Descriptions of the "afterlife"/5th Density

[Chaze]

To build off of what Altair shared regarding Soul Groups, this is from part two of Testimony of Light:

At last came the opportunity to pursue the progress onward which I so eagerly desired. By similarities of mind and aspiration I was “drawn” toward a Group. Eagerly I “communed” with them. My joy was deep and strong when I realized that I had, indeed, found my own Group even though I knew myself to be only on the outer fringe of the their activities. And here may I emphasize the value of the Group consciousness which we had practiced and struggled to attain together. The “groove” which we had forged into our consciousness of Group responsibility at soul level, of unity at the Center, of Group growth of the divine qualities into our composite whole, all this was of inestimable help in my entry into, and understanding of, the Law of Group work.

Gradually I became aware of my fellows as “arrayed” in colors as in garments and by the depth or brightness or soberness or brilliance of their “surround” I came to know not only their characters, but their individual advance into the Spiritual Realms. This was indeed most revealing, yet humbling. I saw that now I must discard the habit to which I had clung. It had served its usefulness. I must wear what I am as a garment. The thought was terrifying. What was I? Dare I stand before my Group companions in the “new habit” of my thought? Would the colors be somber or bright? Long and earnestly I talked with others who were in very much the same predicament, and I meditated earnestly on what I wanted to be that such may be presented in truthful Light about me.

This is a new stage. I am still a neophyte. It is the preparatory stage (concentration before meditation in the earthly technique) of working down into oneself to discover what one really is; the utterly honest summing up of one faculties both mental and aspirational and then “letting forth” of whatever Light had dawned, into a shape. “Let your Light so Shine” has a solid meaning here.

Gradually the garment evolves, the color settles, and you are arrayed as you really are. You have assumed your Light. In other words, the surviving personality is reunited with another least a part of the true Soul body.

Life excites you. Mind grows into clarity, expansiveness, creativeness. YOU ARE. YOU LIVE. You can now take your rightful place in the Group, albeit only on the outer ring. Your ascent into consciousness has begun. You are clothed in raiment of Light as your fellows. Now your Light can mingle with their brilliance and become One in intensity. Thought and aspiration grow into joy and ecstasy. Channels of wisdom and knowledge open to you, beauty becomes a living reality.

 

[Jwade1994]

My spouse and I have recently started watching a 3 part documentary about people who have had near death experiences. They talk about the beauty of heaven, the love of God, the understanding of creation and all that we are. They describe the beauty to the best of their ability, although they mention human words hold no comparison. As we are trapped in this body on earth and can not fathom the experience they had. They touch on how at ease they were after they had left the human body. And how peaceful life is after death. How it doesn’t end, it continues on. They talk about how they know all, about anything and everything, that they are truly at peace and feel the overwhelming power of love from God. How they feel whole and they know exactly who and what they are and have been, and ever will be. All the people telling their stories state that they did not want to come back. They wanted to go to heaven, be with God, be home, be whole, free from all pain and suffering. Once in this light form , able to see and know all, they were shown their families, people on earth, they were able to feel the hurt God allowed them to feel for the ones on earth living in darkness. Reluctantly these people returned to their human form for reasons that were selfless. To return to their children, to their parents, to their friends, only to keep them from suffering and grieving their loss. They gave up heaven, only for a short while, to help those on earth. Even after being so close to unification with the creator.

This series has touched me, and really opened my eyes, and made me want to be more loving, more patient, more kind, more giving, and more positive. It has helped me see that even though we are trapped in this body, with amnesia to all our other lives, and all we are and what we are, that their is light at the end of the tunnel. And it’s filled with beauty, knowledge , awareness, forgiveness, and over all love. So even though we have to live a life filled with hard lessons, go through so much pain, learn from ever mistake and endure the repercussions, it will lead us to something so great that our human form can’t even begin to understand. Once it’s finally our time to go, we will be greeted with an overpowering feeling of peace and love from the divine comic mind, the creator, God.

I just wanted to share something positive and uplifting in these uncertain and trying times. As each day more negativity grows, and we see less love on earth. I have struggled with the fear of death and dying for some time, almost irrational fears at times. But knowing there is beauty in death, and that death is on the beginning, puts my mind at ease.


The series is on YouTube it is called

“Life to afterlife:death and back”

 

[Approaching Infinity]

Apologies if this was mentioned somewhere in this thread (I searched but couldn't find it), but the session bit about positive afterlife experiences prompted me to think about negative NDEs recently. I had heard that they occur, but hadn't looked into them in much depth.

Nancy Evans Bush and Bruce Greyson wrote this paper in 1992 describing the three types: inverse (where ordinary NDE phenomena, like the light, are perceived negatively, not positively), void, and hellish. They also wrote about them in this paper from 2014. Bush has a couple books on the topic, including this one from 2012: Amazon.com: Dancing Past the Dark: Distressing Near-Death Experiences (Greyson wrote a foreword). Book description:

Almost one in every five near-death experiences (NDEs) is not a visit to heaven. Some are marked by alarm, emptiness, threat, guilt, or even the terror of hell or psychosis. How to understand them? Here is a book that gives readers more to go on than old wives' tales and medieval theological images.

Dancing Past the Dark is a comprehensive overview of near-death experiences in general and disturbing NDEs in particular, presented by an author who knows her topic both from the inside, as one who had a reality-shattering NDE, and from her role as administrator and participant in the early decades of near-death research.

Nancy Evans Bush, MA, President Emerita of the International Association for Near-Death Studies, brings ways of thinking about death, dying, and suffering that will be new to many readers.

All NDEs, she says, even the most painful, have astonishing potential to enrich and clarify life here and now. She remains straightforward about the profound difficulty in this type of NDE and knows first-hand the pressing need for information:

• What do they mean?
• Are they real?
• What does science say, or religion?
• NDEs change lives, but to what extent can they be believed?

She presents such research findings as exist about these NDEs and explains why the study data are so sparse. She interweaves thoughtful scholarship, common questions, conventional wisdom, and anecdotal bits from the early years of near-death studies. From reporting data she moves on to opinion, including the diversity and perpetual changing of ideas about an afterlife. She looks at the impact and range of cultural influences and religion. She devotes a chapter to approaches to recovery following such a PTSD-promoting experience. An appendix is made up of first-person accounts of deeply distressing NDEs.

The book covers a lot of ground, yet is "engagingly written," as one reviewer said. It is not about Evans Bush or her NDE, though she details her own experience; rather, it is a fact-filled overview of the struggle for understanding.

Overall, the book presents a compelling case that to see these events only as messages about death or an afterlife is largely to miss their point.

Author Anne Rice (Interview with the Vampire) posted to her blog readers about Dancing Past the Dark: "I want to once again draw your attention to this brilliant book. Put aside whatever you think you know about NDEs and read this...I cannot recommend it enough."

Might have some data points to add to the discussion.

 

[lilies]

about positive afterlife experiences prompted me to think about negative NDEs recently.

Ibn al-Arabi warned about the dangers of the illusionary non-physical planes.

C's said its a real jungle out there:
I think the movie (originally) titled Blueberry shows best, what is awaiting the untrained soul of a modern-man in the jungle. Also in the below clip is amazingly shown a potent shaman, a Don-Juan class sorcerer character, masterfully prepared: notice his 'Ancestral Protection'™ at videotimes 1:01, his extreme 'Spiritual Shielding'™ at 6:58, and 08:24.

Highly recommended movie to watch!
Not shown in below clip: I very much liked, what these "super-pro" Don Juan-class sorcerers did in this movie with their smoking pipes. Demonstrating a unique trance technique, resembling an Eiriu-Eolas-style breathing-pipe-smoking habit for probably warding / contacting their ancestors / keeping themselves in control:

Owen describes two destinations after death, which I think could fit a negative NDE:
(1) Twilight Zone filled with evil-mocking spirits and dark Fallen Angels emotionally and psychologically torturing the unfortunate dead peeps, who land there.
(2) Straight to Hell, which was described as a vast slave-plantation in a colossal volcanic canyon / abyss, which probably also has the below shown everyday-amazing Spa-experiences demonstrated expertly in the following video, I think:

Decades ago I found this being the best(IMO), graphic, theatrical-artistic representation of one of the worst / negative NDEs possible in HELL! For those ignoramuses, who lead truly entropic lifestyles:
- Watcher beware! Its very intense! -

 

[nicklebleu]

I knew a guy who told me his NDE - to sum it up, he was traumatized by it.

Short version - he had a surgical procedure during which he arrested and needed resuscitation. His was a fairly classical description of the ‘beyond’ (life review, bliss, extasy etc), until he was told he needed to go back, that his time was not up yet, and that he still had a mission to perform and his wife needed him. He didn’t want to go back, but was ’pushed back’ regardless.

When he was back, he couldn’t work for 2 years, was depressed and suicidal, because he wanted to go back, but knew that suicide would be a mistake. He blamed his wife for having to come back, his relationship with her turned difficult, and he constantly racked his brain trying to remember what his ‘mission’ was supposed to be.

When he told me his story many years after his experience, he had found some sort of a balance, but he was clearly haunted by it.

In a bizarre twist - over the years I forgot his name, but still tried multiple avenues to find out his whereabouts, to no avail. I always wondered what had become of him. Three years ago I moved where I live now and walked into one of the job sites I work at - and BANG! - there he was! He was quite distant, though, so I never found the opportunity to broach the subject, as I felt he didn’t want to talk about it. A few months ago he retired and I have again lost track of him.

Life IS stranger than fiction …

 

[Wandering Star]

He blamed his wife for having to come back, his relationship with her turned difficult, and he constantly racked his brain trying to remember what his ‘mission’ was supposed to be.

And surely when you return knowing that you have a "mission" to carry out, the same concept creates confusion.

A mission to carry out seems like something very important, like saving a lot of people from a tragedy or something like that.

However, it may be that "simply" the person has to live her life and that's it. The soul knows that without us there would not occur other events that will be useful to others, for example.

The most insignificant act for us can trigger a chain of amazing events...

Of which we will know nothing!

 

[Laura]

This is a bit funny:

 

[Jefferson]

This is a bit funny:

This is funny: dad-blasted hubbie has been gone for 50 years and doesn't even show up for the funeral!

 

[PERLOU]

Si cela est proche de la vérité, comme L. doit être heureux de camper...

If that's close to the truth, how happy L. must be camping...

 

[thorbiorn]

This is a bit funny:

The video title and description:

GHOST DESCRIBES The Afterlife with DECEASED WW1 HUSBAND

The following recording took place on 18th December, 1967 with a woman called Alice Green. The medium was Leslie Flint accompanied by George Woods and Betty Greene - no relation. The following is an edited version.
[...]
Credits: https://leslieflint.com/
[...]

The edited version is based on a transcript.
Below is the intro to the experiment read or written by Betty Greene, followed by the first 10 minutes of the transcript from the Alice Greene session, including the part with her surprise at her husband not showing up for her funeral.

Context for the spirit communication experiment:

Betty Greene's Introduction

Recorded: 1964

Betty Greene attended her first Leslie Flint séance
in 1953, with researcher George Woods.

Over the years George and Betty recorded hundreds of spirit voices, during their regular appointments with the medium.

In this introduction to the recordings they made, Mrs Greene explains how the spirit voices are produced and what can be expected from attending a direct voice séance with Leslie Flint...

Note: This vintage recording has been enhanced for clarity.
[Voice recording]
Read the transcript below as you listen...

Betty Greene:
Hello everybody. This is Mrs. Greene speaking.

Mr. Woods and I thought it would be a good idea that, if before you heard any of these tapes, we gave you an introductory talk. Because, although there may be one or two of you who may know about psychic phenomena, there will be a number of you who have no knowledge whatsoever of this subject, especially of direct voice.

Now, as in all séances, there is a medium, but in the case of direct voice the mediumship is physical and not mental. Mental mediumship consists primarily of clairvoyance, clairaudience (hearing a spirit voice), impressions and inspirational writing.

Physical mediumship is responsible for direct voice, transfiguration (a spirit will overshadow the medium and his face will change), spirit photography, materialisation and telekinesis; the latter being the movement of objects without physical contact.

In everybody there is a substance known as ectoplasm. This substance is a life-force and a physical medium has a great deal of it and therefore, is the chief power-station. From this ectoplasmic substance, we are told, chemists on the ‘other side’ fashion a replica of the vocal organs and reproduce what is known as the voice-box, or in some cases, we have heard it referred to as a mask. Perhaps in this modern age we might refer to it as the etheric microphone.

If you were to take an infra-red photograph during a direct voice séance, you would see cords of ectoplasm emanating from the solar plexus of each sitter and the medium. The emanation from the latter, of course, being the greatest. And all these cords joining up to form what looks like a ball of mist, or the voice-box.

The spirit communicator transmits his or her thoughts through this voice-box and, by so doing, a vibration is created which reaches us as sound or the voice. In other words, the spirit communicators have to lower their vibration so that they may enter the Earth's vibration.

This explains why the voice may not sound quite like the Earth voice - it may be a little distorted. It is rather like when we telephone somebody; we often say we did not recognise so-and-so’s voice. Our voices are being transmitted artificially by the means of an instrument, which at times can distort them. Therefore, how very complicated our spirit friends must find it, when they have to reproduce their voice by thought, and also through an artificially made voice-box. They cannot be expected to reproduce their Earth voice exactly, although I am afraid some sitters do expect it.

Also, if a spirit has been on the other side for a number of years, they forget what their Earth voice sounded like, as they communicate with each other by thought. I ask those of you who are listening to this to try and produce your voice by thought. It's difficult is it not? Especially if have never heard what your voice sounds like to others.

Now when you listen to these tapes, there is one very important fact. And that is, that the voice of the spirit communicator does not come through the medium. I'm going to repeat that: the voice of the spirit does not come through the medium, but in mid-air about three feet away from him - or wherever the voice-box has been constructed. So many people have the erroneous idea that the voice comes through the medium; through his own lips. But in direct voice this is not the case. The voice is completely independent of the medium, that is why the phenomenon is called 'direct voice' or 'independent voice'.

Some direct voice mediums go into trance, but this particular medium does not do so, and is conscious the whole time. He often laughs or makes comments when we do. Also, when you listen to the tapes you may hear the spirit breathing rather heavily, just as they are trying to get through, and you may hear them taking breaths between sentences.

Now, this business of breathing has puzzled some people quite a lot, and it is a question that is often put to us. First of all, you must remember that our friends on the other side are people, just as much as we are on this side. They are spirits. And we are spirits, here and now, but on a lower vibration.

Now, when we talk to people we breathe between sentences. The difference is this: when our spirit friends are in their own environment, communication between each other is done by thought. The same process takes place when they communicate with us via the voice-box. The subtle difference being, that they have lowered their vibrations to Earth conditions, and therefore have brought down their memories of those conditions and they will use all its facilities as they did on Earth, except that they are doing it by thought. It has been known for a person who stuttered while on Earth, to stutter while communicating in direct voice; they were back in their old Earth conditions.

May I try and explain it another way? One often carries on a lecture or a conversation in one's mind. Without realising it we are mentally taking breaths between sentences. But when we are able to use our normal larynx etc., and speak our thoughts aloud, our breathing is apparent to others. That is exactly what is going on with our spirit friends - they are communicating with us by thought, and when those thoughts are lowered to the Earth vibration and we can hear them in sound, those breaths becomes apparent to us.

The heavy breathing, which is sometimes heard as the spirit is trying to get through, are the conditions just before they passed from their Earth life into the spirit world. And as they try to get through, they are entering those conditions again. The same idea applies to accents. A spirit communicator who had an accent whilst on Earth - say, for argument's sake, a Scots accent - when he vibrates to Earth conditions, this accent will be apparent because his memory has drawn him back to Earth conditions.

Most physical mediums have a young [spirit] person attached to them. They help to raise the vibrations, and in direct voice, assist the spirit communicators in getting through. This particular medium has a young boy attached to him who, when on Earth, was a paper-boy and was killed in a road accident. He is usually the first one to come through, and gives us a cheery word of greeting, often calling us ‘Woody’ and ‘Auntie Greenie’. But quite often he will call us by our christian names, and at the end of the sitting he always pops back to say goodbye.

The medium has been through every scientific test, and the genuineness of his mediumship and his integrity have been proved beyond all doubt. Mr Woods has had a great deal of experience in psychic phenomena. In fact, for over 40 years he has been studying it. He has even had the experience of walking around the room with a materialised spirit at a materialisation séance.

I have had about 11 years experience and have been attending direct voice seances with Mr Woods. But approximately 8 or 9 years ago, a spirit communicator came through to us and said that if just the two of us would sit with the medium at regular intervals, but that we must sit without any personal motive - in other words, not for ourselves or wishing to get any of our relatives through - they, on the other side would try and bring through people from all walks of life, who would tell how they passed over, what they experienced, their reactions on finding themselves on the other side, and their life and work in the spirit world.

Well, we have made every effort to sit at regular intervals with the medium and gradually, we have collected these tapes. Please do not think that every time that we attend a direct voice séance we record a good tape. Because there have been times when we have had nothing at all - a blank sitting. We never know who, or if anybody at all, will come through.

People do not understand that a successful séance depends on the conditions; not only of the medium, physically and mentally; the atmospheric conditions; but above all, on the conditions, mentally and physically, given out by the sitters.

For those of you who are becoming really interested in this subject and would really like to study it and eventually attend séances, I wish to lay great stress upon this point - because so many people will blame the medium for a bad sitting, whether it be for clairvoyance or direct voice; but more often than not, the sitters themselves are to blame, because of the conditions they have introduced into the séance room: one must always attend a séance with the highest motives and not just for entertainment.

It is useless attending a séance having just been into a public house for a drink, or having looked at a rather nasty play on television, or read something disturbing in a newspaper, or worse still, having just had a row with somebody. Because these thought conditions will go with you into the séance room and will attract a very low order. One sitter with perhaps a nasty or wrong mental attitude, can wreck a séance or bring it down to a very low level. I would like newcomers to this subject to bear this in mind; that your studies and any psychic work you may eventually do, should be carried out with the highest motives and not just for entertainment or material gain.

Spirits from all walks of life, when on Earth, have come through to talk to us. Some have been cultured, some not so. But they have all given us, in their own way, an interesting description of themselves, their reactions on finding themselves in the spirit world, and their new life. But however humble or however eloquent the spirit communicators have been, throughout all our tapes runs the golden thread of truth and the right way of life. We leave you to judge for yourselves.

We must apologise for any noises-off you may hear on the tapes; such as a dog barking, a car revving up or an aeroplane going over. The microphone being such a sensitive instrument, will pick up these outside noises and I am sure you will understand that any noise outside the séance room is quite beyond our control. There are times, however, when you may hear the medium coughing or sniffing. This is due to the ectoplasm which sometimes gets in his nose and throat.

[Break in recording]

There is one other thing we should like to mention, which is also very important, and that is; that a physical medium feels very tired after a séance. They have had a great deal taken out of them. So that sitters, after a séance, should leave as quickly as possible and not hang around the medium and keep him talking. As it is essential that all physical mediums, whether for direct voice or materialisation or any physical phenomena, should rest immediately after a sitting.

END OF RECORDING

This transcript was created for the Trust by K.Jackson-Barnes - January 2019

The beginning of the transcript from the session where Alice Green comes in, but before she actually shows up. The excerpt gives an idea of the atmosphere and the setting, which in this case was light and humorous:

Alice Green communicates

Recorded: December 18th 1967

“Any book of value is there...”
Mickey shares his good wishes with George Woods
and Betty Greene, in this recording made just before Christmas.

Then Alice Green communicates for the first time
and talks about her death and her experiences after arriving
in the Spirit World.

Alice describes the scenery and landscape of this new world
and explains how she was finally reunited with her husband after 40 years.

Then Alice talks about the vast libraries in the Spirit World
where, she says, any book of value is available to read...

Finally, an unnamed male communicator gives a Christmas blessing.

Note: This vintage recording has been reconstructed from various original source tapes.

[Voice recording]

Read the full transcript as you listen to this recording...

Present: Leslie Flint, George Woods, Betty Greene.
Communicators: Mickey, female voice, Alice Green, male voice.

Betty Greene: [The following] tape recording is that of Alice Green. This was recorded on the eighteenth of December 1967, the sitters being Mr S.G.Woods and Mrs B. Green, medium Mr Leslie Flint.

Greene: Thank you!

Mickey: And may you have a very, very happy Christmas and a very peaceful and a very successful, spiritual new year.

Greene: Thank you Mickey...

Woods: Oh thank you, what a lovely present!

Mickey: And may you... may you have many more years to continue to do the good work.

Greene: Thank you Mickey...

Woods: Oh thank you.

Greene: We would like to...

Mickey: And don't take any notice of old Flint, about getting old...

[Laughter]

Greene: ...you're as old as you feel aren't you Mickey?

Mickey: Well, that's the saying, but, um, if you are still of service to somebody or to the work, then you're not really old.

Greene: No. I suppose not.

Woods: No. No, that is quite right Mickey. There's a lot of people...

Mickey: That's what keeps people going, is being of some service and help and being needed, isn't it?

Greene: Yes.

Woods: Oh yes.

Mickey: That's the tragedy of some old people; they feel that nobody wants them.

Woods: No.

Greene: Quite right.

Mickey: Which is terrible. I think everybody should try to make old people feel they are needed.

Greene: Yes.

Mickey: And give them things to do - even if they are little things - to make them feel that they are doing something that's helpful, you know.

Greene: Quite right.

Mickey: Not just put them away and let them 'go to seed'.

Woods: No.

Flint: [Coughing]

Woods: No, that's quite right Mickey. I quite agree with you.

Greene: The more you have to do, the younger you are.

Flint: [Sniffing]

Woods: It's best if... if you can do something.

Voice: Bless the Lord!

Greene: Hello?

Woods: Oh hello? How are you?

Greene: Good morning, friend.

Woods: Good morning.

Flint: Who was that?

Greene: Don't know.

Woods: [They said] 'bless the Lord'.

Greene: A lady?

Woods: Yes, a lady it was.

Voice: Bless the Lord...

Woods/Greene: Yes.

Voice: ...for all his mercies.

Woods/Greene: Yes.

Voice: And all his goodness to us.

Woods: Yes… Very nice of you to come through.

Voice: May the peace of Christmas be with you now and always.

Greene: Thank you.

Woods: Thank you very much.

Greene: Who's that speaking?

Woods: Who's speaking, friend?

Greene: [Unintelligible]

Flint: Hmm?

Greene: Slightly familiar, her voice was.

Flint: Like who?

Greene: I thought it was...it was slightly familiar, the voice, you know.

Flint: Sounded to me as if she'd got false teeth! I'm awfully sorry [Laughing]
Aren't I wicked?

Woods: Well, we're very pleased...

Flint: I hope not [Laughing] it would be awful; having to go and get new dentures!

Greene: [Laughing] Leslie!

Flint: [Laughing]

Greene: I don't know...

Mickey: Honestly, you can't take him anywhere!

Greene/Flint: [Laughing]

Woods: Well, it was very nice of her to come through anyway. Who was that?

Greene: We didn't know who it was.

Woods: Very pleased.

Flint: I wonder who she was?

Mickey: [Singing] # ...in David's city... # Do you know that one?

Greene: Yes. Rather! Go on Mickey, carry on.

Woods: Go on Mickey. I know it.

Mickey: [Singing] # ...Good King Wencelas looked out, on the feast of Stephen... #

Greene: Yes, go on...

Mickey: [Singing] # ...When the snow lay round about, cold and crisp and even... #

Greene: Yes, go on...

Mickey: Ha, ha - I can't remember!

Greene: “Greatly shone the moon that night...”

Mickey: Oh yes... #...Greatly - brightly shone the moon that night...# “and the wind was cruel” or something, wasn't it?

Greene: [Singing] # … When the poor man came in sight ... #

Mickey: [Singing] # ...Gathering winter fuel! #

Greene: That's right Mickey, lovely.

Mickey: I'm not that good at singing.

Greene: Lovely! What about 'While shepherds washed...'?

Flint: [Laughing]

Greene: I nearly said the other version!

Mickey: 'Shepherds... shepherds watched their sheep by night'?

Greene: “While shepherds washed their socks by night”!

Mickey: Oh, that's being very naughty.

Greene: [Laughing] I'm sorry Mickey! Well, that was the schoolgirl version of it.

Mickey: Honestly, you really are naughty.

Next Mickey leaves the stage, and Alice Green comes in

Woods: You are. She is. Quite right Mickey. She is very naughty.

Greene: Oh dear!

Woods: “Watched their flocks by night.”

Greene: “Watched their flocks by night”, yes. I was singing a schoolgirls version of it.

Alice Green: That's right.

Woods / Greene: Hello?

Alice: Yes, that's right.

Greene: Yes, friend?

Alice: “While shepherd watched their flocks by night, all seated on the ground...”

Greene: Yes, go on.

Alice: “The angel of the Lord appeared and glory shone around.”

Greene: That's quite right.

Alice: That's right.

Woods: Yes.

Alice: [We] used to sing that in the old days.

Woods / Greene: Yes.

Alice: Well, times have changed since then you know.

Woods: Oh, yes.

Greene: They have haven't they?

Alice: Oh dear, oh dear. I wouldn't want to be on your side now, not for anything. I just wouldn't want to be there.

Greene: I shouldn't think you would.

Alice: I'm so happy here.

Greene: Good.

Alice: You're Mr Woods.

Woods: Yes.

Alice: And you're Mrs Greene.

Greene: That's right.

Alice: That's right.

Woods / Greene: Yes.

Alice: Yes, I've heard all about you...

Greene: May we have your name?

Alice: ...from my friends.

Woods: Yes.

Alice: My name, strangely enough, is Green.

Greene: Oh, is it?

Alice: But I'm no relation whatsoever to you.

Greene: Oh.

Alice: At least, as far as I know I'm not, my dear.

Greene: No, I don't expect... I mean, it's a pretty common name, Green, isn't it?
What, um, is your Christian name, friend, may we have that?

Alice: Alice.

Greene: Alice Green?

Alice: Yes, that's right. Alice Green.

Greene: Oh, and where did you live, Alice, when you were on this side?

Alice: Well, I lived in the East End* for the best part of my life.
*the East End of London.

Greene: Yes.

Alice: And then we moved down to Margate.

Greene: Oh, I know Margate.

Alice: Do you?

Greene: Yes.

Alice: Nice place.

Greene: Yes... And, um, Alice, when you, um... did you know anything about this subject before you passed over?

Alice: Me?

Greene: Mmm-hmm.

Alice: No.

Greene: You didn't.

Alice: I had a friend of mine who was a Spiritualist.

Greene: Yes?

Alice: Used to try and talk to me about it. I was interested, but I wasn't that interested to go to meetings.

Greene: No.

Alice: I was a Baptist.

Greene: Oh! Yes.

Alice: Not that I was a good one.

Greene: No?

Alice: But I went to them occasionally. My mother and father; they were all religious people.

Greene: And were you bewildered when you found yourself on the other side?

Alice: No I was not!

Greene: You weren't?

Alice: No. I took it in my stride. I knew there was something. But not quite... you know, I didn't know quite what.

Greene:
Well how did you find yourself - in what sort of conditions did you find yourself?

Alice: Well after I left the cemetery; that was after my funeral...

Greene: Oh, you went to your own funeral?

Alice: ...I went back to my own people, you know. They'd all gone back for a bit of a 'tuck in', you know - like all of them do after a funeral.

*tuck in = eat some food

Greene: Yes.

Alice: Of course, they were all talking about me, and I was sitting around there watching them.

Greene: Oh.

Alice: And no one took any notice of me and I thought, well, there's not much point in staying here. So, I'm out... I go out, you know.

Greene: Yes.

Alice: Up and down the street. No one took any notice. And I thought, well this is a funny 'how-do-you-do'*!

Still, it didn't last long, because I saw my husband coming.

*how-do-you-do = situation

Greene: Oh.

Alice: And he'd been dead for...oh, it must have been getting on for forty years.

Greene: Mmm...

Alice: He was killed in the First World War. It makes you laugh when you think about it, but I was a bit annoyed with him.

Greene: [Laughing]

Alice: Well, I'd have thought he'd have come to my funeral. And I thought he'd have been waiting, you know.

Greene: Yes?

Alice: Anyway, we soon patched that up.

Greene: And then what happened?

Alice: Oh, he just took hold of my hand and he said there's nothing to worry about. I said, 'I'm not worried.' I knew as how there was something after death, but I didn't think that I'd be, sort of, hanging around for long. Anyway, he said there's no need to. The next thing I knew I was sitting in a little place. A nice little place it was - a nice room, a nice pleasant house. And this was his place.

Greene: Yes.

Alice: And his mother was there. But I couldn't make out why they hadn't been to my funeral. I... I thought, 'well this is odd', you know.

Greene: Mmm...

Alice: I'd have thought they'd have all been there, you know. Anyway, he said that he knew as how I was coming over and it was just as well, you know, at first, that I should get my bearings*. I didn't quite know what he meant by that.

*get my bearings = acclimatise

As I said, 'I thought you'd have been there, you know, when I came over?'

He said, 'Oh no'. He said, 'we just wanted you to have a little experience, so that you could see that you had finished with Earth.

Greene: Yes. Mmm-hmm.

Alice: Of course, there was my... my two daughters - they were at the funeral, and their husbands. Oh, I remember one of them wasn't, he couldn't get away, he was working. And there were several of my neighbours; people I'd known. And Barbara was there - that was my little granddaughter.

Oh yes, they all came, but I was so surprised my husband didn't come. Seeing as how he'd been dead all them years, I'd have thought he'd have made a point of being there. But he said I had to learn something and I suppose he was right, you know. I learned, of course, that it was no good hanging around Earth.

Greene: No.

Alice: Anyway...

Greene: Go on, you're awfully interesting. What happened then?

Alice: Oh, well, we just had a talk and he was telling all about his life and things on his side of life... well, my side now, you see. He said, 'we'll go out for a little walk' and I said 'alright'. Of course, another think I found; I could get about easy.

I'd had a lot of trouble with my legs... oh, shocking! I'd had rheumatics terrible and I couldn't get my shoe on... on my right foot. And to go out walking, I thought, 'well this is marvellous'. No aches, no pains. I walked like I was when I was a girl, you know.

Well, we went out and I was going to put a hat on and I realised I hadn't got one! That was funny thing, wasn't it?

Greene: Yes [Laughing] And where did you go to?

Alice: Well, we down this little garden path from the house and... oh, and there were lots of other houses. It was like a suburban house, you know.

Greene: Yes.

Alice: There was a lot of other houses - a proper community. And then he said, 'well, we'll go into the town'. I thought, 'well this is funny. Didn't know they had towns when you were dead!'

It was quite a big town - there were no shops, I noticed, but all sorts of buildings and great big places, there was, like art galleries and... like museums I suppose - not that I went in. [They] looked like as if they was...oh, like you see in London, you know, like St Martin-in-the-Fields, and places like that. But there weren't churches.

The copied part of the transcript corresponds to 10:46 in the recording, but it goes on until 27:08. At the end, a male voice comes in.

More recordings and transcripts
At the Leslie Flint site under recordings archive there are other voices and transcripts, some with allegedly well known people, others are very ordinary people.

 

[thorbiorn]

When I saw the video Laura had posted, I went to the YouTube channel of Weird World, and tried to find similar videos by searching the channel for the word "describe". Below are titles with embedded YouTube links, video description and sometimes a comment.

DECEASED WW1 SOLDIER Describes The AFTERLIFE

The following is an extract that was taken from The Leslie Flint Trust where a man by the name of Private Alf Pritchett, of the 225th Machine Gun Corps Infantry, was killed during WW1. The medium was Leslie Flint and the spirit of Alf Pritchett was interviewed by George Woods and Betty Greene. Alf Pritchett describes what it was like when he lost his life as a soldier in the First World War and the initial question was asked by Betty Greene who asked Alf Pritchett what his reactions were when he found himself on the other side.

See Alfred Pitchett. The description of what Alfred goes through, probably describes what some dying in the war in Ukraine might experience initially.

There is the same title but a different story, very different, because this person, Rupert Brooke, is educated, artistic and philosophically interested. DECEASED WW1 SOLDIER Describes The AFTERLIFE

The following conversation was recorded on September 15th 1957 with English poet Rupert Brooke who died in 1915. The medium was Leslie Flint. This is an edited version.

See Rupert Brooke

DECEASED WW1 LIEUTENANT Describes The AFTERLIFE

Raymond Lodge was the youngest son of Sir Oliver and Lady Lodge and was training to be an engineer when WW1 began. Raymond then volunteered for service in September 1914 and because of his engineer training was given a commission in the 3rd South Lancashire and became Second Lieutenant Raymond Lodge. After his training he was sent to the front in the spring of 1915 and attached to the 2nd South Lancashire Regiment of the Regular Army and it was not long before he saw action in the trenches near Ypres. In the trenches he was lucky to survive many encounters from shell fire and shrapnel but his luck ran out on 14th September 1915 when he was struck by a fragment of shell in the attack on Hooge Hill and died in a few hours. However, his parents would soon have further communications with their son...

The source for this video could be "RAYMOND OR LIFE AND DEATH With examples of the evidence for survival of memory and affection after death", written by the father of Raymond Lodge. In Russian it is available as Р Е Й М О Н Д ИЛИ ЖИЗНЬ И СМЕРТЬ A quote from the book:

In concluding this chapter, I may quote a little bit of non-evidential but characteristic writing from 'Paul.' It was received on 30 September 1915 by Mrs. Kennedy, when alone, and her record runs thus: —

(After writing of other things, I not having asked anything about Raymond.)

"I think it hardly possible for you to believe how quickly Raymond learns; he seems to believe all that we have to fight to teach the others.

"Poor chaps, you see no one has told them before they come over, and it is so hard for them when they see us and they feel alive, and their people keep on sobbing.

See also Oliver Lodge - April 1966 where Sir Oliver Lodge allegedly comes through 25 years after his death. At the time there were great hopes for the progress of psychical research coming from Russia. Sir Oliver Lodge does recognize life elsewhere, but the duality of that life (STO/STS) is not obvious, as if all good out there.

GHOST DESCRIBES THE AFTERLIFE | A British WW2 Sailor's Experience

The following seance took place on July 16th 1966 where a sailor by the name of Terry Smith claimed that he had drowned during World War 2 after the sinking of his ship HMS Hood. He gives a detailed description of what he discovered when he arrived in the Spirit World. He is talking to George Woods and Betty Greene and the medium was Leslie Flint. The following is an edited version of that conversation.

See Terry Smith

DECEASED WW2 PILOT Describes The AFTERLIFE

Amy Johnson was born in Yorkshire, England in 1903 and was a pioneering English pilot who was the first woman to fly solo from London to Australia. She flew in the Second World War as a part of the Air Transport Auxiliary and disappeared in 1941 during a ferry flight. The cause of her death has been a subject of discussion over many years. Twenty-nine years after her death she was interviewed in Jan 1970 by Betty Greene and the medium was Leslie Flint. The following is an edited account of that conversation.

This character Amy Johnson, (Wiki) speaks in more details than the others about the value of effort, and the possibility of help from the other side. How she died is not discussed. See Amy Johnson. She speaks quicker than a few others.

There are a couple of readings among the videos, that are not about the war, but it is only a few and I think they belong with the others, and reflect upon the stories told by them: GHOST DESCRIBES THE AFTERLIFE | What Happens To Wealthy People?

The following is an edited conversation that took place on April 29th 1963 with Elizabeth Fry who was born in 1780 in Norwich, UK and was a prison reformer, social reformer and Quaker. Fry passed away in 1845. She is in conversation with George Woods and Betty Greene and the medium was Leslie Flint.

See Elizabeth Fry

GHOST DESCRIBES What Happens On Entering The AFTERLIFE

Leslie Flint was born in London in 1911 and has been described by spiritualists as the most renowned psychic of the 20th century. Two researchers Betty Greene and George Woods worked alongside Flint where they recorded Leslie Flint seance communications for over 20 years. The following conversation took place between a deceased man by the name of Mr Ohlson who was a personal friend of both Betty Green, George Woods and Leslie Flint. Ohlsen was also interested in Spiritualism and healing and his passing was very sudden.

See George Olsen.

GHOST DESCRIBES THE AFTERLIFE, What He Says Will Shock You...

Leslie Flint was a British medium and a renowned psychic in the 20th century and used direct-voice mediumship. The following session took place on April 11, 1959, when a farmer named George Hopkins originally from Sussex in England came through. George Hopkins had died around 1900 while harvesting and when he initially passed had not realised that he was no longer alive. The following conversation took place with the assistance of a woman called Betty Greene who asked Leslie Flint who was channeling George Hopkins, a series of questions.

See George Hopkins.

DECEASED MOTHER Describes The Afterlife With Her Baby

The following was recorded on April 26th 1971. Betty Greene and George Woods are talking to Jenny Wilson who'd lived in the south of England during the reign of Queen Victoria. The medium was Leslie Flint.

See Jenny Wilson

CONVERSATION WITH GHOST Who Describes The Afterlife

The following conversation with a spirit took place on April 3rd, 1970, the spirits name was George Harris. The medium was Leslie Flint and questions were asked by George Woods and Betty Greene.

The above character is a builder and talks about that. See George Harris

DECEASED 1930'S MAN DESCRIBES THE AFTERLIFE

The following was recorded on Monday, October 14th 1963 and the medium was Leslie Flint and the interviewer was Betty Greene. They communicated with a spirit called Alfred Higgins.

This character visited a spiritual church to get a message through to his life, but he said the medium did not understand what he wanted to communicate. He says some mediums do more harm than good! See Alfred Higgins

Some who had been earthbound
DECEASED 1920's MAN DESCRIBES THE AFTERLIFE

The following was recorded in February 1964 where a deceased man by the name of Ted Butler had died after being struck by a vehicle in 1923. The interviewers were George Woods and Betty Greene and the medium was Leslie Flint. This is an edited version. Ted Butler claimed that one Saturday he'd been out shopping and as he was crossing the road was struck by a lorry. He saw a crowd of people standing, looking down at something. He looked down and saw someone who looked exactly like him and hadn't realised that it was himself. He saw his wife crying and stood beside her, but she couldn't see him. They put the body in the ambulance and the wife got in along with a nurse and Ted sat beside her.

For a time, the above character was earthbound, but he had help, part of it came because he himself was inquisitive. See Ted Butler

GHOST DESCRIBES THE AFTERLIFE, His Story Will Surprise You...

The following is a conversation with a spirit called Harry that took place on March 30th 1957. Questions were asked by George Woods and Betty Greene and the medium was Leslie Flint.

See Harry was Earthbound

In the leslieflint.com archive, there are a couple of others that deal with the topic of being earthbound:
Dorcas was once earthbound, but is now more interested in teaching.
And one not yet ready to go, Fred. There is some commentary by another spirit at the end of the session. Apparently, the spirit that came through is about to find release from his state. The claim is that sometimes help from this side, can be very helpful for earthbound souls to move on, since they, though dead on a vibrational level are closer to this world, which makes work from the other side more difficult.

 

[Chaze]

Apologies if this was mentioned somewhere in this thread (I searched but couldn't find it), but the session bit about positive afterlife experiences prompted me to think about negative NDEs recently. I had heard that they occur, but hadn't looked into them in much depth.

Nancy Evans Bush and Bruce Greyson wrote this paper in 1992 describing the three types: inverse (where ordinary NDE phenomena, like the light, are perceived negatively, not positively), void, and hellish. They also wrote about them in this paper from 2014. Bush has a couple books on the topic, including this one from 2012: Amazon.com: Dancing Past the Dark: Distressing Near-Death Experiences (Greyson wrote a foreword). Book description:

Might have some data points to add to the discussion.

I just made it to Part II in Nancy Bush’s book, and found this to be very interesting regarding some of the speculative “why’s” that lead to some people experiencing negative NDEs:

THE CONVENTIONAL WISDOM

The tinge of centuries colors the way we hear today’s near-death experiences and what we make of them. Why should some individuals tell of blissful heights of spiritual experience while others believe themselves at the depths, lost in the stars or consigned to hell? (Behind the scenes, the unvoiced question of every listener: “And could that happen to me?”)

The plain fact is that no one knows the answer. Theories abound, but nobody knows absolutely why one person’s experience is gloriously life-affirming and another’s so disturbing that it leads to years of turmoil. We are awash in assumptions but with a drought of data. Conventional wisdom teaches us that good people (however that may be defined) will be rewarded and the wicked will be punished or least left out of the good things. Embedded in our thought is the ancient assumption that people get—or should get—what they deserve. But is this a good thing, and does it work?

Theologian Marcus Borg (2002, 160) has observed, “Conventional wisdom leads to a performance and rewards view of life. The quality of our life depends upon doing things right. By making this connection, conventional wisdom also images life as orderly and, to that extent, under our control... But conventional wisdom has a cruel corollary. If your life fails to work out, it must be because you have done something wrong.”

In religious language, this is expressed in terms of righteousness and sin. Moral virtue, moral failure. Live right, go to heaven; live wrong, there’s hell. But this kind of categorizing is not limited to religious belief.

Truth to tell, a great many people who disdain organized religion and intensely dislike any concept of a literal heaven, hell, or ‘divine judgment’ immediately leap to an assumption about frightening near-death experiences that echoes the most conservative religious view. The difference is primarily that secular language replaces talk of sin with descriptions of psychological failure, spiritual weakness, or perhaps a characterological deficiency in the person who “attracted” the experience. Not many writers have theorized about people who have a disturbing NDE, but their adjectives are remarkably consistent: hostile, cold, repressed, suppressed, unloving, controlling, rigid, refusing surrender, guilt-ridden, non-God-loving, fearful, mean. Never mind the absence of data to support those conclusions, the belief remains firm.

One author (Atwater, 1992, 156) has sincerely claimed that the dark NDEs are “usually experienced by those who seem to have deeply suppressed or repressed guilts, fears, and angers, and/or those who expect some kind of punishment or accountability after death.” No data has been offered to support the claim of “usually.” Physician Barbara Rommer (2001, 26) has been widely affirmed for reporting that a frightening NDE “may occur if the person has a... less than loving, or fearful mindset just immediately prior to the event...[or] if one grows up with negative programming expecting hellfire and brimstone, then that is what... one will be given to experience.” No data supported the certainty of her claims.

As more than a century of psychological research has demonstrated, everyone has “deeply suppressed or repressed guilts, fears, and angers.” They are part of the human condition, even for people who report dazzlingly transcendent experiences. Moreover, a good many people who describe themselves as having been guilt-ridden, fearful, and angry have reported beautiful mystical experiences. That bit of conventional wisdom is not enough.

Confident assertions in the absence of testable data seem largely a triumph of personal belief over objective evidence. It does seem probable that something about an individual’s emotional circumstances could influence an NDE; however, NDEs of all types demonstrate such great variability of situation and personal backgrounds that conclusiveness is a long way off. Certainly people are often challenged, after an NDE or similar event, to make life changes; and their mindset may reasonably be hypothesized to have influence (though this begs the question of how suicide attempts can produce experiences of glory); however, unprovability is a significant problem when claiming flatly that experiences occur in order to effectuate a turnaround or as a result of the person’s emotional status. It is not enough.

Curiously, to my knowledge, no researcher has ever raised similar speculations about whether people who had a blissful NDE deserved it. There is no list of personal characteristics of those experiencers. Only the distressing experiences have drawn observers to such fascination.

Another common supposition is that religious belief determines the type of experience—that heavenly NDEs reward devout believers, while frightful ones go to agnostics, atheists, and the merely unobservant. This is another idea that seems more logical than true, as no evidence supports it. Yes, some individuals who believe in a wrathful god report terrifying NDEs; but others have reported bliss. Horrible experiences have been reported by people who believe with all their hearts that “God is love.”

Here, for instance, is an excerpt from an account by Saint Teresa of Avila:

“While I was in prayer one day, I suddenly found that, without knowing how, I had seemingly been put in hell... The entrance it seems to me was similar to a very long and narrow alleyway, like an oven, low and dark and confined; the floor seemed to me to consist of dirty, muddy water emitting foul stench and swarming with putrid vermin. At the end of the alleyway a hole that looked like a small cupboard was hollowed out in the wall; there I found I was placed in a cramped condition... I found it impossible either to sit down or to lie down, nor was there any room, even though they put me in this kind of hole made in the wall. Those walls, which were terrifying to see, closed in on themselves and suffocated everything. There was no light, but all was enveloped in the blackest darkness. I don’t understand how this could be, that everything painful to see was visible.” (Teresa)

If that could befall one of the greatest of all saints, what does that say about the conventional wisdom? Something more is involved. These documented religious experiences of saints, like the range of bardos described by the Tibetan Book of the Dead and the images in psychedelic psychotherapy, indicate strongly that easy explanations point to over-simplification rather than real answers, and that deeper influences are at work.

There is, as of this writing, absolutely no evidence to support the conventional wisdom that deservingness has anything to do with having a glorious or dismal NDE. The psychological testing that has been done over decades provides no clue as to why people get the NDEs they do. Whatever germ of truth underlies these conventional conclusions, expanding it will require far subtler investigation and interpretation than these broad-brush declarations. It may even be that NDEs occur at random, like falling into a pothole on a road at night.

 

[hesperides]

Just to add something I think may be relevant in any NDE is that these people are still connected to their silver cords, which means all these experiences cannot be taken as 100% reliable as a way to find out which kind of characters will lead to blissful/terifying NDE, and then from there apply the same conclusions as to how REAL death experiences are designed to be lived.

I would expect, depending on the capacity of these persons to let go of their attachment to life during a NDE, to be more blissful than a person who is too much inmersed into the material side of the world. The same rigidity internalized during life will likely escalates during the NDE and appear to be forcing him mirroring his own worst fears, unless any STO entity intervenes leading him to experience for example how Lightness feels to make him aware of the need to rearrange his life in another more integrated direction.

 

[Laura]

There is obviously a lot of reading to be done on this topic. But, overall, the general trend seems to be that consciousness does survive death in some way or another.

 

[SlipNet]

But, overall, the general trend seems to be that consciousness does survive death in some way or another.

Thank God for that! I think there is a reality which we cannot fathom, because it's 2 densities "above" us. Two densities closer to the grand unifying principle of godhead, the 5th density contemplative realm. I'm a pessimist so often dwell on the subject of death, I've also attended about a dozen funerals this last 5 years. I cling to the idea that I will get to see those great souls again. I recall having a conversation about the afterlife with my godmother, and she, completely out of the blue, interjected that there has to be a great recycling system to process the human soul aggregate. I was amazed by this 79 year old woman's intuition. She was onto something and it remains an article of faith for me. This is a wonderful thread, good for the soul to read this.