Soul Genetics and Psychopathology

[Approaching Infinity]

I've been thinking about psychopathology and how to place it in an esoteric framework. Here's a start:

The presence of "soul genetics", called "developmental potential" by Dabrowski, is a mediating factor in psychopathology. Its presence makes possible the merging of the intellectual/emotional/motor functions of the human being (i.e., the "lower self" or "lower centers") with higher, non-biologically-based functions (i.e., the "higher self" or "higher centers"). Higher functions "marry" to lower functions if the right genetics are present. This type of development is not necessarily part of the human biological life cycle, i.e. it is not a product of biological forces in the sense that bodily growth is. It is a conscious, self-determined process.

Soul genetics are the dividing line between permanent, or negative, psychopathology and the possibility of positive personality transformation. The presence of trauma and abuse in early life creates pathological emotional and intellectual patterns of behavior which hinder further development. Whereas certain genetic predispositions and environmental factors may have a hardening, integrating effect on an individual, the presence of soul genetics provides the intellectual-emotional forces or "dynamisms" necessary to break down an integrated dysfunction of mental/emotional functioning.

There are at least two distinct types of psychopathology. The first is genetically determined, and characterized by "gaps" in the normal development of emotional functioning. This type produces "personality disorders" (or "psychopathies" in the old jargon) like psychopathy, schizoid, and asthenic personality disorders. The second is dissociative in nature and encompasses most forms of psychopathology, e.g. mood disorders, paranoia, hysteria, eating disorders, obsessive-compulsive disorders, etc.

Certain organic tissue damage, whether trauma- or toxin-based, may have the effect of producing negative personality transformations, e.g. frontal lobe damage. In individuals without soul genetics this can produce psychopathy-like personalities or "characteropathies" as Lobaczewski called them, e.g. "borderpathy", paranoid personality disorder, autistic spectrum disorders. Such changes in functioning can also be produced via "resonance", i.e. functionally or behaviorally. These individuals with solidly integrated patterns of psychopathology make up the majority of mental illness, from severe depression and anxiety to borderline personality disorder and dissociative identity disorders. The general lack of understanding of soul genetics leads to many problems in diagnosis of psychopathology, including overlap of categories, as seen in the diagnoses of "antisocial personality disorder" and "schizotypal personality disorder".

The same pathogenic process can result in different outcomes in individuals with or without soul genetics. Trauma may lead to severe personality disintegration and fragmentation leading to multiple personalities or borderline personality disorder in individuals without soul genetics.

 

[Beau]

So for an individual with soul genetics present, what would be the chances of a re-integration of personality? If so, does it rely solely on individual effort, or is their a possibility that an outside source could assist in the re-integration process? Not sure if their are any actual case studies which point to such healing methods. I know you said that the intellectual-emotional forces necessary to break down dysfunction are present, but what exactly would be needed to "activate" such forces? Would it happen consciously, or perhaps mechanically?

 

[Approaching Infinity]

So for an individual with soul genetics present, what would be the chances of a re-integration of personality?

I think it's hard to say for sure. The only thing for certain is that re-integration is possible. But then again, reintegration can ALSO be achieved by someone without soul genetics. This is probably only the case for dissociative disorders, not the extremely integrated personality disorders. The distinction is that only those with soul genetics can reintegrate on a higher level. And even that is not guaranteed. Such individuals, if the trauma is too much, fall down the 'esoteric staircase' into 'negative disintegration', i.e. psychosis or suicide.

If so, does it rely solely on individual effort, or is their a possibility that an outside source could assist in the re-integration process?

Both, I think. When you combine "will" in third-density with "destiny" in fifth-density, then efforts in this realm have their correlates in higher realms, like overtones vibrating on a string. So in a sense the "outside assistance" is really just the self (albeit in a higher realm) assisting itself, i.e. to "pull" it closer to its level, ultimately to merge and create the conduit to a higher density.

Not sure if their are any actual case studies which point to such healing methods.

We can only really infer based on what we see in this reality, so if we want case studies we should look at what seem to be the most advanced humans. A look at the life of a person like Dag Hammarskjold shows an individual with extreme compassion, strength, wisdom, self-insight, who "pulled" himself up and out of disintegration to achieve a high level of service to others.

I know you said that the intellectual-emotional forces necessary to break down dysfunction are present, but what exactly would be needed to "activate" such forces? Would it happen consciously, or perhaps mechanically?

At first they are present only in potential and the individual cannot yet "see" the path of their own development. They traipse through the forest blindfolded, thinking they can see. Then the first shock spontaneously (or mechanically) shakes the cloth from their eyes and they See for an instant. Dabrowski called this stage "level III: spontaneous multilevel disintegration". At first they aren't under conscious control; an external stimulus prompts an inner conflict which shakes reality into levels of values. As the disintegration process (the breaking down of emotional and intellectual programs and the resulting behaviors) continues, it becomes more controlled and more conscious dynamisms take over, the end result being that every behavior is chosen and purposeful. Each center is given its rightful due. Motor/instinctive centers digest food, regulate body, respond to conscious direction, etc. Emotions respond to relevant scenarios and action is primarily directed by higher emotions and values. Intellect is used in service of higher emotions. Instinct and imagination allow a deeper view of life and greater empathy.

I guess that until emotional blockages are cleared, you can't force the process. Therefore certain dynamisms will be mechanical at first. Some will have been present since childhood and more easily directed.

 

[moonwalker]

Thank you A.I this is a fascinating topic. Have you read Ellen D. Fiedler - Denial of anger/denial of self: dealing with the dilemmas, reaching for the "what could be" and away from the "what is."

To move from level 2 unilevel disintergration to level 3 spontaneous multilevel disintegration requires I would imagine an incredible amount of will, I think most people at this phase without a network will fall back, in order to move ahead Dabrowski talks about the choice being spontaneous because it is involuntary, "You cannot un-see the higher path. " I think that explains why many people keep returning here, you feel the conflict between your behaivours and others. Is clearing emotional blockages the only way to realise, really realise the higher path choice?

 

[kenney]

A.I. I really think you have something there. the more I have read about psychopathy here the more amazed I have been that i am not one...anymore. I spent most of my life fulfilling nearly every symptom/description I have read here, minus the murdering people bit that Laura went through at the end of the Wave. Then about ten years ago i just sort of "woke up" is really the only way to put it.

Actually it is like i just started living ten or eleven years ago. I can't say I ever cried, apologized, well felt anything besides an outward portrayal of emotion to gain something for the first 25 years of my life. Everything I ever did up until that point was an act of manipulation or preparation for one.

 

[Approaching Infinity]

Thank you A.I this is a fascinating topic. Have you read Ellen D. Fiedler - Denial of anger/denial of self: dealing with the dilemmas, reaching for the "what could be" and away from the "what is."

Nope, I'll have to check it out when I get a chance. The "what is"/"what could be" is very Dabrowski!

[Edit: after a quick search I see Fiedler quotes Piechowski, so she is familiar with Dabrowski's work, albeit through the distorted lens of Piechowski. _http://www.neiu.edu/~ourgift/Archives/Fiedler_resources.htm]

To move from level 2 unilevel disintergration to level 3 spontaneous multilevel disintegration requires I would imagine an incredible amount of will, I think most people at this phase without a network will fall back, in order to move ahead Dabrowski talks about the choice being spontaneous because it is involuntary, "You cannot un-see the higher path. "

Yeah, Dabrowski said this transition requires a tremendous amount of energy. It's very rare that a person achieves that transformation alone.

I think that explains why many people keep returning here, you feel the conflict between your behaivours and others. Is clearing emotional blockages the only way to realise, really realise the higher path choice?

Well, put it this way. Can you imagine a person advanced in the Work who has NOT cleared emotional blockages?

 

[Bobo08]

Certain organic tissue damage, whether trauma- or toxin-based, may have the effect of producing negative personality transformations, e.g. frontal lobe damage. In individuals without soul genetics this can produce psychopathy-like personalities or "characteropathies" as Lobaczewski called them, e.g. "borderpathy", paranoid personality disorder, autistic spectrum disorders.

What would happen in individuals with soul genetics (or development potentials) who have organic tissue damage during the course of their life? Would the soul genetics be a mitigating factor, and to what extent?

 

[Approaching Infinity]

Certain organic tissue damage, whether trauma- or toxin-based, may have the effect of producing negative personality transformations, e.g. frontal lobe damage. In individuals without soul genetics this can produce psychopathy-like personalities or "characteropathies" as Lobaczewski called them, e.g. "borderpathy", paranoid personality disorder, autistic spectrum disorders.

What would happen in individuals with soul genetics (or development potentials) who have organic tissue damage during the course of their life? Would the soul genetics be a mitigating factor, and to what extent?

I've wondered the same thing. On the one hand we have people who undergo a complete personality change after brain trauma, like Phineas Gage, for example. On the other hand there are cases of people missing entire portions of their brain and still functioning normally, with other parts taking over for missing parts. One question I don't know the answer to is: Is there a 1:1 correlation between brain damage of a specific sort and psychopathology? What are the statistics? I haven't seen them yet, but that might answer something.

Also, a lot of psychology is functional and results in brain damage (e.g. post-traumatic stress disorder). But that CAN be reversed. It has to do with the right therapy, the ability to See the self, and brain plasticity. Perhaps the same is true for head-trauma. Those without don't have access to the higher self, which then changes the lower self.

 

[Gaby]

On the one hand we have people who undergo a complete personality change after brain trauma, like Phineas Gage, for example. On the other hand there are cases of people missing entire portions of their brain and still functioning normally, with other parts taking over for missing parts. One question I don't know the answer to is: Is there a 1:1 correlation between brain damage of a specific sort and psychopathology? What are the statistics? I haven't seen them yet, but that might answer something.

I've read about another head injury recently, where the frontal lobe was compromised, same as Phineas Gage. Although it was a head injury after a car accident, where the vein that drains the frontal lobe was compromised. After the accident, the guy became violent.

But the following seems very interesting:

nature.com

22 July 2009 | Nature 460, 449 (2009)

Cash boost for mapping the human brain

The US National Institutes of Health last week launched an initiative to map the wiring of the human brain. The Human Connectome Project will provide $30 million over five years for work detailing the connections between major brain subdivisions in healthy adults.

Neuroscientists increasingly view the human connectome as crucial to understanding mental function and disease (see Nature 457, 524–527; 2009). The project demonstrates commitment to this nascent research field, and will generate "a new class of data for human neuroscientists", says its leader Michael Huerta of the National Institute of Mental Health.

Researchers will try to link brain connectivity to genetics and behaviour, by collecting DNA samples, demographic information and behavioural data from their subjects. The initiative also aims to improve non-invasive brain-imaging technologies.

 

[go2]

I've been thinking about psychopathology and how to place it in an esoteric framework.

I have considered this question since I began studying the material on Cassiopaea Forum. I would like to ask a few questions to help me understand your line of thought. Gurdjieff says man has no soul. He has the potential to grow a soul. When you say “soul genetics”, do you mean “soul potential genetics”?

I ask the above question to clarify my understanding of the concept of Organic Portals(OP) in relationship to your use of the phrase “soul potential”. Do OP’s lack “soul genetics”?

If the answer to the above is yes, do you have a hypothesis on the transmission of “soul genetics” in children of mixed “soul genetic” and “non soul genetic” unions? How would a mixed genotype manifest as phenotype?

Mouravieff discusses the pathology of the chimeric type of man in Gnosis. This type of man may have “soul genetics”, but only the instinctive-motor and intellectual centers are functional. I wish to ask a question after the following quotes.

[…] in the majority of cultured men of our times the positive part of the emotional centre is practically paralyzed after the highly intensive development of an intellectual culture: feelings to easily give way to calculation.

[…] Psychologically, this means that, having reached this state of disequilibrium in his Personality, man is from then on governed only by intellectual and instinctive-motor considerations. This human type—the chimeric—is often found among the cultured classes of our time. It can produce people of great intellectual ability, but since intelligence is agnostic by nature and they are not oriented by the compass of the emotional centre, such people become amoral.

[…] The human being who analyses, in the light of the esoteric doctrine, the circumstances that have provoked his moral bankruptcy is bound to conclude that this failure is directly due to the neglected state into which his emotional centre has fallen. If he goes back to the causes and the events that have been lived, he will see that his partner is not to blame. We must never forget that intelligence is agnostic by nature, so that it is only through the correct and intense functioning of his emotional centre that the exterior man can feel the ‘B’ influences in life without confusing them with the ‘A’ influences. It is thanks to this discernment, stimulated by a keen interest in the work and by the ardent desire to reach the Real, that a magnetic centre begins to form in the neophyte. Only then can he come out of the darkness as he desires. The reader may remember that the magnetic centre is formed starting from the lower emotional centre, the doorway to Light and real Life.

My understanding is that a genetic psychopath has only the instinctive-motor centre and the intellectual centre. If so, could we say a chimeric human type, absent a working emotional centre, is functionally a psychopath?

In one age esoteric teaching says, “We are all sinners and have fallen short of the Glory of God”.
In the industrial age, the Fourth Way communicated the state of man by saying, “Man is a machine---rusty and in disrepair.”
In the age of psychoanalysis, mind control technology, pop psychology, Dr. Phil and psychopathology,
are you saying, “Man is psychopathologies”?

Thank you for your patience, AI, this is difficult for me to understand and articulate. Can psychopathology ever be more than a contemporary mirror for man to see himself in an esoteric framework?

Language loses power to shock from age to age. I was unaffected by being a “sinner”, a “machine”, or having “character defects”. However, when I came face to face with the narcissist and psychopath in the mirror, even if I am speaking of functions, it was profoundly shocking. The true horror of the situation was clear to me. From this experience, I think psychopathology is a powerful approach to contemporary educated men and women within the esoteric framework.

Is this what you suggest as the use of psychopathology to the esoteric aim?

 

[Beau]

My understanding is that a genetic psychopath has only the instinctive-motor centre and the intellectual centre. If so, could we say a chimeric human type, absent a working emotional centre, is functionally a psychopath?

I know you were addressing AI with this post, but I just want to chime in on this part. I don't think that all "chimera" archetypes are psychopaths. While that may necessarily be the case vice versa, I don't think you can assume chimera = psychopath. Most of those who grew up in Western culture have a propensity to be chimera-like in their personality, but I think it would be overstepping the relation to equate that with being a psychopath. Many have the opportunity to wake their sleeping emotional center up during their life.

 

[go2]

My understanding is that a genetic psychopath has only the instinctive-motor centre and the intellectual centre. If so, could we say a chimeric human type, absent a working emotional centre, is functionally a psychopath?

I know you were addressing AI with this post, but I just want to chime in on this part. I don't think that all "chimera" archetypes are psychopaths. While that may necessarily be the case vice versa, I don't think you can assume chimera = psychopath. Most of those who grew up in Western culture have a propensity to be chimera-like in their personality, but I think it would be overstepping the relation to equate that with being a psychopath. Many have the opportunity to wake their sleeping emotional center up during their life.

Thanks Pinkerton and I wish all who have insight into my post to help clarify this issue. I can easily build an edifice on a wrong foundation. I am confusing the issue of psychopaths, with psychopathic behavior. I will rephrase my question.
Could we say a chimeric human type, absent a working emotional centre, exhibits psychopathic behavior?

That question now seems unnecessary. I will say a chimeric human type, absent a working emotional centre, exhibits chimeric behavior. Thanks again for showing me how I overstepped similarities to mean equality. Thinking is hard.

 

[Psalehesost]

Mouravieff discusses the pathology of the chimeric type of man in Gnosis. This type of man may have “soul genetics”, but only the instinctive-motor and intellectual centers are functional. I wish to ask a question after the following quotes.

[…] in the majority of cultured men of our times the positive part of the emotional centre is practically paralyzed after the highly intensive development of an intellectual culture: feelings to easily give way to calculation.

[…] Psychologically, this means that, having reached this state of disequilibrium in his Personality, man is from then on governed only by intellectual and instinctive-motor considerations. This human type—the chimeric—is often found among the cultured classes of our time. It can produce people of great intellectual ability, but since intelligence is agnostic by nature and they are not oriented by the compass of the emotional centre, such people become amoral.

[…] The human being who analyses, in the light of the esoteric doctrine, the circumstances that have provoked his moral bankruptcy is bound to conclude that this failure is directly due to the neglected state into which his emotional centre has fallen. If he goes back to the causes and the events that have been lived, he will see that his partner is not to blame. We must never forget that intelligence is agnostic by nature, so that it is only through the correct and intense functioning of his emotional centre that the exterior man can feel the ‘B’ influences in life without confusing them with the ‘A’ influences. It is thanks to this discernment, stimulated by a keen interest in the work and by the ardent desire to reach the Real, that a magnetic centre begins to form in the neophyte. Only then can he come out of the darkness as he desires. The reader may remember that the magnetic centre is formed starting from the lower emotional centre, the doorway to Light and real Life.

My understanding is that a genetic psychopath has only the instinctive-motor centre and the intellectual centre. If so, could we say a chimeric human type, absent a working emotional centre, is functionally a psychopath?

I will rephrase my question.
Could we say a chimeric human type, absent a working emotional centre, exhibits psychopathic behavior?

It is quite obvious that "the majority of cultured men of our times" do not act as psychopaths. While genuine conscience is paralyzed in the chimeric type (I know that from experience. btw, this thread has more Gnosis quotes on the chimeric type a bit down), non-psychopaths develop a mechanical morality in their personality from cultural programming and other influences, and in the absence of genuine conscience, it gives subjective ideas of "right"/"wrong", "good"/"bad" and "better"/"worse".

However, the chimeric type (I also know this from experience) is significantly more vulnerable to ponerization, as subjective morality is formed by whatever programming is assimilated. (and more given to ponerization the chimeric type becomes as its development deepens and sexually-loaded instrinctive/moving-directed "feelings" take over)

OSIT.

 

[go2]

[…] Psychologically, this means that, having reached this state of disequilibrium in his Personality, man is from then on governed only by intellectual and instinctive-motor considerations. This human type—the chimeric—is often found among the cultured classes of our time. It can produce people of great intellectual ability, but since intelligence is agnostic by nature and they are not oriented by the compass of the emotional centre, such people become amoral.

It is quite obvious that "the majority of cultured men of our times" do not act as psychopaths. While genuine conscience is paralyzed in the chimeric type (I know that from experience. btw, this thread has more Gnosis quotes on the chimeric type a bit down), non-psychopaths develop a mechanical morality in their personality from cultural programming and other influences, and in the absence of genuine conscience, it gives subjective ideas of "right"/"wrong", "good"/"bad" and "better"/"worse".

Hi Csayeursost, I am assuming you are a young man in whom the “chimeric” process did not reach to the level of amorality noted by Mouravieff as characteristic of modern men and women of the intellectual classes. I am an older man in whom the chimeric process reached the level of amorality, which is different than a mechanical morality programmed by the family, church, and state. My experience in the world is that a significant fraction of people I know and meet are of this “chimeric” type, amoral and well paid.

Amoral means doing what is necessary to achieve an objective without being hampered by the constrains of subjective morality or a conscience. States and corporations and psychopaths are amoral; I didn’t see why I should live morally anymore than states or the corporate world. Robert McNamara is a public example of the chimeric man and the horrible crimes which an amoral man or woman can perpetrate with nearly complete immunity from the revolt of conscience. http://www.sott.net/articles/show/188673-Who-Was-Robert-McNamara-

Your point that the “chimeric” type is a useful idiot for psychopaths or a pathocratic system is important or so I think. Without a functioning emotional center, we are unable to recognize psychopaths or psychopathic behaviors. I recognize that “chimeric” man is not a psychopath, but is often complicit in actions directed by or on behalf of essential psychopaths.

 

[Psalehesost]

Hi Csayeursost, I am assuming you are a young man in whom the “chimeric” process did not reach to the level of amorality noted by Mouravieff as characteristic of modern men and women of the intellectual classes. I am an older man in whom the chimeric process reached the level of amorality, which is different than a mechanical morality programmed by the family, church, and state.

Yes. Though the reason (on further reflection) it didn't reach that point for me, I think, may well be that I still held on to the remnants of a sort of "higher ideal" that was not based on the wants and expectations of other people, but on spiritual ideas held in place by the constant and consistent experiencing of (to use a New Age term) "energetic" perception, which prevented me from adopting a wholly material worldview following what otherwise was a fairly complete "bankruptcy" or "breakdown" without benefit of something pointing me to the Way. Without such an ideal, I now think I'd likely - given the rest of my thinking at the time - have gone all the way in terms of moral collapse.

My experience in the world is that a significant fraction of people I know and meet are of this “chimeric” type, amoral and well paid.

This explains much of the "how" of, for instance, why much of mainstream science is in such a state as it is. And much of the "how" of how thought and ideas are shaped in pathocracies, how psychopathic agendas are spread and implemented so efficiently.

It filled in a gap in my ponerological understanding!

Amoral means doing what is necessary to achieve an objective without being hampered by the constrains of subjective morality or a conscience. States and corporations and psychopaths are amoral; I didn’t see why I should live morally anymore than states or the corporate world. Robert McNamara is a public example of the chimeric man and the horrible crimes which an amoral man or woman can perpetrate with nearly complete immunity from the revolt of conscience. http://www.sott.net/articles/show/188673-Who-Was-Robert-McNamara-

Previously, I'd thought that the amoral among non-psychos not otherwise having severe pathologies along the lines of those described by Lobaczewski were fairly rare, but I see now that all seems to point toward it being more common than I'd previously thought. How otherwise, for instance, would the major corporations be able to function as they do...?

Your point that the “chimeric” type is a useful idiot for psychopaths or a pathocratic system is important or so I think. Without a functioning emotional center, we are unable to recognize psychopaths or psychopathic behaviors. I recognize that “chimeric” man is not a psychopath, but is often complicit in actions directed by or on behalf of essential psychopaths.

Going by my experience, I wonder if chimeric types - especially when, as I was, highly bitter and alienated - may not also be functionally close to schizoids. Back then, I developed such ideas - thinking that humanity was hopelessly irrational and would need to be forcibly "debugged" so as to create a greater society, and that in its present state, humanity was so bad that it wouldn't matter if it were to go extinct. Unlike a proper schizoid doctrinaire, I didn't bother to work out the details of my in hindsight clearly pathological vision, however, nor to make any serious effort at spreading it.