Twilight

[Tigersoap]

Re: How to Write a Bestseller Just Like Twilight

LOL, I never thought that I would be found out.

:D
I found your blog searching for oatmeal love + unholy hunger fyi.

 

[Starlight]

As a result of all this, everything gets trivialized, over-exposed and dumbed down. Very much in the same vein as drawing hearts and sparkly stars on the picture of a guy you have a crush on, and talking about him to all your girlfriend day after day, month after month, totally ruins whatever point there was in it. If a girl gets hooked up on Twilight, she risks getting stuck in an emotionally immature stage of development -- infantilized for life, as it were.

This worries me, as my daughter, who is 13, is totally hooked with this "vampire" genre type of of books. Come to think of it, most of her friends are as well! Recently she and her friends went to see the second installment of the series i.e New Moon on the big screen (twice!). And, yes, she could not stop talking about it.

Yesterday, she passed me one book entitled "Night World No. 3" which it is a collection of 3 short stories - "Huntress", "Black Dawn" and "Witchlight" by LJ Smith and said to me, "so that you can understand my world". Whoa.... that gave me the creeps! When, I probed more, she just said that then I'll understand what interests her. Okay.... I still have not read the book yet, but I will... soon I hope.. To tell you the truth, I am still reeling over a book that was given to me as a gift from a friend of mine called "Beat the Bitch" by Tess Stimson. OMG!! I barely got through the first chapter! I really cannot begin to tell the dizziness, jitters and creepy crawly feelings of all sorts shooting in my head, my heart and all over my body! I need to gather myself together first before starting with the book given by my dear daughter. I am ever so curious to enter "her world"...

Now the question is, after reading this thread, how do I, as a mom of a teenage girl, try to make her realize what effects and impact all these books will have on her and her perception towards the real world? We, my husband and I, are trying to educate the kids (have another 2 boys) as subtle as possible about the existence of psychopath/sociopath and how they work. But, since she is hooked now with these genre of books, my guess is (please tell me I'm wrong), she is developing a "romantic world" which she will crave, which will lead to negative relationships. Or am I jumping the gun here?

 

[truth seeker]

I'm really curious as to what is going on with this fascination.I just visited a friend of mine (who is 41/42) and she is also hooked on this Twilight series and now the movie(s). She and her daughter absolutely loves them. I personally don get it. I remember from a very young age pushing against stereotypes of both male and female and continue to do so even though I'm sure I'm affected in ways that I don't yet realize.

My interest in the vampire genre came and went with 3 of the Lestat books by Anne Rice. After that, I thought it was getting silly and dropped it.

I've also spoken with men who were absolutely baffled with women who love bad guys and was unable to explain this fascination because I've never felt it. I've always thought "Give me a "boring" nice guy anytime!". Who wants to deal with the constant drama that comes with the others?

Why do some women fall into this trap and others don't? Maybe it's a version of narcissism/psychopathy being normalized in society? Maybe because these types can fake an understanding of women (essentially pretending to be whatever the woman wants/needs)? Maybe this behavior leads women to confuse that for real love and thus negates the need for the real work that has to happen in a real relationship with someone who is actually human? Perhaps this is a sort of pr campaign to promote psychopathic behavior and get humans to turn against each other if that makes sense?

Walking around in New York recently, I was surprised at the amount of ads/media geared toward just this one movie. It's everywhere!

This worries me, as my daughter, who is 13, is totally hooked with this "vampire" genre type of of books. Come to think of it, most of her friends are as well! Recently she and her friends went to see the second installment of the series i.e New Moon on the big screen (twice!). And, yes, she could not stop talking about it.

Yesterday, she passed me one book entitled "Night World No. 3" which it is a collection of 3 short stories - "Huntress", "Black Dawn" and "Witchlight" by LJ Smith and said to me, "so that you can understand my world". Whoa.... that gave me the creeps! When, I probed more, she just said that then I'll understand what interests her. Okay.... I still have not read the book yet, but I will... soon I hope.. To tell you the truth, I am still reeling over a book that was given to me as a gift from a friend of mine called "Beat the Bitch" by Tess Stimson. OMG!! I barely got through the first chapter! I really cannot begin to tell the dizziness, jitters and creepy crawly feelings of all sorts shooting in my head, my heart and all over my body! I need to gather myself together first before starting with the book given by my dear daughter. I am ever so curious to enter "her world"...

Now the question is, after reading this thread, how do I, as a mom of a teenage girl, try to make her realize what effects and impact all these books will have on her and her perception towards the real world? We, my husband and I, are trying to educate the kids (have another 2 boys) as subtle as possible about the existence of psychopath/sociopath and how they work. But, since she is hooked now with these genre of books, my guess is (please tell me I'm wrong), she is developing a "romantic world" which she will crave, which will lead to negative relationships. Or am I jumping the gun here?

You might want to really start talking with her about what specifically she sees in these books/movies that is so attractive to her. Is it because everyone else is doing it and she'll feel left out if she doesn't join in? Is it a form of rebellion (meaning that she's just interested in it because it represents the opposite of what she's taught at home)? Does she think it makes her look cool (embracing the "darkside" because it's so different from her everyday existence)? A combination of the above?

The other thing that can help with all of your children is for your husband to really step up (if he hasn't done so already) and present an alternative and more realistic version of what a real man can be. One of the things my dad did with me that I believe really solidified my expectations of how I should be treated by all men was that he'd take me out to dinner. It wasn't often and doesn't have to be expensive. It was really lovely. Let him take her out by herself and just have a nice time talking about what she's interested in. Each of you can also do this with the other two children. Let them have their own special time alone with each of you to strengthen personal relationships with both of you as well as then coming together as a family just doing regular stuff around the house (cooking, cleaning). I know some of it may sound mundane, but this is what real life is comprised of - the little everyday moments.

Hope that helps a bit.

 

[foofighter]

The other thing that can help with all of your children is for your husband to really step up (if he hasn't done so already) and present an alternative and more realistic version of what a real man can be.

Well, that would be me. I've tried to step us much as possible, although being new at this (I married Starlight and got into the family only last year) I still have a long way to go in understanding what to do and how. The kids have improved immensely over the past year, but there is still much to go, and yes the daughter is what I'm having the hardest time handling. Sometimes no matter what I do, it seems wrong.

One of the things my dad did with me that I believe really solidified my expectations of how I should be treated by all men was that he'd take me out to dinner. It wasn't often and doesn't have to be expensive. It was really lovely. Let him take her out by herself and just have a nice time talking about what she's interested in. Each of you can also do this with the other two children. Let them have their own special time alone with each of you to strengthen personal relationships with both of you as well as then coming together as a family just doing regular stuff around the house (cooking, cleaning). I know some of it may sound mundane, but this is what real life is comprised of - the little everyday moments.

We are doing this with our travel already, in that we will bring one at a time instead of all three, so that they can get their own time with us, and not have to contend with the other two. When we went to Bali earlier this year with Starlights daughter she really relaxed and we got to know each other much better, so yes, the idea I think is very good. We, or I, haven't done it with more everyday things like dinners, but it sounds like a really good idea. Sometimes just getting away from the house environment, where the rest of the family is always around, is a good thing.

One matter which complicates the whole thing is that we have shared custody along with the biological daddy, which is a textbook psycho (along with his new wife which is even worse and not much older than the kids). There is almost constant battling between us, and it is taking a toll on the kids, who are in the middle. I think this adds to her confusion about what a normal relationship should look like, because she is tossed between two worlds, which are completely the opposite. Maybe a dark fantasy world is an escape she can use to dissociate from that. I don't know.

We'll try your suggestion, and see if that helps! Thanks for the suggestion.

 

[truth seeker]

Hey foofighter,

So glad to hear that! It's a really subtle thing but I think in the end it works wonders. I didn't come to fully appreciate just what my parents did until I was in my 30's so be patient with yourself. I've had two relationships with divorced dads who felt that their limited time didn't amount to much in terms of influence. I can say from personal experience that it does. All you need is one "normal" calm parent to provide an alternative view. Kids are smart and can tell the difference between drama and peace. Just keep doing what you're doing and be prepared for when the time comes that they'll want to talk to you about their various issues. As long as you're genuine, even though it may not seem so at the time, they're listening.

 

[Kila]

Just my two cents about the Twilight series. I read all four books along with my 11 year old, she wanted to read them so I read ahead of her to make sure they were appropriate.

Personally, I didn't think they were about vampires at all. I believe they are really about the Watchers. Now that I find that she is Mormon perhaps that makes more sense after all. When I read them I had recently read a book titled From the Ashes of Angels: the forbidden legacy of a fallen race by Andrew Collins and the parallels were eerie.
Collins quoting from the book of Noah and Enoch as well as middle Eastern (Iranian) texts dealing with the Watchers and the Djin or demon race all bear striking similarities to Meyers 'vampires'.

Both the Watchers and her vampires are described as having 'eyes like burning lamps' or golden eyes, superhuman strength, pale with 'shining' skin hard like alabaster, in both accounts they appear to be immortal or at least extremely long lived, and they are described in all accounts as having a distinctive delicious smell like myrrh and honey.
I found this fascinating. Additionally, her accounts of the mating between one of these creatures and a mortal women also reflects the ancient myths in that these couplings often resulted in the death of the woman, as the child is abnormally large and cannot be delivered naturally. The mixed blood child also matures at an astonishing rate. Meyers echos all of these old myths perfectly in her work of fiction.

I also found the 'change' interesting. Could she be describing, at least partially, the change from 3D to 4D existence? The vampires aren't affected by Newtonian physics in 3D the same way as humans are. They have almost spiritual PSI type gifts as well as physical abilities that are super enhanced; increased cognitive and physical power. Additionally, they no longer need to sleep or eat or defecate and cannot reproduce physically. And of course, they drink blood, feeding of the energy of those in 3D.

Just a few things to make some like me say...hmmmmmm.

I even wonder if our fascination with them doesn't reflect the age old fascination with these sorts of creatures?

That said I found it interesting that she had two groups of vampires, essentially STS and STO types. The Volturi clearly STS types that ran the world so to speak and the Cullens a more STO version, interested in protecting and in the case of Dr. Cullen, being of service to humanity, even though this requires an act of supreme will.

Just a few thoughts.

As to the other dynamics between Bella and Edward. That's another post. But suffice to say the books appeal to children of divorce with narcissistic wounding. Since I have plenty of that going on, I could relate to Bella and found the story line pretty compelling. My daughter on the other hand who is, thankfully, pretty emotionally healthy, thought the story was interesting but wasn't obsessed in the least. Now she's reading Harry Potter and says while she liked Twilight, Harry Potter is a much better story.

 

[Gaby]

Personally, I didn't think they were about vampires at all. I believe they are really about the Watchers.

Hmm, I see it perhaps like variations of the same archetype.

Now that I find that she is Mormon perhaps that makes more sense after all. When I read them I had recently read a book titled From the Ashes of Angels: the forbidden legacy of a fallen race by Andrew Collins and the parallels were eerie.
Collins quoting from the book of Noah and Enoch as well as middle Eastern (Iranian) texts dealing with the Watchers and the Djin or demon race all bear striking similarities to Meyers 'vampires'.

I had a look at some quotes in the net, creepy! They are practically talking about the same thing.

Both the Watchers and her vampires are described as having 'eyes like burning lamps' or golden eyes, superhuman strength, pale with 'shining' skin hard like alabaster, in both accounts they appear to be immortal or at least extremely long lived, and they are described in all accounts as having a distinctive delicious smell like myrrh and honey.
I found this fascinating. Additionally, her accounts of the mating between one of these creatures and a mortal women also reflects the ancient myths in that these couplings often resulted in the death of the woman, as the child is abnormally large and cannot be delivered naturally. The mixed blood child also matures at an astonishing rate. Meyers echos all of these old myths perfectly in her work of fiction.

There was a speculation about the Watchers having elongated skulls and the thing about their shining skins with the sunlight (in reference to the Watchers) reminded me about the value of transillumination of the skull in medical examinations of certain skull malformations. When there is water in an elongated skull (as in hydrocephaly), you can shine a light and there will be some transluency of the skin because the hydrocephalus (water in the head) is transparent. In some cases sunlight suffices. Perhaps there is more to this shining of the skin though.

It seems that the Watchers were also described as "giants", or at least very tall. And what you say about women dying while giving child birth, made me wonder about the elongated skulls (related also to the giants?), as I wondered that if they were indeed born with their skulls elongated, then how did they managed to go through the birth canal without killing the mother?! Just a thought. There are some pretty weird elongated skulls in existence that can't really be due to cranial deformation (a common practice in the past).

I did a search in the forum and found one of the quotes that are related to the Watchers:

http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=7206.msg50893#msg50893

[...]I saw Watchers in my vision, the dream-vision. Two of them were fighting over me, saying… and holding a great contest over me. I asked them, “Who are you, that you are thus empowered over me?” They answered me, “We have been empowered and rule over mankind.” And they said to me, "Which one of us [will have you]?" And I lifted my eyes, and looked at one of them directly. His appearance was dreadfully frightening, and his skin was multicolored, darkly glittering scales. (4Q542)

(Note: The "Watchers" are consistently identified with the Annunaki in modern ET/Alien speculation.)[...]

There is also a description of the Watchers as "vultures", which is not surprising that Meyer chose the Volturi for the evil vampires.

From the thread of the Zendar council, there is a summary about what I found from the web regarding the Watchers:

http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=14713.msg116208#msg116208

In the Keys of Enoch the angels/watchers are usually described as the fallen angels that mated with the women on Earth, giving rise to the race known as Nephilim. However, there is an alternative view of the angels which is often written about in books on the Enochian Tablets and Enochian Magick. The angel is seen as the watcher or guardian that guides you in the transition between the Physical Realm and the Ethereal Realm and helps you in the quest for knowledge and the search for enlightenment.

_http://www.paganlibrary.com/reference/on_hereditary_italian_witchcraft.php

In the Italian system, these ancient Beings are called the Grigori. They are the Guardians of the "doorways" between the physical plane and that which is beyond. In Italian witchlore, the stars were thought to be the campfires of the legions of the Watchers (there were other stellar associations as well). In the 16th Century, the French theologian Sinistrari spoke of Beings existing between "men and angels". He called them demons, and associated them with the Elemental natures of Earth, Air, Fire, and Water. This, however, was not a new concept, but was taught by certain Gnostic sects in the early days of Christianity. In the Old Testament (Daniel 4: 13-17) there is reference to the Irin, or Watcher, which appear to be an order of angels. In his book DICTIONARY OF ANGELS, Gustav Davidson lists the Watchers as a high order of angels, known also as the Grigori. In Rabbinic lore, the "good" Watchers dwell in the 5th Heaven, and the "evil" Watchers dwell in the 3rd.

In Aridian lore, the Watchers guard our circle and watch over us. They assist us in our spiritual growth, and "escort" us to the next realm, when we cross from physical life. We acknowledge them as Guardians of the entrances and exists, to and from the worlds which connect with the physical plane. We also know them as the Keepers of the Ancient Wisdom, and guardians of the Art. They are Clan Guardian spirits, known as The Old Ones. They are also pre-Christian and pre-Gardnerian.

I also found the 'change' interesting. Could she be describing, at least partially, the change from 3D to 4D existence? The vampires aren't affected by Newtonian physics in 3D the same way as humans are. They have almost spiritual PSI type gifts as well as physical abilities that are super enhanced; increased cognitive and physical power. Additionally, they no longer need to sleep or eat or defecate and cannot reproduce physically. And of course, they drink blood, feeding of the energy of those in 3D.

Just a few things to make some like me say...hmmmmmm.

I even wonder if our fascination with them doesn't reflect the age old fascination with these sorts of creatures?

Barbara Hort wonders about the fascination for the vampires, she asks "Why are we so fascinated by the vampire?" She develops the answer in her book "Unholy Hungers" from a psychology point of view. It is a very enlightening reading.

That said I found it interesting that she had two groups of vampires, essentially STS and STO types. The Volturi clearly STS types that ran the world so to speak and the Cullens a more STO version, interested in protecting and in the case of Dr. Cullen, being of service to humanity, even though this requires an act of supreme will.

Just a few thoughts.

This "STS and STO" example reminded me of a reference to the Quorum:

http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=13490.msg100608#msg100608

A selection of raw transcripts collected using the search term "monoatomic gold" and "Quorum" (which came up in the MA sessions, so am including them for context, as well as enough of each session for the context to be intact; short in some cases, longer in others.) Arranged chronologically.

18 October 1995

Q: (L) I would like to know what is the origin of the Freemasons?
A: Osirians.
Q: (L) Can you tell us when the original Freemasons formed as a society?
A: 5633 B.C.
Q: (L) Is Freemasonry as it is practiced today the same?
A: 33rd degree, yes.
Q: (L) So, there is a continuing tradition for over 7 thousand years?
A: Yes.
Q: (L) Is this organization with a plan to take over and rule the world?
A: Not exactly.
Q: (L) What is their focus?
A: Overseers.
Q: (L) Of what?
A: The status of quorum.
Q: (L) What is the quorum?
A: Deeper knowledge organization. Totally secret to your kind as of yet. Very important with regard to your future.
Q: (L) In what way?
A: Changes.
Q: (L) Can you get more specific? Is that changes to us personally?
A: Partly.
Q: (L) Earth changes?
A: Also.
Q: (L) What is the relationship between this quorum and the Cassiopaeans?
A: They communicate with us regularly.
Q: (L) Do they do this knowing you are Cassiopaeans or do they do it thinking...
A: Yes.
Q: (L) Has there been an ongoing relationship between the Cassiopaeans and this quorum for these thousands of years?
A: For some time as you measure it.

25 October 1994

Q: (L) Is the Quorum composed of members who are humans on this planet?
A: Partly.
Q: (L) Would we know any of them as well known figures?
A: Hidden. None you would know.
Q: (L) How is the Quorum important in regard to the Earth changes?
A: Watchers.
Q: (L) Why is it important to have watchers?
A: Keep track of prophecies.
Q: (L) How do the Masons relate to the Illuminati?
A: Masons are low level branch.

12 November 1994


Q: (L) On a number of occasions we talked about the quorum and the Illuminati. They both seem to be the highest levels of secret organizations. What is their relationship to each other?
A: Please put new music on; this a little disruptive. [Creation Chant]
Q: (L) How is this? [Celtic harp]
A: Better.
Q: (L) You don't like the Native American stuff?
A: It is okay but disruptive to vibrations.
Q: (L) Back to the quorum and illuminati.
A: Quorum mostly alien; illuminati mostly human.
Q: (L) Well, the quorum has been described...
A: Meet; two halves of whole.
Q: (L) Well the quorum seems to be described as being in touch with the Cassiopaeans, that is, yourselves, which you have described as beneficial beings, is this correct?
A: Close.
Q: (L) The illuminati has been described as being behind or with the brotherhood which has been described as being in connection with the Lizard beings...
A: Close. But not that simple.
Q: (L) Well, if the quorum is the good guys and the illuminati is the bad guys, and they both are at the high levels of Freemasonry, what is the story here?
A: Picture a circle or cycle first now then contemplate for a moment before follow up.
Q: (L) Okay, I am contemplating a cycling circle.
A: Now, two halves representing positive and negative. Two halves.
Q: (L) Well, what I am getting out of that is the two halves and both sides are playing with the human race. Is that it?
A: No. This is complicated but if you can learn and understand, it will be a super revelation.
Q: (L) Well, go ahead and explain.
A: Ask step by step.
Q: (L) Why do we so often have to ask things step by step?
A: In order to absorb the information.
Q: (L) The quorum is described as the good guys. The illuminati is described as bad guys. And yet, they are both Masonic. When a person in the Masonic organization reaches the higher levels, are there individuals at the higher levels recruiting masons to one side or the other?
A: First, not exactly one side or another.
Q: (L) I am beginning to not understand something here because if the Lizzies...
A: Unblock.
Q: (L) I don't have a block here. If the brotherhood AKA illuminati AKA Lizzies AKA beast are the ones who are going to do detrimental things to this planet, how are they related or connected to the quorum which is in touch with...
A: This will take time to explain be patient it will be worth it.
Q: (L) Well, are you going to explain it right now?
A: Ask step by step.
Q: (L) Okay. What is the nature of evil?
A: Blend.
Q: (L) Are the Lizzies what we would consider to be evil?
A: Yes.
Q: (L) Are the Cassiopaeans what we would consider to be good?
A: Yes.
Q: (L) Yet, do the Cassiopaeans use and manipulate the Lizzies to accomplish certain things?
A: No.
Q: (L) The Lizzies work independently and in opposition to the Cassiopaeans?
A: Independently, not in opposition.
Q: (L) Well then, is there somebody over and above this whole project...
A: We serve others therefore there is no opposition. Careful now. Step by step. If you do not fully understand answer ask another.
Q: (L) Part of a whole. Part of a circle.
A: Blend.
Q: (L) Does this mean...
A: Picture a blending colored circle image.
Q: (L) Are you saying that at some levels the two halves overlap?
A: Close.
Q: (L) Are you saying that some of the Quorum are good guys and bad guys and the same for the Illuminati because the two are on opposing sides of the circle but at the point of blending one is weighted more to one side and the other to the other side? And these organizations are where the interactions come together?
A: Closer.
Q: (L) Let's leave it for the time being.
A: No. Now please.
Q: (L) Okay. So it is a blending. Does it have something to do with ... in your case service to others means that you even serve those who serve self, is that correct?
A: Yes; we serve you and the Lizards have programed your race to self service remember.
Q: (L) Well, I am down a notch or two. So, I am still a service to self individual to some extent, is that correct?
A: But moving slowly toward service to others. Not all humans are.
Q: (L) Does this mean that when people who are members of the quorum or illuminati call for information or help, that you, because of your service to others orientation are obliged to answer whoever calls?
A: Yes and no.
Q: (L) What is the no part.
A: If vibrational frequencies are out of pattern we do not connect.
Q: (L) Is the work of the Lizzies part of an overall grand plan or design?
A: All is. ...

[...]

I didn't quoted the rest of the sessions on that quote for sake of brevity, but they can be found here: http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=13490.msg100608#msg100608

I remember also other references about shining skins, or light emanating from the skin from Secret History:

http://www.cassiopaea.org/cass/biblewho6.htm

[...]What is it about Moses’ face? The meaning of the Hebrew term is uncertain, and for a long time, people thought that it meant that Moses had acquired horns. This resulted in many depictions of Moses with horns in Medieval art. Another interpretation was that something was wrong with Moses’ skin - that light beamed out from his skin. So many translations and interpretations go along with this idea and teach that there was “glory” shining from Moses’ face that hurt the eyes of the beholders. I was taught this version myself.

In more recent times, biblical scholar, William Popp, has assembled an array of evidence that suggests that the writer of P was telling his audience that Moses was disfigured in the sense that he is so horrible to look upon that the people cannot bear to see him. The text does tell us that the “glory of Yahweh” is like a “consuming fire” and this suggests that the flesh of Moses’ face has been eaten away making him a specter out of your worst nightmare. If this was an understood colloquialism of the time, then it is a masterly touch of manipulation by the author of P. He hasn’t denigrated Moses, but he has created an image of horror that no one will want to contemplate!

However, I believe that there is a different reason for this allusion. Going back to our Sun-god allusion, we find that one of the early efforts to demonize the goddess was the symbolism of the Old Babylonian god Huwawa (Humbaba). Huwawa appears in the Gilgamesh stories as Enlil’s guardian of the Cedar Forest, and we have some idea that cedar wood was very important to the god of Moses as presented in the P text. We also know the earlier importance of the fir tree to the birth goddess, so we find this Huwawa assimilating the goddess' prerogatives as well. We also note that most interesting name: Huwawa. Sounds close to Yahweh to me!

The use of cedar in the sacrifices, and the demand to build the temple of cedar wood are indeed, most curious connections to this god Huwawa. In 2 Samuel, chapter 7:7, Yahweh is reported as saying to David via his prophet, Nathan,

In all places where I have moved with all the Israelites, did I speak a word to any from the tribes of Israel whom I commanded to be shepherd of My people Israel, asking, Why do you not build Me a house of cedar?”

And then, in verse 13 Yahweh tells David that his son shall be the one to build this house. “He shall build a house for My name and I will establish the throne of his kingdom for ever.” In 1 Kings, 5:6, Solomon is recorded as requesting cedars from Lebanon to build the Temple of Solomon. Curiously, in the Bible story, Solomon raised a levy of forced labor for the cutting of the trees and building of the temple, quite similar to the stories of bondage in Egypt. The foundations of the temple were “great costly stones” which, of course, have never been found in Jerusalem.

Was the relationship of the terrible face of Moses, in comparison to the terrible visage of Huwawa, the guardian of the cedar forest, understood by the people? Huwawa was described as a giant protected by seven layers of terrifying radiance. He was killed by Gilgamesh and Enkidu in a story that is quite similar to the slaying of Goliath by David and Medusa by Perseus. In those stories, the Osirian hero prevails over the Setian serpent.

Melam and ni are two Sumerian words which are often linked. Strictly speaking ni seems to denote the effect on human beings of the divine power melam. The Babylonians used various words to capture the idea of ni, including puluhtu, “fear.” The exact connotation of melam is difficult to grasp. It is a brilliant, visible glamour which is exuded by gods, heroes, sometimes by kings, and also by temples of great holiness. While it is in some ways a phenomenon of light, melam is at the same time terrifying, awe-inspiring. Ni can be experienced as a physical creeping of the flesh. Gods are sometimes said to “wear” their melam like a garment or a crown, and like a garment or a crown, melam can be “taken off.” While it is always a mark of the supernatural, melam carries no connotation of moral value since demons and terrifying giants can “wear” it too.[2]

So, it seems that this is very likely the point that the writer of P was trying to make about Moses. Moses was being compared to Huwawa/Humbaba, the horrible guardian of the cedar forest, a variation on the sun-god whose face is so brilliant that it must be “veiled;” following which Huwawa/Yahweh demanded that his sacrifices contain cedar, and his house be built of cedar![...]

As to the other dynamics between Bella and Edward. That's another post. But suffice to say the books appeal to children of divorce with narcissistic wounding. Since I have plenty of that going on, I could relate to Bella and found the story line pretty compelling. My daughter on the other hand who is, thankfully, pretty emotionally healthy, thought the story was interesting but wasn't obsessed in the least. Now she's reading Harry Potter and says while she liked Twilight, Harry Potter is a much better story.

I agree, the story appeals to wounded people, specially women of a certain background. There must be a lot of potential of "transference" or "projection of a certain ideal or illusion." And with the Twilight series, I do believe that Stephenie Meyer had produced a greatest disservice to wounded women, leaving them exposed to psychopaths or enhancing and chasing illusions.

 

[Gertrudes]

This thread plus http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=13687.30, where Twilight is also discussed have given me a few things to think about.

I agree, the story appeals to wounded people, specially women of a certain background. There must be a lot of potential of "transference" or "projection of a certain ideal or illusion." And with the Twilight series, I do believe that Stephenie Meyer had produced a greatest disservice to wounded women, leaving them exposed to psychopaths or enhancing and chasing illusions.

I also agree. I have had my own fascination with vampires in my teens, when my life was just a mess. Fascination for twisted dynamics in relationships goes, IMO, hand in hand with some sort of wounding, dysfunctional relationship with others (family and/or pears), and lack of healthy exchanges. The vampiristic relationship or ideal seems to be an exacerbation of the dynamics we already experience in some part, if not the all, of our lives.

Using a rough example from our 3D earth, looking at today's teenagers interactions: There is usually one or two central figures, the popular one(s), beautiful and strong or with which ever attributes those people are embellished with. The cycle of friends will gravitate around these core figures, loosing themselves in this process, in a continuous give little from the core figures, to then take a lot. I have experienced that, and remember well not being able to access my own thoughts for feeling so drained.
Laura has also given an interesting account of a similar dynamic amongst teenagers in one of the Wave books where she describes picking her daughter from school, if my memory doesn't fail. Apologies for I can't remember in which book I have read it.

The vicious dynamic of give and take in unequal shares that we all experience at some point, tends to hook us in the expectation of something more, that deeply, we probably know to be inaccessible. This is something well described in the psychology books, a dynamic that we tend to replicate, most of the times unconsciously, in our own lives.
I find the presence of some sort of Inaccessibility in a relationship to function similarly to a drug, hooking us to the very inaccessibility itself, perhaps in a vain attempt to achieve or control it - the object of persuit - therefore feeding our false sense of being. I think this is an example:

As it happens, the other day, I was reading some reviews of the movie Legend on IMDB, and there was some debate going on in the discussion board, because some women admitted that if they were Lily (the heroine), they would have chosen the character Darkness over the more "dull" hero (Jack). One of the guys taking part in the discussion couldn't understand how women could prefer such a horrible, abusive and dark character over a nice guy who would do anything for them. Some girls thought the male hero was whiny and they just preferred the bad guy because he had more "personality" (yup).

I think the bad guy here (which can be taken as the vampire in nowadays romances) symbolizes that so full of himself character, apparently so strong, yet inaccessible, something we wish to obtain, as a measure of our own value.

Theres is another side to it already pointed out in this thread, which is the need of a woman (and I believe man, for that matter) to be truly loved and appreciated for what she is. And this is where things get twisted, we want it, yet experience has shown us that appreciating someone can be equal to doggedly following the leader of that teenager group. And that doesn't feel good, but rather icky and servile. What do we do? We choose the bad guy that seems to have that character and Independence.

I have not read the Twilight series, but from what I have read in the threads here, the vampire character is described as something godlike, beautiful hair, skin, something nonhuman. And again, somewhat inaccessible.

One is the idea of being loved unconditionally and nurtured by a wonderful person -- not for any achievement or anything you did, but just because it's you. This is something we want in our lives. This is not weakness, passivity or old stereotypes of femininity, that's a deeply spiritual need. And I think it's a really an unfortunate state of affairs that women are so under-nurtured in our society, that even grown-up women get totally hooked up and addicted to this theme when it's offered in teen fiction; obviously, the real life experiences were few and far between for them. Partly because nobody ever talks about how much work goes into creating, manifesting these experiences in your life.

I agree. Sadly, it seems that in today's world most women (and man) lack the experience and consequently the maturity to choose a relationship.

 

[Biomiast]

Using a rough example from our 3D earth, looking at today's teenagers interactions: There is usually one or two central figures, the popular one(s), beautiful and strong or with which ever attributes those people are embellished with. The cycle of friends will gravitate around these core figures, loosing themselves in this process, in a continuous give little from the core figures, to then take a lot. I have experienced that, and remember well not being able to access my own thoughts for feeling so drained.
Laura has also given an interesting account of a similar dynamic amongst teenagers in one of the Wave books where she describes picking her daughter from school, if my memory doesn't fail. Apologies for I can't remember in which book I have read it.

Hi Gertrudes,

I believe that was in Adventure Series, I don't have Wave books, but if I am not mistaken it could be on book 7. From online Adventure Series, Chapter 14:

Each group consisted of about seven or eight people - maybe as many as ten. In each group there was a dominant person who was the focal point of the gathering. Watching the eye contact, the touching, the fawning behavior of the "low man" in the group, was a fascinating study. And as I watched, I noticed something else: the dominant person actually seemed to "swell" and grow while the submissive persons gathered around him literally seemed to shrink. Of course, this was a trick of posture and the way they were all holding their bodies. But it was definitely clear that there was a form of "feeding" taking place. And when the submissive persons ran out of "juice," they were dismissed to the outer fringes of the circle and a new submissive moved in to take their place. The eye contact and touching went through the same series of gestures, and the dominant person stood taller and taller, and his or her eyes opened wider and glowed brighter, while the submissives were diminished one by one, shoulders slumped, and they often crept away.

http://www.cassiopaea.com/cassiopaea/adventures088.htm

Well, that is just one pharagraph for simplicity, but it is a long story, so it might be a good idea to take a look at the link. It was a beautiful chapter, full of amazing revelations. I personally think it was the best chapter in Adventure Series. I think I am going to read it again to understand how my sister operates with her friends. :)

 

[Gertrudes]

Hi Gertrudes,

I believe that was in Adventure Series, I don't have Wave books, but if I am not mistaken it could be on book 7. From online Adventure Series, Chapter 14:

Thank you Biomiast, that was exactly the portion I was referring to.
I haven't read the Adventure series, only a few excerpts online. I have read the Wave books published so far, and if I understand you correctly and from the excerpts I have read online from the Adventure, it seems the Adventure series are integrated in the Wave, as in, the Adventure being the equivalent of a couple of the Wave books? (Not sure, but I think 5 and 6)

It was a beautiful chapter, full of amazing revelations.

Indeed :)

 

[knowledge_of_self]

I work in a video store so I am frequently faced with the obsession of people and different movies. The latest one being the Twilight saga. As soon as New Moon came out, EVERYONE wanted to see the first Twilight. Needless to say I’m not looking forward to the video release of New Moon, lol…

When I was a young girl, I also had a huge fascination with vampires and one of my favorite shows was Buffy the Vampire Slayer. Not so much because of all the vampire stuff, but more because of the forbidden love between Buffy and Angel.

I think a lot of people; especially women love the idea of “forbidden love” or the “taboo”. Which I think could stem from many different things such as psychic wounding from childhood and an upbringing in a society that is filled with narcissism in school & social gatherings, etc.

Not to mention, many don't know what love is and are always fascinated with false ideas of love, such as "belonging to someone", or "unconditional love" (in form of pure abuse).

And I found myself thinking perhaps this is the reason why Twilight is so popular? Because other than the idea of 'vampire' it delves into the subject of "forbidden love, which to any drama addict, is bliss.

Barbara Hort wonders about the fascination for the vampires, she asks "Why are we so fascinated by the vampire?" She develops the answer in her book "Unholy Hungers" from a psychology point of view. It is a very enlightening reading.

Yes this is a very good read that delves into a lot of this topic and I was going to recommend it for Starlight’s daughter.

Starlight, you should get a copy for your daughter, I have no doubt she will enjoy it. And it may help her distinguish the reality within books such as Twilight.

 

[luke wilson]

Interesting discussion. Huuuuge fascination with the vampire stuff of late. It seems hollywood is on over-drive. Twilight, True Blood and Vampire diaries. Always the same theme, girl is leading a somewhat boring life, girl meets vampire. Vampire is exceptionally charming. Girl falls in love and the drama unfolds.

Clearly this are aimed at girls of a particular disposition.

Ok, twist!

Super-hero movies that hollywood over the last 10 years has been on over-drive aswell. Superman, spiderman, ironman, wolverine, Kick-Ass!, Batman etc. Ok, new strain of comedy eg, Knocked up, superbad, Pineapple express with guys like, michael cera and seth rogen leading the pack having taken over from the adam sandlers of hollywood and the old school teen movies of late 90's early 2000's like american pie. Now there seems to be a somewhat new kind of sophistication. All this is aimed at guys.

They say, fiction/media is meant to mirror life but I think now it's the other way round, life is mirroring what the media outlets put out.

Clearly all this are meant to subtly influence our behaviours be it, the girl or the guy and as a result influence our development.

All the above movies are huge record breaking movies that are dangerously popular and being churned out year after year.

It is curious to note that there is a fascination by hollywood at this time to concentrate on almost supernatural kind of movies be it vampires or superheroes over the last 10 years. People might attribute this to technology which makes it possible to make such movies but it's interesting to watch them do this with the intensity in which they are in the last decade. The comics set the foundation for the superhero movies we now see in cinema. For the vampire stuff, clearly the novels set the foundation for those. Comics aimed at teenage boys, have pictures/illustrations etc. Novels aimed at girls have well, the words that gets a girl thinking and her heart melting yearning for this mysterious guy and this mysterious life.

I wonder if this is just the natural progression of things or if it is somewhat been deliberately set up. Clearly the whole thing has played out over decades... So one wonders why this would interest someone with time travelling capabilities if it has indeed been set up deliberately...

 

[Arctodus]

I HATE Stephanie Meyers' books with a passion. They are the most trivial drivel I've ever had the misfortune to peruse.

While Vampires certainly are a major theme these days with the TBPTW; for me, finding out Twilight was written by an observant Mormon made me recoil in horror.
It would be no different than something written by a fundie observant woman of any other religion and dressed up for tweeners.

This site gives you an idea of the forces driving Mrs. Meyers' programs. WARNING: it does use foul language to get it's point across. Even without the foul language, it still would be very educating and hilarious at the same time.

http://stoney321.livejournal.com/317176.html

LDS Sparkledammerung IS HERE!
The Secrets of the Sparkle a.k.a. TWILIGHT: STONIFIED (Image heavy)
ETA Due To Heavy Traffic This was written to amuse my friends and myself. I am not claiming to be the Mormon Vampire Authority, even though let's face it: I am the leading Mormon Vampire Authority. (Nutshell: laugh, or turn back now. This was meant for joking and is filled with dirty words they can't use on TV.)Also, you'll note that this was written a few years ago, so I don't really reply back to people. Feel free to strike up convos with anyone, however.


The Secrets of the Sparkle a.k.a. TWILIGHT: STONIFIED (For real this time.)

So here's the thing. I was going to be all whipping out the smart essay, pointing out all the subconscious LDS meta that SMeyers jammed in these books, showing how I thought she didn't even realize what she was borrowing (because honestly, I just don't think she's smart enough to lay it out there, you know?) But here's the thing:

THE BOOKS ARE REALLY REALLY DUMB. Like, "Strategery" dumb. So I'm giving back at the same reading-comprehension level if you will. And you will. There's so much dumb, in fact, that it will take a few posts to get it all out there. Here's the first book and change.



Hold on, hold on, I need to keep setting the tone:



"Is there anything more beautiful than a beautiful, beautiful flamingo, flying across in front of a beautiful, beautiful sunset? And he's carrying a beautiful rose in his beak, and also he's carrying a very beautiful painting with his feet. And also, you're drunk." ~Jack Handy.


There is heavy word abuse in the book. The words abused the most are "beautiful," "perfect," "chagrin," and the one I wanted to scream every time I read it, "UGH." Because cop fathers would clearly say repeatedly, "Ugh." They're such bratty 13 year olds that way.

Stephenie Meyer [From now on I'll call her SMeyers] claims that her name is spelled weird. Um, only in Utah, lady. Which, you know? Probably not, as here are some examples of some typical Mormon/Utah names, all people that I KNOW:

Jannilyn
Randilynn (guess what her dad's name is?)
Faunette
LaVonne
Mohonri Morianchimer
Aereign <-- good ******* hell.)


Smeyers grew up in Phoenix and you know this because she likes to mention how awesomely huge it is. She likes it so much that her protagonist, Isabella Swan aka Bella, is from there and constantly reminds her father, Charlie, that Phoenix is waaaaaay bigger than Provo. I mean, Forks, Washington, where the story is set.

 

[EmeraldHope]

The Host- from the author of the Twilight series- an alien story

Two people I know have now told me about this book so I looked it up. I just can't believe it. :O

Melanie Stryder refuses to fade away.

Our world has been invaded by an unseen enemy. Humans become hosts for these invaders, their minds taken over while their bodies remain intact and continue their lives apparently unchanged. Most of humanity has succumbed.

When Melanie, one of the few remaining "wild" humans is captured, she is certain it is her end. Wanderer, the invading "soul" who has been given Melanie's body, was warned about the challenges of living inside a human: the overwhelming emotions, the glut of senses, the too vivid memories. But there was one difficulty Wanderer didn't expect: the former tenant of her body refusing to relinquish possession of her mind.

Wanderer probes Melanie's thoughts, hoping to discover the whereabouts of the remaining human resistance. Instead, Melanie fills Wanderer's mind with visions of the man Melanie loves—Jared, a human who still lives in hiding. Unable to separate herself from her body's desires, Wanderer begins to yearn for a man she has been tasked with exposing. When outside forces make Wanderer and Melanie unwilling allies, they set off on a dangerous and uncertain search for the man they both love.


"Stephenie Meyer is an amazing phenomenon—out of the brightness of her mind and spirit comes the illuminated darkness of her stories. For no matter how much pain her characters suffer, Meyer infuses the tales with light and hope." —Orson Scott Card, author of the Ender Saga

"A fantastic, inventive, thoughtful, and powerful novel. The Host will keep you reading well into the wee hours of night, and keep you thinking, deeply, hauntingly, well after the final word."

 

[Gimpy]

Re: The Host- from the author of the Twilight series- an alien story




She can't write her way out of a wet paper bag. I couldn't get through even a few pages of her first book, and I wouldn't light a fire with this one either. Harsh of me, but its just that bad.