Insomnia

[Keyhole]

You might also want to have something with a bit of carbs late in the day - but not too late! We try not to eat too late because it prevents good sleep. Also, turkey breast late in the day, with some peas and a bit of sweet potato should get you really sleepy!

Great suggestion. Any type of poultry is a good idea for the evening meal because all contain L-tryptophan.

Turkey does have the makings of a natural sedative in i­t, an amino acid called tryptophan. Tryptophan is an essential amino acid, meaning that the body can't manufacture it. The body has to get tryptophan and other essential amino acids from food. Tryptophan helps the body produce the B-vitamin niacin, which, ­in turn, helps the body produce serotonin, a remarkable chemical that acts as a calming agent in the brain and plays a key role in sleep.

We mix between glycinate and malate, but I think the optimal form is dependent upon each person. Citrate may "go straight through" some people.

 

[Mgse]

Thank you Laura, you're right. I'll try to calm down and do the right research and networking. It's been three weeks already, I hope it's the detox going on, but what I need right now is a physical rest for 3-4 hours. A year ago I've changed my diet to keto diet, I've certainly seen the results, but in the last weeks I went into a stress cycle which may cause the keto to not work properly. I'll try to minimize my job work (work less), get to know more about my body and use the tips from the forum posts. Thank you again.

What I did to ease the Herx was take prednisone. But that was only for the WORST. After that, I started taking 5 grams of vitamin C twice a day BEFORE 3 PM (15:00). You can't take some things late in the day or they keep you awake.

Take several magnesium a half hour before bed. Melatonin, perhaps. If I am desperate for sleep, I'll take benadryl - JUST two of them about 30 minutes before getting in bed. And then get a warm bath and go to bed with a boring book.

Thank you Laura. What I usually do is drink a 1 liter of water with 1 lemon in the morning on a empty stomach to release myself (constipated), then eat 2 organic eggs (1 tsp of olive oil), sometimes a banana (I know it interferes with the constipation, making it worse, I took because after sweating at night I'm losing potassium and magnesium), sometimes a glass of kefir with 10-15 goji seeds. At lunch if I'm at home I'll have mashed potatoes with organic chicken breasts or legs, saukerkraut and sometimes bone broth. If I'm at work, I'll have avocado, potatoes and beans. At dinner, again mashed potatoes with a little bit of chicken or bone broth (beef, chicken). I've taken vitamin C in the afternoon, but yesterday I took 2g at 21:00, probably not a good idea because it puts the system into fight mode again. I take melatonin right now, magnesium citrate before bed (100mg capsule). I've taken epsom salt baths, it helps relaxing so I'll try tonight again. Is it ok to take more then 100mg of citrate, what about the magnesium sulfate in the epsom salt, will increase my magnesium levels, is it ok, I usually pour 1 cup into the bath and then wash myself again after the bath.

 

[Laura]

Thank you Laura. What I usually do is drink a 1 liter of water with 1 lemon in the morning on a empty stomach to release myself (constipated), then eat 2 organic eggs (1 tsp of olive oil), sometimes a banana (I know it interferes with the constipation, making it worse, I took because after sweating at night I'm losing potassium and magnesium),

Probably better to drink the water with powdered vitamin C than the lemon juice. And if you find the right dose of magnesium, you'll never be constipated again. Eat only eggyolks, NO WHITES. Banana evil. Ditch immediately. If you need postassium, vinegar is better or take a supplement.

sometimes a glass of kefir with 10-15 goji seeds.

Goji is a nightshade. Ditch immediately. You might want to go off kefir for awhile and re-test later.

At lunch if I'm at home I'll have mashed potatoes with organic chicken breasts or legs, saukerkraut and sometimes bone broth.

Potatoes are also a nightshade. Change for white rice if you must have something like that.

If I'm at work, I'll have avocado, potatoes and beans. At dinner, again mashed potatoes with a little bit of chicken or bone broth (beef, chicken). I've taken vitamin C in the afternoon, but yesterday I took 2g at 21:00, probably not a good idea because it puts the system into fight mode again.

You are obviously NOT on a keto diet. Way too many potatoes and wrong kind. Don't take vitamin C late - it is energizing. You've been repeatedly shooting yourself in the foot because of a basic lack of knowledge.

I take melatonin right now, magnesium citrate before bed (100mg capsule).

Most people need 6 grams of magnesium or more a day. If you don't get it in your food, you need to supplement.

I've taken epsom salt baths, it helps relaxing so I'll try tonight again. Is it ok to take more then 100mg of citrate, what about the magnesium sulfate in the epsom salt, will increase my magnesium levels, is it ok, I usually pour 1 cup into the bath and then wash myself again after the bath.

Believe me, I doubt that one gram of mg and whatever you absorb from one cup in a bath will do much of anything. Heck, when I take a magnesium bath, I put in 2 kilos of the stuff. And, like I said, I take 5 or more grams of magnesium most nights.

 

[Mgse]

Thank you Laura. What I usually do is drink a 1 liter of water with 1 lemon in the morning on a empty stomach to release myself (constipated), then eat 2 organic eggs (1 tsp of olive oil), sometimes a banana (I know it interferes with the constipation, making it worse, I took because after sweating at night I'm losing potassium and magnesium),

Probably better to drink the water with powdered vitamin C than the lemon juice. And if you find the right dose of magnesium, you'll never be constipated again. Eat only eggyolks, NO WHITES. Banana evil. Ditch immediately. If you need postassium, vinegar is better or take a supplement.

sometimes a glass of kefir with 10-15 goji seeds.

Goji is a nightshade. Ditch immediately. You might want to go off kefir for awhile and re-test later.

At lunch if I'm at home I'll have mashed potatoes with organic chicken breasts or legs, saukerkraut and sometimes bone broth.

Potatoes are also a nightshade. Change for white rice if you must have something like that.

If I'm at work, I'll have avocado, potatoes and beans. At dinner, again mashed potatoes with a little bit of chicken or bone broth (beef, chicken). I've taken vitamin C in the afternoon, but yesterday I took 2g at 21:00, probably not a good idea because it puts the system into fight mode again.

You are obviously NOT on a keto diet. Way too many potatoes and wrong kind. Don't take vitamin C late - it is energizing. You've been repeatedly shooting yourself in the foot because of a basic lack of knowledge.

I take melatonin right now, magnesium citrate before bed (100mg capsule).

Most people need 6 grams of magnesium or more a day. If you don't get it in your food, you need to supplement.

I've taken epsom salt baths, it helps relaxing so I'll try tonight again. Is it ok to take more then 100mg of citrate, what about the magnesium sulfate in the epsom salt, will increase my magnesium levels, is it ok, I usually pour 1 cup into the bath and then wash myself again after the bath.

Believe me, I doubt that one gram of mg and whatever you absorb from one cup in a bath will do much of anything. Heck, when I take a magnesium bath, I put in 2 kilos of the stuff. And, like I said, I take 5 or more grams of magnesium most nights.

Thank you, I'll change those. I was thinking to introduce some vegetables like kale, celeri, spinach, broccoli into my diet to help get some nutrients, I've eaten them but no so often.

 

[Chad]

There are other factors which need to be understood-as per previous commenters - but as someone who has suffered chronic insomnia since a teenager, the following has been a huge help:

[...]

Thank you itellsya.

I've been following the same procedure with more or less success (everyone is different). No light my room is dark, I've tried GABA only on stressful days. I use Melatonin for the time being which let me dream for 1-2 hours because I can recall my dreams. What kind of magnesium are you taking, citrate form ? I do the EE breathing.

You might also want to have something with a bit of carbs late in the day - but not too late! We try not to eat too late because it prevents good sleep. Also, turkey breast late in the day, with some peas and a bit of sweet potato should get you really sleepy!

We mix between glycinate and malate, but I think the optimal form is dependent upon each person. Citrate may "go straight through" some people.

Thank you Laura. What I usually do is drink a 1 liter of water with 1 lemon in the morning on a empty stomach to release myself (constipated), then eat 2 organic eggs (1 tsp of olive oil), sometimes a banana (I know it interferes with the constipation, making it worse, I took because after sweating at night I'm losing potassium and magnesium),

[...]

Believe me, I doubt that one gram of mg and whatever you absorb from one cup in a bath will do much of anything. Heck, when I take a magnesium bath, I put in 2 kilos of the stuff. And, like I said, I take 5 or more grams of magnesium most nights.

From what i've read regarding magnesium, from the magnesium discussion group on facebook to the articles and personal experience, i've found the more magnesium the better, and personally have been working up the dose and have only found benefits - including the reliable, bowel movements.

I've noticed from reading others experiences that regarding the type, everyone is different, relatively. Though oxide seems to be the least absorbed according to the stats, and the more expensive threoronate (sp?), orotate and glycinate the most.

From my experience; malate was the best for during the day - i felt it working - and has lower incidence of bowel movements. Citrate was the worst in this respect, i did have a delicate gut but now, since working up in dose over a year or more, i can apparently take alot more at night (according to the myprotein pack 1500mg). Glycinate, that was supposed to be gentle, for me, was as bad as citrate. They recommend glycinate for sleep but i didn't notice any effect - maybe experiment with that though, i read some positive reviews. Also, bearing in mind different types have different additional benefits.

The good thing about mg is that your bowels know the optimal dose, so in that regard, i think work up with the dose and listen to your body; maybe by 100mg a day till you feel the effects? I find taking one if i wake up the middle of the night, because my stomach is empty, gives a nice relaxing effect to the muscles and i can fall back to sleep. I use myprotein.co.uk_ magnesium and zinc caps which, according to the ingredients are 1 = 500mg mag citrate, and i've been taking up to 3 a night, 30 minutes to an hour apart, before bed. I wonder if they are so high in mag citrate because, generally, mag pills that strength would be much bigger.

As noted by Laura, you probably aren't following the ketogenic diet, and in ketosis with it's accompanying benefits. if you are eating white potatoes and beans; I understand they really mess with blood sugar. If you are sensitive for any reason, your diet could be the main culprit. Within days of the fat bombs i was sleeping better so you may need to take some time to look into that. Sugar rushes and crashes can easily be mistaken, and antagonists, for stress leading to insomnia. At the least they make thinking clearly and assessing situations trickier and this can lead to anxiety; you can eliminate any issues with the diet whilst trying to see the stress you are experiencing for what it is and perhaps networking on the specifics when you feel able. This may be a good step in that direction :) [quote author=Mgse Because it seems there's the issues with diet but also how you feel generally which could be causing the sleeplessness. And one can negatively impact the other.

[quote author=Mgse][...] I was thinking to introduce some vegetables like kale, celeri, spinach, broccoli into my diet to help get some nutrients, I've eaten them but no so often.[/quote]

I think if you read through the related ketogenic diet threads, you'll find it's much more encouraged to focus on lots of good quality fats and grass fed protein as the solution to nutrient difficienicies more than anything. Chicken for example, from what i understand, has less benefits than beef and has only a little fat.

Keep us updated Mgse

 

[Laura]

Thank you, I'll change those. I was thinking to introduce some vegetables like kale, celeri, spinach, broccoli into my diet to help get some nutrients, I've eaten them but no so often.

Kale and spinach are not optimal. You don't even need the veggies for nutrients - you should get most of what you need if you eat good quality meats.

Stick with very simple things: peas (round green balls), green beans, sweet potato, carrots, cauliflower, beets. That's pretty much the limit of what we eat (except home made sauer kraut) and you can't go wrong with them. You have to test onions though. Cucumbers are a "no" for most people though some can tolerate them.

My approach is to just keep it simple. I have my little list and that's it.

Also, eat liver - calves or chicken.

And I take boron every day now, too.

 

[kujo]

Hello everyone,

I've been struggling with insomnia for the past two weeks and I'm trying to find out what's causing it. I've never had any sleep problems before, I'm kind of puzzled by the whole thing. Here is my brief description of the events that probably played a factor in it. Three weeks ago I had a dentist appointment to check on a lower front teeth root canal. On the x-ray the tooth has infection around the root and my dentist told me to see an endodontist (specialist in root canals). She recommended one and I went to see her and on examination she laid three options: retreatment, apiectomy or extraction. Anyway from that day I was really getting stressed about it, reading and finding information about the options and solutions for each. Since then stress probably got me (work, tooth), I've had no energy, and reading about the root canal problems on the internet (forums), got me really worked up, it was like no escape. At the same time I had some kind of viral infection according to the symptoms (red left ear, swelling throat) and the doctor prescribed me an antibiotic Biaxin. I didnt' take for 2-3 days but then for whatever reason on saturday (April 18th) I took one at 22:30 in the night (normally they should be taken during meals, not at NIGHT). That was a big mistake, that night I couldn't sleep at all, shills all over the body, sweating. The very next morning my anxiety got worse, worried all the time about what happened. I took another antibiotic at 10:30 but then I stopped taking them, because the symptoms worsened, but somehow the viral infection went away. The next days were the same, no sleep, sweating, heart beating, cold feet sometimes, felt like crap, constipation big time. Monday morning (April 20th) I took blood tests, the results were good (only ALT liver was 46, max 40 and triglycerides was 0.55, min 0.56), but the rest were all in the range (iron, calcium, phospore, thyroid, feritine, white/red cells etc). I've taken vitamins and supplements all this time (magnesium citrate, vitamin D3 liquid form, Coenzime Q10, selenium, vitamin C powder), stopped drinking coffee (one cup a day), no alcohol, eating well (not much carbs). I've taken also GABA (helped a little bit), melatonine (2.5 mg), capsule of l-theanine suntheanine (100mg) + 5-HTP (15mg) + melatonin (1.5mg) (no help). I believe that my body rejected or had a strong reaction to this antibiotic because on that saturday night all hell broke loose. I usually take a walk after dinner, don't watch TV, less time spent on the computer at home but I spend eight hours at work (computer programmer). It affects my daily life (work, family) and I don't know what else to do. This friday I will see a cardiologist and I will try to take an appointment with a sleep specialist in the following days (weeks). Somehow my sleep and biological clock cycles are out of sync, probably caused by the antibiotic taken at the wrong time, but that's my assumption. I've stopped to take any vitamins or supplements, but eat mostly organic food (chicken, eggs, brazil nuts, kefir etc), thinking that maybe my body will recover somehow. I'm kind of desperate, I'd like to hear some of your opinions and advices.

Thanks,
Mihai

I think Laura nailed it:

Most of what is going on here is in your mind, your highly over-active imagination that is creating a parade of horrors due to a simple misunderstanding of a normal physiological reaction to an antibiotic when the body is loaded with pathogens.

I usually sleep pretty well myself, but when I don't and I'm tossing and turning in my bed for hours on end it's almost always an on going inner dialog of crap that is stirred up by something that is concerning me / stressing me out. Futuristic thinking, what ifs, scenario building, and round and round it goes. When I realize I'm not actually on my way to rest an I'm just laying there spiraling in stress-talk in my head, almost like listening to someone else talk and play through scenarios, only then am I able to separate myself from that and have a pow wow with the parts of me that make sense. Sometimes I say directly (in my head) something like "Right now is a time for rest - I need this rest in order to be able to respond to things when I'm not asleep. Tomorrow morning I can revisit some of these concerns, but only in the way that is practical." Kind of like talking oneself down from a ledge. I then attempt to focus on my breathing, and relaxing the muscles in my face and neck. It's surprising to me always how tight they seem to be once I pay it any attention.

I agree with the suggestions of several grams of magnesium at night. It has become a regular thing for our house, regardless of sleepless nights it's part of the wind-down routine. I take a huge mounding tablespoon of Natural Calm - a magnesium supplement. It helps to relax me quite well, and I find after heavy exercise / physical stress it fends off sore muscles. Here's a link to the one we purchase regularly.

http://www.amazon.com/Natural-Vitality-Magnesium-Calcium-Drink-Raspberry/dp/B003I4P3JS/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1432571245&sr=8-2&keywords=natural+magnesium+calm

It has some potassium in it as well, which could help with supplementing in lieu of bananas.

Wishing you some restful nights ahead.

 

[kujo]

My approach is to just keep it simple. I have my little list and that's it.

Also, eat liver - calves or chicken.

Laura, how do you prepare the liver? Do you freeze it and then eat it? I've read some simple ways of freezing and then cutting them into little "pills" that are easy to consume for those that aren't thrilled about it. I imagine cooking them makes them less nutritious.

 

[Laura]

My approach is to just keep it simple. I have my little list and that's it.

Also, eat liver - calves or chicken.

Laura, how do you prepare the liver? Do you freeze it and then eat it? I've read some simple ways of freezing and then cutting them into little "pills" that are easy to consume for those that aren't thrilled about it. I imagine cooking them makes them less nutritious.

Why would I freeze it and then eat it? Or as pills? I LOVE liver! Calves liver, chicken livers, deep fried, pan-fried with onions and garlic, broiled, etc. If chicken livers are deep fried, I can eat them like popcorn! I love liver pate, too. It's great made with either chicken livers, pork livers, calves liver and chopped up bacon. You don't cook liver very long. Just until it is done and still tender. YUMMMMMM!

 

[kujo]

Why would I freeze it and then eat it? Or as pills? I LOVE liver! Calves liver, chicken livers, deep fried, pan-fried with onions and garlic, broiled, etc. If chicken livers are deep fried, I can eat them like popcorn! I love liver pate, too. It's great made with either chicken livers, pork livers, calves liver and chopped up bacon. You don't cook liver very long. Just until it is done and still tender. YUMMMMMM!

Haha, I've had pate before and it was wonderful, I guess I just wasn't so sure of chicken livers - seeing your enthusiasm I'll consider some of your suggestions. I've read that liver should be frozen for up to two weeks to eliminate any creepy things that may be living inside of it. Do you agree with that? Definitely the SOURCE is so important, but I wonder now if it's necessary to freeze with what you're saying.

 

[Laura]

Why would I freeze it and then eat it? Or as pills? I LOVE liver! Calves liver, chicken livers, deep fried, pan-fried with onions and garlic, broiled, etc. If chicken livers are deep fried, I can eat them like popcorn! I love liver pate, too. It's great made with either chicken livers, pork livers, calves liver and chopped up bacon. You don't cook liver very long. Just until it is done and still tender. YUMMMMMM!

Haha, I've had pate before and it was wonderful, I guess I just wasn't so sure of chicken livers - seeing your enthusiasm I'll consider some of your suggestions. I've read that liver should be frozen for up to two weeks to eliminate any creepy things that may be living inside of it. Do you agree with that? Definitely the SOURCE is so important, but I wonder now if it's necessary to freeze with what you're saying.

Never heard of that freezing business. I get nice, fresh, calves livers or chicken or pork livers from the butcher and take them home and cook same day.

 

[Mrs.Tigersoap]

Why would I freeze it and then eat it? Or as pills?

Yes, some alternative health bloggers are proposing to cut liver in tiny pieces, freeze them and pop them like pills/supplements. This way you can have liver even if it's not your cup of tea. Can be a good idea for kids who are not too keen, too.

 

[Laura]

Why would I freeze it and then eat it? Or as pills?

Yes, some alternative health bloggers are proposing to cut liver in tiny pieces, freeze them and pop them like pills/supplements. This way you can have liver even if it's not your cup of tea. Can be a good idea for kids who are not too keen, too.

I find it hard to imagine consuming enough in pill form to equal what I would eat in a slice for dinner. Like two handfuls of pills?

 

[Mrs.Tigersoap]

I find it hard to imagine consuming enough in pill form to equal what I would eat in a slice for dinner. Like two handfuls of pills?

Yeah, not very practical. Never tried, to be honest.
I guess the rationale behind it is 'better a little than none at all'?

 

[Mgse]

Thanks for the tips to everyone. Yesterday night was like the other nights (sweating, awake most of the time, 1-2h of dreaming), took 1 melatonin (2.5mg) and 3x110 mg of magnesium citrate (not sure how much magnesium). I did another round of blood tests (hepatitis, bacteria, testosterone levels etc), urine test (culture) yesterday (results in 5 days) and thursday I'll do an ecography for the liver, at least to narrow down the possible causes. My right leg numbness is better, but my sleep hasn't improved much. I'm not sure if I'm still in the detox process, a bit constipated again (I drink 2l of water), anxious and worried about not sleeping. I followed your tips about diet, but there is some kind of imbalance (hormonal, chemical) or organ dysfunction, where the melatonin is not produced properly to induce the sleep (maybe too much cortisol, saliva test is needed). While trying to sleep I see a pattern, after melatonin has its effect, I start dreaming and then 1/2-1 h later I wake up suddenly with heart palpitations and sweating (my body temp increases rapidly) lasting 2-3min, maybe my body temp lowers to much while dreaming, or it's a sleep apnea (I snore, my wife told me). Then I cannot go to sleep again until 4-5 am where I start dreaming again (1/2h), probably my body is too tired. Benadryl might help, is there anybody else that tried it. I did EE breathing yesterday, but stopped at Ba-ha because my hands started to shake. I'm trying to find a reasonable explanation for an aid to help my body rest for a couple of hours because we know when our bodies get rested.