Palestinian man jailed for rape over Jewish lie

[Keit]

This one is tricky. I wonder if the woman would be so distraught if the guy was Jewish, and still wouldn't want to have any serious relationship with her. In my opinion, she was looking for revenge over her mistake. This conviction reminds me of black men being accused of raping white women on plantations. Obviously, not all cases are the same, but this one looks like the woman was "offended" that she slept with an Arab.

_http://www.smh.com.au/world/palestinian-man-jailed-for-rape-over-jewish-lie-20100721-10l4e.html

JERUSALEM: Israeli legal experts have expressed concern at the rape conviction of a Palestinian man who, the court found, had consensual sex with a woman after telling her he was Jewish.


When the woman learnt that the man, Shabbar Kashur, was not Jewish, she filed a police complaint on the grounds she had been deceived into having sex.

Sentenced to 18 months in prison by the Jerusalem District Court this week, three Israeli judges agreed that although it was not a ''classical rape by force'', the woman's consent was obtained under false pretences.

The court rejected the option of a six-month community service order. Kashur is believed to be seeking an appeal.

''If she hadn't thought the accused was a Jewish bachelor interested in a serious romantic relationship, she would not have co-operated,'' the judges wrote.

''The court is obliged to protect the public interest from sophisticated, smooth-tongued criminals who can deceive innocent victims at an unbearable price - the sanctity of their bodies and souls.

''When the very basis of trust between human beings drops, especially when the matters at hand are so intimate, sensitive and fateful, the court is required to stand firmly at the side of the victims … to protect their well-being. Otherwise, they will be used, manipulated and misled, while paying only a tolerable and symbolic price.''

According to Kashur, who is married with two children, he met the woman, who is in her late 20s, outside a Jerusalem grocery store more than two years ago.

''I would say she set upon me,'' Kashur said. ''She was interested in my motorcycle and so we talked. I didn't pretend; I said my name was Dudu because that's how everybody knows me. My wife even calls me that.''

Dudu is an accepted nickname for someone named Daniel.

The couple then went to a nearby building and had consensual sex, after which Kashur left the building without waiting for the woman to get dressed.

Kashur was initially charged with rape and indecent assault, but this was changed to a charge of rape by deception as part of a plea bargain arrangement.

In 2008 Israel's Supreme Court established the precedent that any man who ''does not tell the truth regarding critical matters to a reasonable woman, and as a result of the misrepresentation she has sexual relations with him'' can be convicted of rape.

Kashur's lawyer, Elkana Laist, said the court had opened the door to a rape conviction every time a person lies regarding details of his identity.

Abeer Baker, a legal advocate with the human rights group the Legal Centre for Arab Minority Rights in Israel, said she was shocked by the decision.

''It's a crazy decision,'' Ms Baker said. ''What is a lie? When a man tells a woman that he loves her, they have sex, and then it turns out that he doesn't really love her? Will he be charged with rape? This is a very dangerous precedent and … a mistake by the court.''

 

[theos]

It doesn't seem like she spent much time getting to know much more than his name before sleeping with him let alone his ancestry. I wonder how she found out that he was Arab and what happened in the two years between the consensual encounter and the conviction?

 

[Guardian]

Kashur was initially charged with rape and indecent assault, but this was changed to a charge of rape by deception as part of a plea bargain arrangement.

In 2008 Israel's Supreme Court established the precedent that any man who ''does not tell the truth regarding critical matters to a reasonable woman, and as a result of the misrepresentation she has sexual relations with him'' can be convicted of rape.

Kashur's lawyer, Elkana Laist, said the court had opened the door to a rape conviction every time a person lies regarding details of his identity.

OK, am I the only person who thinks this might not be such a bad law IF it was applied to all nationalities and genders equally?

It's illegal to lie to someone in order to take their money in the US...unless you're a politician or corporate official. Why should lying to get sex be any less damaging than lying to get money? I'd think it would be the other way around. You can get your money back.

 

[Keit]

OK, am I the only person who thinks this might not be such a bad law IF it was applied to all nationalities and genders equally?

Nope, not the only one. That's why this case is tricky and very uneasy to pass judgment or give opinion on, because clearly there was a deceit on man's part, if only a deceit by omission, which sounds quite deliberate. There are also many details missing in between. In such cases, judicial system would definitely benefit from the Law of Three.

It's illegal to lie to someone in order to take their money in the US...unless you're a politician or corporate official. Why should lying to get sex be any less damaging than lying to get money? I'd think it would be the other way around. You can get your money back.

I am not really familiar with the way legal thinking goes, but if for legal system any "transaction", monetary or sexual should fall under the same rules, then the woman in question was indeed deceived into buying something she didn't want. But this kind of approach opens a door to many potentially dangerous cases, where spirit of the law can be easily used to serve the letter of the law. Or something like that.

It is also possible that this case possibly would never reach the court if the man was Jewish. The man was also married, and we don't know if the woman was aware of that. This in itself is a deception already, but notice how the emphasize is on him being a Palestinian (which according to Israeli thinking, excludes any possibility of any serious relationship).

I do still think that there is bigger (racial) issue involved, and it is a good demonstration of a general Israeli attitude toward non Jews or even uncircumcised Jews. For example, at the beginning of the 90th, there was a big wave of immigration from Russia. And many young people, though Jews, were never circumcised. They had to go through operation at the adult age because otherwise they would be either ridiculed in the army, or most of native Israeli woman wouldn't be willing to sleep with them. There might be some other reasons too (like medical or religious ones), but in general, being an uncircumcised Jew in Israel might be too uncomfortable. So they chose self mutilation.

So yeah, under different circumstances, such law can be quite helpful and useful.

 

[Guardian]

I do still think that there is bigger (racial) issue involved, and it is a good demonstration of a general Israeli attitude toward non Jews or even uncircumcised Jews.

I agree!! Rape laws here in the US are NOT enforced equally when the victim is white and the attacker black (or vice versa) Making lying to get something of value illegal sounds like a good idea, but due to the nature of the people who enforce the laws, class abuse is almost guaranteed :(

I didn't know there were uncircumcised Jews, I thought that was a central part of their religion....thanks for the info.

 

[RyanX]

FWIW, I think it's a bit crazy to call what is described in this article "rape". It appears to be consensual sex between two adults. Men and women lie all the time to get each other in bed. Not that this makes it right, but it is pretty darn common. It doesn't appear the woman was traumatized, besides maybe a bruised ego. Although maybe I'm projecting details into the story that aren't there? It's hard to tell exactly what did happen between the two of them.

If anything, this article just goes to show how ideological and racist Israeli society is.

 

[Keit]

I didn't know there were uncircumcised Jews, I thought that was a central part of their religion....thanks for the info.

Yeah, many of Soviet Union Jews weren't or aren't circumcised. Religion was out of law in Soviet Union, so perhaps it influenced this fact. Jews were also persecuted under Communist regime, so hiding this fact was also advised. I know that many Jews were still trying to be observant or at least follow some of the traditions there, but in my personal case I didn't know that I was Jewish (and what it meant) until several months before leaving to Israel in 1991. My grandfather was an atheist and Communist party member, so he didn't look kindly at my mother's decision to move there.

 

[Keit]

Well, at least someone sees a problem with this sentence.

_http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3924147,00.html

And if he were Jewish?

Op-ed: Arab man’s rape conviction raises disturbing questions about our legal system

Sima Kadmon
Published: 07.24.10, 13:59 / Israel Opinion

This past week, the Jerusalem District Court slapped an 18-month prison sentence on an Arab man who impersonated a Jew and had consensual sex with a Jewish girl.

The 30-year-old Arab man, Sabar Kashour, was convicted of rape because he falsely presented himself as Jewish and single, while he was in fact Arab and married.

In the framework of a plea bargain agreement, Kashour was convicted of a rape offense as well as a charge of performing an indecent act. In addition to the prison term, he was also slapped with a 30-month conditional sentence and a NIS 10,000 (roughly $2,800) fine to be paid as compensation to the complainant.

Notably, the judges did argue that this was not a “classic case of rape,” as the sexual relations were consensual. So what was this act all about then? According to the judges, the sexual act was elicited via fraudulent means and reliance on false information.

Or in other words: This is about sex elicited through lies. Had the girl known the man was not a Jewish single interested in a meaningful romantic relationship, she would not have cooperated with the accused, the judges ruled.

Hello? Are we getting this straight? If any married man who has ever lied in order to get sex would be charged with rape, there would be no room in our prisons. It appears that the court had a problem with Kashour being Arab, rather than with him being married.

This raises just one question: What would the court decide had a Jewish, married man falsely presented himself to a woman in order to get her into bed? For example, what if someone like that told a woman that he is a wealthy single man, while he was in fact poor and married? Would he too be convicted of rape?

 

[seek10]

And if he were Jewish?

Op-ed: Arab man’s rape conviction raises disturbing questions about our legal system

This raises just one question: What would the court decide had a Jewish, married man falsely presented himself to a woman in order to get her into bed? For example, what if someone like that told a woman that he is a wealthy single man, while he was in fact poor and married? Would he too be convicted of rape?[/b]

[/quote]

This reminds me of what C's said regaring 4D STS " they do it because they want to do it , they can do it, they do it". No other logic works. smoke screens of twisted logic to justify this act , not only hides the pathology , but confuses and distracts the common man. After all that is what they want. Media does exactly that. Instead of exposing the pathology of the judicial system and it raises all the implications of this skewed judgement with no answers or partial answers to create sense of resignation and helplessness. After all, what else can be expected in an 'Experiment'.