Whiplash (2014)

Rich

The Living Force
Not often would I watch a film twice but Whiplash is one that can be because of the excellent musical score, message and accompanying screenplay. One could argue it contains 'work' concepts in defeating barriers to self-development. Although, in this case the motivation for the protagonist to better himself is partly driven by revenge and seeking external validation from a bullying professor. It does give a clear illustration of the level of effort required to excel in a chosen field:
A young and talented drummer attending a prestigious music academy finds himself under the wing of the most respected professor at the school, one who does not hold back on abuse towards his students. The two form an odd relationship as the student wants to achieve greatness, and the professor pushes him.
_http://www.imdb.com/title/tt2582802/
 
I did not experience this movie like you did at all! :)

I thought this would be a movie about jazz or at least about music, to some extent. It's not. It's a movie about bullying and abuse. Which would be OK if the moral of the story was not all skewed.

While working on oneself and on one's craft is commendable indeed, the movie illustrates none of that imo. As you said, the kid is just trying to gain validation from a pathological man. Is playing the same part of a given tune until your fingers bleed a way to become a better musician? I'm not sure. In the movie, music seems to be totally taken out of context. I found this totally bizarre. I thought I would be able to enjoy some jazz music. But you get is the same segment played ad nauseam.

The way the 'teacher' is behaving towards his pupil reminded me how some chefs yell and humiliate their kitchen staff. It's really cringe-inducing. Does that make them better chefs? No. Some totally give up. Were they not chef material because they caved? I don't think so. Yes working as a chef is hard and it's not for the fainthearted but everyone is different, not everyone can stomach daily humiliation (nor should they) and some pathologicals have the uncanny ability to just know what buttons to push to break someone. And by the way, more and more chefs are taking a stand against these practices because they just don't work and they are inhumane.

So seeing this psychopathic 'technique' being praised in the movie seems backward and amoral.

In the movie, the pupil does not want to be the best musician he can be, he wants to be the fastest. Admittedly, I'm not a musician myself, but many people in my entourage are and I don't recall them ever saying that they needed to improve on their fastness. And certainly not to the detriment of all the rest.

He also wants to be recognized. Fame seems more important than music itself. So much so that if he cannot wow the teacher and become famous, he just gives up music entirely! As Steven Pressfield says in the War of Art, when something is your 'territory' (whether it be writing, making music, cooking, being an accountant, knowing the Truth), that's the thing which you would do all day long if money was no object, if the world had collapsed and you were left all alone. It's what you live for. Is music Andrew's territory in the movie? If we go by Pressfield's definition, hardly.

In that respect, I thought this article from The New Yorker was interesting:

New Yorker said:
Movies about musicians offer musical approximations that usually satisfy in inverse proportion to a viewer’s devotion to the actual music behind the story. Few, if any, fictionalized musicians are played onscreen by real-life musicians of their calibre. (Dexter Gordon, in “’Round Midnight,” is perhaps the best; Jackie McLean and Freddie Redd, in “The Connection,” don’t do as much acting, but their music is brilliant.) Most good music in movies is played by musicians playing themselves, whether it’s Little Richard in “The Girl Can’t Help It,” Louis Armstrong and Lionel Hampton in “A Song Is Born,” the Rolling Stones in “Sympathy for the Devil,” or Artur Rubinstein in “Carnegie Hall.” Yet I’m not bothered by musical approximations and allusions in dramas, as long as the drama itself has the spirit of music. The mediocre jazz in Damien Chazelle’s new film, “Whiplash,” the story (set in the present day) of a young drummer (Miles Teller) under the brutal tutelage of a conservatory professor (J. K. Simmons), isn’t itself a problem. The problem is with the underlying idea. The movie’s very idea of jazz is a grotesque and ludicrous caricature.

Teller is a terrific actor, and he does a creditable job of playing the protagonist, Andrew Neiman, who’s nineteen and idolizes Buddy Rich. (Buddy Rich? A loud and insensitive technical whiz, a TV personality, not a major jazz inspiration. As I heard his name in the film, I spoke it in my head as dubiously as Leonardo DiCaprio says “Benihana” in “The Wolf of Wall Street.”) Teller is a student at New York’s fictional Shaffer Conservatory, where he catches the attention of Terence Fletcher (Simmons), the authoritarian leader of the school’s concert band and an ostensible career maker. The core of the movie is the emotional and physical brutality that Fletcher metes out to Andrew, in the interest (he claims) of driving him out of self-satisfaction and into hard work. Fletcher levels an ethnic slur at Andrew, who’s Jewish; he insults his father, smacks him in the face repeatedly to teach him rhythm, hazes him with petty rules that are meant to teach military-style obedience rather than musical intelligence.

Fletcher justifies his behavior with repeated reference to a long-repeated anecdote about Charlie Parker, who, while still an unknown youth, was playing a solo at a jam session with professionals—one of whom was the great drummer Jo Jones, of the Count Basie Orchestra, more or less the inventor of classic jazz drumming, and even of the four-four glide that persists as the music’s essential pulse. In Fletcher’s telling, Parker played so badly that Jones threw a cymbal at his head, nearly decapitating him. After that humiliation and intimidation, Parker went home and practiced so long and so hard that he came back a year later and made history with his solo.

Here’s the real story, as related in Stanley Crouch’s recent biography of Parker, “Kansas City Lightning.” Crouch spoke with the bassist Gene Ramey, who was there. It happened in 1936, and Parker (whose nickname was Bird) was sixteen:

“Bird had gotten up there and got his meter turned around,” Ramey remembered. “When they got to the end of the thirty-two-bar chorus, he was in the second bar on that next chorus. Somehow or other he got ahead of himself or something. He had the right meter. He was with the groove all right, but he was probably anxious to make it. Anyway, he couldn’t get off. Jo Jones hit the bell corners—ding. Bird kept playing. Ding. Ding. Everybody was looking, and people were starting to say, ‘Get this cat off of here.’ Ding! So finally, finally, Jo Jones pulled off the cymbal and said ‘DING’ on the floor. Some would call it a crash, and they were right, a DING trying to pass itself as under a crash. Bird jumped, you know, and it startled him and he eased out of the solo. Everybody was screaming and laughing. The whole place.
Not attempted murder but rather musical snark; a humiliation but not an oppression. (By the way, Crouch himself has been a professional musician, an excellent drummer in the free-jazz manner—I had the pleasure of seeing him perform around 1976. His book joins an extraordinary depth of research and a profound understanding of the inner life of the music with a vivid depiction of life in Kansas City in the nineteen-thirties.)

Crouch adds that, at around this same time, Parker “had a breakthrough,” a musical epiphany that resulted from listening to the solos of the Kansas City-based tenor saxophonist Lester Young (who, later in 1936, joined Basie’s band). Parker found a steady gig with a local band, with whom he performed onstage for many hours every night. Crouch writes that Parker also got serious about music, studying harmony at the piano and spending lots of time listening to other musicians on the radio, including the trumpeter Roy Eldridge and the alto saxophonist Buster Smith. And, yes, Parker did play a historic solo a year later. He showed up at another jam session, in 1937, and, as the trumpeter Oliver Todd told Crouch, “Before the thing was over, all the guys that had rejected him were sitting down with their mouths wide open. I had seen a miracle. I really had. It was something that made tears come down my face.”

Here’s what Parker didn’t do in the intervening year: sit alone in his room and work on making his fingers go faster. He played music, thought music, lived music. In “Whiplash,” the young musicians don’t play much music. Andrew isn’t in a band or a combo, doesn’t get together with his fellow-students and jam—not in a park, not in a subway station, not in a café, not even in a basement. He doesn’t study music theory, not alone and not (as Parker did) with his peers. There’s no obsessive comparing of recordings and styles, no sense of a wide-ranging appreciation of jazz history—no Elvin Jones, no Tony Williams, no Max Roach, no Ed Blackwell. In short, the musician’s life is about pure competitive ambition—the concert band and the exposure it provides—and nothing else. The movie has no music in its soul—and, for that matter, it has no music in its images. There are ways of filming music that are themselves musical, that conjure a musical feeling above and beyond what’s on the soundtrack, but Chazelle’s images are nothing of the kind.

To justify his methods, Fletcher tells Andrew that the worst thing you can tell a young artist is “Good job,” because self-satisfaction and complacency are the enemies of artistic progress. It’s the moment where Chazelle gives the diabolical character his due, and it’s utter, despicable nonsense. There’s nothing wrong with “Good job,” because a real artist won’t be gulled or lulled into self-satisfaction by it: real artists are hard on themselves, curious to learn what they don’t know and to push themselves ahead. No artist can find what isn’t already there within; he can only develop it. What’s most memorable about John Ridley’s “Jimi: All Is by My Side” is André 3000’s portrayal of Hendrix as a man with a secret—not an unpleasant personal secret but a sense of constant wonder arising from within, apart from and prior to any actual musical performance that realizes it. That’s how Clint Eastwood has Forest Whitaker portray Parker in “Bird”; that’s how Anthony Mann has James Stewart play the title role in “The Glenn Miller Story.” That’s even what John Cassavetes did with Bobby Darin in Cassavetes’s early, studio-produced film “Too Late Blues” (Darin plays a fictional jazz pianist).

But those performances of musicians with a secret are made possible by scripts that don’t rely on index-card psychology, as “Whiplash” does. Certainly, the movie isn’t “about” jazz; it’s “about” abuse of power. Fletcher could as easily be demanding sex or extorting money as hurling epithets and administering smacks. Yet Chazelle seems to suggest that Fletcher, for all his likely criminal cruelty, has nonetheless forced Andrew to take responsibility for himself, to make decisions on his own, to prove himself even by rebelling against Fletcher’s authority. There’s nothing in the film to indicate that Andrew has any originality in his music. What he has, and what he ultimately expresses, is chutzpah. That may be very helpful in readying Andrew for a job on television. “Whiplash” honors neither jazz nor cinema; it’s a work of petty didacticism that shows off petty mastery, and it feeds the sort of minor celebrity that Andrew aspires to. Buddy Rich. Buddy - freaking - Rich.

So we see that the movie even lies about the Parker anecdote to justify its bullying technique!

Despite all this, the movie is interesting to see, I think. But probably more to reflect on the difference between abuse and pushing someone out of their comfort zone for them to grow.
 
Mrs. Tigersoap said:
So we see that the movie even lies about the Parker anecdote to justify its bullying technique!

Despite all this, the movie is interesting to see, I think. But probably more to reflect on the difference between abuse and pushing someone out of their comfort zone for them to grow.

Thanks Mrs. Tigersoap, a spot on summation of the film and thought-provoking too.
 
*spoiler alert*

While I read some reviews praising the efforts of the young lead to "be the best", putting up with a demanding and strict teacher who finally "finds someone willing and worthy" in his young student. my experience with the movie was that of abuse, exploitation, manipulation and a mere seek of narcissistic goals by the teacher. He says he wanted to look for the next Parker, but I think that was a self-narrative to justify his grandiose purposes.

That the student was so willing to please his ever demanding teacher speaks of a narcissistic dynamic often seen in families and described in The Narcissistic Family. I pictured him as a young, hurt and wounded man who needed to prove hs worth to a father figure who is a moving target (to say the least).

Just by looking at the evil grin of the teacher while he unveils to the young man his final humilliation at the end of the movie (not to mention the cunning and evil plan he setup with a smile) is shivering.
 
Theseus said:
Mrs. Tigersoap said:
So we see that the movie even lies about the Parker anecdote to justify its bullying technique!

Despite all this, the movie is interesting to see, I think. But probably more to reflect on the difference between abuse and pushing someone out of their comfort zone for them to grow.

Thanks Mrs. Tigersoap, a spot on summation of the film and thought-provoking too.

I just saw the movie as well recently, and my immediate impresssion was similar to Mrs. Tigersoap. Playing drums until your hands bleed is definitely abuse in my opinion. However i can also appreciate the idea where people need to be pushed or rather motivated to constantly better themselves, but in this case Fletcher's character seemed to me as psychopatic, and his training methods certainly were abusive, degrading, and not in any way motivational.
 
Mr.Cyan said:
I just saw the movie as well recently, and my immediate impresssion was similar to Mrs. Tigersoap.


Navigator said:
*spoiler alert*

While I read some reviews praising the efforts of the young lead to "be the best", putting up with a demanding and strict teacher who finally "finds someone willing and worthy" in his young student. my experience with the movie was that of abuse, exploitation, manipulation and a mere seek of narcissistic goals by the teacher. He says he wanted to look for the next Parker, but I think that was a self-narrative to justify his grandiose purposes.

My impression and experience of the movie was similar as well. I saw the movie about a month or so ago. I believe several people in the audience even clapped at the ending, which I found annoying. My cousin who I went with and who seemed to like the movie thought I seemed triggered by the movie (which is probably about right). Was feeling angry/upset to a degree-by the end of it. Anyway, a relief to read others reviews here.
 
I watched the preview, and got the impression that this was just another movie about violent psychopathic behavior, with a minor emphasis on developing a musical talent.
Decided not to bother watching the movie. There's more than enough violent movies.
 
I haven't seen the movie quite yet, but a number of the views presented here really remind me of "male on male" vampirism in the book "Unholy Hungers"... although I can sort of appreciate Theseus' seeing in it a lesson in stalking the petty tyrant, however tainted its ends are.
 
Just watched this film and IMO it was a stunning depiction of a psychopath.

I thought it was an accurate display of the damage that psychopathic individuals can inflict on the people psychologically. The fact that the main character gradually began to acquire some of the teachers pathology throughout the movie was also interesting. During the final scene, I had the impression student was "getting back" at the teacher and taking back some control of himself. However, we notice right at the end of the movie the student's smile seemed to me to be a seeking of approval, therefore in the end teacher is actually in still full control. In this situation, it was as if the psychopathic teacher was faced with a "win-win" situation in terms of control. If the student walked out, he would have broken him down and essentially "won the game". Whereas even though the student actually walked back on stage, he was still was emotionally susceptible and eventually succumbed by handing over the power back to his teacher right at the end. Very impressed!!
 
Mrs. Tigersoap said:
I did not experience this movie like you did at all! :)

I thought this would be a movie about jazz or at least about music, to some extent. It's not. It's a movie about bullying and abuse. Which would be OK if the moral of the story was not all skewed.

While working on oneself and on one's craft is commendable indeed, the movie illustrates none of that imo. As you said, the kid is just trying to gain validation from a pathological man. Is playing the same part of a given tune until your fingers bleed a way to become a better musician? I'm not sure. In the movie, music seems to be totally taken out of context. I found this totally bizarre. I thought I would be able to enjoy some jazz music. But you get is the same segment played ad nauseam.
Totally agree Mrs. Tigersoap, my impression was after watching the movie, that the movie was not about achieving perfection through hardship but about the abuse of human beings by a pathological individual. And by the way this method used by the pathological teacher in order to "help" someone to achieve a quasi perfect mastering of their skills is the "right" method from a deviant, pathological point of view, but, from a normal, human, emphatic point of view this is abuse that can cause only damage. As other said this kind of teaching method is pretty predominant in each sphere of our society unfortunately and it's just another sign of the psychopath's massive damage(ponerization) inflicted on the whole society.
 
I haven't watched the movie, only what's shown in the trailer, but my thoughts on what little I saw of it goes something like this. The music teacher was not much different then a drill instructor but worse. The way he quickly switched personalities in the scene where he threw something at the kid after being so nice up to that point showed me that he was trying to break him down and insert a hypnotic program which basically said "I'm the master." First he's nice, then in the next moment he becomes psychopathic mean. The kid's in shock and then during his brief moment of going into a (negative) dissociative state the music teacher quickly inserts that "master" program much in the same way a drill instructor will break down a new recruit so as to begin programming him to be a killer for the country. No difference in my opinion. But this guy is even worse. He's like a drill instructer but more like a psychopathic one. He wasn't acting consciously when he switched personalities from nice to mean, but he was acting that way because that's who he truly was, probably manic/psychotic or something along those lines. He just incorporated his mental disorder into his teaching methods.

Many years ago I trained and was taught by some pretty tough kickboxers some of whom you can say were pretty badarse, one of whom would sometimes even go out and stupidly get into street fights and take on several guys at a time but even as "tough" and crazy as he was he wasn't even close to the way that music teacher was when I'd train with him. When we would spar, even if it was very intense, he'd always show some restraint. I'd get stitches sometimes and even broken bones but this came from the results of the sparring and not because he really had the intent to hurt me (physically or psychologically). There was at a psychological level some compassion coming from him when these things happened (OK, maybe not much but it was there!). This guy however, at least from what I can see in the trailer, is coming from a place with no compassion whatsoever and if he was shown to be compassionate at some points in the movie it probably was just added to the story but was not a real reflection of who he was in real life. So that's my little review fwiw!
 
We watched it yesterday and I must say I found it brilliant on many levels. They don't seem to do films like that anymore.

**spoilers**

I liked the ambiguity of it all. It was not a simple good vs. evil plot with some grand simplistic "moral", like all those woke movies. So on the one hand, the instructor clearly is a sadistic sociopath. On the other hand, I found myself rooting for the kid to get over himself and try harder, and saw some value in the insane pressure he's subjected to.

People here have commented on how awful the instructor is, and for good reasons - he's an abuser. But interestingly, his "hyper-manly" drill-seargeant approach also leads to some good outcomes: the kid finally has enough courage to ask the girl out, he's finally able to stand up to his relatives, and so on. In some respects, all this harsh treatment has a positive effect.

What's interesting is that his father (his mother left long ago) is portrayed as a weakling and push-over, who hasn't achieved his goals, and who can't even stand up to his stupid relatives who ridicule him in front of everyone at the dinner table. He's also over-protective and motherly. So the kid hasn't got a good male role model, and he repeats these patterns. I think that's the reason why he "falls" for the instructor in the first place, and also for why there are some good effects of this.

It's an interesting dynamic, especially in light of all the wokeness these days. Of course sociopathic males like the instructor are not good role models. But there is another side to it: why do people fall for them? Why are they drawn to them? The movie implies that part of the reason is weak fathers. Stronger male role models could have taught the hero in the movie the kinds of things he does learn from the instructor, but better, and without the abuse.

Reminds me of the whole Tate brothers and Red Pill thing. Young men crave these kinds of "manly" role models, true authority figures who will push them to the limits. Who use some dirty language, and don't hide their masculinity. And no wonder this is effective in a world of safe spaces, talking about feelings constantly, walking on eggshells, fear of the slightest insult etc. But this also drives those guys into the hands of abusive sociopaths.

Great movie, great acting, and well done all around!
 
I remember a book that I read when I was a child. In it, a domestic dog ends up in a wild environment with other dogs. The dog must learn to survive in the new environment and what helps him to adapt is to learn from the experiences of the other dogs without suffering them directly. That difference makes you be prepared when the situation to overcome arrives. He gets over it because he learned before the other dogs.

This movie is something similar, you can learn a lot about "little tyrants" that can result in the destruction of the person or in the improvement of him.

Empathy with the character leads to learning how we would respond in similar situations.

It is a good movie and can teach from "outside" the choices that perhaps a person can make in extreme situations.
 
I saw this movie several years ago and my husband and I still talk about it as we each experienced it quite differently. My view being similar to others here and I thought the review Mrs Tigersoap posted was spot on also.

The difference I think arises from my awareness of how prevalent psychopathy is in this world and less so from my husband’s perspective. I found the movie deeply disturbing but fascinating as I was watching a feeding frenzy, two individuals cannibalising each other. The kid seems to be engaging in an exercise of self loathing and flagellation which totally distracts him from actually studying to develop his musicality.

My husband on the other hand thinks it’s an amazing portrayal of how adversity builds resilience and pushes someone to be better. We had lengthy discussions about this as I didn’t feel either of the main really made any ground at all.

There’s a heck of a lot of deeper levels of relationship dynamics, from a hyper-dimensionsal perspective, portrayed in this movie and I’m not sure all of it was intentionally included.
 
Essentially what’s going on between the main characters of this movie is the complete opposite to the activities that develops one’s cosmic antennae as presented by @luc in this new thread about Densities.

Edit: particularly in light of the review Mrs Tigersoap posted as it explains how the music the student is producing is technically advanced but has no soul. It lacks the broader aspect of human experience and conscious learning of connecting with a broader musical information field.
 
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