Real Direct 4D STO Contact?

Tycho

Jedi
The C's say they are at 6D level and their communications seem to bear this out, as well as their elevated intentions and advice. There is no mention of disagreements among themselves, nor would I think there would be if they are at the level of practically all seeing/all knowing.

If staying within the C statemens: They are one soul groups of many. They might not have "disagreements among themselves" (proof? Maybe they dont tell you) but they could have disagreements with our soul groups.

All pure speculation.....
 

happyliza

The Living Force
If staying within the C statemens: They are one soul groups of many. They might not have "disagreements among themselves" (proof? Maybe they dontT tell you) but they could have disagreements with our soul groups.

All pure speculation.....
Tycho I would tend to lean towards the fact that what may appear as a 'disagreement' with us in the future, or our soul groups per se, could be misconstrued as a disagreement from our inferior knowledge p.o.v. Perhaps they are purely pointing out things from a higher perspective to help increase our learning/frequency level?

To reach 6th density level I would assume they would all be reading from the same page in everything they do and think? From an STO grounding. Just my thoughts :-)
 
R

Resistense

Guest
I'm through page 4 of the thread.


It is good to be sceptical (and I am too, which is why I am asking), but isn't it the same with the C's message? It is also a benevolent group from a higher density helping us evolve to a higher state. It is only by looking at it more deeply that we can see whether it is helpful or not.
They (C's) seem to be willing to give to those who ask. Benevolence? I like the characterization of, "not nice, but smart" more.
That is not really what they are saying though. The supposedly "official" stance of the Federation is no direct contact with humanity, but they disagree with that (to some degree) and with other approaches of the Federation in Earth affairs.
Not only is it direct contact, it sounds to me (although I haven't read it) that they're dispatching "diktats" : or telling us what's what, because they know better based on their 4D level, as established by their claim to be on 4D level...
They are also saying that there are no "negative forces" within the Federation,

[...]
Oh, they're outside the bounds of the law of three. Or they're trying to convince us they just play patty cake and only make nice, so we can trust them.
You said you ventured a guess, but now you seem quite sure that it is ultraterrestrial misinformation. It could be, or it could be real. The fact that these are not channeled conversations makes this contact certainly quite unique. The usual flavor of the fake contacts (which @PopHistorian analyzed) seems to be a sort of "all is well" message and only general platitudes, while these do not shy away from stating the problems and the "horror of the situation", such as a genocide and enslavement being likely outcomes of where we are headed.
..."The Terror-of-the-Situation"
"In the name of the causes of my arising, I shall always strive to be just towards every already spiritualized origination, and towards all the originations of the future spiritualized manifestations..."
"..."Faith," "Hope," and "Love."...
"...how they believe, how they love, and how they hope-- ah, it is exactly in this that all the peculiarity of these three being-properties lies!...
"...consequences of the properties of the organ Kundabuffer --..."
"In consequence of this, the three-brained beings here are for the most part subject just to the perceptions and fixations in their presences of all sorts of "Sinkrpoosarams" or, as it is expressed here, they "believe-any-old-tale.""

In my understanding, the TotS is from our own stunted personal development, and is not related to the existential threat of nuclear war, or aliens waiting out in space, or genocide or enslavement. And rather that possibility for these last two follow from lack of development, and are patterns from history that seem to repeat to service "loosh for the moon".
Why not? The C's have said that they are with the Federation as well (July 30, 1994 session):
But did they display the official insignia, salute, and pledge fealty to future Cpt. Swarru?
And keep in mind that these are not "official representatives" of the Federation, but supposedly just a group of people who disagree with the official approach.
Well if they're not officially sanctioned with the Federation...
How did you recognize the help from 6D STO (C's) as real? Is it more difficult to recognize 4D STO help than 6D STO help?

They are already providing help in the form of information/knowledge and so far I have not seen any contradictions to what the C's have said. A confirmation from them whether this is a real contact or a very elaborate disinformation campaign would still be helpful though.

Beyond information, it is difficult to say what type of help we can expect. It is also not just me who thinks we could use some 4D STO help. Laura was saying the same thing in that session which I posted above:

From what this crew is saying, the main point of disagreement within the Federation seems to be whether the "negative forces" should be allowed to trick us into harmful free will decisions or whether the Federation should put a stop to it or at least expose it. The "official" stance is supposedly that this should not be interfered with, while this starship crew (and many others within the Federation) think that this cannot be allowed since it will lead to an enslavement and genocide type situation.

It does all come down to the free will decision of humanity. And if enough of us ask for help from 4D STO against the negative forces, then we may get it - maybe even in other forms than "just" information. They are also saying that there is much more weight to the free will decisions and asking of "awakened" people - that one person like that can "count" as much as hundreds of those who are asleep and just following programs or the organic portals (which they also talk about).
I think you're trying to weigh this for what it's worth, and I applaud that, as well as your asking questions.

I think that Laura has qualified that the C's material is not a gospel -- that there are methodological problems in the past with formulating questions, making assumptions, etc., and even in my opinion there will be problems in communicating information between parties if there is a gap in language or understanding on the topic in question, as a matter of course.

And I think C's channeling ought to be viewed in the context of Laura, and others involved, asking for things they may not be able to verify themselves, or asking for directions on what to investigate to better inform themselves. I think some times the answers there may have been "functional", as in pointing in a direction or getting thinking to go a certain way, rather than being straight-matter-of-fact. Also, IMO, some of the "feedback" is so hilarious or off-the-wall it dispels to me the idea that she's just using the board for funsies.

So the essence there is they are asking for help because they know they "don't have the whole banana", whereas this Federation group and Swaruu have the deal sealed up, and will present it to you wholesale, by e-mailing Gosia.


[...]
Regardless of this I went to the SWARUU website. I couldn't get past the first page. Why is the most advanced other realm extraterrestrial, Yazhi Swaruu, a fighter pilot? Who is she fighting as a fighter pilot? And she is also an 'expert in time manipulations'. Why would any 4th density STO soul be manipulating time or even focus on methodologies of manipulating time to become an expert in it. It just all sounds very STS to me. Then again what is this site's definition of what time even is? [...]
Swaruu: "I am Martha McSally, from the future."
The C's have also said that there will be no nuclear war (July 30, 1994):



Notice that the answer is not "the future is open" or even "that is unlikely", but "No, no nuclear war." This can only mean that nuclear war will not be allowed.
"atomic". "The future is open" is always a potential answer, don't you think? What do you suppose "close", means?
"You've closed discussion by trying my patience."

[...]

Q: (J) Would that be nuclear bombs?

[...]

It may be the case that neither 4D STO nor 4D STS want an all-out nuclear war on Earth. Maybe that is why the C's said with certainty that there won't be one.
Out around the neighborhood stars seem to be doing nuclear fission/fusion business is booming. If they're sticking their nose in with an agenda, that don't jibe with STO, IMO, and this smacks of self-importance.


I think you should read the entire waves series, maybe that will help you understand many aspects we mentioned before. In this case STO doesn’t “want” or “desire” something, that’s purely STS thinking. They don’t “fight” either like we think in our concept of what we know about a wars. The war mentioned by them in the past transcripts It’s more like a balance thing from the universe itself.
[...]
See, the real battle is within ourselves, the knowledge will get us more free will which allows us decide which side we want to be in when the transition happens.
I believe casssiopeans appeared in Laura’s life not because she cried for help to be saved but because she wanted answers, she asked for help to get answers.
Thing is, I’m not going to put my hand in the fire and say this galactic confederation is fake entirely, I won’t say otherwise either, maybe they send real STO messages, perhaps mixed with some lies, even the Cs had some corrupt messages in the past because of the people that were present in those sessions which affected the outcome of the message!
Just for curiosity: It will help you in any way to validate that source?
That is a good point - and it is also one of the trickier lessons we have to learn: using intent without anticipation and without "grasping" at an outcome. It seems that this starship crew is definitely not beyond wanting. Does that mean they are purely STS? Maybe.

I was also thinking that it takes being 51% STO to graduate to the Fourth Density, according to the C's. Which means that in that case we are still 49% STS after an STO graduation. That number of course can be decreased, but it seems that 4D may still be more or less a mix of STO and STS tendencies, unlike 6D which are pure STO.

In other words, even if these supposed Pleiadeans display some signs of STS-type wanting, they may still be primarily STO.

Yes, and this seems to be another quite complex topic. Again, according to this source the Federation learned a long time ago that fighting wars against the "regressives" is not a good idea. Instead they learned not to attract/manifest nightmares, as this group puts it. This seems to describe the same kind of primarily "inner battle" between STO and STS.

On the other hand, they supposedly also have fighter pilots. I am not too familiar with the reasons, but apparently these are necessary in certain situations that are sort of like the exception to the rule.

Maybe, maybe not. I try not to anticipate, but I felt that I needed to ask this question.

"Goals" are a slippery slope in any case, as it usually involves anticipation. But yes, according to this group, the Federation races all agree on the "main goals" (for lack of a better word), but can disagree on the best ways to get there.

That's what this group is saying as well: "You are the help that was sent for humanity", referring to the supposed star seeds. The Ra material calls these people Wanderers who incarnated here from higher densities.

The C's also confirmed that Wanderers as described by Ra are real (August 11, 1996):
So I get the impression of your sincerity in this thread, axj. Let me point out the above bolded quote, though, and instead claim that everything is a slippery slope when there is no defined goal. "Outcome independent" in the outlook, by holding back anticipation of results? I think the work aspects are that we set aims (a necessity, in the system), make efforts toward them, but we do not control results, although we'll likely try to measure results and recalibrate...
I infer that your aim here is to try and vet the material from this source. I'll continue reading, thanks.
 
R

Resistense

Guest
Correct me if I am wrong but the quote in italics above (and maybe Mememe's two subsequent quotes) seems to come from something an individual going under the name Montalk wrote back in 2003 after he had a falling out with Laura over the Quantum Future School and its approach.
That's correct.
But, since Mememe not only hijacked this thread, but also did it with a lot of nonsense, this thread was split and Mememe's participation along with members' replies were moved to this thread.
Is that an angler fish popping up ? 🤔 now there's looming many more pages of potential kandelnoost unwindings.

Well, that's just it, I don't think that the issue is that things aren't interesting enough for 4D STO to establish contact. It is us who have to choose to move in their direction, so to speak.

Otherwise, the way I could describe it is, if 4D STO sees us, they see us as the cattle of a farmer inside their fence being toyed around by the farmer. Interfering as such, would be a self serving act.

Which is probably another analogy to describe the group being discussed, the description they've given as motivation for their actions is akin to that one of a vegan activist who disrupts a farm. Disagreement, but self serving nonetheless.
Ayiyi. Analogy of us as sheep hypnotized by the magician...


I've been looking for something relevant to contribute to this thread for a while.

Someone said: Better no knowledge than false knowledge (I am paraphrasing)!

And today I read this from a comment by "Jeep" on the coronavirus thread:

Wetiko is a unique form of mind-blindness that renders us blind to our blindness (i.e., we don’t realize we are blind, but fancy ourselves as clear-seeing). Pointing at wetiko in its own unique way, The Gnostic Gospels says, “The darkness comes to anesthetize the intelligence and spread the cancer of mind blindness.” Seeing how the wetiko mind-virus surreptitiously works—both out in the world and especially within our own minds (which is the only place it can be confronted and potentially dissolved)—is its worst nightmare, for to see it takes away its raison d’etre, which is to perpetuate itself. Seeing wetiko simultaneously dispells its power over us while empowering ourselves.
By Paul Levy
Top of page 9! Perfect spot IMO, and a nice side reference.
I agree with you, Wandering Star, good catch. I think Levy´s way of explaining how psychic diseases develop is quite imprecedent, I would also highly recommend listening this interview and his books for those interested in understanding better how and why the corona virus lies is so damaging people´s sanity.
 

Ghazi18

Padawan Learner
I've been looking into this "contact" and in my opinion, this has a new agey/Billy Meier's feel to it. There are some truths mixed in those sessions but doesn't every "contact" have some truth to it? Even the Bible has some truths to it and it is still mainly propaganda. The good thing about the C's is that they didn't spoon feed Laura & crew whatever they wanted, they did all of this work based on pure research and connecting the dots. Also, the C's never claimed to be here and help us "evolve" like all these other "contacts".
 

WIN 52

The Living Force
It is reasonable to assume some 4D STO may be there. But, thinking that we can recognize them or their "help" is premature (to say the least) based on some chat or app or some channel. It is also assuming that we know what type of "help" we need at any time.

As it was told many times, there is a program for every body. We have seen over and over in human affairs, the help or happening in good in religion or politics or ideology or medicine or science is found to be trap. We have seen this trap over or over in New age in the name of Ascension. Best help STO can provide when properly asked is with knowledge/information leaving the application to individual choice. Other wise, it is a violation of free will.

What type of help you are expecting from them?
During the set of visions I had in a hospital bed with my right side paralyzed in 2005. I was asking if there was much time left for me in this lifetime. I was shown a series of markers for me to watch for.

One of the first was to search for the woman that I was told about in 1983, I believe. By 2007, I had found the Cassiopaea material.

Another was a child calling me PaPa. I had thought that was my granddaughter now 9. In fact the voice I heard was of my grandson now 5. To him I am PaPa. Whenever mom or dad get him down he turns to papa for rescue. About the right age also.

These were 2 of the highlights.

The help we got was in the form of 3D beings. They had set up shelters and were offering food and blankets to those who came out of hiding, requesting assistance. Things were not that great for humanity on the surface at the time. A lot of turmoil had taken place, winter was at hand and surface electricity was questionable. Also, there were a lot of empty dwellings. The people who were around were hidden in their homes, afraid to come out.

People were able to stand in front of a screen and view records of past lives, right up to current events. Answering questions they may have. No one was forced to do anything. It was on a voluntary basis.

It's not clear but people didn't have 4D abilities yet. They were just beginning to transfer. Some were not nearly ready yet. More time was necessary for those.
 

seek10

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
Thank you for sharing @WIN 52. I think we all have similar type experiences with the life's challenges, asking for help and some thing received in response. I doubt any of us in this forum would have survived with out some form of help. That doesn't need to be 4D STO alone.
The help we got was in the form of 3D beings. They had set up shelters and were offering food and blankets to those who came out of hiding, requesting assistance. Things were not that great for humanity on the surface at the time. A lot of turmoil had taken place, winter was at hand and surface electricity was questionable. Also, there were a lot of empty dwellings. The people who were around were hidden in their homes, afraid to come out.

People were able to stand in front of a screen and view records of past lives, right up to current events. Answering questions they may have. No one was forced to do anything. It was on a voluntary basis.

It's not clear but people didn't have 4D abilities yet. They were just beginning to transfer. Some were not nearly ready yet. More time was necessary for those.
Do you mean to say the above text is from the vision you have seen when you are on the hospital bed?
 

Tycho

Jedi
I probably didn't point it out clearly enough, I was referring to the 'Swaruu' STO fighter pilot channelings. :rolleyes:

She says its direct communication using some kind of networked text-chat, NOT channelling. This information is at the start of all, or at least most of their videos.
 

WIN 52

The Living Force
Thank you for sharing @WIN 52. I think we all have similar type experiences with the life's challenges, asking for help and some thing received in response. I doubt any of us in this forum would have survived with out some form of help. That doesn't need to be 4D STO alone.

Do you mean to say the above text is from the vision you have seen when you are on the hospital bed?
Yes, just after suffering a stroke. There was multiple visions of different things over a couple of days. Most of them have been put on here already. Quite a bit has passed under the bridge like water, and is gone.

What was put here has relevance for me in relation to others comments about what to expect. The end of PaPa, PaPa and this event were in sequence. Well my grandson is not around anymore, recent development. Starting kindergarten 100km away, with his mom.

The only thing now is a reduction in the population and cooler weather to set in.

I would think my vision is as accurate as anyone else's, for now.
 

MJF

Jedi Council Member
Yes, just after suffering a stroke. There was multiple visions of different things over a couple of days. Most of them have been put on here already. Quite a bit has passed under the bridge like water, and is gone.

What was put here has relevance for me in relation to others comments about what to expect. The end of PaPa, PaPa and this event were in sequence. Well my grandson is not around anymore, recent development. Starting kindergarten 100km away, with his mom.

The only thing now is a reduction in the population and cooler weather to set in.

I would think my vision is as accurate as anyone else's, for now.
Thanks for sharing your visions. Do you think they were a kind of near death experience (NDE)? My sister lives in Seattle, not a million miles from you. She has had two very graphic dreams recently in which she saw sheets of fire all over the place and huge destruction everywhere. Such fires could I guess be caused by cometary bombardment, as occurred in western Europe in the 6th century AD, which we now know brought the Roman Empire to an end and ushered in the Dark Age. Alternatively, it might be caused by plasma or electric discharges (ground based lightning), as occurred on Malta thousands of years ago, leaving behind grooves in the ground that people today think of as cart ruts. The C's have warned us of this.
 

WIN 52

The Living Force
Thanks for sharing your visions. Do you think they were a kind of near death experience (NDE)? My sister lives in Seattle, not a million miles from you. She has had two very graphic dreams recently in which she saw sheets of fire all over the place and huge destruction everywhere. Such fires could I guess be caused by cometary bombardment, as occurred in western Europe in the 6th century AD, which we now know brought the Roman Empire to an end and ushered in the Dark Age. Alternatively, it might be caused by plasma or electric discharges (ground based lightning), as occurred on Malta thousands of years ago, leaving behind grooves in the ground that people today think of as cart ruts. The C's have warned us of this.
There was no fire or cometary bombardment viewed. It was brought to my attention that things were about to get significantly worse for surface dwellers. Thus the initial assistance from 3D, off world beings who looked human. It seemed to be part of some type of moving on.

This was understood much more deeply once I began diving into the Cassiopaean material. Right at the beginning stages of this forum. Which I might add, was the first thing that was part of these visions. They were most definitely out of body experiences. My body was stable on the bed. I was connected to it by a long thread or cord and could see myself the entire time. Or felt connected to myself while viewing what was playing out.

I had a similar spiritual connection in 1980 after a near death experience which lasted throughout. Right up to today. To be fully honest, the connection goes back to 1952, my year of birth. It has been a great comfort during times of stress/distress. And usually on the money!
 

MJF

Jedi Council Member
There was no fire or cometary bombardment viewed. It was brought to my attention that things were about to get significantly worse for surface dwellers. Thus the initial assistance from 3D, off world beings who looked human. It seemed to be part of some type of moving on.

This was understood much more deeply once I began diving into the Cassiopaean material. Right at the beginning stages of this forum. Which I might add, was the first thing that was part of these visions. They were most definitely out of body experiences. My body was stable on the bed. I was connected to it by a long thread or cord and could see myself the entire time. Or felt connected to myself while viewing what was playing out.

I had a similar spiritual connection in 1980 after a near death experience which lasted throughout. Right up to today. To be fully honest, the connection goes back to 1952, my year of birth. It has been a great comfort during times of stress/distress. And usually on the money!
Thank you for the follow-up. I have never had an out of body experience or near death experience as you have had, although I know people who have, including my twin brother. The long thread or cord you saw is normally referred to as the silver thread or cord, which preserves one's connection to this 3D life. An Australian friend of mine, who has now passed away, told me of a near death experience he had at the age of 12. Like you he saw his body externally, in his case from above. What really struck him though was the overwhelming sense of lightness of being that he felt, which made him realise just how heavy the material body is. This makes me think of what the C's have said about the role of gravity in the transcripts.

Another acquaintance of mine had a near death experience after a serious accident, where he was shown by a being he took to be Christ that he needed to use his inherent gifts more once he returned to this life. He is in fact a skilled Reiki healer and after his experience he started providing his services for free through a local hospital. Interestingly, he has Mayan blood in his lineage.

Where you say: "Thus the initial assistance from 3D, off world beings who looked human." - this reminds me that the C's have told us that 4D Nordics can operate in this world without the experiencing the strain that STS beings do when they enter our realm, which limits the time STS beings can spend here. The C's also said that help would come from 4D Nordics once things got very interesting. Perhaps what you saw was an example of this.
 

WIN 52

The Living Force
Where you say: "Thus the initial assistance from 3D, off world beings who looked human." - this reminds me that the C's have told us that 4D Nordics can operate in this world without the experiencing the strain that STS beings do when they enter our realm, which limits the time STS beings can spend here. The C's also said that help would come from 4D Nordics once things got very interesting. Perhaps what you saw was an example of this.
They also said there was no help, it is up to us. Now, the person asking the question might have had something totally different in mind when that was asked, justifying that response.

To me, the whole scene was that of a convention. Where people were getting a first, new look at things we were previously kept from knowing and understanding. It was quite the revelation for many, including me.

I just thought they looked like 3D human beings. The convention atmosphere was complete with tables of food. Some people were in review, some were divided into groups like a reunion of sorts and others were having discussions with these arrivals. There likely were 4D beings around as well. I did not see any specifically, not that I would know what they looked like. I understand 3D food is likely quite different than 4D food. These beings were partaking in the fare.

I did understand that people would be gathering in family units. Not all of the family members were present. People had the opportunity to view why they were missing from the units, should they be curious. That was left up to those who had questions. There was no condemnation from these beings either. Also many found their units to be larger than expected.

In fact, thanks to the Cassiopaean material I have found love for myself. No more condemnation of myself. I have come to accept all as lessons to learn from. Today only condemnation comes from others which rolls off like water on a ducks back. I look at it as if it's their issues reflected onto me.
 

Debra

Jedi Council Member
@WIN 52, what an interesting and beautifully detailed description. Thanks for sharing this.
I too, have had similar experiences and when you described the gathering, whoa, I had a lot of recall, as well.
You wrote:
To me, the whole scene was that of a convention. Where people were getting a first, new look at things we were previously kept from knowing and understanding. It was quite the revelation for many, including me.
Man, you gotta watch this movie, if you haven’t yet.
It has been out for years, and was done in a light hearted, romance comedy, yet it delivers some deep messages.
Even the subject of food preferences and differences between 3rd density and 4th density are featured in this movie!
 
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