righteous anger is of better use in those concrete situations. M2C :)

 

[EmeraldHope]

Facing this fear gives a sense of control and acceptance of this world's atrocities; It is not my job to save the world; that would be a serious violation of the other incarnations' free will. All one can do is trying to make a difference in the evil situations one comes in personal contact with, and the righteous anger is of better use in those concrete situations. M2C :)

But see, here is the free will thing that is such a fine line for me. I know we cannot all save the world. But, think for a minute- most of the kids that are on the receiving end of crazy stuff are going to develop some major issues. Feminine vampires and borderlines, MPD etc, most all come from some type of abuse that is heavy duty. Heck- even by our on criteria here we technically should stay away from them. But by default, those very people who were abused, are now sucked into some dark crazy energy, and on top of that, society shuns them and turns their head. That in turn makes the spiral down even worse. And if they are so badly damaged that they cannot get out of it, well, then, I guess dna married with soul energy and it is their lesson.

As parents, most would not want their kids associating with these types of kids. The further down the socio- economic food chain you go, the less likely information is available or that help that would matter exists.

It has been my experience that many of these people are never really HEARD. These books and documentaries and all the gory details are their story. If one cannot handle that, one is quite ill prepared to handle it in real life . What tends to happen is that people will , like I said, change the subject, or look away, do anything not to see what is real. They certainly do not want to get involved The issue goes far beyond just the initial heinous acts these vile predators commit . Most of the damaged people I have known do not even know what is wrong with them. So is it a free will violation to tell them? Where is the line that you do not get involved? At what point is another human more important than our "frequency"?

I only say this because it is so so easy for the thoughts expressed here in this thread to become rationalizations to not "see".

 

[anart]

I only say this because it is so so easy for the thoughts expressed here in this thread to become rationalizations to not "see".

I tend to agree with that, to a certain extent. Especially these children, they deserve to have a witness to what they've been through - they deserve the compassion that can only come from understanding how horrific the experience is. In short, they deserve more than just turning away, since they could not turn away when it was happening to them. So - on that level, yes, I think compassionate human beings should bear compassionate witness, even though it sickens and is painful.

There is a danger here, of obsession, or desensitization that must be understood. Each case is unique, but I think a balance must be found and it's a very, very fine line to walk (IMO).

 

[HiThere]

EmeraldHope, I do not mean that one should be indifferent to this - quite the opposite.

But see, here is the free will thing that is such a fine line for me. I know we cannot all save the world. But, think for a minute- most of the kids that are on the receiving end of crazy stuff are going to develop some major issues. Feminine vampires and borderlines, MPD etc, most all come from some type of abuse that is heavy duty. Heck- even by our on criteria here we technically should stay away from them. But by default, those very people who were abused, are now sucked into some dark crazy energy, and on top of that, society shuns them and turns their head. That in turn makes the spiral down even worse. And if they are so badly damaged that they cannot get out of it, well, then, I guess dna married with soul energy and it is their lesson.

It is painful to watch these people damage themselves and the kids they give birth to. Sometimes there is an opening where one can try to be a positive influence, but often this is only used as a basis for attempts of manipulation, by playing on the pity which they know only too well is their due.
It is rare to make a difference towards changing the outcome of their lives, but every once in a while one makes a difference that can last for a shorter or longer period. This feels extremely rewarding and is a large part of the reason why I feel it deeply meaningful to work with people who suffer under these circumstances.

Most of the damaged people I have known do not even know what is wrong with them. So is it a free will violation to tell them? Where is the line that you do not get involved? At what point is another human more important that our "frequency"?

Always help, always reach out, always try to establish communication - even with the perpetrator, to understand more and also because the victims will often continue to have relations with their molester even after incidents have been exposed.
But it is difficult to interact with a clear agenda without being formally asked to do so by the victim - this often leads to polarization where one can end up with the victim distrusting one's motives, and the opportunity for trust is lost.
I strongly feel that one should try to influence victims towards self-knowledge about suspected crimes, but in my experience it can be destructive to be too pushy - the inner wish for further knowledge has to be aknowlegded by the victim.

Quote from my post :

All one can do is trying to make a difference in the evil situations one comes in personal contact with, and the righteous anger is of better use in those concrete situations.

 

[EmeraldHope]

Hithere, I did not mean to imply you meant indifference. Sorry. I was more or less expounding on the post I made on page one of this thread, in regards to the free will issue.


It has just been my personal experience most people who have a good heart by and large do not have a very good constitution for dealing with the the nastiness and ugliness, and in that respect the actual fighters on the ground are few and far between . If one can not handle it from an armchair, one surely cannot stare down infinity.

 

[anart]

Hithere, I did not mean to imply you meant indifference. Sorry. I was more or less expounding on the post I made on page one of this thread, in regards to the free will issue.


It has just been my personal experience most people who have a good heart by and large do not have a very good constitution for dealing with the the nastiness and ugliness, and in that respect the actual fighters on the ground are few and far between . If one can not handle it from an armchair, one surely cannot stare down infinity.

Why would one want to stare down infinity?

 

[EmeraldHope]

Hithere, I did not mean to imply you meant indifference. Sorry. I was more or less expounding on the post I made on page one of this thread, in regards to the free will issue.


It has just been my personal experience most people who have a good heart by and large do not have a very good constitution for dealing with the the nastiness and ugliness, and in that respect the actual fighters on the ground are few and far between . If one can not handle it from an armchair, one surely cannot stare down infinity.

Why would one want to stare down infinity?

Perhaps I got the reference wrong I was referring to Castanada about straring at infinity and not blinking.

 

[anart]

Hithere, I did not mean to imply you meant indifference. Sorry. I was more or less expounding on the post I made on page one of this thread, in regards to the free will issue.


It has just been my personal experience most people who have a good heart by and large do not have a very good constitution for dealing with the the nastiness and ugliness, and in that respect the actual fighters on the ground are few and far between . If one can not handle it from an armchair, one surely cannot stare down infinity.

Why would one want to stare down infinity?

Perhaps I got the reference wrong I was referring to Castanada about straring at infinity and not blinking.

He's talking about standing in the face of the unknowable. There is a very big difference. One doesn't need to delve into the darkest pits, much less live in them, in order to stand and face the unknowable. There is a line here, Emerald Hope, and it's important to find it. Did you read the thread Kniall suggested?

 

[EmeraldHope]

Hithere, I did not mean to imply you meant indifference. Sorry. I was more or less expounding on the post I made on page one of this thread, in regards to the free will issue.


It has just been my personal experience most people who have a good heart by and large do not have a very good constitution for dealing with the the nastiness and ugliness, and in that respect the actual fighters on the ground are few and far between . If one can not handle it from an armchair, one surely cannot stare down infinity.

Why would one want to stare down infinity?

Perhaps I got the reference wrong I was referring to Castanada about straring at infinity and not blinking.

He's talking about standing in the face of the unknowable. There is a very big difference. One doesn't need to delve into the darkest pits, much less live in them, in order to stand and face the unknowable. There is a line here, Emerald Hope, and it's important to find it. Did you read the thread Kniall suggested?

LOL- Anart- Laura was talking to ME in that thread. Of course I read it . I did not say one needs to live in a pit, but if one has trouble with knowable details, it logically to me would mean perhaps one could have issue with a bigger unknowable.

 

[anart]

LOL- Anart- Laura was talking to ME in that thread. Of course I read it . I did not say one needs to live in a pit, but if one has trouble with unknowable details, it logically to me would mean perhaps one has issue with a bigger unknowable.

No, you are misunderstanding the term 'unknowable'. It has nothing to do with what you appear to think it does.

I asked you if you'd read that thread because it seems you haven't...

 

[EmeraldHope]

LOL- Anart- Laura was talking to ME in that thread. Of course I read it . I did not say one needs to live in a pit, but if one has trouble with unknowable details, it logically to me would mean perhaps one has issue with a bigger unknowable.

No, you are misunderstanding the term 'unknowable'. It has nothing to do with what you appear to think it does.

I asked you if you'd read that thread because it seems you haven't...

I edited my post because I worded it wrong .

If you will see my post on page one of this thread, I readily admitted I am having a issue in this area. That does not mean I did not read the post. I am just going to keep reading and hopefully I will work the kink out.

 

[Mrs.Tigersoap]

I tend to agree with that, to a certain extent. Especially these children, they deserve to have a witness to what they've been through - they deserve the compassion that can only come from understanding how horrific the experience is. In short, they deserve more than just turning away, since they could not turn away when it was happening to them. So - on that level, yes, I think compassionate human beings should bear compassionate witness, even though it sickens and is painful.

I agree with that and that's what I do: I read the books, the articles, hear my clients' stories, discuss the subject, etc. So, personally, I'm not turning away. I feel it's my responsibility to know. But at some point, I need to see how much I can take in one go and respect that. I know these kids do not have that option. My way of honouring that, so to speak, is to think about them a lot and share their fate, when appropriate, with others. And when something new surfaces, like the snuff movies in France documentary, if I'm still processing stuff I have read about, I think it is best to wait before watching it. But maybe this is not the way to go, I don't know.

 

[HiThere]

Hithere, I did not mean to imply you meant indifference. Sorry. I was more or less expounding on the post I made on page one of this thread, in regards to the free will issue.
It has just been my personal experience most people who have a good heart by and large do not have a very good constitution for dealing with the the nastiness and ugliness, and in that respect the actual fighters on the ground are few and far between . If one can not handle it from an armchair, one surely cannot stare down infinity.

No offense taken of course. :) Your point is very important; one should stay alert to the reality of these matters and not allow oneself to slip into a "comfort zone".