Laura's Stem Cells

Hi Gaby, even though I don't have a proven/measured diagnosis, neuropathy, would Pento be worth trying? How can I get it, just to try? Laura mentioned that it is not available in the West...

Doctors here have given up, and me too. I'm still on the same medications as before and now when they don't know what to do they say that it is time for me to start put out my medication and start to exercise. Yeah, right, why didn't I think of that!

I know, maybe a long stretch, but not much to lose right now.

(Still waiting for my NIR unit)
 
worldbridger said:
Hi Gaby, even though I don't have a proven/measured diagnosis, neuropathy, would Pento be worth trying? How can I get it, just to try? Laura mentioned that it is not available in the West...

Doctors here have given up, and me too. I'm still on the same medications as before and now when they don't know what to do they say that it is time for me to start put out my medication and start to exercise. Yeah, right, why didn't I think of that!

I know, maybe a long stretch, but not much to lose right now.

(Still waiting for my NIR unit)

You might want to do a direct consult with Gaby via her website. http://health-matrix.net/

ADDED: I do have diagnosed, measured, neuropathy in the left leg and I can tell you, the pentox really helps.
 
worldbridger said:
How can I get it, just to try?

It is available under prescription, but usually you will not hear about its potential beneficial effect in quite a number of conditions including neuropathic pain.

Doctors forget it exists, specially when pharma sponsored education only emphasize opiods and biological agents that costs thousands per vial. Comparatively speaking, pentoxiphylline is Big Pharma's cheapest and good drug.

Pentox's safety track record and beneficial effects should make it a first line of therapy before mind numbing pain killer drugs.
 
I didn't say to toss it out :) . I was noticing it's not so efficient, and wondered if its efficacy is due to combination with other therapy.

In the articles Gaby gives, it appears that in jaw osteonecrosis it has been combined to vit E.
In the other article (review on vascular health), the authors conclude " Larger studies are clearly indicated to evaluate pentoxifylline as an adjunct to current proven therapies."

In tinnitus, it's used also in combination:

Multimodal therapy for chronic tinnitus. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18616089
Abstract

From 2001 to 2006, we performed a retrospective study of patients suffering from chronic unilateral or bilateral tinnitus that was previously ineffectively treated by oral drugs [betahistine (Betaserc), extract of Ginkgo biloba (EGb 761), tanakan (Tebokan), and cinnarizine-dimenhydrinate (Arlevert), singly or in combination]. We divided 150 tinnitus patients (80 men, 70 women) into seven treatment groups. Treatments consisted of application of intravenous pentoxifylline, lidocaine, or vinpocetine (Cavinton) and combination of these agents with physiotherapy and soft laser. Mean duration (+/- standard deviation) of tinnitus in these patients was 7.4 +/- 6.0 years; their mean age was 55.6 +/- 12.5 years. The aim of our study was to compare treatment modalities and define their effectiveness for tinnitus relief. The most effective treatment was defined as a combination of Cavinton and physiotherapy. We evaluated pure lidocaine infusion therapy as ineffective. None of the treatment modalities had an objective correlate of improvement, though improvement was reported by a visual analog scale.

Human body is so complex, and drugs can give an antagonist effect. Here is a case of musical tinitus triggered by pento:
Musical hallucinations: perpetual music. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24570359

Musical hallucinations are a kind of auditory hallucination that are prevalent among the non-psychiatric population, but which have rarely been reported in the neurological literature. They occur most frequently in the elderly, in females and when there is a loss of hearing, but their pathophysiology has still to be unravelled.

We report here six cases (five females and one male) of musical hallucinations diagnosed in a general neurology clinic over a time-span of five years. In five cases there was also concurrent hypoacusis, to a greater or lesser extent, and one had been triggered by pentoxifylline. In most instances, the musical content of the hallucinations had its origins in music experienced in childhood and early youth. In the cases submitted to pharmacological treatment, the response was poor. Yet, after explaining to the patients that the condition was benign and had no connection with a psychotic pathology, the degree of acceptance of the symptoms was good.

Musical hallucinations are a little-known pathology lying on the borderline between neurology, otorhinolaryngology and psychiatry which are often wrongly linked to mental disease. It is essential to explain to patients and relatives that these symptoms are not necessarily of a psychiatric nature, and to be aware of the potential capacity of some commonly used drugs to generate them.

Gaby, when I read your articles, I think "wow, what a wonderful drug". Nonetheless, in practice, when I see patients treated with pento or other vasodilatators, I see disapointed patients! I also saw some patients who had a crisis of angor or a cerebral stroke while they were under pento (or same family like trimetazidine) for may months or years.
It reminds me of methylen blue; on paper it's a wonderfull drug, but in practice those who tried it didn't notice particular effect.
Now, regarding your articles, I don't deny its usefullness; and yes we can wonder why removing it particularly, whereas other non-usefull drugs are still on the market.
Anyways, thank you for your research of articles, I didn't know its indication as painkiller.
 
Laura said:
worldbridger said:
Hi Gaby, even though I don't have a proven/measured diagnosis, neuropathy, would Pento be worth trying? How can I get it, just to try? Laura mentioned that it is not available in the West...

Doctors here have given up, and me too. I'm still on the same medications as before and now when they don't know what to do they say that it is time for me to start put out my medication and start to exercise. Yeah, right, why didn't I think of that!

I know, maybe a long stretch, but not much to lose right now.

(Still waiting for my NIR unit)

You might want to do a direct consult with Gaby via her website. http://health-matrix.net/

ADDED: I do have diagnosed, measured, neuropathy in the left leg and I can tell you, the pentox really helps.

Sure, good idea.

Well, it's good to hear that some meds really DO work...for a change.
 
nature said:
Gaby, when I read your articles, I think "wow, what a wonderful drug". Nonetheless, in practice, when I see patients treated with pento or other vasodilatators, I see disapointed patients! I also saw some patients who had a crisis of angor or a cerebral stroke while they were under pento (or same family like trimetazidine) for may months or years.
It reminds me of methylen blue; on paper it's a wonderfull drug, but in practice those who tried it didn't notice particular effect.

Keep an open mind because its potential might not be due to the adjunct therapy, but to a potentiation of effects. Pentoxifylline works in various levels and other drugs that act on those same pathways can cost over a thousand euros per vial.

Safety track record for a Big Pharma drug doesn't mean zero reports of adverse effects. I wouldn't jump into conclusions or discard it based on some odd report that might have been due to, in part, other factors. I wouldn't discard it based on my experience with pento on the public health care system in Spain either. Sometimes I was biased to think that all the drugs people take are related to their current problems. That is not necessarily an opened minded approach. You have to go through the studies with an open mind. What if it is something that could make the difference in a person's life, even when it is combined with other efforts?

Laura benefited from pento, some of the positive effects were corroborated after the initial clinic experience when she was at home. I myself didn't care about pentoxifylline before, it was only after hearing Laura deriving a positive effect from it that I got very curious as to what might be happening there.

I wouldn't throw the baby with the bathwater. See for instance,

Treatment of vascular inner ear disease with pentoxifylline: a 4-week, controlled, randomized trial

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11865830

The efficacy of pentoxifylline (PXF) in vascular inner ear disease (VIED) was studied comparing PXF and placebo in a 4-week study; 60 patients with unilateral loss of hearing, vertigo, dizziness, tinnitus (analyzed with an analogue scale line), and cochlear flow reduction were included. The aim of the study was to study the effect of PXF (1800 mg/day) in VIED considering clinical outcome and cochlear flow. All patients completed the study. Improvement in cochlear flow (p<0.05) and a decrease in score in both groups were observed. The cochlear flow increase was 287.5% in the PXF group vs 168% in the placebo group (119.5% difference; p<0.02). There was a difference in score decrease (44.1% larger) in the PXF group (p<0.05). PXF was more effective considering flow and symptoms.

It is being studied for vertigo as well,

Trental for the Treatment of Vertigo/Dizziness/Imbalance

https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT02592863
 
Did some searching, seems like Pento goes under the names Trental, Pentoxil etc, and is not available/legal in Sweden, but you can order it online for approx. 1 euro a pill 400 mg from some online pharmacy. In Sweden i believe the vets use it, not sure though.
 
So glad you are feeling better, Laura, and that the treatment seems to make such a big difference!! :headbanger:
 
worldbridger said:
Did some searching, seems like Pento goes under the names Trental, Pentoxil etc, and is not available/legal in Sweden, but you can order it online for approx. 1 euro a pill 400 mg from some online pharmacy. In Sweden i believe the vets use it, not sure though.

Well, that's not too bad. I was taking 1200 mg per day in divided doses (1 400 mg 3X day or 1 600 mg 2X per day). Now, I just take it like five days on, two off, 1 400 mg 2X per day. It has done some pretty amazing things for Chu's vasculitis and my son's hidradenitis. I'm pretty sure it has had a very beneficial effect on the jaw problem I've dealt with for 40 years.

Reading about the "musical hallucinations" above made me think "Yeah, it really helps blood flow in the brain, memory and such, so why not? The person is having memories 'awakened', so to say."

Overall, reading the various studies, and considering different meds pushed by Big Pharma, I'll keep my pentox, thank you very much! It works well - miraculously even - and the only side effect I've experienced has been some slight burpiness and upset stomach that clears up. Chu and Atriedes have not experienced any side effects at all. I sent some to my brother who has COPD and he hasn't experienced any side effects and swears it makes him feel much better too.
 
Sounds promising. Sent a question to the online pharmacy asking about placing orders from Sweden, they have a US and a UK office it seems, well a phone number anyway. Can't be that illegal can it? It's not opiates...
 
Yes of course, it's worth giving it a try in each individual cases, regardless of other unsuccesfull cases, because you report also successfull cases.
 
I'm thinking to that and would like to share it with you:
1. Is pento the most efficacious among vaso-active drugs? I'll do a research on pubmed. If you've got the answer yet Gaby, as you've done research, I'll be glad to have your response :)

2. Why some patients don't respond to these drugs and others do very well? The thought that came to me is that:
as vaso-dilatators increase vascular flow towards organs, they bring more nutrients and more oxygen, thus the healing. But if the body is intoxicated - junk food, kidney or liver failure which prevents elimination of toxins- more toxins arrive to organs by the same time, thus the lack of real efficacy.
Then, it's very important to pursue or even increase detox protocol while taking these drugs.
Certainly other factors come up in that efficacy, like the brain biochemistry, and the parasympathetic status. Thus doing EE during the treatment may help too, so as having a good mental state.

Whole view, whole care: holistic medicine ;)
 
The pharmacy answered quickly, I asked some questions about import restrictions/legal matters etc:

"The medications are delivered from India.

The product will be shipped out in plain envelope with no marks about its
content.
Just sender and recipient addresses on a front side of a discreet parcel."

I also might need a prescription, I will know when I place the order.
 
Merci Laura, worldbridger, Alada, Nature pour le partage de ces informations intéressantes...

Thank you Laura, worldbridger, Alada, Nature for sharing this interesting information ...
 
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