Hajj stampede: Death toll in Mecca rises

Re: Hajj stampede: Death toll in Mecca rises to 717 people killed, 863 injured

gdpetti said:
Zeep, you should have sott.net put that up on their site, makes a good whodunit and why.

I'm sure if any content I post is deemed worthy, than it would make its way to Sott in some form. Meanwhile, Dr. Ezzat's books have been featured on Veterans Today & strongly contested by another VT contributor, Jonas E. Alexis - a very hard-core Christian believer (he SO didn't want to hear about Caesar is Jesus or that there was no historical evidence of Jesus' existence). He's been writing nonstop articles re Zionism & its general mandated destruction of moral/Christian culture in particular. Here's the link to his rebuttal of Ezzat's work:

_http://www.veteranstoday.com/2015/05/03/egypt-knew-no-pharaohs-nor-israelites/

I so appreciate that one can generally post links here whereas the VT comment section limits to one link which will automatically put you in 'moderation' cyberspace for sometimes an almost interminable length of time. And if they really don't like your link (or even description - the youtube of something zipping past the Twin Towers on 911 & what it might have been for instance) it can be permanently disappeared even after intially posting.

Mod edit: link deactivated
 
Re: Hajj stampede: Death toll in Mecca rises to 717 people killed, 863 injured

Some better news for Muslims:

Moscow's biggest mosque reopens, with President Putin praising Muslim leaders in Russia for their resistance to extremism.

Moscow inaugurates the biggest mosque in Europe [Eng Subs]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QPI-5ACQ4Tg

_85700879_85700878.jpg

The rebuilt Jum'ah mosque will accommodate 10,000 worshippers
 
Re: Hajj stampede: Death toll in Mecca rises to 717 people killed, 863 injured

Indeed, another unfortunate incident.

Toll from Hajj stampede outside Mecca reaches 2,000: Sources
http://www.presstv.ir/Detail/2015/09/25/430691/Hajj-Mecca-Stampede-Irans-Hajj-and-Pilgrimage-Organization-Saeed-Ohadi-Saudi-Arabia

“Based on the latest announcement by Saudi Arabia’s officials, the number of those who were killed in the Mina incident is around 2,000,” Saeed Ohadi said on Friday.

‘Prince’s convoy’

The incident occurred on Thursday, after huge pilgrim processions were joined in their course, leading to the catastrophic entanglement.
It has been reported that the convoy of Prince Mohammad bin Salman Al Saud, the son of Saudi King Salman bin Abdulaziz, had arrived at the site, forcing the pilgrims to change their original directions.

Ohadi added that imprudence, irresponsibility and mismanagement of Saudi authorities are the main factors behind the tragic incident in Mina. He said the Saudi army blocked access to all medical centers Thursday evening.

The Iranian official said four committees have been tasked to investigate the latest situation of the Iranian pilgrims wounded in the event.
 
Re: Hajj stampede: Death toll in Mecca rises to 717 people killed, 863 injured

Hum...

111 death when the crane fell on people in Mecca on 9/11 in the Gregorian calendar.

717 death on 9/24 which is in the Julian calendar the... 9/11.

717 deays apart between 9/24/15 and 9/11/17...

Pure random coincidence.

How good is gematria? :/
 
Re: Hajj stampede: Death toll in Mecca rises to 717 people killed, 863 injured

http://www.sott.net/article/302687-Europes-biggest-mosque-ablaze-More-than-70-firefighters-tackling-huge-fire-in-South-London

One man as been taken to hospital as much of the building, which can hold up to 10,000 worshippers, is up in flames

More than 70 firefighters are tackling a huge blaze at a mosque in South London.

Most of Baitul Futuh - said to be the largest mosque in Western Europe - is on fire, according to the fire service.

London Fire Brigade sent eight fire engines to the scene in Morden just after midday.
[...]
The £15million mosque can hold up to 10,000 people and opened in 2003.

It was built by Britain's Ahmadiyya Muslim community who opened London's first mosque nearly 80 years ago.

This on the heels of the suicide bombing of a mosque in Yemen:

Yemen suicide bombing in Sanaa mosque 'kills 25'

A suicide bomb attack on a mosque in Yemen's capital Sanaa has left at least 25 people dead and wounded at least 36.

Two explosions struck the al-Balili mosque as worshippers were performing prayers for the Eid al-Adha festival.

The so-called Islamic State (IS) militant group said it had carried out the bombing.

The attack comes two days after Yemen's President Abdrabbuh Mansour Hadi returned to the southern city of Aden from exile in Saudi Arabia.

He had fled in March following gains by Houthi rebels, who have since been targeted by a Saudi-led coalition.

The coalition, along with loyalist forces, have pushed back the Houthis from some areas, including Aden.

However the Houthis - Shia Muslim rebels from the north of the country - still control the capital.

The UN says almost 4,900 people, including more than 2,200 civilians, have been killed in Yemen in fighting on the ground and air strikes since 26 March.

Read more:
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-34344648

Crane collapse - stampede - fire - suicide bombing > :cry:

Eid al-Adha - the festival of sacrifice - is celebrated by Muslims worldwide.

It honours the willingness of Abraham to sacrifice his son as an act of submission to God's will.
 
Re: Hajj stampede: Death toll in Mecca rises to 717 people killed, 863 injured

http://english.farsnews.com/newstext.aspx?nn=13940707001697

Iraqi Official: Riyadh Plotted Mina Tragedy to Abduct Iranian, Iraqi Officials
 
Trouble in the Saudi King-dumb. Wonder, if one of the factors (among a wide-selection) of ousting King Salman might be pressure related to the recent Hajj disaster? Their "dynasty" reminds me of a giant octopus - where the hands are all related but one doesn't know what the other is doing? Prince Ahmed, who the royal household support in inheriting the position - seems to be more educated with a disposition towards diplomatic relations. If the Saudi Government could reverse their proxy war in Yemen, it would ease up tensions in Iran.

Saudi Arabia: Eight of King Salman's 11 surviving brothers want to oust him
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/saudi-arabia-power-struggle-between-king-salman-and-mohammed-bin-salman-could-bring-down-the-a6706801.html

A growing number of members of the royal household support a move to oust King Salman and replace him with his younger brother.

Eight of the 12 surviving sons of Saudi Arabia’s founding monarch are supporting a move to oust King Salman, 79, the country’s ailing ruler, and replace him with his 73-year-old brother, according to a dissident prince.

The prince also claims that a clear majority of the country’s powerful Islamic clerics, known as the Ulama, would back a palace coup to oust the current King and install Prince Ahmed bin Abdulaziz, a former Interior Minister, in his place. “The Ulama and religious people prefer Prince Ahmed – not all of them, but 75 per cent,” said the prince, himself a grandson of King Ibn Saud, who founded the ruling dynasty in 1932.

Support from the clerics would be vital for any change of monarch, since in the Saudi system only they have the power to confer religious and therefore political legitimacy on the leadership.

The revelation suggests there is increasing pressure within the normally secretive Saudi royal family to bring to a head the internal power struggle that has erupted since King Salman inherited the throne at the beginning of this year. The prince, who cannot be named for security reasons, is the author of two recently published letters calling for the royal family to replace the current Saudi leadership.

In 1964 King Saud was finally deposed after a long power struggle, when the majority of senior royal family members and the Kingdom’s religious establishment spoke with one voice and withdrew their support. The prince says something similar is going to happen again soon.

“Either the King will leave Saudi Arabia, like King Saud, and he will be very respected inside and outside the country,” he told The Independent. “Alternatively Prince Ahmed will become Crown Prince, but with control of and responsibility for the whole country – the economy, oil, armed forces, national guard, interior ministry, secret service, in fact everything from A to Z.”

Unhappiness at King Salman’s own diminishing faculties – he is reported to be suffering from Alzheimer’s disease – has been compounded by his controversial appointments, the continuing and costly war in Yemen and the recent Hajj disaster. Earlier this week the International Monetary Fund warned that Saudi Arabia may run out of financial assets within five years unless the government sharply curbs its spending, because of a combination of low oil prices and the economic impact of regional wars.

The King’s appointment of his favourite son, Mohammed bin Salman, 30, to the novel post of Deputy Crown Prince in April, and the decision to make him Defence Minister – enabling him to launch a proxy war in Yemen against the Iranian-backed Houthi rebels who forced the pro-Saudi former President to flee – have heightened tensions. He is said to have assumed too much power and wealth since being elevated to this position.
“Any paper or phone call to his father goes through him,” said the prince. The current Crown Prince, Mohammed bin Nayef, 56, a nephew of King Salman, is also unpopular.

Prince Ahmed, the man most family members support to take over the throne, is the youngest son of the Kingdom’s founder by his favourite wife, Hassa bint Ahmed Al Sudairi. He was deputy interior minister for 37 years and spent four years responsible for the religious sites in Mecca before being appointed Interior Minister in 2012.

He left the post five months later, officially at his own request, and was replaced by Prince Mohammed bin Nayef, now the Crown Prince. The dissident prince claims Prince Ahmed left after a disagreement about the treatment of political detainees.

“Prince Ahmed wants to introduce reforms like freedom of thought, cleaning up the justice system and freeing political prisoners who don’t have anything to do with terrorism,” he said.

“Many political prisoners have been in prison since before 2001 because of their wise opinion and their moderate Islamic views. If Prince Ahmed has the authority he will allow such people out.”

Prince Ahmed, who has a Master’s degree in political science, is favoured by clerics and by others within the royal family because of his professional experience and moderate lifestyle, according to the prince. “The eldest brothers want him because he is healthy and wise, and he has been clean all his life. He is not in trouble with gambling, women, drink or drugs.

“Prince Ahmed likes the desert, hunting and sitting by the Red Sea or in Taif, by the mountains. He is religious but open-minded, he knows English and follows the world news.”

The current King’s third wife, Fahda Al Hithlain, is said by the prince to be another key figure. “She is Mohammed bin Salman’s mother and has influence on his father,” he said. “The King is in love with her and so he is in love with Mohammed bin Salman.” However, because of ill health she has reportedly spent little time in Saudi Arabia recently.

The struggle to remove King Saud took several years and led to tension between Saudi Arabia’s main armed organisations – the army, interior ministry and national guard – before finally he left without bloodshed. The prince expects the same will happen this time. “It is a kind of internal revolution. We want financial and political reform, freedom of thought and cleaning the justice system, freeing the political prisoners and proper Islamic sharia,” he said.

The Saudi embassy in London did not respond to a request for comment.
 
Not from a source anybody likes, but . . .

Saudis and Israeli’s Stage Hajj Stampede in Terror Plot

Dozens of diplomats, scientists and political leaders from Iran, Iraq, Syria and Lebanon are missing, presumed dead or kidnapped from Saudi Arabia after this year’s Hajj as part of a joint terror plot by Israel and Saudi Arabia that killed thousands.

Officials sources from both Iraq and Iran are accusing Saudi Arabia, in concert with the security services of the State of Israel, for staging the Mina stampede during this year’s Hajj. Despite Saudi claims to the contrary, no estimate of the dead and “missing” totals less than 3500 with the current comprehensive list of missing reaching nearly 9000.

High level security sources tell of how Saudi Arabia and Israel screened visa applications months in advance in order to single out targeted individuals.

"From an anonymous security source: “Some were picked up before the the Mina incident while others were kidnapped at hotels or the airport. When the chaos began, teams of Saudi and Israeli security officials disguised as pilgrims equipped small canisters a poisonous gas or liquid, began taking down predetermined victims by the score.”

The bodies of the murdered where picked up from various locations with many dumped like so much dirty laundry with the stampede victims. From the UK Independent:

"In his bestselling book, Gordon Thomas, author of Gideon Spies: The Secret History of the Mossad, gives a chilling and detailed account of how the Mossad uses Biochemists and genetic scientists in order to develop lethal cocktails as bottled agents of death.

This includes the development of nerve agents, choking agents, blood agents, and blister agents – including Tuban (virtually odorless and invisible when dispensed in aerosol or vapor form), Soman (the last of the Nazi nerve gasses to be discovered which also has a slightly fruity odour and is invincible in vapour format), blister agents (which include chlorine, phosgene and diphosgene, and smell of new-mown grass) and blood agents (including those with a cyanide base)."

A report issued today by the European Department for Security and Information in direct consultation with the security services of the Islamic Republics of Iraq and Iran stresses the danger to the region of continued Saudi and Israeli unwillingness to answer for the fate of those now known to be the targets of this act of terrorism.
[...]
The European Department for Security and Information Secretary General Ambassador Dr. Haitham Bou Said underscores today that the unfortunate ” Mina ” Incident that occurred lately in Saudi Arabia will not come to an end unless the fate of the missing Iranian and Iraqis security officers and diplomats is revealed.

Dozens of high-ranking officials disappeared when they were performing their religious rituals in Mecca. The Saudi authorities claimed that the large number of people were missing as a result of stampede in the pilgrimage makes it impossible for them to account for the missing VIPs.

Among the most important missing Iranians are:

Iranian Ambassador to Lebanon Ghadanfar Rukin Abadi, Iranian Ambassaor to Lebanon, Abdullah Zeighami, deputy head of the Intelligence DEPT. affiliated with the Revolutionary guard, Dr Ali Asghar Foldghar, Head of the Research Strategic Centre of the Revolutionary Guards, Ahmad Fheem, Foreign ministry top official, and many others.

Two bodies were found: one belongs to the Iranian Ambassador to Slovenia Mohammad Rahim Aqayyi Boor and the other to the Iraqi General Isamil Hamid Zaer, Head of Crimes Department in the Interior Ministry.

Hassam Amir Abdullahyan, Iranian Foreign Minister Deputy, asked the Saudi authorities to determine the fates of 344 missing Iranians from the Iranian pilgrimage mission.

“The Organization began to collect evidence and testimony, in coordination with other international organizations in order to unearth the truth,” Bou Said stated, adding “there is evidence of an Israeli security apparatus which was inside Saudi Arabia during the Hajj targeting Iranian, Hezbollah, and Iraqi delegates who went to the pilgrimage, to execute secret kidnapping and arrest operations in cooperation with the Saudi Authorities.”

Also, the DESI has documented reports and videos indicating the stampede that killed eight thousand six hundred and thirty-four people (8634) was purposefully staged by Saudi secruity. A considerable number of the dead were never retrieved and may have been hauled to public landfills instead of receiving required funeral rites.

DESI indicates that additional lists of missing from Iraq and Lebanon’s Hezbollah organization are being withheld for security reasons.

Syrians living inside Syria are not allowed to visit Saudi Arabia even for religious purposes.

Kaiser_454.jpg


_http://www.veteranstoday.com/2015/10/26/saudis-and-israelis-stage-hajj-stampede-in-terror-plot/

This new information puts the 'stampede' in a whole new light. It would appear that Syria has the appropriate policy and that the Saudis are not to be trusted. And the Israeli's will use whatever tactics they deem necessary to accomplish their missions.

Comment to the article by Jim W. Dean, Managing Editor:

Wow! Things seem to never be slowing down. That a lot of high level people were missing was mentioned in the beginning, and it seemed strange that their bodies could not be located within several days among the 700ish figure initially put out. And then the circus began over the Saudi just stiff arming the Muslim world on accounting for the missing people, when it seemed that it would be a huge loss of prestige for them, but they seemed totally unconcerned about that. This seems to indicate why…they had bigger fish to fry in terms of keeping the lid on.

From another article commenter:

"“The Israeli Mossad wanted to kidnap key people in Iran’s government who were attending the Hajj. So they cooperated with a Saudi Prince, who drove his entourage out in to the middle of the crowd at the Hajj, where there were millions of people. His entourage then had 150 heavily armed guards draw their weapons on the crowd and at that time, they threw canisters of poison gas (presumably the extreme irritant cs gas) into the crowd. This caused a stampede, where thousands of people got crushed to death.

In the mayhem, the Israeli Mossad kidnapped approximately 225 prominent members of Iran’s government, a number which included most of the key advisors to Ayatolla Kahmeni and many of the key people in Iran’s missile defense program." [quote attributed to Jim Stone & posted to Facebook]

Alik (presumably from Russia) sent the following:

Pilgrims are identified even before they leave their home country. all potential pilgrims have to register with Saudi Arabian agency. the pilgrims will be positively identified at that agency at least 30 days before departure to hajj. their travel, stay etc are all pre-planned and pre-assigned. they are all registered and wrist bands and id cards are issued upon arrival in mecca. In Mecca pilgrims from all over the world are mixed in. So, it is easy for Israeli and American agents to mix in with Iranian group.

Should this presumed act of terror be confirmed, I can't even imagine how that will reverberate on a global level.
 
JEEP said:
This new information puts the 'stampede' in a whole new light. It would appear that Syria has the appropriate policy and that the Saudis are not to be trusted. And the Israeli's will use whatever tactics they deem necessary to accomplish their missions.

While such things are possible, its not the best to take everything as fact when articles get into 'an anonymous security source said' territory I think.
 
Alada said:
JEEP said:
This new information puts the 'stampede' in a whole new light. It would appear that Syria has the appropriate policy and that the Saudis are not to be trusted. And the Israeli's will use whatever tactics they deem necessary to accomplish their missions.

While such things are possible, its not the best to take everything as fact when articles get into 'an anonymous security source said' territory I think.

I ended my post w/:

Should this presumed act of terror be confirmed,[...]

That means I am not taking this information as fact until it is confirmed elsewhere. It's definitely a 'wait & see' situation. However, there were other reports towards the end of Sept:

Iranian News Agency Blames Mossad, Saudis, for Staging Mina Stampede to abduct Senior Iranians
By JNI Media September 30, 2015 , 2:30 pm

Read more at https://www.breakingisraelnews.com/49934/iranian-news-agency-blames-mossad-saudis-for-staging-mina-stampede-to-abduct-senior-iranians-middle-east/#KojS4U0tw4eHcDCm.99

SAUDI PRINCE CAUSED HAJJ STAMPEDE ON PURPOSE TO PROVIDE ISRAELI MOSSAD COVER
Sep 28 2015

This report came from a European intelligence agency and diplomats in Brussels, and has a few details I subsequently dredged up on my own.
[NOTE: This article contains the exact same quoted material from the VT article comments that I originially posted]
[...]
At this time, many EU diplomats have rejected the authenticity of this report, and there is rising speculation that Russians leaked this information to western intelligence agencies.
_http://theunhivedmind.com/wordpress3/saudi-prince-caused-hajj-stampede-on-purpose-to-provide-israeli-mossad-cover/

Saudis & Iranians Trade Conspiracies Over Hajj Massacre
by Jordan Schachtel 1 Oct 2015 Washington, DC

Iran’s state-run Mehr News Agency alleged that the Hajj incident was “probably pre-planned.”

A Syrian analyst said in an interview with Iran’s state-controlled media outlet: “the missing [sic] of some of Iranian diplomatic and media figures indicates that the incident had been pre-planned.”

“It is too obvious that Saudi Arabia abuses the huge income every year it makes from Hajj pilgrimage. Not a penny of these huge income [sic] is spent in reconstruction and improvement of the holy places and shrines, since the Wahhabist radical ideology is essentially hostile to the idea of construction. In the past, Saudis had plans to destroy the Shrine of the Prophet (as), for example,” he added.

Others have alleged that Saudi Arabia is not revealing the true death toll, and predict that perhaps thousands, not hundreds, were killed in the Hajj incident.

Officials from Nigeria, Pakistan, India, and Indonesia have all been quoted as saying that they believe more than 1,000 people were killed.

A Nigerian official told the BBC that 1,075 bodies have already been taken to morgues.

Separately, a senior Saudi Prince is now calling for King Salman to step down over the Hajj event, declaring that the King is “not in a stable condition” and no longer fit to lead the Wahhabi state.

http://www.breitbart.com/national-security/2015/10/01/saudis-iranians-trade-conspiracies-hajj-massacre/

Hmm - that last sentence makes me wonder, based on what angelburst29 posted - was this a two-fer?
 
The September stampede during the hajj in Saudi Arabia killed at least 2,411 pilgrims, a new Associated Press count shows, three times the number of deaths acknowledged by the kingdom three months later.

AP: Over 2,400 Killed In Saudi Hajj Stampede
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/hajj-stampede-ap-2400-killed_56697e02e4b0f290e5221371

The AP figures establish the Sept. 24 crush at Mina as the deadliest in the history of the annual pilgrimage. It occurred just weeks after a fatal crane collapse in Mecca.

Saudi Arabia rebuffed criticism from its regional Shiite rival Iran and efforts by other countries to join a probe into the deaths. And while King Salman ordered an investigation into the tragedy almost immediately, few details have been made public since.

The AP count is based on state media reports and officials' comments from 36 of the over 180 countries that sent citizens to the hajj. Hundreds of pilgrims remain missing. The official Saudi toll of 769 people killed has not changed since Sept. 26, and officials there have yet to address the discrepancy.

The state-run Saudi Press Agency has not mentioned the investigation into the disaster since Oct. 19, when it reported that Crown Prince Mohammed bin Nayef, who is also the kingdom's interior minister, was "reassured on the progress of the investigations." The crown prince is the next in line to the throne and any blame cast on the Interior Ministry, which oversees safety during the hajj, could reflect negatively on him.

The ruling Al Saud family maintains its major influence in the Muslim world through its oil wealth and its management of Islam's holiest sites. Like Saudi monarchs before him, King Salman has taken the title of the Custodian of the Two Holy Mosques.

Authorities have said the Mina crush and stampede occurred when two waves of pilgrims converged on a narrow road, suffocating or trampling to death those caught in the disaster. Saudi Arabia has spent billions of dollars on crowd control and safety measures for those attending the annual five-day pilgrimage, required of all able-bodied Muslims once in their life, but the sheer number of participants makes ensuring their safety difficult.

The hajj this year drew some 2 million pilgrims, though in recent years it has drawn more than 3 million without any major incidents.

Iran was most affected by the disaster, according to the AP count, with 464 Iranian pilgrims killed. Mali said it lost 305 people, while Nigeria lost 274 and 190 pilgrims from Egypt were killed.

Others include Bangladesh with 137 pilgrims killed; Indonesia with 129; India with 120; Cameroon with 103; Pakistan with 102; Niger with 92; Senegal with 61; Ethiopia with 53; Ivory Coast with 52; Benin with 50; Algeria with 46; Chad with 43; Morocco with 42; Sudan with 30; Tanzania with 25; Burkina Faso with 22; Kenya with 12; Somalia with 10; Ghana, Tunisia and Turkey each with seven; Libya and Myanmar with six apiece; China with four; Afghanistan, Djibouti, the Gambia and Jordan with two each; and Lebanon, Malaysia, the Philippines and Sri Lanka each with one.

The second deadliest incident at hajj was a 1990 stampede that killed 1,426 people. The Sept. 11 crane collapse at Mecca's Grand Mosque, which preceded the Mina disaster, killed 111 people.
 
This is incredible, when you think about it. This, I think, is one of the worst tragedies that happened this year. But so few news for this tragedy, Muslims after all are not important on this planet. And what really happened is silenced because it happened in Arabia, a country like out of this earth, with their laws, out of this world. A sort of Guantanamo,when you think about it.
 
Four people are missing after falling into the sea when an offshore construction unit tilted off the coast of Huzhou City, China.

According to local media, at the time of the incident there were 65 people on board, of whom four are missing.

Currently, search and rescue efforts are taking place involving helicopters and vessels, while the jack-up unit haz stabilized.

The unit was built in 2015, with the first information indicating that the cause of the incident could be a sudden penetration of one of the rig’s legs into the seabed.

An Oddity:

TURLOCK (CBS13) — Traffic is slow on northbound Highway 99 through Turlock due to a big rig trailer that looks like it partially imploded on itself Monday morning.

The accident happened just after 5:30 a.m. right near the W. Main Street on-ramp.

California Highway Patrol says the onramp will be closed for some time as the load is transferred from the damaged truck to a different trailer.

Exactly what caused the trailer to collapse is unclear.
 

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