Gurdjieff and Ouspensky

[Psalehesost]

The way "faith" is understood - or rather misunderstood is perhaps a big source of problems.

The definition in the Esoteric Glossary is relevant to this question. What most people refer to as 'faith' fits its description of 'belief': "firmly deciding that the world is a certain way and holding fast to this view even in the face of evidence to the contrary", or "attempting to force one's model on the world". So in 'belief', the believer has already made up his/her mind, so there is really no regard for truth. Regardless of whether the belief happens to be correct or not (really a matter of chance or accident), belief involves a form of subjectivity and internal considering.

By contrast, 'faith' as defined by the Esoteric Glossary is pretty much the exact opposite, an openness to and trust in the process of inquiry itself, however it unfolds and wherever it leads. So in 'faith', there is faith in reality, rather than attempting to impose what one wishes to be true on reality.

In short, 'faith' is conducive to objectivity while 'belief' prevents it. But very few make this distinction between 'faith' and 'belief', perhaps not even having the concept of 'faith' as defined by the Esoteric Glossary.

 

[rymw]

Meaningful observations, Menna, Obvyatel, and Psalehesost, thank you.
I can't agree more, and your collective comments serves to further reinforce the notion of just how complex the 4th way is for it demands that we scrutinize each and every aspect of our many believes, and yes, even faith in order that we might ultimately filter out the trash that has been perpetrated for aeons that so many of us are still falling prey to day on day. IMHO, if and only if we are 'attuned', for want of a better word, to the correct way of instilling faith as described by Palehesost can we see thru the veil. But even that tuning process, I believe depends on the seed as recently mentioned by the C's that was or was not implanted in us...as the C's too had said back then, those who are encoded will feel it and I trust that feeling guides one thru muck and mire. How else can we explain for the millions of people out there purportedly serving the world with knowledge, ideas and whatnot but who are still sleepwalking even at this troubling hour...