Induced Lucid Dreaming

[Al Today]

[...]
What is a big deal is learning how to master ones mental and emotional states - learning how to BE and, in that, becoming what we can only define as immortal - the real Work - that's a big deal because it could be the reason we are here (the alternative reason being just to be "food for the Moon")
[...]

And to me, here is the terror to the situation. Boiled down to a one-liner. DO what can Done. BE what can Learned. And "someday", perhaps we will "SEE".

Thank you for the smack in the face wake up call. The splash of cold water on my face. 'Tis times like this is when I see value in the Work (effort), never giving up, gotta keep trying to wake up and BE what IS.

Just when the daily rut is mundane and selfishly deep within. Some nugget of gold is accidentally found on this here forum that lifts my spirit. Reminds me there is more than this sack of flesh, bone and water I think to inhabit. More than this daily drudge of so-called life on this BBBM, (Big Beautiful Blue Marble). More than mine & me. Provides me with just a little more fuel to continue my journey. Refreshes my vision that yes, yep, and yup there is more to life than the krap of this day.

Thanks Bunches.



edit: spelling, grammer and punctuation, as usual... :P

Later, I came back to read this and couldn't help but notice how many times the words I, me, my and mine were used. This says much to me.

 

[Approaching Infinity]

Personally, I am very curious about lucid dreaming and OOBEs. However, I'm curious purely from the point of what it can tell me about the nature of reality and what it suggests about consciousness, the mind-body problem, and things like that. I've had a few lucid dreams, but not an OOBE (however, both of my parents have). I have no desire to force such experiences, however. If I did, I'd ask myself why I wanted it so much. What is it about my life as it is that makes me want it to be something it's not? And if it really was like that (the hoped for alternative), would that really make a meaningful difference in who I am and who I want to be? In other words, is my goal a realistic or helpful one, or is it simply me wanting to escape from my current situation? It comes down to priorities. Do I want to trip out lucid dreaming and astrally projecting my consciousness, or do I want to become a better human?

 

[timmyman]

Thank you so much for clearing all that up :)

as for experience chasing in my account. It is what got me started down on this path in the first place. It was the quest to find god. I now of course know better but i still can not deny that it was experience chasing with all that is bad about it (drugs, extreme lifestyle, living recklessly, you name it) that got me where i am today. So in a sense you need the bad to see the good?

...or it kills you first (figuratively and/or literally).

well yes.

but still.I had no idea where to start and all the above just made sense with what my friends were doing( of course they did not do it for god searching but just to have an awsome experience). I never had any doubt about why i was doing it. Kind of like find out no matter what. And bare in mind that i was very young and just needed to know that there must be more to life than everyday happenings. In a sense i just needed to know that magic was real, that all that we saw was not all that we got. And the first book that i got my hands on was Graham Hancocks book of everything can be explained by mushrooms. So i guess i was lucky to start so bad and find myself here now:)

you use what you can get your hands on at that age really... and i was influenced really bad at that time but it did get me here and moving in a new direction

 

[SeekingtheTruth]

I am using my cell phone to post and for some reason there isn't the option to edit my previous post. One other observation I have made about this type of dreaming has to do with with the following:
ity to recognize "flavor" coming from system 1.

6. If you are attempting to do The Work then it may be utilized as prep school for observing emotions and its connection to the feedback loop of the "dream field". If something in your dream is attacking you then the usual response is fear or anger. If you working on trying to observe your emotions then you can observe it in "dream time" and you can see how watching it changes the surrounding "dreamscape" This may lead to bringing your emotional horse under conscious control in reality.

What I have noticed is that the connection of the emotional state and the surrounding "dreamscape" to observation and allocation of memory capacity. For me, dreams take on a certain "personality" it has its own wishes, desires and ideas of impressions received. It seems that system 1 is the "ruler" if this domain. Since it is an associative machine it will suggest very quickly suggest to system 2 a coherent reality that will cause you to believe that everything you are
experiencing makes "perfect sense". However, the logic used here will seem wholly illogical if system 2 has not been drained or depleted of its resources to access both short and.long term memory storage in addition to allocation of new memories. And it seems that in "dream reality" the capacity for the allocation of the new memory is very small and almost zero. For example, if you are observing your emotions while being attacked, say by a wolf, the surrounding "dreamscape" will take on another set of wishes, desires and have a "personality" wholly different from the preceding one. This is where allocation of new memory becomes important. If system 2 is depleted then it will "forget" the immediate past and believe whatever system 1 has told it without question. It will be as though the previous "personality" never existed and that.the current "personality" is the "true" one. Of.course this is nonsense and is a result of believing something without question. However, if system 2 is not depleted of its resources then you it will be able to allocate new memory of the previous "personality" in addition to the present "personality" being suggested to you by the very quick actions of system 1 that is once again sorta hypnotizing you into thinking that the present "personality" is the "true" one. To me, this is the dream equivalent of "self-remembering". In this case, the thoughts are not ideas but take on the appearance of the "true" reality. Each "reality" will lull you into thinking that it is the only true one and if system 2 can't "self-remember" then you will most likely start believing it. For me, the ability to do this dream equivalent of "self-remembering" has improved. I think this.has to do with doing the work in actual reality (and may be aided by doing it in dreams as well).

The ability to observe and also remember the changing "dreamscape" is analagous to remembering strings of numbers. In the case of dreaming each number is a "personality or dreamscape" that has taken on the appearance of a three dimensional environment. If system 2 is.depleted then it will be able to remember, at most, a sequence containing one number. Each number is the one and only number and there was no.other number before it (you will think). If it.is.not depleted then of course the sequence or string will be a number greater than one. The difficulty in remembering a string of numbers is proportional to its length and its sequence. Ifbyou are given the string 2591413835567994 I'm sure you will find it difficult to remember the entire sequence in the order given but if you use the resources of system 2 you may recognize an easier way to always know the entire string. In this case the string contains the first 16 digits of the number pi. If system 2 can "see" the number pi in the sequence then it can developing a "working hypothesis" about the nature of the string and the order within it. If it.cannot "see" it.then it will see entropy instead. In the "seeing" case, system 1 has been reprogrammed to "see pi" thus freeing up space in system 2's working memory. What was unknown before now.becomes self-evident. Once.again, I am basing.this on experience. FWIW

 

[PerihelionX]

6. If you are attempting to do The Work then it may be utilized as prep school for observing emotions and its connection to the feedback loop of the "dream field". If something in your dream is attacking you then the usual response is fear or anger. If you working on trying to observe your emotions then you can observe it in "dream time" and you can see how watching it changes the surrounding "dreamscape" This may lead to bringing your emotional horse under conscious control in reality.

Very interesting. This is somewhat along the lines of my initial curiosity about using lucid dreaming as a tool. It's too hard to do just for entertainment but the synchronicity of how I was introduced to it suggested that there was something useful to be learned. As someone who's main spiritual block seems to be unawareness of my own emotions, exploring emotion in the dreamscape might be very useful. Anyone else have any thoughts on this?

 

[anart]

but the synchronicity of how I was introduced to it suggested that there was something useful to be learned.

It's my understanding that synchronicities that occur before you make a choice or decision are often the influence of 4D STS trying to lead you 'down the garden path'. Synchronicities that occur after having made a choice or decision are often confirmation from the universe that you're on the right track. So, with that in mind, what do you think?

 

[PerihelionX]

but the synchronicity of how I was introduced to it suggested that there was something useful to be learned.

It's my understanding that synchronicities that occur before you make a choice or decision are often the influence of 4D STS trying to lead you 'down the garden path'. Synchronicities that occur after having made a choice or decision are often confirmation from the universe that you're on the right track. So, with that in mind, what do you think?

This event came shortly after I firmly decided I wanted to reach a higher state of awareness.

 

[anart]

but the synchronicity of how I was introduced to it suggested that there was something useful to be learned.

It's my understanding that synchronicities that occur before you make a choice or decision are often the influence of 4D STS trying to lead you 'down the garden path'. Synchronicities that occur after having made a choice or decision are often confirmation from the universe that you're on the right track. So, with that in mind, what do you think?

This event came shortly after I firmly decided I wanted to reach a higher state of awareness.

You're missing my point. Had you firmly decided to pursue lucid dreaming, and then the synchronicity happened, or did the synchronicity guide you toward exploring "induced" lucid dreaming ? From what you wrote earlier it is the latter. That is called "being led". Your resistance to realizing that is another indication that you are, in fact, being led.

 

[PerihelionX]

I see what you're saying. However, it appears to fully embrace what you're saying I would have to follow a new truth which I did not decide on (your advice) and therefore "be led" again. Basically what you're saying seems counter-learning. I embrace skepticism but being paranoid about every new experience as a possible trap I think could be just as much a block to learning as embracing every new "truth" that comes floating by. In order to learn I must be open to new experienced which I did not anticipate. "Non-anticipation" is the first most basic step toward 4D thinking if I remember the C literature correctly. Non anticipation would mean I don't pre-judge opportunities, either pro or anti without investigating and observing.

BLUF: making a hard rule about unexpected opportunities being 4D STS is not practicing discernment anymore than blindly accepting all opportunities.

 

[anart]

I see what you're saying. However, it appears to fully embrace what you're saying I would have to follow a new truth which I did not decide on (your advice) and therefore "be led" again. Basically what you're saying seems counter-learning. I embrace skepticism but being paranoid about every new experience as a possible trap I think could be just as much a block to learning as embracing every new "truth" that comes floating by. In order to learn I must be open to new experienced which I did not anticipate. "Non-anticipation" is the first most basic step toward 4D thinking if I remember the C literature correctly. Non anticipation would mean I don't pre-judge opportunities, either pro or anti without investigating and observing.

BLUF: making a hard rule about unexpected opportunities being 4D STS is not practicing discernment anymore than blindly accepting all opportunities.

So, in other words, your cup is full and you're going to do what you're going to do no matter what input you get here. Then, why ask? If you are not asking in sincerity, which means being open to actually accepting that the input you get is true, then you're wasting others time and energy.

The hardest way to learn is by making your own mistakes - a wise man can learn from his own mistakes, a genius learns from the mistakes of others. Then, there are those who are so enamored with their own thinking that they never really learn at all. Of course, that's life!

 

[PerihelionX]

That's a good point you make about learning. I don't believe I've decided anything at this point. However, I could be ignorant to my true motives! If I am hopefully I will remember your foresight and learn from it.

 

[obyvatel]

6. If you are attempting to do The Work then it may be utilized as prep school for observing emotions and its connection to the feedback loop of the "dream field". If something in your dream is attacking you then the usual response is fear or anger. If you working on trying to observe your emotions then you can observe it in "dream time" and you can see how watching it changes the surrounding "dreamscape" This may lead to bringing your emotional horse under conscious control in reality.

Very interesting. This is somewhat along the lines of my initial curiosity about using lucid dreaming as a tool. It's too hard to do just for entertainment but the synchronicity of how I was introduced to it suggested that there was something useful to be learned. As someone who's main spiritual block seems to be unawareness of my own emotions, exploring emotion in the dreamscape might be very useful. Anyone else have any thoughts on this?

Dreams can be messages from the unconscious which have not been brought into conscious awareness. So they can be clues asking us to pay attention to certain aspects of our lives. In my experience bringing emotional dynamics and unconscious narratives into conscious awareness and subjecting them to rational analysis through efforts in "waking" life changes the dream landscape. In other words conscious effort is the cause, change of dreams is the effect - osit.