Cutting out dairy.

Loreta,

Wheat contains "exorphins," which are morphine-like substances. It is very literally adicting.

I did see one or more references to heavy cream. It is indeed high in fat, but those with allergies can still react to it. There are indications that casein may be similar to gluten in its ability to cause problems, and most dairy has been denatured through pasteurization if not also homogenization.

I wish there were more published research that could help us decide, but sometimes you have to go on what you can find. The dairy industry is not going to fund or publish unfavorable results, and there are ways of discouraging others from doing it as well.
 
melatonin said:
Ive never had skin problems, but ive certainly suffered from sinusitus and fatigue.
I forgot to mention that I will also become congested after consuming dairy products. Laura mentioned early in the Life without Bread thread that switching over your diet to Paleo is like switching from gasoline to diesel. It was a rocky road for me in the beginning, but after a couple weeks of strictly adhering to the diet so much has improved for me health-wise. Sometimes the struggle is worth the reward.
 
I think it is interesting to watch the debate about dairy taking place in the larger 'paleo diet' community. When I go searching on the Web for information about 'dairy' it can be difficult to find anything useful, but when I search specifically for 'paleo dairy' then at least the debate starts to come into focus.

If you buy dairy products from a store that sells "factory food," you are going to be consuming something awful. It doesn't matter if you have genes (from both parents) that are "adapted" to dairy or not. Nobody is adapted to industrial "dairy."

If you manage to find dairy products made from raw milk from "heritage," grain-free, fully-pastured cows that have been well treated, then you can start to ask about whether milk (not "milk") is a suitable human food. Any genetic adaptation to milk that occurred over the last 10,000 years would be to that kind of milk, not the the kind of "dairy" you find in stores today.

I don't drink milk. If I went to enough trouble, however, I think there is a small chance I might be able to find healthy raw milk near where I live. I'm not sure. I don't think it is illegal to sell it here, but I am not sure that I could find raw milk from grain-free pastured cows that were properly treated. Finding milk from heritage breeds (as opposed to modern breeds) would be even more difficult. Finding other products made from such milk is, for me, not very possible. So I would have to make them myself, and I consider that more trouble than it is worth since neither the benefits nor the risks are clear.

If you do have access to natural, pre-industrial dairy and you have the genes to digest both lactose and casein correctly (special testing might be needed) and you are not allergic to milk then you might want to dig deeper. But then you are going to find that generally in nature, animals don't drink the milk of other animals or continue drinking it past infancy. And while some people have genes that let them do it anyway, being able to digest it is not the same as being fully adapted to it. This is way to much for me to spend time on, since I don't have access that kind of dairy anyway.

In order to include a variety of fat sources in my diet I do consume a limited amount of "organic cultured butter" from "pasture-based" cows (yes, they can sometimes be grain-fed, depending on the season, but it is organic grain -- whoopee). It's not local. The producer makes another, better grade, but it is not sold here. I take my chances with it, and don't eat a lot. You can't really buy traditional fermented (from raw) butter, at least not here. I think that would be the best choice, if you can make it.

I also consume a significant amount of a locally-produced high-grade organic ghee (which costs $20 for a medium-sized jar). There are similar issues with what "organic" really means, but the risk is lower than with butter. I would not recommend less expensive products.

For more information, Google 'paleo dairy' and see what you come up with! But look beyond just that which matches with your beliefs and preferences.
 
Laura said:
Melatonin, the only way to get through the withdrawal is to eat meat almost constantly. Bacon, ham, steak, eggs, pork chops, whatever. I survived it by having plenty of sliced ham on hand - and bacon. Once you deal with the withdrawal from carbs and dairy, you can then begin to be more particular about what meats you eat.

Note: there is no point in doing any of this if you aren't going paleo - gluten free and dairy free foods that you buy at health food shops are just junk and they are loaded with carbs.

I do that. I have always good ham "jamón ibérico" at hand. Instead of candies, I eat jamón. That helps me a lot. I imagine that with time my withdrawal will disappear. What I like in this diet is this discipline that you develop. Sometimes it is hard, other times it is very easy.
 
Megan said:
I also consume a significant amount of a locally-produced high-grade organic ghee (which costs $20 for a medium-sized jar). There are similar issues with what "organic" really means, but the risk is lower than with butter. I would not recommend less expensive products.

For more information, Google 'paleo dairy' and see what you come up with! But look beyond just that which matches with your beliefs and preferences.

Yesterday I bought ghee from a Ayurvedic brand. I will try to put in on some veggies and on my meat. Very expensive but.

This diet is like beginning a new language, it is not easy at the beginning when you learn a new language. Now, when I go to the stores I hallucinated of the big amount of carbohydrates products on the shelves, it is just carbs! This is incredible. Hopefully we have this forum. Thanks to all of you for all your points. This help has no price!
 
loreta said:
...This diet is like beginning a new language, it is not easy at the beginning when you learn a new language. Now, when I go to the stores I hallucinated of the big amount of carbohydrates products on the shelves, it is just carbs! This is incredible. Hopefully we have this forum. Thanks to all of you for all your points. This help has no price!

I had an "experience" at the conference I attended this week. Just before the end they had an "ice cream" break. That is "ice cream" in quotes. Not non-dairy, but packaged in plastic, with a shocking list of chemical ingredients that I now recognize and know to be very bad if consumed regularly. And the crowd had no clue. Incredible!

Sometimes you feel pressured to eat like other people do. And sometimes it seems like since you know more now, other people should too. But they don't. So find ways to politely resist the pressure!
 
Laura said:
Melatonin, the only way to get through the withdrawal is to eat meat almost constantly. Bacon, ham, steak, eggs, pork chops, whatever. I survived it by having plenty of sliced ham on hand - and bacon. Once you deal with the withdrawal from carbs and dairy, you can then begin to be more particular about what meats you eat.

Note: there is no point in doing any of this if you aren't going paleo - gluten free and dairy free foods that you buy at health food shops are just junk and they are loaded with carbs.


Thanks for the advice Laura, im working my way towards that.
Tried Almond,Hazlenut and Coconut milk today, and i must say they all taste gorgeous. I wish id made the change sooner.
 
Scarlet said:
melatonin said:
Ive never had skin problems, but ive certainly suffered from sinusitus and fatigue.
I forgot to mention that I will also become congested after consuming dairy products. Laura mentioned early in the Life without Bread thread that switching over your diet to Paleo is like switching from gasoline to diesel. It was a rocky road for me in the beginning, but after a couple weeks of strictly adhering to the diet so much has improved for me health-wise. Sometimes the struggle is worth the reward.

No pain, no gain as they say. :)
 
When a person cuts dairy what happens to calcium levels? I searched the forum but it seems nobody asked this question here. Checking Dr. Mercola's website gives few clues about calcium, particularly he mentions "The Calcium Lie" by Robert Thompson. Being low on funds now I can't buy this book, but Amazon has a kindle preview. There he says that calcium significance is largely exaggerated by modern medicine, and that our bones consist of at least 12 minerals, and each of them is important for healthy bones. Also he notes that sea salt can help to maintain proper blood calcium levels. I really need scientific base on this question being attacked by my family for `crazy ideas`.
 
Have a look at this reply in the "Life Without Bread" topic, posted earlier today. It doesn't contain references, but may give you a better idea of where to look. There is quite a bit of information here in the forum, and much more in the recommended reading.
 
Thank you, Megan :) Common sense tells us that people somehow got their minerals before they started to consume dairy, so bone broth and fish idea looks plausible.
 
I have been gluten- and dairy-free since January 1st (so three months) and nearly 100% sugar-free. In that time I experimented with using a lot of coconut milk and coconut oil, however I discovered that I am intolerant to even small amounts of those two things because it nearly always resulted in wind and/or diarrhea.

Three days ago I re-introduced milk, yoghurt and cream purely out of interest to see what reaction this would have after being dairy-free for three months. I can report that it has had no effect upon me whatsoever; in fact I can easily conclude that coconut milk has had a far more negative impact upon my well-being than dairy.

Be that as it may, I am not going to continue to consume dairy because I still do not believe we should be consuming the milk of another species, or indeed of any species after infancy. The long-term effects of dairy consumption cannot be fully known.
 
3D Resident said:
I have been gluten- and dairy-free since January 1st (so three months) and nearly 100% sugar-free. In that time I experimented with using a lot of coconut milk and coconut oil, however I discovered that I am intolerant to even small amounts of those two things because it nearly always resulted in wind and/or diarrhea.

Three days ago I re-introduced milk, yoghurt and cream purely out of interest to see what reaction this would have after being dairy-free for three months. I can report that it has had no effect upon me whatsoever; in fact I can easily conclude that coconut milk has had a far more negative impact upon my well-being than dairy.

hmmm I thought it took longer than 3 months for milk to leave your system.

I am taking quite a large dosis of C-vitamin and magnesium - don't know if you do too? What I find is that I get diarrhea every day but when my body reacts to something be it food or a virus, then my poo solidifies..

Could it be that you are actually reacting to the milk rather than the coconut?
 
the_hammer, I would like to know where you read that milk takes 3 months to leave one's system?

Excess magnesium can cause diarrhea. And if you are getting diarrhea every day then you really need to do something about it because your body is telling you that something is wrong; you can't just keep doing whatever it is you are doing.

About the coconut milk causing me diarrhea -- it was obviously the result of the coconut milk and not dairy because I hadn't been consuming dairy for months and yet like clockwork, I would get diarrhea within hours of consuming coconut milk or oil.
 
3D Resident said:
...About the coconut milk causing me diarrhea -- it was obviously the result of the coconut milk and not dairy because I hadn't been consuming dairy for months and yet like clockwork, I would get diarrhea within hours of consuming coconut milk or oil.

The only brands of coconut milk in the store here contain guar gum as a thickener. This is soluble fiber of a kind that one might ordinarily want to avoid. Does yours contain it?

This dawned on me after reading the website linked in this post. What applies to cats might just apply to people too!
 
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