Dropa stones

grini

Dagobah Resident
FOTCM Member
I searched the forum and couldn't find anything about this, so I'm opening a thread.

I'm reading a little book from the Yugoslav era called "They also visited us..." by Jovan Knežević, published in 1976.

1663789352632.png

In the chapter about the mystery of Povlen's balls he writes a few sentences about Dropa stones.

Here is a description: ISRPPA - Exploring the Paranormal Realm of Archaeology

History
In 1938, an archeological expedition led by Dr. Chi Pu Tei into the Baian-Kara-Ula mountains of China made an astonishing discovery in some caves that had apparently been occupied by some ancient culture. Buried in the dust of ages on the cave floor were hundreds of stone disks. Measuring about nine inches in diameter, each had a circle cut into the center and was etched with a spiral groove, making it look for all the world like some ancient phonograph record some 10,000 to 12,000 years old. The spiral groove, it turns out, is actually composed of tiny hieroglyphics that tell the incredible story of spaceships from some distant world that crash-landed in the mountains. The ships were piloted by people who called themselves the Dropa, and the remains of whose descendents, possibly, were found in the cave.

According to Dr. Tsum Um Nui's translations, one of the lines of the hieroglyphs read,

"The Dropas came down from the clouds in their aircraft. The men, women and children of the neighboring peoples (Ham) hid in the caves ten times before sunrise. When at last they understood the sign language of the Dropas, they realized that the newcomers had peaceful intentions...".

Another section of the writings expressed 'regret' by the Ham tribe that the aliens' spaceship had crash-landed in such a remote and inaccessible mountains and that there had been no way of building a new one to enable the Dropas to return to their own planet. In the years since the discovery of the first disk, archeologists and anthropologists had learned more about the isolated Bayan-Kara-Ula area. Much of what they learned seemed to corroborate the bizarre story recorded on the discs. Legend still preserved in the area spoke of small, gaunt, yellow faced men who 'came from the stars, long, long ago'.

Current Location
There are no completly intact stones known to remain in existance. The disks were supposedly stored in several museums in China. None of these museums report any traces of these disks, nor can any be found of those supposedly sent to USSR for analysis. In a museum in Cen, south of Guangzhou, a man informed of these disks inquired to the curator and photographed a display resembling the disks. However, the disks in the Cen museum disappeared from their display shortly after the photographs were taken.

They look like this:

1663790568056.png


From the Wikipedia: Dropa stones - Wikipedia

Russian examination​

Russian researchers requested the discs for studying, and allegedly several were shipped to Moscow. Once there, it is said that they were scraped for loose particles and put through a chemical analysis which revealed that they contained large amounts of cobalt and other metallic substances. As recorded in the Soviet magazine Sputnik, Dr. Vyacheslav Zaitsev describes an experiment where the discs were supposedly placed on a special turntable whereby they were shown to 'vibrate' or 'hum' in an unusual rhythm as though an electric charge was passing through them.[1]

Ernst Wegerer​

Supposedly, Ernst Wegerer (Wegener) was an Austrian engineer who, in 1974, visited the Banpo Museum in Xi'an, Shaanxi Province, where he saw two of the Dropa stones.[3] It is said that when he inquired about the discs the manager could tell him nothing, but permitted him to take one in his hand and photograph them up close. He claims that in his photos the hieroglyphs cannot be seen as they have been hidden by the flash from the camera and have also deteriorated. By 1994, the discs and the manager had disappeared from the museum.[4]

Publications​

A reference to the Dropa and Dropa stones is found in the July 1962 edition of the German vegetarian magazine Das vegetarische Universum.[5]

They are mentioned in the 1978 book Sungods in Exile by David Agamon (real name David A. Gamon). This book is written as if it were a documentary of a 1947 expedition with the scientist Karyl Robin-Evans. It follows his supposed travels into the secluded region of the Bayan Har mountain range where he finds dwarfish people called the Dropa. According to his book, the Dropa population consisted of a few hundred members all of which were approximately 4 feet (1.2 m) tall. Robin-Evans allegedly lived among the Dropa for half a year and during that time he learned their language and history, and also impregnated one of the Dropa women. He was told that they had crashed there long ago and that their ancestor had come from a planet in the Sirius constellation.[6] Gamon later revealed in the British publication Fortean Times that his book was his "favorite hoax" and a satire.[7]

In Japan, they were mentioned in 1996 when a translated version of Hartwig Hausdorf and Peter Krassa's Satelliten der Götter ('Satellites of the Gods') was released.[4]

Controversies​

It has been suggested that Tsum Um Nui is not a real Chinese name. There is no mention of him in China outside his connection to the Dropa stones.[citation needed] According to Dropa enthusiast Hartwig Hausdorf, Tsum Um Nui is a "former Japanese name, but adapted to Chinese language".[8] Nor is there any mention in any records about Chi Pu Tei's expedition in 1938.[citation needed]

Sungods in Exile with its account of Karyl Robin-Evans in all appearances gave credibility to Dropa stones until 1988 when David A. Gamon told Fortean Times magazine that the book was fiction and Karyl Robin-Evans' imaginary.[citation needed]

The stone discs were supposedly stored in various museums across China. However, none of these museums have any records or traces of Dropa stones ever being there.[citation needed]

According to the Gould-Parkinson system of transliteration,[dubious – discuss] drop-ka is Tibetan for "solitude" or "inhabitant of pasture lands". It is said to be the name of a tribe of Tibetan nomadic herders on the eastern Tibetan plateau.[3]

With Wegerer's photos lacking concrete evidence of the hieroglyphs, they display similarity to bì discs. Bì are round jade discs with holes in their centers. When buried in the earth, the minerals change them to be multi-colored. Bì have been dated to 3000 BCE and were common in what is now Shaanxi. Some bì are decorated with parallel grooves and other markings.[9]

I wonder if anyone knows anything more about them?
 
Alas! According to this webpage these stones are a hoax and pure fiction. Its main snippet reads:

The real story​

Although the story is rich in circumstantial detail, unlike so many in the Bad Archaeological literature, the detail turns out to be fiction. The earliest source for it is an article in Литературная газета (Literaturnaya Gazeta) of 9 February 1960, p 2, discussing the speculations of Matest M Agrest (1915-2005) that aliens might have visited earth in the remote past and left traces of their arrival. It was subsequently reprinted in its entirety as “Hypotheses, assumptions and guesses: does the trail lead into space?” by Valentin Isaakovich Rich and Mikhail Borisovy Chernenko in the magazine Новое Русское Слово (Current Digest of the Russian Press, a Russian language newspaper published in the USA since 1910, Volume 12 No 9 (30 March 1960), p 24-6). Intriguingly, this contained the story before the alleged date of Tsum Um Nui’s translation of the disks as related in later accounts. Some have suggested that Valentin Rich and Mikhail Chernenko never existed and were pseudonyms. However, they published a book in 1964, Сквозь магический кристалл: повесть о мысли (‘Through the Magic Crystal: a story of ideas’), on artificial diamonds, while Valentin Rich published Охота за элементами (‘The hunt for the elements’) in 1982 and В поисках элементов (‘In search of the elements’) in 1985 and so they appear to have been genuine popular science writers.

Two years later, the story turned up in the July 1962 edition Das Vegetarische Universum, a German vegetarian magazine, which published a story attributed to a Reinhardt Wegemann called Ufos in der Vorzeit? Die Hieroglyphen von Baian-Kara-Ula (‘Ufos in ancient times? The hieroglyphs of Bayan Kara Ula’). Intriguingly, the story is attributed to a news agency DINA, Tokyo; this is neither General Pinochet’s secret police nor the Mexican lorry manufacturer, so it is unclear what the acronym represents (it looks as if it could be the Deutsche Internationale Nachrichtenagentur, although if the agency ever existed, it has left no trace). The same story, from the same (apparently non-existent) news agency, again credited to Reinhardt Wegemann, was published in UFO-Nachrichten, a German UFO magazine, in July 1964. However, no trace of Reinhardt Wegemann can be found outside the story as published in Das Vegetarische Universum. The Belgian UFO organization BUFOI published a French translation in the March-April 1965 edition of its newsletter (number 4), to be followed by a Russian translation in 1967, bringing the story full circle.

The Russian translation was condensed by Vyacheslav Zaitsev in the English language magazine Sputnik: the Russian Digest dating from 1967, where it was called ‘Visitors from outer space: science versus fiction’. Sputnik is a sensationalistic magazine similar to Britain’s Daily Sport and the USA’s National Inquirer (please note that you may not be able to see its pages outside the USA).

What can we make of all this? Firstly, that the story has a very, very dubious pedigree. A speculative article by a pair of science writers seems to have been expanded by an unknown writer into the story published in the name of Reinhardt Wegemann in 1962. Whoever was behind this seems to have been disappointed by the poor take up of the story (a page in a vegetarian newspaper can hardly have had the impact the author of the hoax would have wanted), so he pushed it out again in 1964. Although rewritten, there is a clue in the text that it was originally prepared two years previously: it describes the expedition in which Chi Pu Tei discovered the discs as having occurred forty-five years previously, which would have placed in 1939, rather than 1937 as originally claimed. It seems that 1964 was a better year for tall tales involving crashed UFOs, as the story was taken up in a variety of publications. It was through one of these that Vyacheslav Zaitsev’s popularisation made it known to a wider world, including the up-and-coming Erich von Däniken. From there, the story blossomed, giving rise to at least two works of fiction, one of which was to foist the non-existent Lolladoff Plate on the gullible through the fictional Sungods in Exile.
 
Alas! According to this webpage these stones are a hoax and pure fiction. Its main snippet reads:

If Keith Fitzpatrick-Matthews of Bad Archeology is the main obstacle to the veracity of these stones the verdict on them may still be out.

He sneers at Immanuel Velikovsky ("who proposed Venus originating as a comet and Mars having a close encounter with earth") as being a creationist, mentions Atlantis as an 'obvious but still believed fraud', challenges the existence of pyramids at Cydonia on Mars, and mocks ancient maps showing Antarctica, hinting at but not mentioning the Piri Reis Map.

One of his conclusions on his site (concerning Velikovsky)
Generally the reason why mainstream scholars ignore their work is much more simple: despite what many people believe, academics do not have the time to read rubbish!
He should have been reading Pierre's latest work.

What a dreary and uninformed kind of guy.
 
If Keith Fitzpatrick-Matthews of Bad Archeology is the main obstacle to the veracity of these stones the verdict on them may still be out.
Thanks for jumping in and setting the record straight. His website emerged prominently during a Google search and I'm not knowing enough about this subject to make a fair assessment, apparently. Sorry for the noise. :-[

However, I would gladly take note of your opinion on these stones (if you have one). You didn't mention anything substantively about them.
 
Thanks for jumping in and setting the record straight. His website emerged prominently during a Google search and I'm not knowing enough about this subject to make a fair assessment, apparently. Sorry for the noise. :-[

However, I would gladly take note of your opinion on these stones (if you have one). You didn't mention anything substantively about them.

I remember reading about the Dropa stones more than fifty years ago in one of the books by journalist Robert Charroux which I found very fascinating at the time.

Wikipedia states

(..) writing in his book Lost Worlds Charroux rejected evolution, instead he argued for human devolution. Charroux claimed that man is regressing and was superior in the past; he claimed that "Atlantis and Mu are not dreams of spiritualists, but realities of a mysterious era". He further explained that the Atlantans and Hyperboreans were the ancestors of modern humans, and the first humans on earth were originally aliens.

He must have had a connection with French intelligence, since about twenty years before the Roswell story was seeping through he told readers that humans have been in contact with ET's using flying saucers. He even proclaimed that a group of very small off-world creatures was using craft that were prone to malfunction. He wrote that in the late 1960's.

Concerning the Dropa stones he might have got the story from the Russian scientist Mr. Saitsev, who made the story popular in 1968. My impression at the time was that the scientists were trying to gather information that might have been stored on these stone discs like on 'records' (there were no compact discs back then).

Since the original find was made in 1938 I tend not to consider it as a hoax but will the files and finds have survived the events in Maoist China? True or false, the story seems to have faded in to obscurity.
 
Thanks for your explanation and the additional links. :cool2:

Since the original find was made in 1938 I tend not to consider it as a hoax but will the files and finds have survived the events in Maoist China?
I, for one, will remain undecided either way but I'm prepared to give them the benefit of the doubt.

I guess it's very unlikely that anything of this nature survived the so-called 'cultural' revolution of the late 1960's and early 1970's.
 
I'm reading a little book from the Yugoslav era called "They also visited us..." by Jovan Knežević, published in 1976.
In the chapter about the mystery of Povlen's balls he writes a few sentences about Dropa stones.
……………
They look like this:
47463-8aa7ce620a2eb216bef769929dec891c.jpg

…………… anything more about them?

They make sense to me… I don’t think it is a hoax, at least not for good part. That’s perhaps because they remind me of some myths and (involved) somewhat similar artifacts like the ancient Chinese “Bi disks”—showed next— that used to be made in jade:
lossy-page1-471px-Jade_Bi_Ornament%2C_Dragon_designs%2C_China_-_Warring_States_period%2C_Western_Han_dynasty%2C_4th-2nd_century_BC.tiff.jpg

Bi disk — 202 BC to 220 AD period​
640px-Bi_with_two_dragons_and_grain_pattern.jpg

Bi disk (c. 481 BC) with 2 lateral dragons

Some traditional “Bi-disks” —said to mean ‘Sky disks,’ and claimed as old as 3,400 BC— have their surfaces with a hexagonal pattern (top photo) and are told to represent sky deities and the 4 directions. Indeed they are understood as closely connected to the cosmological creation seen in the imagery of some Chinese dynasties.

In addition, for another specific example, some thoughts and these mentioned features call me to the Nebra Sky Disk, that is a disk found in Germany and claimed from 1,600 BC:
488px-Nebra_Scheibe.jpg

Nebra Sky Disk​

Made of bronze, the Nebra Sky Disk is inlaid with golden symbols. Some of those are interpreted as a sun, a lunar crescent, 33 stars —included the Pleiades— and (originally) 2 arcs along the sides marking the angle between the Solstices.

Okay, back to the supposed Dropa inscription: “The Dropas came down from the clouds in their aircraft. The men, women and children of the neighboring peoples hid in the caves ten times before sunrise...." It seems to me that the translator confused the words’ sequence. My wild guess would be ’.…people —“Dropas,”not the local Han people— hid in the 10 caves at times before sunrise.’

At last, but not least, regarding on these particular ancient objects and their symbology, they ignite in my mind —like a fluorescent sign— certain passages of some Sessions:
May 2, 1998 Session

A: It is not the people but the message, the artifacts hold the key.
……………….

November 28, 1998 Session
A: Ever feel as if you are dancing around in circles?
 

Trending content

Back
Top Bottom