Friends with babies - vaccination woes.

[manitoban]

This leads me to thinking that maybe there is an energetic transfer/sharing going on.

When talking about an unwanted subject, (vaccinations for instance) with an aggressively resistant person or group, what happens to this energy/information flow then?

I am pondering this because I don't just see brain freeze in the recipient , but in myself as well during such discussions.

It's like a feeling of disorientation or 'stuckness'. Where the information I try to share suddenly feels like it really may be false and feeble, despite my knowing all the facts line up.

My friend was able to understand the ideas behind Virology that I'd shared with her, but found herself unable to express them or even bring them up in the presence of doctors and Official Medicine.

I wonder if this isn't an ephemeral kind of 3D reality-creation, just not as pronounced as the variable reality described at 4th density, where what you wish for becomes solid?

What happens when two 4th Density beings disagree on what form their immediate reality should take?

Fwiw, I think that what may be happening when we too, experience the brain freeze/stuckness, is our own programs kicking in. Even though we are aware of the truth, we have still received much of the same programming such as obey authority, doctor knows best, etc. And this programming gets triggered to some extent, (an energy transfer) when we are with people who strongly hold those beliefs, so we get stuck ourselves. And like any program, it takes a lot of energy to hold your ground, so to speak, when it gets triggered.

 

[Woodsman]

Fwiw, I think that what may be happening when we too, experience the brain freeze/stuckness, is our own programs kicking in. Even though we are aware of the truth, we have still received much of the same programming such as obey authority, doctor knows best, etc. And this programming gets triggered to some extent, (an energy transfer) when we are with people who strongly hold those beliefs, so we get stuck ourselves. And like any program, it takes a lot of energy to hold your ground, so to speak, when it gets triggered.

Yeah. The "authority figure in a lab coat with a clip board" response. We've all been heavily programmed to react in a specific way to that image. Especially when such a person speaks with absolute confidence.

I suppose one tactic to use in such situations would be to recognize the program, stop and think, "Okay. I'm auto-reacting to this stimulus. Let's stop right here and listen to the words being spoken and compare them to what I've learned and deliberately organize my thoughts on a fact for fact basis. Move forward one step at a time."

The other one would be to simply refuse to engage in debate. Just politely say "No" as often as is required to get out the door. "I'm not going to enter into a debate with you."

"It's selfish to rely on the herd for your immunity."

"Perhaps. Perhaps not. I'm not going to debate that with you."

"Don't you love your child enough to give them the protection they need?"

"Of course I do. Oh, look at the time. I've got to get going."

"Well, how do you plan to protect your child?"

"I'm sure we'll work something out."

"Well, science overwhelmingly agrees that vaccination is the best protection."

"That's very interesting. Where did I put my coat? Ah. There it is."

"We will make a note then that you refused vaccination for your child. Are you aware that there may be serious consequences?"

"Absolutely. Thank-you for your time. Good bye."

 

[3DStudent]

The freeze up thing I can relate to. It could be that I just have a hard time explaining things, that I don't know them myself well enough and cannot explain them to a 7 year old. But I think it's when you start to cast your line so to speak and reveal some truth, and then you realize that they're not buying it. So you try to lie, back up, or steer the conversation somewhere else. This causes a bit of hesitation as you think yourself back to consensus reality. I've noticed that doctors can be stubborn if you try to counter their misconceptions, so I just agree and answer vaguely.

It's interesting describing it as a "reality bubble". There really seems to be an energetic aspect to it.

 

[Konstantin]

Fwiw, I think that what may be happening when we too, experience the brain freeze/stuckness, is our own programs kicking in. Even though we are aware of the truth, we have still received much of the same programming such as obey authority, doctor knows best, etc. And this programming gets triggered to some extent, (an energy transfer) when we are with people who strongly hold those beliefs, so we get stuck ourselves. And like any program, it takes a lot of energy to hold your ground, so to speak, when it gets triggered.

Yeah. The "authority figure in a lab coat with a clip board" response. We've all been heavily programmed to react in a specific way to that image. Especially when such a person speaks with absolute confidence.

I suppose one tactic to use in such situations would be to recognize the program, stop and think, "Okay. I'm auto-reacting to this stimulus. Let's stop right here and listen to the words being spoken and compare them to what I've learned and deliberately organize my thoughts on a fact for fact basis. Move forward one step at a time."

The other one would be to simply refuse to engage in debate. Just politely say "No" as often as is required to get out the door. "I'm not going to enter into a debate with you."

"It's selfish to rely on the herd for your immunity."

"Perhaps. Perhaps not. I'm not going to debate that with you."

"Don't you love your child enough to give them the protection they need?"

"Of course I do. Oh, look at the time. I've got to get going."

"Well, how do you plan to protect your child?"

"I'm sure we'll work something out."

"Well, science overwhelmingly agrees that vaccination is the best protection."

"That's very interesting. Where did I put my coat? Ah. There it is."

"We will make a note then that you refused vaccination for your child. Are you aware that there may be serious consequences?"

"Absolutely. Thank-you for your time. Good bye."

I have seen myself a parent's who knows for sure that their child have a big vaccine damage. It have a diabetes.They have made a lot of researching and lot of consultations with medical persons from abroad, and they are sure that that condition is made by a vaccine. BUT THEY STILL VACCINATE THE CHILD.They said they are using acellular vaccines, but its almost the same. ITs a great example how our programs work even when we have the facts in front of our eyes. Very sad , but very true.

 

[Henchman 21]

This topic has recently been a source of vexation for me as well! I feel like there has been a sudden influx of interest stirred by news stories. "A pertussis outbreak in traverse city! Why do people refuse vaccination?" Whenever I hear these stories, my first question is, "how do you know those kids weren't vaccinated?" And it usually boils down to assumptions made based on "the type of people" who live in any given community. My most recent efforts to question vaccine promoters resulted in my daughter being labelled "toxic spawn," and that was followed by the suggestion that I should castrate myself. Honest to god. Then of course, there's the intellectual attack, which assumes if you don't believe in vaccination, you lack understanding of simple science. It is simply impossible to share information with a creature that is deathly afraid of the measles. And fair enough. This is all about the agenda to take control of our blood.
On another note, acceptance is key it helps to remember that no incarnation can be "screwed up" if we truly came here to learn lessons. Our specific personal challenges don't need to be viewed as "sins of the father," even if that was the means. Perhaps it is the soul contract of the child that drives the parent to act against common sense. And I don't mean to rationalize the evils of the world- I only mean to find the most helpful understanding I can. Thoughts?

 

[Josi]

It is so frustrating how complete the programing is. Below is a article from Raw Story where the herd hysteria is running rampant against anti-vaxxers. Read the comments after the article. Sigh! :(

Sick privilege: Wealthy anti-vaxxers are driving outbreaks of deadly 19th century diseases
_http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2015/01/sick-privilege-wealthy-anti-vaxxers-are-driving-outbreaks-of-deadly-19th-century-diseases/comments/

 

[Menna]

Some are more effective than others

The most effective is when they are ready. Might want to change the approach of you to them and focus on them to you. Looking and recognizing signs of when and how others ask for help in their own way then see where your advice fits in the situation. Or you can casually make a statement about said knowledge and then back off if they don't continue in that direction. Otherwise....Eh IMO

 

[MusicMan]

I think, in my opinion, that the problem is with multiple virus injections, which is one injection with several viruses in it. If they don't get you the first time, they make you come back and have another go with a 'booster'.

Never mind all the adjuvants and possibly live viruses running around in them, and Aluminium and other pollutants.

If a child is being injected with multiple viruses all at once, then there are going to be some that have a lowered immune system which will be overwhelmed, and suffer some kind of consequence.

MMR is one such vaccine, and has been hotly debated on the Autism issue.

You have Measles, Mumps and Rubella running around in your system at the same time, AND the adjuvent attenuates/suppresses your immune response, what do you think will happen?

From my own point of view, and because I was in the Navy I had every injection going, I will never have another injection, as I consider them too dangerous, even for me.

I feel sorry for all the parents who are being subjected to this peer group pressure, and Government legislation. Even child care centres are refusing admission to those who are unvaccinated.

But I feel even more for the next generation of children who are going to be subjected to this invasion of their very being, perhaps affecting their chromosomes and future generations.

For clarification, this is my opinion, I have no medical qualifications.
Do your own research.
You could start with Gulf War Syndrome, and consider all those guys who went to Iraq/Afghanistan, and had to have Anthrax shots.

 

[HifromGrace]

Yeah. Offer the information (several times in several ways), then stand back. It's not my fault if it is then ignored. Sure.

This kind of thinking is rather too well within my grasp. As I learn more, it becomes altogether too easy to see people as mechanical and unaware, as simple action/reaction machines. Also, it feels good to not feel pain. However, I very much don't want to *not* feel pain or compassion. I *want* to be able to feel other people's pain (and joys). I think the reasons for this are obvious, especially around here. So.., balance.

Woodsman, I can relate to the weight of your heartache.

I have no words of advice or encouragement, just compassion and comrodery.

Whenever I find out that a close friend vaccinates, I have to use everything within me to stop the room from spinning and my palms sweating and running out of the room. I can now count on one hand all those who don't now - I thought it was a lot more.

I just found out another one vaccinates last week, so it's front of mind for me, it's heartbreaking. Part of the cognative dissonance, for me, is that it's someone I love & respect - it's not someone that I can just write off. And it's someone who also thinks deeply, again, can't just write her off, although she doesn't think deeply about medical issues.

I get it, how people don't have the time to look into issues (& I'm like you Woodsman, have been looking into this for about 10 years and am the most educated one in our social group on this topic)... but I just can't handle it. Frankly, I just want to slam the computer shut and go dissociate with a novel.

I live in a good bubble at home (as in a husband who is on the same page about parenting & medical concerns) - but we all live in the world at large, I have a community I love and am surrounded by people I respect... but I still have to put on this air of falseness around friends that I don't completely agree with.

Do we all have to agree with one another??? Not really, I get it (intellectually). But this damn topic of vaccinations is such a profound representation of so many evils. It's such a deep symbol for me, and I don't know how to not react so strongly to it.

Or is it like I quoted above - perhaps I, too, am not that person who wants to be cut of from disgust, fear, compassion, worry and love. Thank god I'm not that person? Or am I just a puppet, like someone deeply believing in our sham elections and being simply drained by psychopaths?

I don't constantly live in this state of intensity, I used to be, and I'm grateful that I'm not. I wonder if this is some type of deep control program running through me - a need to control the people around me?

I'd like to think it's just part of being a caring and aware human.

I think I need to take to heart what another person said up further - use this hugeness productively, aim it in a different direction where it might be heard (article or poem). Or at least reach out to a few of my like-minded friends so that I have a sanity check.

 

[Konstantin]

This topic has recently been a source of vexation for me as well! I feel like there has been a sudden influx of interest stirred by news stories. "A pertussis outbreak in traverse city! Why do people refuse vaccination?" Whenever I hear these stories, my first question is, "how do you know those kids weren't vaccinated?" And it usually boils down to assumptions made based on "the type of people" who live in any given community. My most recent efforts to question vaccine promoters resulted in my daughter being labelled "toxic spawn," and that was followed by the suggestion that I should castrate myself. Honest to god. Then of course, there's the intellectual attack, which assumes if you don't believe in vaccination, you lack understanding of simple science. It is simply impossible to share information with a creature that is deathly afraid of the measles. And fair enough. This is all about the agenda to take control of our blood.
On another note, acceptance is key it helps to remember that no incarnation can be "screwed up" if we truly came here to learn lessons. Our specific personal challenges don't need to be viewed as "sins of the father," even if that was the means. Perhaps it is the soul contract of the child that drives the parent to act against common sense. And I don't mean to rationalize the evils of the world- I only mean to find the most helpful understanding I can. Thoughts?

I will tell you how we are trying to show resistance here.
I live in Macedonia. Vaccination is Mandatory here. Few parents made a group and we made a lawsuit to Constitutional Court because many parts of the law for mandatory vaccination were totally opposite with the constitution , and the basic human rights.
( We were asking the vaccination to be non mandatory.)

For example: The right to accept or not accept specific medical procedure or intervention.Vaccination is a medical procedure or intervention.So when we started we hired a good lawyer, but we still know that out lawsuit will fail because of the corruption of the judicial system here. On the key points in the health care department in the government , there are people who have a huge material benefits from pharmaceutical companies.So its all clear that they will defend their positions.
By the way a lot of them never vaccinate their own children.I have a friend who works in a hospital and i get that information from him

Then in some schools the names of the children whose parents refuse shots for their children , were published on a boards in the middle of the schools. We sent a protesting letters to all those schools where we quoted some basic laws and
rights from our constitution that the what they are doing is just a simple discrimination, and we threatened with lawsuit to every school who will do that again.
According to many studies vaccinated children are the main reason for many illness outbreaks.

http://www.cidd.psu.edu/research/synopses/acellular-vaccine-enhancement-b.-parapertussis

So , all this things are just a very small steps.Education and real knowledge about danger from vaccines is the real weapons against this evil.On the pages of SOTT, there are lot of material about that.

I`m trying to protect my children from that evil too. Its a hard fight but i don't have other option about that.Connect, network with other people and try to find a way how to protect our own children.


Many parents who refuse vaccines have a court lawsuits, and if that is their first refuse they will get only a warning from the judge not to refuse the shot next time. So when next time the parent refuses the shot they are financially punished and the penalties are quite high.

This is not even close to free and normal society, but we must find a way to learn and to restore the normal society. We all know how that pharma gang and their psychopathic puppets in the government are working.

If you read the laura`s article on SOTT, you will find the description of how this works.

http://www.sott.net/article/291441-Bizarro-World

On our every step they made 10 more steps in bringing more and more repressive laws for mandatory vaccination. Its a hard job to live a normal life in a place where from every possible direction psychopathic creatures are attacking the normal human beings and their basic rights.

 

[HifromGrace]

She said, "The doctors and people sound so sure and I forget what I was going to say and I was just coming from a long day at work, and my husband wasn't there, and I'd been up all night..."

As I think on it now... I don't think it was that she was ignoring my advice and input. It was that she was bullied, energetically coerced.

It almost feels like there needs to be an advocacy system in place for such moments.

Thank-you, Fluffy for bringing this into focus.

Hi Woodsman, I'm coming to you with practical information this time around since your friend doesn't seem to need education.

Have her consider forgoing any further Wellness Visits. The child is past the 3 month mark and is clearly emotionally and physically healthy & if he didn't have proper weight gain and body fat, they would already be addressing this issue.

So that long string of office visits is NOT mandatory. It's set up purely for the vaccination rhythm.

If the child uses daycare (as we had to), state vaccination mandates are carried out through the daycares - as in they get fined if their records are not up to date. Were I live, in Wisconsin, if you flip over that record sheet there is an actual check box to state that you are opting out (no feigning of religious exemption necessary here). I used to use a bright highlighter marker to mark it (so the administrator would quit calling me to update his files).

What we did to not be harrassed by doctors & nurses about the vaccinations was to drive 45 minutes out of town to a naturalpath. It's an absurd distance to drive when I have several hospital centers within a stones throw away from my home. It was well worth it.

Consider providing her a list of non-vax friendly offices. Don't just suggest to her to go do it herself (with all due respect, she's clearly overwhelmed & overworked - I get it, I worked full time up until recently too. There's no time for anything extra). You can typically find a list by joining some natural mothering group locally on line - people are very generous about sharing this type of helpful information.

If she ends up in the same predicament we did, with a 45 minute drive (to be fair, I have since found conventional docs locally that are non-vax friendly - but we never go to the doctor, so I have not established services, my son is 7 now), consider offering an invitation to drive their son yourself. It's not at all uncommon that someone else takes the kid, like a grandparent or nanny.

Here's another piece of practical information for her - if she does have to take her son to the emergency room, simply LIE. State that "yes, my son is up to date on all vaccinations, thanks for asking," just to get through the door with peace. If it comes up later that she lied, cross that bridge when you get there, they can't treat/threaten you any worse than they would have anyway in such a high stress & vulnerable situation.


Now from the angle of mitigating any potential damage - look on our forum the list of supplements to take (sorry, I don't have the time today to look up the links for you) & print out for her (vs send a link, so she can take the list to the store) . In all practical purposes, I'm not sure how you can get a 4 mo old to take much of anything - but there is a huge market for liquid kid vits.

She could supplement her pumped breast milk or formula (or make homemade formula, I highly recommend it. Look here at the Weston Price Foundation http://www.westonaprice.org/childrens-health/ they have the right fat profiles. I used it as a filler for when my son was transitioning to solid foods, I did not feel that the adult foods, which were high fat & protein (not starch & grain based) were enough for him to eat. that site link is great for that info too, if she isn't already in the know about how important good fats are for immune system & neurological development & mood & intelligence.)

I wonder if the mother is breast feeding, that if she supplemented her own diet with the damage neutralizing supplements, that they may come through her milk to her son? Probably does.


Oh, and a last thing, (disclaimer, I don't pretend to "know" you as an individual, so please don't get me wrong as sounding condescending or presumptuous - the upcoming advice stems from reminders to myself, to stay in the mind frame of compassion, respect & dignity for the other person & staying helpful/useful... vs, I can flip out, become argumentative, aggressive and fear mongering.) Come with the sentiment having compassion for how damn hard her situation is - all of it, working, sleeplessness, doctor harassment, it's horrible. I think you already processed this from your perspective & initial post, her situation has nothing to do with you (as in taking your advice, etc.), she just needs a friend to lean on, she knows what the better choices are already.