Another question for young forum members--education

Neil

Dagobah Resident
FOTCM Member
This has been bugging me for a few days, and I wonder if all of you twenty-somethings out there have experience with it. Thanks in advance for your thoughts.

What are your experiences with the public education system in your area/country? More specifically, have you ever had the feeling that you learned a lot and know nothing? I know that is kinda contradictory, but it seems that they fill your head with data, data that is potentially useful but seems largely useless. Now we could get on a big spool with COINTELPRO and the NWO etc. but that's not really what I'm looking for. You see, I'm interested in Ark's work, but am nowhere close to being able to comprehend it. School used to be my primary focus in life, obsess over good grades, get to college, get the dream job and live a happy life, that cliche. Then, after I got wrapped up in Cassiopaea about a year ago, my lifestyle took a radical turn. I spend a good part of my day just reading stuff, and now, talking to people on this forum. The problem is, Cassiopaea accelerated me on this "life quest" which is leading who knows where, and school has become secondary, if not at times even insignificant. This has begun to show in my grades, as I seem to be constantly thinking about Cassiopaea and wanting to become better informed on this quantum future project. It feels like I'm finally learning about something important. The problem is, the "real world" considers this type of organization a bunch of malarkey. And it is really only important to my soul, and a few others who have joined the group. So my question is, have/are any of you ever had a problem of balancing your spiritual life while still trying to appear relatively normal in the real world and it's institutions? How did/are you dealing with it? How do you view education as a whole? Does it ever change, or do you change and work your way around it? With all of the STO teachings I've been trying to integrate, it's getting harder and harder to maintain the lie about who I am and what my beliefs are. It's even becoming dificult to justify why such a lie needs to be in place, except for the fact that the MCS tends to deal with people like me. It is also getting harder and harder to cope with controlled thought. So in essence, how do you stay intellectually respectable in the Control System, while pursuing your own freedom? Is it necessary to bust out of the MCS by suddenly rejecting it's precepts and drawing a lot of attention and ridicule, or is it possible and more beneficial to ease your way out?
 
Hi Neil,

I'm reading a book right now that you might enjoy. It's called "Dumbing Us Down: The Hidden Curriculum of Compulsory Education." Public education is a fraud and most probably a Pathocratic tool to keep people enslaved. I went to a Catholic High School, which wasn't much different than the public ones, except mine was known as a school for 'smart kids.' We were a 'nerd school,' basically.

I was like you (in fact I still am) in regards to working and grades. In high school I worked hard and kept my grades high. While in college I found the Cass site, and I started studying/practicing less and reading more. However, what I did do that I think is important is the following: I made a schedule. I made sure to divide my time between school work and School work.

I'm at a university now, but I see the same public school dynamic that you describe. There is no meaning. It is just facts, and scholars working away at arbitrary and meaningless projects. It's difficult to find a prof who isn't like the guy who only works out his upper body, leaving his legs spindly as pencils. They are all convinced that the 'way' to whatever is through strict use of intellectual capabilities. Their emotional centers are almost completely atrophied and they have no clue.

However, I find that it helps to stay 'in the system'. Where else are you going to go at 17? What are your options? Personally, I try to hone my critical thinking and practice having a strategic enclosure while in such an environment. So I don't think it's necessary to "bust out", but to strive to be "in the world but not of it." If we cannot endure living 'in' the world (of education, for example), how can we expect to survive if the neocons' fascism becomes totally open?
 
I want to add another book by the same author, John Taylor Gatto, for your consideration. It is called 'The Underground History of American Education', you can read it right at his website, http://johntaylorgatto.com/chapters/index.htm

The feeling you describe is very familiar to me. I grew up in Russia and went to school there. The environment there was very much oriented towards academic achievement. This was especially apparent in my town, since a it was a home to a major university. I remember being inundated with useless information, to the point that it was literally choking me, without leaving me any time to think or room to breath. The social conditioning was done in an authoritative and fear-based way. This ended up being somewhat of a saving grace -- since it was so obvious, it was easier to see and tune out, although the lies told really warped one's mind at times.

It is my impression that here in the States formal academic achievement is emphasized less, although the tide is turning now a bit, with people hiring tutors to prepare their kids for kindergarten in a public school (!). The social programming, however, is far more subtle and successful. What better way is there to enslave people than to imprint in their minds that they are free? What I am observing is a certain innocence or ignorance in kids that I knew I at their age already didn't have. Like I knew, from I don't know where, that there are topics you thread very carefully around, things are not what they seem, and in general people aren't to be completely trusted.

By the time my schooling was nearing to completion, I was burned out academically and depressed by the lack of the apparent purpose of it all, while my instincts were going haywire picking up danger at every corner. Not the best place to make decisions out of, for sure.

Now that I have been reading and studying the Cassiopaean material and participating in the group work for a while, I feel that my capacity for formal academic learning had increased dramatically. I have more discipline and concentration, and had lost a lot of the mental and emotional trash I was hauling around -- though there is still plenty there, for sure. :)

I now look back at my education and weep bitterly, that I have wasted so much precious time on emotional rollercoasters and pursuits of checkmarks in my transcript book -- while I could have actually been LEARNING something. I can see areas where my education is lacking, and very much wish that I could spend days and weeks in solitude, reading all the books on history, philosophy, psychology, medicine, music, etc, that I want to read. I would also have liked to go back to school, where I could map my own course of study and work towards it.

Of course now that I have two young children and homeschool them, it is not really possible. My own reading, writing ands studying is done at the expense of daily responsbilities or, more often, sleep. And yet, homeschooling and family life is a great journey, which I can write about forever -- but that would be off-topic.

Bottom line is, you are at the point in your life when you are at the height of your mental capacity, AND you are by yourself, you aren't (yet) expected to fully support yourself, AND you are not (yet) responsible for other human beings. I can't imagine a better time to go to school and a better chance to make it a meaningful experience. Your next lessons are probably already lined up for you and will fall on your head only too quickly.

IMO it might be better for you for now to stay put and practice your self-discipline and critical thinking, as has been suggested. While at that, you might want to think about what education means to you, what going to college means to you, and what you want to do after all that. Try searching the net for 'unjobbing', 'Teenage Liberation Handbook', and essays by Alphie Kohn for some ideas, including those on 'easing your way out' of the system.

I understand what you mean by a challenge of 'appearing normal'. This is something that is not directly related to school, you'll have to do it everywhere and at all times. If anything, school and college IMO give more leeway to 'weirdness' than the big mean corporate world :) Again, a great place and time to practice being 'wise as a serpent, gentle as a dove' -- and perhaps a good place to find like-minded people and build networks, all in good time.

When I just started here, I had a feeling that I am asleep all day and only wake up in the evening, when my husband comes home from work and when I can put kids to bed and go on the computer. Only then did I feel like myself. I was very frustrated by that. I felt cheated by life that I am not being unconditionally accepted by the people around me. Well ... too bad, no one owes me that. But I think the frustration began to subside only when I grew into the Work more, and began to see more of the 'Terror of the Situation', in an abstract way and in my own life experiences. Then, 'appearing normal' became something with a definite purpose -- to advance the Work, and not simply to stay safe from MCS.

Thank you for listening, and good luck!
 
Thanks for your input. Hkoehli, I'm not sure what I would do if the fascists took over. It really depends on how powerful they were. If they were the omnipresent control nightmare, my options may very well be limited to activities that would result in my prompt diestruction. If there was still hope, they still had their imperfections, I guess I would do as I have always done, be quiet and submissive in my interactions with others, while being rebellious and inquisitive on the inside. While my parents are suspicious of what my beliefs are and are a bit offput by my nature, they wouldn't disown me if I stood on the livingroom floor and told them what I've really been up to for the last 2 years, but I see I must always live a cautious distance from just about everyone, it is the path I chose, and I have decided to follow it.

Freetrinity, your advice was very helpful, and I have begun reading the book you suggested. Part of this whole battle has been figuring out how to use the MCS against itself. I see that I must stay the course, that it is possible to be part of the system and break down its power over you at the same time. Yes, appearing normal is the most dificult. It has only been useful for shielding myself from the MCS, but people might be afraid of who you were if they knew the truth. Some people here seem to have pretty astounding abilities, and you could easily harm them if you slapped them in the face with esoterica. So, I believe appearing normal can protect people as well. I must agree with your part about only being able to feel yourself when you are on the computer. It is how I feel now, this is the only place where I can find solace. Sometimes it is all that keeps me going, knowing there are others out there, that there is something worth fighting for besides myself. But I believe there are still more that haven't found groups like Cassiopaea, and never will, but they have the same feelings we do. And I hope that by fulfilling our respective destinies, we can all some day come together as a complete unit, and is oftentimes seems that this is why I must go on.
 
hkoehli said:
Public education is a fraud and most probably a Pathocratic tool to keep people enslaved.
I agree with Harrison here 100 %. To me public education in North America is ludicrous. My initial thought to your query was the song Off the Wall by Pink Floyd.

We don't need no education,
We don't need no thought control.
No dark sarcasm in the classroom.
Teacher leave them kids alone.
All in all you're just another brick in the wall.
I came to Canada from Iran in grade 5. So I knew a different kind of education. In Iran, it was an extremely difficult period of learning especially for a child but no matter what, the kids were always friends with each other. When I came to Canada all I saw was divide and conquer. All the kids were each others enemies, and they all even had labels for themselves, ie. Jocks, popular kids, nerds, Goths, etc... I find that amongst many other things to be one of the most obvious psychopathic techniques of the MCS. I read somewhere a while back that if you are a live by the end of North American high school, you can survive ANYTHING, because the kids literally act as vultures to each other.

Anyway to make a long story short, my point of view of school was SOOO much disgust that I dropped out, went back and dropped out again because I just could not find one good reason to be in school. Everything they taught you was a lie, from history and math to arts and crafts.

So I had enough! I decided if I was going to be educated there is other ways. The whole point is to educate your self right? And in this day and age you have a world library right in your own very home. The internet! So I started to educate myself. Yes, I don't get a degree, but I still know the same amount if not more than the person who got a degree. And also, my energy is not sucked away everyday by different people and incidences because I'm just not in a position to be fed on anymore.

I think dropping out of school was the best decision I ever made. This of course may not be the case for everyone, and they may even laugh when they read my post but it is true. I am happy that I am not getting brainwashed. And I see, I see people (my friends) who finished high school and went to College and that they are not the same people I knew before they went to school (college). School changes people, and not for good either. It gives them more ego, and pride.

And of course there is another tool the MCS uses to trap you and suck you of your energy, student loan. I am one of my only friends who is not indebted to the government for their education.

Again, this is all my point of view and I am not suggesting that you or anyone should drop out of school; I am simply presenting you with a different way/choice/picture.

Public education? They can keep it!

Thanks
Nina
 
Hello Neil,

I want to tell you that probably many people here share your problems. I for example find it extremly difficult to focus on work. The fact that almost all my life now is centered around my computer and internet isn't making it any easier. I work at the computer, read the news, learn, have fun and communicate with people - all in one place, one room, almost 18 hours a day. Only recently I restored some balance between reading Cass material, interacting at SOTT forum and earning money, but I almost took it to the edge (unpaid rent, empty refrigerator, etc) so I hadn't any other choice anyway. So, watch out and try not to get close to such extremes.

You would be wise not to attract too much attention, at least for now. When people around you start asking questions regarding your "strange" behavior and you are not carefull with your answers things may get difficult.

Once, tired with all my so called friends I've sent them text message that I'm off to another matters now and I don't desire to hang out with them anymore. Reaction outgrown my wildest expectations and in one moment I saw all of them without their social masks. The amount of hatred my message has triggered was stunning. That obviously wasn't the way to do it, so I revoked my statement and turned it into bad joke. I found another solution - after some time I informed all of them (one after another) that I'm tired and bored with so called clubbing, loud music, smoking tons of cigarettes and drinking barrels of beer. I told them that I'd love to hang out with them, but on an individual manner - two, three persons at one time, in some fine, calm environment, when we can talk without disturbance and all those games that people play when gathered in large number.
And that worked miracles :D I'm not bothered anymore. I meet those people from time to time, exchange some casual chit-chat and keep my mouth shut about what I'm really doing in my free time. Although I feel lonely sometimes I think that where is the place for new acquaintances, they will emerge eventually.
For now, forum members are my only family.

Regarding maintaining some respect within the control system - there is one simple option for everyone. No matter where you are and what you do, there is something you have to do - to take part in some exchange which guarantees your basic needs - shelter, clothing and food. This area provides you with an opportunity to keep some contacts, appear "normal" and take part in social life. I just do my job the best I can and that's it. People I cooperate with expect me to stick to schedules and provide quality service - in exchange they pay me money. So basically what I get from it is some recognition among my customers and people from my profession, a lot of satisfaction, bread on the table and..no questions asked ;)
Of course, in your case it's a bit different, at least for now, when you are in school, but keep in mind that there always have been some outsiders in every community and you just can be one of them. Stick to the rule of minimum engagement, stay away from trouble and be smart. It isn't time for reckless bravado - for any of us.

p.s. You might find some additional useful info in this thread: http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=1470&p=1
 
INDEPENDENT SCHOOL
Winter 2002-03
How Not to Get Into College
The Preoccupation with Preparation
By Alfie Kohn
Education...is a process of living and not a preparation for future living.
-- John Dewey
In 1981, while I was teaching at an independent school, this journal published my very first article about education. It was an ironic commentary, perhaps a tad short on subtlety, entitled "How to Make the Least of Your College Years," and it consisted of ten rules that had already "helped literally millions of students successfully avoid meaningful learning experiences." Among them:
Let grades control your life. All decisions about how to spend your time and plan your academic schedule should be arrived at with grades in mind. Anything that increases the probability of an A is time well spent; conversely, anything that distracts your attention from boosting a grade is time wasted. . . .
Most important of all, always think in terms of "product." . . . If an activity most likely will not lead to a tangible reward...you're better off without it. Under no circumstances should you allow yourself to enjoy something for its own sake.
These bits of paradoxical advice were intended to satirize something that I continue to write about, more than two decades letter. Now, however, the sensibility in question shows up long before students even get to college. Indeed, teenagers are making the least of their high school years in large part because of their desperate attempts to get into college.
There's another respect in which my article might need updating. It seemed to imply that students simply choose to act this way and ought to wise up. In effect, I was blaming the victims rather than looking at the systemic factors that turned them into grade grubbers: pressure from teachers and parents, broader social forces, and the existence of grades themselves. The students' behavior may even be an indirect result of well-meaning articles advising educators how to be more effective at preparing each student to triumph over his or her peers and get into the most selective colleges. Such advice distracts us from the terrible costs of that process, particularly when it eclipses other values and goals. Take a step back from discussions about the relative benefits of SAT I and SAT II, or the effects of early admission, or other aspects of the search for more efficient methods for grooming students' transcripts, and ask the deeper, more subversive question: What are we doing to our students in the name of college prep?
*


A friend of mine who counsels high schoolers in Florida once told me about a client of his who had amazing grades and board scores. It remained only to knock out a dazzling essay on his college applications that would clinch the sale. "Why don't we start with some books that had an impact on you," suggested the counselor. "Tell me about something you've read for pleasure - not for an assignment." A painful silence followed. There were no books to be listed; the very concept of reading for pleasure was unfamiliar to this stellar student.
A number of years ago, I wrote about an experience I had while addressing the entire student body and faculty of one of the country's most elite prep schools. I spoke, by coincidence, during the cruelest week in April, when the seniors were receiving their college acceptances and rejections. I talked to them about the implications of the race they had joined. For many of these teenagers, it was no longer necessary for parents to stand behind them with a carrot or a stick: each had come to internalize this quest and see his or her childhood as one long period of getting ready. They were joining clubs without enthusiasm because they thought membership would look impressive. They were ignoring - or perhaps, by now, even forgetting - what they enjoyed doing. They were asking teachers, "Do we need to know this?" and grimly trying to squeeze out another few points on the G.P.A. or the SAT, in the process losing sleep, losing friends, losing perspective. Many of them may have been desperately unhappy, filled with anxiety and self-doubt. Some of them may have had eating disorders, substance abuse problems, even suicidal thoughts. They might have gone into therapy except they had no spare time.*
None of this was a secret to these students, but what few realized was that the process wouldn't end once they finally got to college. This straining toward the future, this poisonous assumption that the value of everything is solely a function of its contribution to something that may come later -- it would start all over again in September of their first year away from home. They'd scan the catalogue for college courses that promised easy A's, sign up for new extracurriculars to round out their resumes, and react with gratitude (rather than outrage) when a professor told them exactly what they would have to know for the exam so they could ignore everything else. They'd define themselves as pre-med, pre-law, pre-business -- the prefix pre- signifying that nothing they were doing had any intrinsic significance.
Nor would this mode of existence end at college graduation. The horizon never comes any closer. They would have to struggle for the next set of rewards in order to snag the best residencies, the choicest clerkships, the fast-track positions in the corporate world. Then would follow the most prestigious appointments, partnerships, vice-presidencies, and so on, working harder, nose stuck into the future, ever more frantic. . . until, perhaps, they might wake up one night in a tastefully appointed bedroom to discover that their lives were mostly gone.
And those are just the successful students.
These are the sorts of things I said to this prep school audience, sweating profusely by now and sounding, I began to fear, like a TV evangelist. But I felt I also needed to offer a message for the teachers and any parents who were present. If you know from experience what I'm talking about, I said, then your job is to tell these kids what you know and help them understand the costs of this pursuit - rather than propelling them along faster. They need a cautionary view about what is threatening to take over their lives far more than they need another tip about how to burnish a college application or another reminder about the importance of a test.
When I finally finished speaking, I looked into the audience and saw a well-dressed boy of about 16 signaling me from the balcony. "You're telling us not to just get in a race for the traditional rewards," he said. "But what else is there?"
It takes a lot to render me speechless, but I stood on that stage clutching my microphone for a few moments and just stared. This was probably the most depressing question I have ever been asked. This young man was, I guessed, enviably successful by conventional standards, headed for even greater glories, and there was a large hole where his soul should have been. It was not a question to be answered (although I fumbled my way through a response) so much as an indictment of college prep and the resulting attenuation of values that was far more scathing than any argument I could have offered.
*


When I conduct a workshop for educators, I like to begin by asking these questions: What are your long-term goals for your students? How would you like them to turn out? What word or phrase best describes what you want them to be like after they've left your school? The answers that come back are strikingly similar, regardless of whether they come from parents or teachers, regardless of whether the students in question are toddlers or teenagers, and regardless of the community's demographics. People usually say they want their kids to end up happy and fulfilled, ethical and decent, successful and productive, independent and self-reliant but also caring and compassionate - and (to continue the alliteration) confident, curious, creative, critical thinkers, and good communicators. Also, someone invariably expresses the hope that students will always keep learning and wanting to learn.
The reason I mention this - and the reason I urge readers to consider (with their colleagues) how they might answer the same question - is that such reflection has the potential to challenge our practices. Never mind thought-provoking; it can be change-provoking. Of course, some people might say their long-term goals begin and end with getting students ready for, and into, high-status colleges; this may well be the raison d'être of their school. In such a case, we must concede that the means match the end. But I'm concerned with the far greater number of teachers and schools that say they are committed to other objectives, such as those listed above, but act as if all they cared about was college prep.
With such a tension between goal and practice, something has to give. Inconveniently, there are only two possibilities. Either: the objectives are pushed to the side, regarded as a pleasant-sounding but functionally irrelevant ideal confined to mission statements and P.R. materials. ("It's not really that important to us whether our students are happy, ethical, reflective lifelong learners, but we'll keep that rhetoric in the admissions brochure because it sounds reassuring.") Or: the goals really do matter, in which case the preoccupation with preparation has to be seriously reexamined.
Immediately comes the objection: It's not our fault! Some of our students' parents would have hired fetal tutors if they'd thought that could improve their Apgar scores. Some of them have dedicated their lives to preparing their children for Harvard (a process I've come to call "Preparation H"). Some pursue this agenda with the best of intentions, and some are mostly concerned to derive a vicarious sense of triumph from the success of their offspring, to trump their friends when the talk turns to whose kids made good. What are we supposed to do, given pressure from parents who seem to care less about their children's well-being than about their SAT scores and the thickness of the envelopes that arrive senior year from Cambridge, New Haven, and Providence?
Do some people think like this? You bet. Some people also judge individuals by the size of their houses, or nations by the size of their armies. Since when is that a reason for us to do likewise - or to become enablers of their warped values?
What's more, while the faculty blames the parents, there are also plenty of parents blaming the schools with equal passion. ("We try to keep things in perspective for our daughter, but it feels like a losing battle because the school culture is so steeped in grades and scores and admissions.") The only thing teachers and parents can agree on, it seems, is that they are both utterly helpless, caught in the grip of colleges. The colleges, meanwhile - or at least many of their professors - blame the K-12 educational system that deposits eighteen-year-olds in their classrooms whose interest in learning has already evaporated. Fingers are pointed in all directions, understandably in each case, but the upshot is that none of the parties takes responsibility for trying to restore a measure of sanity.
People who work in schools have a responsibility for leading, not only following. Pressure from college admission offices notwithstanding, educators are not being forced at gunpoint to make college preparation the overriding priority in adolescents' lives. Pressure from families notwithstanding, educators have an opportunity to educate parents, not only children. Of course, we can also learn from them, and we must be respectful of their concerns and beliefs; finding a balance here is an art and sometimes an agony. But part of our job is to help students and parents understand that the difference between acceptance to a moderately elite college and acceptance to an extremely elite college does not justify sacrificing everything (health, happiness, friends, love of learning) in a desperate effort to gain access to the latter.
What happens when college preparation takes over the upper school, squeezing out other purposes? Pre-K-to-12 schools become increasingly traditional as the students get older, with more rating and ranking and a curriculum that is more predefined and less driven by students' interests. But don't adolescents need and deserve student-centered instruction as much as younger children do? And, if so, is it impossible to change what we're doing, or merely difficult?
Even those unwilling to question the emphasis on college preparation ought to realize that this goal may not require all that is currently done in its name. Take the SATs. (I resist the temptation to add, "...please!") Those scores often count for less with admissions committees than we think, suggesting an opportunity to rethink those time-consuming, stress-inducing, money-wasting coaching sessions designed to teach tricks for raising scores on a bad test. In fact, about 400 colleges and universities, including Bates, Bowdoin, and Mount Holyoke, have stopped requiring the SAT (or ACT) altogether. (For more information, go to the appropriate page on Fairtest's website.)
What else can we dispense with? As Fieldston and other schools have discovered, students get into terrific colleges without Advanced Placement courses, and that provides an opening for us to think about whether we really need them. The fact that a course is difficult does not mean it is worthwhile. (Indeed, the confusion of harder with better helps to explain an awful lot of what is wrong with the "raise the bar" mindset that currently dominates school reform.) Some courses merely accelerate the worst forms of lecture-based, textbook-driven pedagogy: they have high standards but little room for deep thinking. A.P. courses allow the College Board to determine our curriculum. By virtue of the fact that they are geared to an exam, they are typically more about covering (material) than discovering (ideas).
The list goes on. Schools don't have to give out awards or otherwise create artificial scarcity. Learning doesn't have to be turned into a quest for triumph, and students don't have to be made to regard their peers as rivals. In fact, there's good reason to think that students truly flourish, intellectually and otherwise, in schools that are less (or even entirely non-) competitive, those that feel more like a caring community than like a rat race. Query: What policies in your school might contribute to an adversarial mindset that could be changed without costing a single student a single college acceptance?
Class rank is one answer that comes to mind. True, plenty of admissions committees seem to be looking for winners rather than learners. But relatively few colleges actually insist on this practice. When a survey by the National Association of Secondary School Principals asked 1,100 admissions officers what would happen if a high school stopped computing class rank, only 0.5 percent said the school's applicants would not be considered for admission, and four out of five colleges said it would have absolutely no bearing on students' prospects.
The next step is to look at grades themselves, and especially pressures to raise them, which likewise may be based on false assumptions (see SIDEBAR: "Grade Expectations"). Some schools have eliminated grades entirely - all the way through the upper school - as a critical step to raising intellectual standards, and they have done so without jeopardizing their graduates' chances of getting into selective private colleges or large public universities. To find out what it means to shift the balance of a school from grade-oriented to learning-oriented - and, yes, research does confirm that these tend to pull in opposite directions -- speak to the folks at the Poughkeepsie Day School (New York), the Carolina Friends School (North Carolina), the Waring School (Massachusetts), Saint Ann's School (New York), or other schools that offer thoughtful assessments of students' accomplishments without traditional letter or number grades.
The preceding paragraphs make a relatively nonthreatening argument: Even if preparation for college is paramount, it's still possible to phase out some of the most egregious school practices. Students may even be better prepared for college as a result of an education that isn't defined by tests, grades, competition, and the like. But in the final analysis we must concede the possibility that there will occasionally be a trade-off. In some instances, the most efficient way of getting into certain colleges may be to do dubious things, and, conversely, the activities most conducive to intellectual, social, and moral development may not give them an edge with an admissions committee. What then? What matters most? Here we return to the place we began, to a question that defines who we are as educators.
* If this portrait seems too dark or melodramatic, consider that it is now corroborated by empirical research as well as anecdotal evidence. Affluent, suburban teenagers exhibit higher rates of substance abuse and anxiety than their counterparts in the inner city. A brand-new report entitled "Privileged but Pressured? A Study of Affluent Youth," published in the academic journal Child Development this past fall [2002], confirms the prevalence of drinking (especially among boys) and depression (especially among girls) among wealthy middle school students. The researchers explicitly link these symptoms to the pressure these kids are already feeling to get into college. Moreover, seventh graders who reported that their parents place a lot of emphasis on academic achievement were considerably more likely (as compared to those whose parents were more concerned about their children's well-being) to show signs of distress and "maladaptive perfectionism."

[SIDEBAR]
Grade Expectations: Examining a Chain of Assumptions
(Adapted from The Schools Our Children Deserve: Moving Beyond Traditional Classrooms and "Tougher Standards" (Boston: Houghton Mifflin, 1999), pp. 188-89.)
To read the available research on grading is to notice three robust findings: students who are given grades, or for whom grades are made particularly salient, tend to (1) display less interest in what they are doing, (2) fare worse on meaningful measures of learning, and (3) avoid more difficult tasks when given the opportunity - as compared with those in a nongraded comparison group. Whether we are concerned about love of learning, quality of thinking, of preference for challenge, students lucky enough to attend schools that do not give letter or number grades fare better. Where grades are still given, students benefit from a concerted effort to make them as invisible as possible. The more they can forget about grades, the better the chances they will be engaged with ideas. (For more details about all this research, see The Schools Our Children Deserve, or the article "From Degrading to De-Grading.")
Still, some may fear that students will be unsuccessful in life if they haven't been graded or if those grades aren't impressive. After all, most people - notably admissions officers and employers - care about those marks regardless of how useless or destructive they may be. There is some validity to this concern, but perhaps less than is normally assumed. In fact, the argument rests upon a chain of assumptions that is only as legitimate as its weakest link.
1. Does encouraging students to get good grades make them share that concern? It depends. Heavy-handed techniques, such as public recognition or other rewards for good grades, may lead kids to feel resentful and to try to reclaim a sense of autonomy by staging a quiet rebellion. The harder you press, the more they resist. One study, by Adele Gottfried and her colleagues, found that parents who push their children to get good grades cause them to be less interested in what they're learning, which, in turn, appears to have negative effects on later school achievement.
2. Assume a student comes to share her parents' or teachers' concern about getting good grades. Does that actually produce good grades? Often, but not always. Some stressed-out grade-grubbers end up undercutting their own effectiveness, while some students who are able to take pleasure in learning wind up with good grades that they weren't directly chasing.*
3. Assume a student does get good grades. Does that translate into acceptance by a good college? Below high school, grades are essentially irrelevant to college admission. (Of course, one could argue that making students work for A's at age seven will create a habit that will be firmly in place by age seventeen - and more's the pity if that's true.) But while colleges obviously look at high school grades, that is not the only thing they care about, nor does a high G.P.A. guarantee admission to the most selective institutions. Ivy League schools, for example, typically reject most of the high school valedictorians - and, incidentally, most of the students with perfect or near-perfect SAT scores - who apply. That's worth thinking about in advance: if acceptance to such a college is the sole reason for sacrificing everything else in high school in order to get straight A's, then what happens if it doesn't work? Of course, we're talking here about the most elite colleges, but that fact cuts both ways: at least half of American institutions of higher education accept just about everyone who applies, so again one wonders about the wisdom of devoting one's early years to a costly, nonstop effort to get better grades.
4. Does getting into a good college ensure financial success? While there is undoubtedly a correlation between the two, that doesn't mean the first causes the second. It may be that certain factors associated with one (such as family income) also happen to be associated with the other. If that's true, then admission to the school of one's choice (or one's parent's choice) may be neither necessary nor sufficient for financial well-being. People without the usual credentials, but possessed of determination and a genuine love for what they're doing, often manage quite well in material terms, while people with superlative credentials may be summarily sacked. (Tough economic times make many nervous parents push their kids even harder to get good grades - and, in effect, to see education as little more than a credentialing ritual. But if the conventional approach offers no guarantees, perhaps we should respond instead by questioning basic assumptions about the purpose of school and the role of grades.)
5. Finally, we shouldn't forget to ask whether economic success is the same as, or even positively related to, fulfillment or psychological well-being. The degree to which one spends one's life in pursuit of material gain reflects one's basic values. However, researchers have found that the more people are driven by a desire to be wealthy, the poorer their mental health tends to be on a range of measures. (I reviewed this evidence in "In Pursuit of Affluence, at a High Price," New York Times, February 2, 1999.)
In short, the more we're apt to take for granted that it's good to emphasize grades so students will be successful, the more important it is to probe each step in the argument. If there is reason to doubt any of these connections, the ostensible advantage of focusing attention on getting A's - or a school's decision to give grades in the first place -- may be outweighed by the demonstrated harms of doing so.
* The study of affluent middle-school students mentioned in the footnote in the main text found that "a disproportionate emphasis on children's achievement, not uncommon in upwardly mobile, suburban communities, not only has the potential to engender distress among children but also has real constraints in terms of the capacity to generate the successes so pervasively exhorted." Specifically, the researchers found that students whose parents especially valued academic achievement were less likely than their peers to score high on teacher ratings of academic competence
Copyright © 2002 by Alfie Kohn. This article may be downloaded, reproduced, and distributed without permission as long as each copy includes this notice along with citation information (i.e., name of the periodical in which it originally appeared, date of publication, and author's name). Permission must be obtained in order to reprint this article in a published work or in order to offer it for sale in any form. Please write to the address indicated on the Contact Us page.
 
Well, I was just going to go to bed, but no, my mind was at it again - thinking and rethinking. I was faced with this internal problem today - about formal education. I was going to post a new topic but doing a search I saw Neil has already started such a discussion. Let me add to it :)
Here's my situation: I start my first semester of my second year of college in less than a week, and it was in this past summer that I have consciously 'woken up' to the objective reality... and I have been reading so much, and expanding my mind, and then reading some more. I have come to the conclusion (like many of you here) that formal education is the anti-thesis of what I am learning here, by myself, and I can actually FEEL this knowledge CHANGE me!
I have ALWAYS in the past been big on school... graduated Valedictorian, straight A student until the present. Not that school has been 'hard' but I was really interested in what I was learning. Now - what's the point? I have this wealth of knowledge that I have just STARTED to dig into and another semester of 'brainwashing' is starting in less than a week! As soon as I posed this question to myself, I kind of got a response... and I want to know what you all think:
Being open-minded, I have never really believed everything I read/heard... I picked and chose concepts that 'felt' real and true and then applied them to my working knowledge - it is what I did with religion, the news, and, now, I realized that this is what I have been doing with formal education all this time! Of course, for tests, I would put the answers the teacher/professor wanted down on paper to get my A... So, I guess what I am getting at is this: If I keep an open-minded, OBJECTIVE outlook, being very careful, of course, my 'enlightened self' CAN, indeed, survive in the MCS of formal education. This is how we learn to really live day-by-day while keeping off the radar.
Strangely, I just read the part in Laura's book SecretHistory that says that even disinformation carries 'a fuzziness of truth' to attract the curious (this is repeated in the Cass material as well). Why not practice the 'weeding out' process in formal education... cheat the system in my own way, so to say? If I am consciously doing this, am I not, in a way, protecting myself from the lies?
Thinking back, it is really in my first year of college that I began to see things differently, as I kind of explained in my "McFeudalization" post in the Bloggers Blog section. There I explain how I read many sources, connected ideas that seemed to be true, and wrote a paper on the 'big picture' that, subconsciously at the time, put me on the right path... a path that led to the Cassiopaea web site and these forums.
And here's another thing: While keeping an objective point-of-view and learning the things the higher education teaches me, I can learn MUCH about how other people and the PTB are thinking. I can learn the bells and whistles of, say, economics and sociology (my minors), and perhaps sometime in the possibly bleak future this knowledge will serve a purpose of greater good, especially if it is to deceive the MCS and the PTB with their own disinformation? As long as I don't FALL for this stuff and actually believe it (but have a working knowledge of it), it can, IMO, serve a meaningful purpose. To have knowledge of both mind-sets (the subjective and objective realities), and the ideas behind them, could be beneficial in the future...
... or maybe this whole idea is just wishful thinking?
 
Neil,


Here are a couple of things off the top of my head after reading your posts.
I grew up and was educated in Florida. My mentor in History was fired because of his 'unusual' teaching techniques. Too much talk of the flow of human ideas and too little empahsis on regurgitating dates. It was the beginning of the end for me. He invited me to his house the day he was fired. I told him I wanted to continue studying history, the way he taught it.
"Get out of university then." he replied.
I took his advice and left. I also read everything I could get my hands on. I saved myself enormous amounts of debt and instead took an active participation in my life. The first thing I did was GET THE HELL OUT OF FLORIDA. You'll find much more interesting and like minded people in a place like San Francisco or Denmark than in Bush Land. Florida is the perfect trap, it is bulldozed swam and pretty palm trees on top.
You also need to understand that if you are going to be awake, then you are going to be constantly combating dark forces. You are up against incredible odds, my friend, as we all are. The closer you get to the truth, the more in danger you are. A clear analysis of your strengths and weaknesses is vital. Balance your life. If you do too much of one thing and not the other (like not taking care of your personal life.) you are inviting a portal of attack.
I go back to Florida now and again. Each time, I am AMAZED at how zombie like everyone around me it. It's not thier fault. The entire culture is anesthesized. The place is FLAT, so all those lovely cell phone towers have no mountains to be disrupted by. The place is poison. If your old enough to leave your home, then do so as soon as you can. Cut the cord from your parents and go on an adventure. When you move around, you are harder to pin down. The second you decide to leave, you will feel this rush of emotions and energy. That is the chessboard your soul complex realigning, rebalancing. That is STS forces turning up the dial on your current belief system, making it harder for you so see past it.
The path I suggest is not 'safe' per say, and it will challenge you. It is only through challenges that we grow strong enough to see lies and it is only by changing perspective that we see the perspective that is limiting us.
Another thing I must add is to cut the elitism. It's a form of attack to think that knowone has anything for you to learn, that you are a lone man who knowone understands. I did this for years, and all I did was destroy my emotions with lonliness. I say adopt a Hunter Thompson attitude, shake people and places up. Develop the confidence to be who and what you are. If people don't like it, go somewhere else. If you don't like people, then go live on a mountain top.
I for one am very active socially these days. It is an amaziing arena. One can loose oneself in a maze of confussion for weeks. But when you work your way out of it, you are energized. I can say that if you look hard enough, you will find people who are interesting, awake, and can offer a perspective that YOU can learn from. People will be attracted to you and they know know why. Others will hate you and not know why. You will start to see thier true natures and it will be easier to spot the 'sparks' of interest. See yourself as a front man for individuality and openess. Your not alone, your here to learn how to be TOGETHER with people, which is what STO is all about. How to share experiences without feeding off eachother. How to be OPEN.
Ok, I'll leave it at that....
 
Neil said:
You see, I'm interested in Ark's work, but am nowhere close to being able to comprehend it.
All depends on the level of understanding that you are aiming at. Sometimes I do not understand my work myself. I know no one, even among the top experts, who would be able to check my calculations without spending a year on just that and nothing else.

My own experience is that I learned most of what I know by private discussions with the experts. Of course to be able to do it I first had to go through the standard university courses, and to excel in that. But theoretical physics is rather special.

If you study other, less "exact" sciences, then, probabl you can learn a lot from just reading books and papers. But you will know next to nothing UNTIL you learn enough of terms and standard concepts to be able to have private discussions with the experts. Best it is done in personal talks, optimally with a glass of wine or (better) with a glass of vodka. Only then the experts confide to you that most of what is considered to be the "standard wisdom" is of little value ( I would not dare to use the word that would be automatically censored on this forum).
Yet KNOWING this s * * t, first, is crucial! Because only when you know it, you have any chance at all to go beyond and do something about it.

What I wrote above is not 100% true. As with everything - there are exceptions. But to discuss all possible exceptions would take me many pages ....
 
Neil,
What an excellent set of questions! And as you can see from the replies, many of us have had to deal with these questions at some point. In brief, the education system is set up to "stuff" you with so-called "facts", sometimes there may even be discussions about methods and science, but rarely will you get to the important things: like learning how to discern truth from false. If school taught but one thing, and that was it, then that would be a great achievement. You would be able to read many many books on a wide variety of topics, and decide for yourself what was true, what was hypothesis presented as facts, and what was wishful thinking or even lies. You would be an independent being capable of anything you wanted to do. Which is, of course, why school does not teach you that.

In my area of expertise, computer science, as but one example, once you get beyond algorithms that can be proved to do this or that, the questions almost ALWAYS come in the form of "What is the best way to do X?". "Should I build my system like this?" "Should my team use this process?" "Should I integrate with X or Y or both?". And almost ALWAYS the correct answer is "it depends". However, almost ALWAYS you will hear experts say "THIS is the only way" or "THAT way never works", and so on.

Here's where the Work and Cassiopaea can be applied in a very practical sense: by KNOWing that the future is open, that "it depends", that the Law of Three Forces applies (i.e. one active force, one passive force, and one neutralizing force, aka "context", is involved in any interaction), and that some people NEED to be right because of psychological issues. Your life will then be much much simpler, because you can See all these things for what they are and not as they appear to be, and you will be able to avoid becoming entangled with imaginary things. Just being able to be open to many possibilities will make you powerful beyond belief compared to peers who choose this or that dogma. See? This is "Knowledge Protects" in real life.

And as Ark, I agree that private discussions with experts is where I learn the most. The most enlightening moments in my career has been with the "top of the crop" at the annual "vacation-in-the-Rockies-but-let's-call-it-a-conference" hikings in Crested Butte, Colorado. I don't go to the US anymore, and that is what I miss the most.
 
One more thing.

There is immense power in being able to say "I don't know".

It means to be open for new possibilities, new learning, new information, new knowledge, new adventures.

Last time I checked school does not teach you that.
 
sHiZo963 said:
Of course, for tests, I would put the answers the teacher/professor wanted down on paper to get my A... So, I guess what I am getting at is this: If I keep an open-minded, OBJECTIVE outlook, being very careful, of course, my 'enlightened self' CAN, indeed, survive in the MCS of formal education. This is how we learn to really live day-by-day while keeping off the radar.
<snip>
As long as I don't FALL for this stuff and actually believe it (but have a working knowledge of it), it can, IMO, serve a meaningful purpose. To have knowledge of both mind-sets (the subjective and objective realities), and the ideas behind them, could be beneficial in the future...
... or maybe this whole idea is just wishful thinking?
i don't know. some parts of what you wrote sound fine, but some other parts sound a bit 'game-theory'-ish to me. as if you just want to play the MCS games back at 'em - as if you are rather enjoying getting involved in the mind games and simply trying to come out on top, and outsmart them so, in effect, you have 'won'. Now I know you need to learn how to stay off the radar and survive the system, but this particular outlook strikes me as a bit inward looking, IMO.

Yes, it is useful to practice discernment, and also to gain insights into the mindset of the pathocrats who run our lives and impose false dreams and principles, so you need to pay attention. Also I'm aware of the whole concept of the 'petty tyrant' as per don Juan (in 'The Fire From Within'?) but these kinds of manouvres require a certain level of awareness already to not become a victim, and this is all done with some further aim in mind, some deeper quest. Having said that, I haven't read your blog, or any of your other posts, afaik, so I could easily be 'out' in how I read this. just take it as a bit of general feedback.

I agree with some of the various other comments on here, which basically say to subtly minimise one's involvment, in such a way as to not bring too much friction down on to one's head. and then at the same time take the 'outward-looking' path: discover what it is you really want to do, seize a dream, work out how to do it, and go for it. leave the pathocrats to their life-sapping games.

Neil said:
So my question is, have/are any of you ever had a problem of balancing your spiritual life while still trying to appear relatively normal in the real world and it's institutions? How did/are you dealing with it? How do you view education as a whole? Does it ever change, or do you change and work your way around it?
Life is education, so education doesn't stop, it isn't some kind of time-limited, rationed event. Instead it gradually changes and evolves as you do. how to work out balancing your 'normal' outward life with you 'real' spiritual life - well for me this is something that gradually evolved also. by making the occasional mistake you will come to understand where the boundaries are, and that in many situations you have to keep outwardly quiet about the things that are important, in order to allow yourself to carry on to pursue those important things. Neil you seem to be asking a lot of questions and playing with ideas, and trying to evaluate what other people say, and approaching all this with a healthy attitude, and I think if you carry on doing that you will find your own way.

Neil said:
So in essence, how do you stay intellectually respectable in the Control System, while pursuing your own freedom? Is it necessary to bust out of the MCS by suddenly rejecting it's precepts and drawing a lot of attention and ridicule, or is it possible and more beneficial to ease your way out?
yeah, I'd advocate the 'easing out', rather than the 'busting out' approach for the time being.
 
Hi Neil,

Thanks for your thoughts.

It is no easy task living in societies that have been set up to be pathological by nature: education, politics, art - makes no difference, the spider's web of entropy/ponerization is clear and present.

Your comments on education are revealing in that perhaps you are being tested as to your mettle so to speak? Are you able to attain that creative tension between knowing what you know and still "playing the game" until such time you are able to extricate yourself from those particular "educational" influences? Suffering of this kind can help to build the strength you may need in the future. It is necessarily a lonely path at some point. Granted, you are in college and understandably seeing that this is largely dead information - a form of definite control if you will, but when folks are beginning to really SEE reality as it is, it can be a intense period where, rather like Neo in the Matrix, a machine can descend from God knows where and pluck you out of your pod dumping you unceremoniously into a lot of bother, usually when we take on too much and try to "bust out" prematurely. Neo survives (just) only due to his network and it is the networking principle that gets us through it. Then again, knowing when there may a perfect opportunity to find another way out is also important but it requires a some impeccable timing and some practical preparation.

I certainly couldn't have achieved (I hope!) some form of progress without the principle of feedback that one can experience in the Signs forum and on the discussion lists. We need this feedback in order to be able to confirm the objective or subjective nature of our experience which is vital in order to able to see ourselves as we are, just as we are beginning to see the external world as it is. This is the nature of the 3-D world in which we find ourselves wandering so aimlessly. We cannot hope to achieve anything true, genuine or lasting as applies to the world of the soul if we cannot begin to coldly look at the layers of programming we have accumulated from this very same Matrix or General Law - from the very mind we have been born with - and for that, we need help. The whole is greater than the sum of the parts - and no where is that more applicable than within a network striving to see and do.

For me, it was only by realising that I was effectively still a machine but that there was a spark inside that was driving me on to network towards a specific aim that I was able to begin to even start finding my own aim that was part of that whole, while remaining individual - and sane! That is to say, none of us truly seeking are looking for props or a collective to escape into, rather a unity of understanding leading to some form of creative action i.e. a co-linearity that is applied in a graduated way and becomes progressively more urgent and in turn, dependent on our own "friction" from our lessons and our ability to stay with it. Therefore, for that to succeed, especially in the initial stages of finding the "path of access" and for networking along creative/STO lines, we need to keep our heads down while quietly defending our outpost from attacks. This is not at all hypocritical in that we need not be "submissive" we can retain our integrity by standing up for truth but being aware that we have to be "Wise as serpents gentle as doves." In other words, work within the system as Hkoehli mentions and not to push our luck!

I think we all need to concentrate on conserving as much energy as we can in order to be of use to ourselves and for all that become connected by thought in this network of like minds seeking knowledge, truth and freedom. Perhaps then we may add to that singular future that we can be "tunnelling" to manifest through all our different efforts including yours!

And yes, the more I learn the more it reconfirms I know nothing! Even without the "benefit" of an American schooling! ;)

J.
 
Neil said:
So my question is, have/are any of you ever had a problem of balancing your spiritual life while still trying to appear relatively normal in the real world and it's institutions? How did/are you dealing with it? How do you view education as a whole? Does it ever change, or do you change and work your way around it?
First of all, GREAT set of questions.

I deal with the "balancing act", so to speak, by just understanding, or SEEing, the absurdity of the system. Make a conscious effort to be "in" the world, rather than "of" it. I didn't come across the C's until about 2003 or so. But even when I was a sophomore/junior in HS (93-94), I got the impression that the "educational system" was a big joke. My genetic heritage was such, general intelligence-wise, that the curriculum throughout ALL of my school years was viewed, by me, as "child's play", so to speak. My position was helped by the fact that my father, from whom I inherited said intelligence, was on the same page as I was, as regards public education. My grades, even though they were great, weren't really a big deal to my parents. I always received an "education" outside of school. I believe it was Mark Twain who said "Don't let your schooling interfere with your education". That sums up, very concisely, my views on "education", in the public sense, as a whole. It seems to be getting worse - OSIT

Neil said:
So in essence, how do you stay intellectually respectable in the Control System, while pursuing your own freedom? Is it necessary to bust out of the MCS by suddenly rejecting it's precepts and drawing a lot of attention and ridicule, or is it possible and more beneficial to ease your way out?
I suppose that all depends on ones inherent nature. The mainstreamy types - hardcore christians, military, I guess what may be considered OP's - think, at least it would "seem" that they would think, that I'm a bit crazy, for excersizing my free will. And by thier standards, I would have to agree. As far as "busting out" of the MCS, it seems as though you already have, or at least are in the process of said busting out. I think this has to do with "mind" more that anything else. I am assuming you are still in High School, so correct me if that assumption is wrong. Being such, I can imagine it being a LOT harder than my situation, because my chosen profession, that is, orchestral musician, by it's nature, attracts those who are a little on the fringe as it is, at least in the contemporary generation of orchestral musicians. As a result, I don't feel as constrained to "shut up and take it smiling", so to speak. I would suggest that you strive to actualize your own destiny, while at the same time not impeding anothers right to same said end. I think that you'll notice, once "out in the world", a higher chance of meeting like minded individuals, which helps quite a bit. But then again, you've already found like minded individuals, in a general sense at least, right "here", that is, on this forum :)

By the way, I am in FL as well, and have been since I was 2 (beginning in early 80).

Kris
 
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