Acupuncture and Chinese medicine

[munaychasumaq]

I work as a server and acupuncture help me a lot to deal with back pain.For me it`s really awesome how it works.Sometimes the feeling is like to be in a meditative state.Thanks for sharing your knowledge.

 

[Seamus]

I was thinking of general questions. If you have questions like "will acupuncture or herbs help with X", then I'd be happy to give my opinion.

Do you have an opinion (or perhaps personal experience treating) on how well acupuncture or TCM works with symptoms of:

* Hypertension
* Tinnitus
* Itchy skin problems

In my experience acupuncture and/or Chinese herbs can help with hypertension (HTN). IMO hypertension is often caused by chronic stress and acupuncture can be quite effective at regulating the autonomic nervous system and normalizing stress response. Herbal medicine can also be quite effective at treating hypertension, there are a number of formulas that could be used depending on the patient's diagnosis. Long story short I think it is worth trying before going on anti-hypertensive drugs and its worth trying if someone wants to come off of the drugs as well.

In my experience, and from what I've heard, tinnitus is tricky to treat. If someone has both HTN and tinnitus they may be related, so sometimes getting the bloodpressure under control can help with the tinnitus. I know of some patients who told me that acupuncture "cured" their tinnitus and some on which it had no effect. I think its worth a try.

Itchy skin problems are also tricky to treat. IMO herbal medicine is probably more effective than acupuncture, but acupuncture might help in some cases. We saw a patient in one of my clinic rotations who had terrible psoriasis and got tremendous relief from an acupuncture technique called "seven star needling" and through diet change. He still had occasional outbreaks but after a year of off and on treatment he said he considered himself "cured" and said it "changed his life". One of my teachers specialized in treating skin conditions with topical herbal formulas and herbal decoctions taken orally and she seemed to get quite good results.

I do know that the body will heal itself if given the right stimulus. Unfortunately, most western doctors only want to suppress symptoms, NOT find the reason and try to cure. I remember once going to my doctor with a painful knee. He said, without any examination, "oh, that is tendonitis, I'll give you a prescription for the pain". When I asked about other options or possible therapy, he looked at me as if I had grown two heads. I took the RX, did not fill it and started taking turmeric (just the the spice I had in my kitchen). The inflammation and pain subsided.

Great job! There are definitely lazy doctors and lazy acupuncture practitioners out there... just because someone has a fancy degree it doesn't mean that they're a saint.

Traditional veterinarians are big on steroids for itchy dog skin of course, never wanting to find the cause of the problem. My 4 year old lab mix has had itchy skin since puppy hood. My most recent effort at trying to help her was with Chinese herbs, which have seemed to calmed the problem somewhat. There are no TCM veterinarians in the area, although I think there is one who does acupuncture. Most local vets in my area (middle of nowhere, Texas) don't want to know about anything other than vaccines and drugs.

Thanks for reading.

Yeah it seems steroids are the go-to for most skin conditions and they can help but I don't think they're safe to use long term. In TCM skin problems are often related to digestive issues, especially in the large intestine. If I were you I would experiment with her food a little, if you haven't already. Especially make sure her food doesn't have any corn in it, that's a common dog allergen. The lab my folks had for many years seemed to be prone to yeast infections in her ears, so if her food is clean and she still has issues I would try a probiotic like S Boulliardii. I imagine you may have already tried these things since you're here on the forum, but in case you haven't I hope this helps!

 

[Seamus]

I work as a server and acupuncture help me a lot to deal with back pain.For me it`s really awesome how it works.Sometimes the feeling is like to be in a meditative state.Thanks for sharing your knowledge.

Cool, thanks for sharing your experience! I know that meditative acupuncture state well :D I'm glad it helps with your back pain.

 

[SevenFeathers]

Thank you, Seamas, for your opinion on the symptoms I mentioned. I am thinking of trying acupuncture for my hypertension (the tinnitus came first actually). I had always had normal pressure until a few years ago when I started a sedentary, stressful job. I do not want to go on drugs, as I have read the side effects can be bad. I have brought it down quite a lot with herbal hawthorn berries and some other supplements. As for my sweet dog, I have tried almost everything except acupuncture. The Chinese herbs have helped a lot, along with some homeopathic remedies.

 

[JGeropoulas]

...
In my personal practice I've started using a lab that does hair tissue mineral analysis. They test for heavy metals and nutritional minerals and return a report that makes specific diet and nutritional recommendations. Minerals act as enzyme activators in the body and they have complicated interactions with each other (ie calcium and magnesium) and other nutrients (ie Vitamin D and Calcium). Personally I usually had trouble telling whether or not a supplement was helping me so I decided to try this test and the supplement protocol they recommended. It's helped me with several stubborn health problems and I've seen my heavy metal load decrease in the two retests I've taken since February without taking any chelators. Balancing different mineral ratios in the body activates the bodies enzymes and detoxification system to clear the heavy metals.

I like this lab because their protocol has worked well for me personally and their recommendations make my job easier. In my experience some chronic conditions (chronic fatigue, chronic migraines, chronic Lyme disease) can be quite resistant to treatment and I think this protocol can really help to balance the endocrine system and improve detoxification. That said I mostly rely on acupuncture and herbs at this point because I have the most experience with them and I can address specific symptoms faster. I decide what combination of treatments to use on a case by case basis.
...

Thanks for that informative post about de Morant. It answered a lot of questions I've had. I've been wanting to get some testing done to get some idea of my biochemistry after years of taking supplements recommended on this forum. How can I utilize that lab you mentioned that does hair tissue mineral analysis?

 

[Seamus]

Thanks for that informative post about de Morant. It answered a lot of questions I've had.

You're welcome :)

I've been wanting to get some testing done to get some idea of my biochemistry after years of taking supplements recommended on this forum. How can I utilize that lab you mentioned that does hair tissue mineral analysis?

There are a couple of possibilities I need to look into, I'll get back to you on that in the next few days.

 

[munaychasumaq]

Dear Seamas what is exactly a micro trauma in this context? What i understand about it, could be all this "bloody marks"after the copping and how painful is to move the day after? Could you be so kind to explain the process than involves this "micro trauma" in our body? And also i have a curiosity questions:Is Kombucha part of the Chines medicine and how beneficial o detrimental is it dealing with candida?

 

[flashgordonv]

Hi Seamus

Many thanks for taking the time to start and maintain this thread. The information presented to date has been clear and really interesting. Your efforts are greatly appreciated.

 

[JGeropoulas]

Dear Seamas what is exactly a micro trauma in this context? What i understand about it, could be all this "bloody marks"after the copping and how painful is to move the day after? Could you be so kind to explain the process than involves this "micro trauma" in our body? And also i have a curiosity questions:Is Kombucha part of the Chines medicine and how beneficial o detrimental is it dealing with candida?

My acupuncturist said the mechanical lifting of tissue accomplished by cupping stimulates the body in ways that parallel the effects of needling.

 

[Seamus]

Dear Seamas what is exactly a micro trauma in this context? What i understand about it, could be all this "bloody marks"after the copping and how painful is to move the day after? Could you be so kind to explain the process than involves this "micro trauma" in our body? And also i have a curiosity questions:Is Kombucha part of the Chines medicine and how beneficial o detrimental is it dealing with candida?

My acupuncturist said the mechanical lifting of tissue accomplished by cupping stimulates the body in ways that parallel the effects of needling.

Micro trauma in the context of acupuncture refers the small amount of damage done to the body by the acupuncture needle. There's some evidence that this stimulates the body's healing response. For example if someone has knee pain we might use 5-10 needles locally on acupuncture points around the effected knee and this theory supposes that the small injuries from the acupuncture needles around the knee calls the patient's body's attention to the knee. Does that make sense?

The marks from cupping come from stagnant blood and metabolites like lactic acid that are pulled from the muscles into the space between the muscles and the skin. It is often used on the back and shoulders because those postural muscles tend to hold alot of tension, which causes poor circulation and a buildup of cellular metabolites. Cupping releases this buildup and encourages circulation into the muscles. It is almost like a "therapeutic bruise" and it does stimulate the body's healing response, so it is similar to the effects of needling in that way. munaychasumaq if it is painful to move the next day you might be overdoing it a little bit...

Kombucha is not one of the "herbs" that we learn about in school and I don't know too much about it, but I do drink it on occasion. As to whether it is beneficial or detrimental for candida, I think it would depend on the case. FWIW, the beneficial probiotic yeast Saccharomyces boulardii has been shown in some studies to inhibit candida in mice and it can help to prevent travelers diarrhea and antibiotic induced diarrhea.

Hi Seamus

Many thanks for taking the time to start and maintain this thread. The information presented to date has been clear and really interesting. Your efforts are greatly appreciated.

I'm happy to be able to help the community out in this way, thanks for your feedback!

 

[Ina]

Hi Seamus,
Thank you for your explanations. Back in my late teens I was suffering from chronic headaches. Much of it was considered by the doctors as self importance and attention seeking until the doctor of a football team freshly specialised in Chinese medicine diagnosed my dysfunctional gallbladder and treated me for 5 days with acupuncture. The headaches subsided in one week after the treatment and never returned for 5 years. We lost contact and 10 years later after enough sufferance the poor organ was surgically removed after the removal of the appendix of course. Now all I am left to deal with is chronic inflamation, ‘IBS’ and depression and anxiety symptoms. From your previous posts, I feel encouraged to look for a Chinese doctor to restore my digestive functions as far as it is possible.

However, I feel even more encouraged to ask a silly question. Do you think that acupuncture treatment could work in restoring the function of pancreas islets? My husband contacted type I diabetes after a massive viral infection. He still produces insulin however not enough and and yet too little to be corrected by diet and lifestyle alone. So far the only available ‘cure’ is islets transplantation but that imho is far worse than insulin dependancy. Do you know of any cases of diabetes I treated with acupuncture?

Many thanks ,
Ina

 

[Seamus]

Hi Seamus,
Thank you for your explanations. Back in my late teens I was suffering from chronic headaches. Much of it was considered by the doctors as self importance and attention seeking until the doctor of a football team freshly specialised in Chinese medicine diagnosed my dysfunctional gallbladder and treated me for 5 days with acupuncture. The headaches subsided in one week after the treatment and never returned for 5 years. We lost contact and 10 years later after enough sufferance the poor organ was surgically removed after the removal of the appendix of course. Now all I am left to deal with is chronic inflamation, ‘IBS’ and depression and anxiety symptoms. From your previous posts, I feel encouraged to look for a Chinese doctor to restore my digestive functions as far as it is possible.

However, I feel even more encouraged to ask a silly question. Do you think that acupuncture treatment could work in restoring the function of pancreas islets? My husband contacted type I diabetes after a massive viral infection. He still produces insulin however not enough and and yet too little to be corrected by diet and lifestyle alone. So far the only available ‘cure’ is islets transplantation but that imho is far worse than insulin dependancy. Do you know of any cases of diabetes I treated with acupuncture?

Many thanks ,
Ina

Hi Ina,

I'm happy to hear that you got some relief from your headaches. I've had some success treating chronic digestive conditions and I think acupuncture and herbal medicine could help you with your remaining symptoms.

There are treatments for Type 1 diabetes in Chinese medicine, especially herbal treatments. I'm not aware of any studies suggesting that acupuncture or herbs can restore the function of the islets of Langerhans. There are a number of studies from China that suggest that herbal medicine may be able to manage the symptoms of the disease, so I definitely think that it could help. As far as I know herbal medicine would be more effective than acupuncture alone, so if you do seek treatment make sure that you find a good herbalist for him. If there is an acupuncture school in your area you could call them and ask for 2-3 referrals, then ask each one if they have experience treating diabetes. Make sure they know that his condition was triggered by a viral infection.

Good luck and keep us posted!

 

[munaychasumaq]

Dear Seamas what is exactly a micro trauma in this context? What i understand about it, could be all this "bloody marks"after the copping and how painful is to move the day after? Could you be so kind to explain the process than involves this "micro trauma" in our body? And also i have a curiosity questions:Is Kombucha part of the Chines medicine and how beneficial o detrimental is it dealing with candida?

My acupuncturist said the mechanical lifting of tissue accomplished by cupping stimulates the body in ways that parallel the effects of needling.

Micro trauma in the context of acupuncture refers the small amount of damage done to the body by the acupuncture needle. There's some evidence that this stimulates the body's healing response. For example if someone has knee pain we might use 5-10 needles locally on acupuncture points around the effected knee and this theory supposes that the small injuries from the acupuncture needles around the knee calls the patient's body's attention to the knee. Does that make sense?

The marks from cupping come from stagnant blood and metabolites like lactic acid that are pulled from the muscles into the space between the muscles and the skin. It is often used on the back and shoulders because those postural muscles tend to hold alot of tension, which causes poor circulation and a buildup of cellular metabolites. Cupping releases this buildup and encourages circulation into the muscles. It is almost like a "therapeutic bruise" and it does stimulate the body's healing response, so it is similar to the effects of needling in that way. munaychasumaq if it is painful to move the next day you might be overdoing it a little bit...

Kombucha is not one of the "herbs" that we learn about in school and I don't know too much about it, but I do drink it on occasion. As to whether it is beneficial or detrimental for candida, I think it would depend on the case. FWIW, the beneficial probiotic yeast Saccharomyces boulardii has been shown in some studies to inhibit candida in mice and it can help to prevent travelers diarrhea and antibiotic induced diarrhea.

Hi Seamus

Many thanks for taking the time to start and maintain this thread. The information presented to date has been clear and really interesting. Your efforts are greatly appreciated.

I'm happy to be able to help the community out in this way, thanks for your feedback!

Guauu! sounds to me as an apparent paradox.Our body already got a "trauma",but the needling does a small trauma and our smart and beautiful body stimulates its natural healing response Comes to my mind how the firemen fight the fire with using fire.


Thank you very much for your information Seamas and do not worry about the pain,the acupuncturist always have told me that is normal after the therapy.

 

[Galaxia2002]

Dear Seamas what is exactly a micro trauma in this context? What i understand about it, could be all this "bloody marks"after the copping and how painful is to move the day after? Could you be so kind to explain the process than involves this "micro trauma" in our body? And also i have a curiosity questions:Is Kombucha part of the Chines medicine and how beneficial o detrimental is it dealing with candida?

My acupuncturist said the mechanical lifting of tissue accomplished by cupping stimulates the body in ways that parallel the effects of needling.

Micro trauma in the context of acupuncture refers the small amount of damage done to the body by the acupuncture needle. There's some evidence that this stimulates the body's healing response. For example if someone has knee pain we might use 5-10 needles locally on acupuncture points around the effected knee and this theory supposes that the small injuries from the acupuncture needles around the knee calls the patient's body's attention to the knee. Does that make sense?

The marks from cupping come from stagnant blood and metabolites like lactic acid that are pulled from the muscles into the space between the muscles and the skin. It is often used on the back and shoulders because those postural muscles tend to hold alot of tension, which causes poor circulation and a buildup of cellular metabolites. Cupping releases this buildup and encourages circulation into the muscles. It is almost like a "therapeutic bruise" and it does stimulate the body's healing response, so it is similar to the effects of needling in that way. munaychasumaq if it is painful to move the next day you might be overdoing it a little bit...

Kombucha is not one of the "herbs" that we learn about in school and I don't know too much about it, but I do drink it on occasion. As to whether it is beneficial or detrimental for candida, I think it would depend on the case. FWIW, the beneficial probiotic yeast Saccharomyces boulardii has been shown in some studies to inhibit candida in mice and it can help to prevent travelers diarrhea and antibiotic induced diarrhea.

Hi Seamus

Many thanks for taking the time to start and maintain this thread. The information presented to date has been clear and really interesting. Your efforts are greatly appreciated.

I'm happy to be able to help the community out in this way, thanks for your feedback!

As for cupping it seems to be a mechanism related to endorphins and shock proteins, you may want to check this post :

https://cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php/topic,44298.msg737099.html#msg737099

 

[Seamus]

Guauu! sounds to me as an apparent paradox.Our body already got a "trauma",but the needling does a small trauma and our smart and beautiful body stimulates its natural healing response Comes to my mind how the firemen fight the fire with using fire.


Thank you very much for your information Seamas and do not worry about the pain,the acupuncturist always have told me that is normal after the therapy.

Some of these ideas can be difficult to get your mind around at fist, thats for sure. There are many ways of thinking in Chinese medicine that were "counter intuitive" for me when I first encountered them, I think partly because Chinese philosophy is quite different from Western, Cartesian thinking. The Chinese really embrace the idea of dualism, the idea that there can be two or more "correct answers" to a question or a problem. Something can be "both a and b, and more". This is especially true when we are trying to understand complex living systems and something like acupuncture or cupping.

As for cupping it seems to be a mechanism related to endorphins and shock proteins, you may want to check this post :

https://cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php/topic,44298.msg737099.html#msg737099

Thanks for sharing Galaxia2002. From reading through the articles you linked to it sounds like these "Heat Shock Proteins (HSP)" may play a role in the physiological response of the body to cupping. I noticed that the first article you linked to also linked HSP to HGH production in effected muslces"

HSP Stimulate HGH for Muscle Repair

Research has shown that when rats were exposed to intermittent heat sessions, they had a "robust" expression of heat shock proteins that was associated with 30 percent more muscle regrowth compared to a control group.6 The expression of HSPs persisted for up to 48 hours after the heat session and may actually lead to a higher expression of heat shock proteins even when you are not exercising. When you do exercise, heat acclimation may prompt an even greater release in HSPs than normal.7

"This is a great example of how a person can theoretically use hyper-thermic conditioning to increase their own heat shock proteins and thereby reap the rewards," including muscle growth and more, according to Dr. Rhonda Patrick.8 Human Growth Hormone (HGH) is the foundational biochemical that addresses allserious muscle loss and muscle repair. The bio thermal induced by the resonance effect of Infrared frequency will initiate the HSP response that will in turn trigger the HGH that the body produces to repair and build muscle. Exposure to heat has been shown to increase lifespan (by up to 15% percent) in flies and worms, a benefit that is attributed to HSPs.9 One particular HSP (the HSP70 gene) has also been associated with increased longevity, which suggests there may be anti-aging benefits to regular infrared heat stress.10

It may be that these proteins and the related HGH increase are also responsible for the positive effects of Moxabustion and the heat lamps that acupuncturists use. Its nice to know that some researchers have started to identify the physiological mechanisms behind the healing response created by cupping and other therapies, it helps to be able to reference scientific studies when speaking to MDs and skeptical patients.

When it comes down to it, as one of my teachers says, the body doesn't care what we call it as long as it works