How does one develop their "Being?"

[Alejo]

Adding to my post above, you can probably see the problems that arise with knowledge that is not balanced out with sufficient Being. You have all this knowledge, but lack the Being to put it appropriately into practice. I think that was briefly discussed in a session at one point.

Yes, it is one of those reasons why intelligence doesn't equate wisdom.

We've all met very intelligent individuals, and probably have noticed this in ourselves (I know I have), who lack wisdom entirely.

I haven't always applied all the information i've absorbed in my life, but I've definitely felt like the information (as in just simply knowing about it) has given me immense protection.

Imagine if you applied your knowledge to your behavior, what that would to your protection.

 

[Maya]

That makes sense. Moving towards truth/objectivity may just be one of the most important aspects of increasing Being.

and moving means applying/ testing by experience, so... to know + to do = to become

 

[Andrey]

Please excuse me for being a bit of a smartass in some of the later posts. I was in a certain frame of mind during those moments and the output didn't come out the way it should have and I should've been more delicate with my words.

What I meant to say minus the tone is that throughout the thread, knowledge is mentioned over and over again and being is more or less implicitly described as dependent on knowledge, so my train of thought was that knowledge should be valued more, as far as "hierarchy" of concepts/words is concerned. That is not to say we shouldn't explore what it means to increase one's being; just that from what I'm getting after thinking about this, is that gathering of knowledge should be prioritized and we should of course take steps to apply that knowledge, but even if we always can't at the moment, it's not the end of the world (though it certainly can be depending on the situation!) as long as knowledge is continued to be gathered. This is of course only one perspective and I'm sure there are many counterpoints to this line of thought. Main reason I feel this way is that I want to increase my being, but the current circumstances of my life will not allow me to do so right now. I need to focus on a few things right now and making changes to the machine at this point in time would most likely disrupt that focus I require to complete the projects I am working on. I have a tentative plan in place for how I will go about applying the information I've gathered, but unable to do so at this moment due to time restraints and financial complications. So I'm doing things I shouldn't be right now to give the machine what it requires to focus on what needs to be done so that I can apply the knowledge in a more controlled setting and once things stabilize. Making changes to the machine right now would distract me from what needs to be done at the moment. I don't have the fortitude to go through weeks of dopamine detox and trying to rebalance my neurotransmitters for example while trying to maintain focus on my present responsibilities, that too on a poor diet regimen since I can't afford better quality foods at the moment. However, I am gathering information meanwhile for future use.

With that being said, I will also make a counterpoint to my present line of thought, in relation to the idea that knowledge and being should be developed simultaneously. One part of the Work for many is diet and supplements. There are some threads I am holding off on reading at the moment because I am unable to acquire the materials I need to apply the information, and I feel like it would be a bit of a waste of time for me to read those threads right now since I can't do anything about it, but once I do, I plan to apply the information concurrently while learning it.

It is certainly possible to apply knowledge immediately after/while gathering it. It just seems difficult given different circumstances and situations, but that could be an illusion.

 

[Ryan]

Please excuse me for being a bit of a smartass in some of the later posts. I was in a certain frame of mind during those moments and the output didn't come out the way it should have and I should've been more delicate with my words.

Further proof that your being needs much more development.

What I meant to say minus the tone is that throughout the thread, knowledge is mentioned over and over again and being is more or less implicitly described as dependent on knowledge

I'm not sure why you formed that assumption. Having just read this thread, it seems to me that Knowledge is described as something distinct from, although related to, Being.

It is certainly possible to apply knowledge immediately after/while gathering it. It just seems difficult given different circumstances and situations, but that could be an illusion.

How difficult the transforming of knowledge into Being is depends on the specific situation. In some circumstances, it could be very difficult. In others, easy as pie.

 

[MatiaS]

Please excuse me for being a bit of a smartass in some of the later posts. I was in a certain frame of mind during those moments and the output didn't come out the way it should have and I should've been more delicate with my words.

What I meant to say minus the tone is that throughout the thread, knowledge is mentioned over and over again and being is more or less implicitly described as dependent on knowledge, so my train of thought was that knowledge should be valued more, as far as "hierarchy" of concepts/words is concerned. That is not to say we shouldn't explore what it means to increase one's being; just that from what I'm getting after thinking about this, is that gathering of knowledge should be prioritized and we should of course take steps to apply that knowledge, but even if we always can't at the moment, it's not the end of the world (though it certainly can be depending on the situation!) as long as knowledge is continued to be gathered. This is of course only one perspective and I'm sure there are many counterpoints to this line of thought. Main reason I feel this way is that I want to increase my being, but the current circumstances of my life will not allow me to do so right now. I need to focus on a few things right now and making changes to the machine at this point in time would most likely disrupt that focus I require to complete the projects I am working on. I have a tentative plan in place for how I will go about applying the information I've gathered, but unable to do so at this moment due to time restraints and financial complications. So I'm doing things I shouldn't be right now to give the machine what it requires to focus on what needs to be done so that I can apply the knowledge in a more controlled setting and once things stabilize. Making changes to the machine right now would distract me from what needs to be done at the moment. I don't have the fortitude to go through weeks of dopamine detox and trying to rebalance my neurotransmitters for example while trying to maintain focus on my present responsibilities, that too on a poor diet regimen since I can't afford better quality foods at the moment. However, I am gathering information meanwhile for future use.

With that being said, I will also make a counterpoint to my present line of thought, in relation to the idea that knowledge and being should be developed simultaneously. One part of the Work for many is diet and supplements. There are some threads I am holding off on reading at the moment because I am unable to acquire the materials I need to apply the information, and I feel like it would be a bit of a waste of time for me to read those threads right now since I can't do anything about it, but once I do, I plan to apply the information concurrently while learning it.

It is certainly possible to apply knowledge immediately after/while gathering it. It just seems difficult given different circumstances and situations, but that could be an illusion.

I can relate to the vibe of this post, putting off the Work because of circumstances, putting of the dietary changes because of circumstances etc.

Now, I of course don't know the specifics of your circumstances but I do believe there's always at least something one can do every day to keep nudging oneself towards more self-awareness and STO orientation. It's the little choices we make on a daily basis that add up over time.

Think of someone you knew of heard of that was not very well educated, not "worldly wise" but was a very good person, salt of the earth type, probably giving, tolerant, patient, kind, strong as concerns matters of conscience. That's the 'being' part. Basically, someone who had mastery/control over the 'smaller' part of themselves, and had developed the 'bigger' part, by whatever means. We might describe a person with a well developed Being as an 'STO' person, because to be more STO, one has to be able to subordinate/have control over self-centered (STS) inclinations. Such a person does not have to be knowledgeable. Their lack of knowledge may, however, mean they are easily manipulated or taken advantage of. That's why a fairly equal level of knowledge is necessary, to effectively put Being into appropriate service.

You're saying you want to increase your being but that your circumstances are not allowing it. What kind of circumstances do you find yourself in which would not allow you to every day try to be externally considerate and embody the other qualities Joe mentioned above?

The 4th Way work is, at least to my understanding, meant to be pursued in the midst of the ordinary circumstances of everyday life. Developing one's being is something we can do regardless, and more often than not precisely because of the circumstances we find ourselves in.

You say you would not benefit from trying to change your machine right now, but doesn't the knowledge you've gathered suggest completely otherwise?

 

[Alejo]

Further proof that your being needs much more development.

I was going to say something similar, it's a great opportunity to apply some of that knowledge onto your behavior and develop your being.

And also, developing your being can happen in any sort of situation in life, in whatever condition. It reminded me of this video from JBP

Not saying you're bitter or anything, what I think matters from the video is that, one can take almost any condition in life and make something out of it, or make nothing out of it. Same goes for developing Being, it is done when one identifies the opportunities, the "right" conditions, never really arrive.

 

[Ryan]

I was going to say something similar, it's a great opportunity to apply some of that knowledge onto your behavior and develop your being.

Why do you have to be so damn kind?

 

[Abats]

I think as far as Gurdjieff is concerned, Being is equivalent to Will. I think his definition of knowledge aligns with the idea of pure theory, whereas Being aligns with practical experience.

I’ve tried to lay these ideas over the framework of Being vs. Non-Being, but I’ve found they don’t fit very well, since both knowledge and Being in a person come under the category of or are reflections of the over-arching category of Being itself, as opposed to Non-Being.

So to try to answer the question of how one increases one’s Being in the Gurdjieffian sense, I’d say it’s a question of ‘getting out of the classroom’ and going out into the world. Of having experiences, rather than just focusing on ideas. That you can’t ever really get a good understanding of how things actually work in real life by only focusing on theory. Being is about practice and practicality, experience. That practical experience leads one to being more objectively useful and able (the ability to Do) since it is born from interaction with reality.

I had a lot of trouble understanding the difference between "being and non-being" but you have just enlightened me completely on this!

 

[T.C.]

I had a lot of trouble understanding the difference between "being and non-being" but you have just enlightened me completely on this!

Well, if I did, that was not my intention

Could you explain what it was that you understood from what I wrote? I don’t want you to misinterpret things based on something I wrote that I thought was only loosely related to the differences between being and non-being. It may actually be that you’re seeing something important that I’m missing.

 

[Abats]

Joe also helped you with the explanation. Actually I always thought that to be or not to be (thanks shakespeare ^^) was a question of state of mind and not of action. Because I didn't like reading gurdieff I had the feeling that he was complicating things when they were rather simple (like Lacan in psychoanalysis, it looks like a word salad it's undrinkable). So the fact of underlining that the difference is in the putting into practice and not a theoretical state which remains in the mind, I did not see it at all like that.

 

[Alejo]

Why do you have to be so damn kind?

oh nothing... you know, just exercising my Being is all.. lol

In all seriousness, if I understood your question, sometimes the way you say things is more efficient in delivering a message, than what you say.

 

[Ryan]

So the fact of underlining that the difference is in the putting into practice and not a theoretical state which remains in the mind, I did not see it at all like that.

I think you could say that mind is actually a quality of Being. For instance, we generally don't consider rocks to have any kind of 'mind', and yet they still are. So, Being actually preseeds mind. At least, that's how I see it, anyway.

 

[MatiaS]

I had a conversation with a friend the other day, and we speculated on how an enlightened being would behave in everyday reality. We had an idea form around the flow state and I see that it ties into this discussion about Being, so let me break down our theory.

I remember once seeing a graph that I can't seem to find anywhere now, that described the "flow tunnel". Basically the x axis of the graph was something like "pressure to perform" and the y axis "skill level". The theory goes that to enter the flow state there has to be a significant amount of pressure or demand to perform the task at hand, while also pushing you to the limit of what you are capable of.

If what you're doing is too hard (resulting in inability to do the task) or too easy (resulting in not enough attention given to the task), the flow state remains elusive. Similarly if the pressure to perform isn't just right, no dice. The "flow tunnel" is the zone in which the circumstances/demands/skills harmoniously converge.

As we're talking about Being being the act of going out there in the world as opposed to remaining in the world of ideas, let's refine the categories of "pressure to perform" and "skill level" according to more Work related terminology.

The pressure to perform could for instance be seen - in any given situation - as understanding the importance of seeing everything as ultimately part of the STS - STO interplay. You would understand that every situation is equally important as a chance for you to learn a given lesson (all there is, is lessons). The stakes are high in every situation, as the decisions we make ultimately have a STS or STO (being or non-being) intention attached to them, polarizing us towards one or the other.

Combine this with our "skill level" of being able to see the unseen, arrive at the right decision and also having the courage to act out that right decision, perhaps our level of Being gets refined and defined (magnetic center) and we move in and out of something akin to the flow state.

One characteristic of the flow state is a sense of timelessness, and as the C's keep reminding us all the time, time doesn't exist.

It's possible I'm trying to overlap incompatible concepts on top of each other, but I do find that many times when I follow the above methodology; get confronted with a situation, seeing what it is I should do, acting on it by putting in some effort, it's as if being in a very subtle state of flow. Things just seem to work out as they should and I feel like an influence beyond myself is working through me. Also not really paying attention to the passing of time.

In contrast when I don't act on what I know to be right, or when I can't just seem to figure out what is right, time becomes very palpable and drawn out. Little things go wrong and more obstacles seem to arise.

So basically the theory goes that perhaps achieving sufficient Being corresponds to an ability to remain in a kind of flow state for significant periods of "time", by acting on the Knowledge that has been acquired, thus seeing the simultaneous development of the two lines.

 

[Ryan]

and moving means applying/ testing by experience, so... to know + to do = to become

Just a small note on this; I was recently rereading one of the Sessions (9th June, 2018) and the C's finished the session with this quote:

A: Just remember that periods of apparent stasis are not necessarily bad. Sometimes Being needs to catch up with Doing. Patience and dedication are key. It is impossible for us to give predictions of exactly when dramatic changes will take place due to the many variables in an open universe. But be assured that things are definitely on the move in cosmic and psychic spheres. Keep your eyes open and be aware at all levels and don't be taken unawares.

Here, the C's have drawn specific attention to patience and dedication as ways to cultivate Being. So the application by experience is one part, but how that application is done also seems to be important to the effectiveness of the process. By applying diligently through periods of apparent stasis - when we might feel like we're "hitting a wall", so to speak - this seems to be when the greatest levels of transformation can occur.

So basically the theory goes that perhaps achieving sufficient Being corresponds to an ability to remain in a kind of flow state for significant periods of "time", by acting on the Knowledge that has been acquired, thus seeing the simultaneous development of the two lines.

You make some interesting points here, and I would also suggest that the state 'flows' from Being achieved; once we Are, we naturally work within a flow state, as described by many people who, after struggling for mastery of a task or process, then hit "the zone" and are henceforth able to accomplish that process very quickly and almost effortlessly. I think in such cases, we see Being has caught up with Doing.

 

[Alejo]

You make some interesting points here, and I would also suggest that the state 'flows' from Being achieved; once we Are, we naturally work within a flow state, as described by many people who, after struggling for mastery of a task or process, then hit "the zone" and are henceforth able to accomplish that process very quickly and almost effortlessly. I think in such cases, we see Being has caught up with Doing.

That is a good point, and I think this is reflected in neurophysiology, where the circuitry that is activated at any given situation, is finally switched to one that aligns more with volition, and what we attend to. it is a slow process and it requires effort, and dedication and discipline.. but, it's like learning any new skill, at first it's a completely foreign sensation, but it eventually becomes part of who you are, part of your being.