Learned Helplessness

[anart]

Our learned helplessness

Hmmm - your 'quote function' appears to be a bit off since your post appears to be one long quote by me - which is not the case.

You also seem to be confusing feeling emotion with 'the emotional center' and the usurping of the energy of the emotional center by the intellect.

I've read Ouspensky (Uspenski) and it's rather ironic that you quote him since he, according to available evidence - his writings and those of his contemporaries - he evidences quite a blocked emotional center - he spoke of that which he did not viscerally understand. He tended to do such things, being equipped with a large ego and an even larger intellect.

I never said that empathy is 'bad' - I am empathic to a fault myself - but when it comes to THINKING - and to seeing things as they truly are - the emotional center - if allowed to run amok and if not fully understood, awakened and 'harnessed' will lead one astray as surely as the sun rises in what we perceive to be the East.

I notice in your response that you, again, allude to being a teacher - you've done that several times, as if trying to increase the credibility of what you write. Is that why you keep mentioning it or is there another reason?

My point, which seems to have been lost on you, is that Erna is not served by an emotional center run amok telling her to immediately do 'this and that' - and that Erna is served by a thorough understanding of the situation - incorporating the emotional center.

Ultimately, that is up to Erna - and I was simply pointing out to you that in using the emotional language you used, it was coming across as slightly manipulative and as if you 'thinking' with your 'emotions' - this one tends to 'get us every time'. fwiw.

You've edited your post since I wrote the above (is there a reason you did not simply reply to my post?) and added:

I think I see the situation clearly. I see someone who is is facing a possible violent death, and is writing about feeling as helpless as a dog in a cage in which the entire floor has been wired to give electric shocks, states that she doesn't want to know what's going on, is not facing the fact that the country she grew up in and loves exists no more,
veers away from the thought of exile even while she is considering it, and takes refuge in the intellectual center, the slowest of all the centers, while she discusses the political situation in Zimbawe. I think she's in shock, and no wonder. It is, I think, almost too much to bear, but her very survival may depend on really feeling the reality of her situation ASAP which may galvanize her to take the necessary steps she needs to free herself of that cage.

So you presume to think that she does not understand her situation?? And do you, webglider, understand Free Will? Or do you think 'determining the needs of another' is not STS?

 

[webglider]

Our learned helplessness

Anart wrote :

"I notice in your response that you, again, allude to being a teacher
- you've done that several times, as if trying to increase the credibility
of what you write. Is that why you keep mentioning it or is there another
reason?"

I am providing a context for my responses. Many of my posts would not make sense without being placed in that context. I have spent most of my life in that role. I am no longer teaching, and one of my goals is to diminish the importance of that archetype and explore other sides of myself.

I was simply pointing out to you that in using the emotional language you used, it was coming across as slightly manipulative and as if you 'thinking' with your 'emotions' - this one tends to 'get us every time'

.

You're right. The emotional language is manipulative even though I didn't realize it at the time. Thanks for pointing it out.

 

[anart]

Our learned helplessness

I am providing a context for my responses. Many of my posts would not make sense without being placed in that context. I have spent most of my life in that role. I am no longer teaching, and one of my goals is to diminish the importance of that archetype and explore other sides of myself.

Actually, in the context in which you've pointed this out, it has not been necessary. Many of your posts would have, in fact, made sense without being 'placed in that context'. So what is lacking in your own self-confidence and self-perception that tells you that you need to point out that 'I was a teacher' - as if that tells the reader, objectively, anything at all?

It seems that you are, quite simply, identified with being 'a teacher' and thus feel that referencing it adds weight to what you are saying - not context. If it helps you to get past that idea - your having been a teacher does not add any weight at all to your statements.

Your statements will stand on their own - on their own merit, data, and level of objectivity (if any) - so perhaps it's time to move past the 'As a teacher' thing. fwiw.

 

[Anulios]

Learned Helplessness



Loss of Control & Burnout
Dr. Beverly Potter

Learned Helplessness

_http://www.docpotter.com/boclass-25helplessness.html
    Psychologist Martin Seligman spent years studying the impact of "controllability" on people and animals which is described n his book, Learned Helplessness: On Depression, Development and Death.

    In a typical study matched pairs of dogs were divided into two groups, one where the dog could control what happened and one where it could do nothing. In the first situation, a naive dog was place in a room with an electric grid floor. This first situation was called "controllable" because the room also contained a puzzle. If the dog "solved" the puzzle, the shock stopped. In this example the puzzle was a lever, which when pushed, turned off the shock.

    Since the dog had never been in the room before and it had no knowledge of the shock it was about to receive, the dog was relaxed and friendly as it wagged its tail and wiggled its nose. However, when the electric floor was activated, the dog's demeanor changed dramatically. It jumped and yelped as it frantically searched for a way out. In the process the dog accidentally pushed the lever, causing the shock to stop -  a powerful negative win. Over the next couple of trials when the dog was put back in the room and the shock turned on, the dog learned very quickly to run to the lever and push it. The dog was highly motivated - albeit avoidance motivation - because the dog learned that it could do something to control its world.

    The dog in the "uncontrollable" group was placed in the same room with the electric floor, only this time there was no puzzle and there was nothing that the dog could do to turn off the shock. Just like the first dog, it ran around trying to find a way out. When the dog eventually learned that there was nothing that it could do it gave up, and laying down on the floor, it took the shock. The dog was not motivated because it learned that it was helpless.

    Later the second dog that had learned that it was helpless was put into the room with the puzzle but it made no effort to find a way out. Instead the dog just lay on the floor and took the shock. Even when the door was left wide open, the dog did not attempt to escape the shock. The dog could not seem to learn that the conditions had changed and that it was no longer helpless.

    To summarize, the second dog "learned" that it was helpless and stopped trying to get away. Its motivation to escape was extinguished or eliminated. In the process, dog exhibited a lot of negative emotions: first yelping and growling, later whimpering, and eventually just remaining motionless. Something happened that interfered with the dog's ability to learn when things changed and when it could do something. In effect, the dog burned out.

    Powerlessness at work can affect people in the same way. As you learn that there is nothing you can do you'll probably experience negative emotions, beginning with frustration and anger, later anxiety and guilt, and eventually depression and despair. In the process, motivation declines. When the conditions change you will probably find it hard to learn and continue acting helpless.

    Of course, scientists can't subject people to such experiments so we have no direct scientific data on the effects of powerlessness on human subjects. However, we can speculate that the battered-wife syndrome may be caused by learned helplessness, for example. If the woman believes that she is powerless before an abusive husband, she will probably act like the dog on the grid floor, taking the abuse and not running away when she has the opportunity. People in the ghetto who don't avail themselves of opportunities, such as educational programs, may fail to do so not because of laziness, but because they have learned that they are helpless and, as a result cannot act. Homeless people who are skilled and were once securely employed but now are
    unable to hold a job, may also be victims of learned helplessness. People who are chronically depressed may have become so as a result of uncontrollable situations. For example, there is a statistic claiming that more Vietnam Vets committed suicide than were killed in the war. Perhaps they were suffering from burnout. Remember the yellow ribbons and the people held hostage over 400 hundred days in Iran? A large percentage of the hostages developed chronic depression. Perhaps it was learned helplessness.

    In his research, Seligman discovered that animals who learn to be helpless have little resistance to adverse situations. They often die in as few as ten minutes when placed in a survival situation, whereas animals who have learned mastery continue fighting to survive hours later. This research suggests learned helplessness is literally life-threatening. Research suggests it even triggers a biological suicide mechanism. In some cases biological functions simply slow down or cease; other studies indicate that the body may develop a terminal disease. This notion has been supported by research with cancer patients that suggested that people who are depressed and feel like victims were more likely to get cancer.

    An uncontrollable situation can be harmful without being physically painful, however. Feeling helpless can do serious damage to motivation in any situation, even those filled with luxury and privilege. An example is the poor little rich boy whose daddy does everything for him.  As a kid he breaks a window with a ball, and daddy fixes it.  He gets ho hum grades in school but gets into college anyway because daddy gave a big donation. After graduation he gets a job with a big salary and a corner office in daddy's firm.

    Surprisingly, the poor little rich boy's situation is similar to the unhappy worker suffering under a hypercritical boss.  While the worker is overloaded with criticism and the rich boy has an overabundance of goodies, both lack a sense of control. Neither feel they can influence what happens to them. Seligman emphasizes in his research on learned helplessness that it is not the quality of the situation that causes feelings of helplessness and depression. Even though we tend to think that the cause is punitive circumstances, situations filled with rewards can also lead to the same debilitating learned helplessness and depression when the person does not have to perform to get those rewards. Seligman describes research with rats and pigeons in which they could choose between getting food free and having to make certain responses to get the same food. The rats and pigeons choose to work!

 

[anart]

Anulios, I've merged your new thread with the already existing threads on Learned Helplessness. I noticed you just posted the information without commenting on it. Did you have something to add?
Here is a link to the original SoTT article from March of this year on the subject: http://www.sott.net/articles/show/152054-Our-Learned-Helplessness

 

[Anulios]

Anulios, I've merged your new thread with the already existing threads on Learned Helplessness. I noticed you just posted the information without commenting on it. Did you have something to add?
Here is a link to the original SoTT article from March of this year on the subject: http://www.sott.net/articles/show/152054-Our-Learned-Helplessness

Thanks Anart
Somehow, i thought it should fit in with Gurdjieff's teachings.
I tried to wedge it in, but it just didn't look right to me that the second dog had no lever to control the shocks and was completely powerless.
There was no option for the second dog, only for the first. Depressing!!

Anyways, i got discouraged and just posted the article.
(Obviously, i failed to do a proper search)

“If a man could understand all the horror of the lives of ordinary people who are turning around in a circle of insignificant interests and insignificant aims, if he could understand what they are losing, he would understand that there can only be one thing that is serious for him — to escape from the general law, to be free. What can be serious for a man in prison who is condemned to death? Only one thing: How to save himself, how to escape: nothing else is serious.”
– G. I. Gurdjieff

Best
Anulios

 

[thevenusian]

Erna,
Thank you for sharing with us what you are going through and what you are thinking and feeling about it. And thank you for sharing your wisdom and courage about thinking tactical and keeping a cool head. I fear these are skills many of us will be learning to deploy more urgently in the days ahead, under circumstances like what you describe. If it helps at all to know, at least this reader of your words thinks you will know well enough what you should do when the right time comes.

 

[bedower]

Hi Erna,

Your post made my heart ache; although I can imagine what it must be like to live in such anarchy, I don't really know what it's like. It must be terrifying.

I came across this article at

_http://www.thetruthseeker.co.uk/article.asp?ID=9848

entitled 'Mandela's Smile: Notes on South Africa's Failed Revolution' by Breyten Braytenbach, a SA poet. You've probably heard of him. He also writes that he can no longer live in SA, what a wrench it was to leave, and he advises those who can to leave while they can.

He lists some of the atrocities he's heard about, as you do. The article did not make for easy reading; the same as your post.

I wish you well for the future, and hope the decision you finally make will be the best one for you and your loved ones.

 

[Erna]

Thank you thevenusian, I am like a see-saw when it comes to South Africa. Mostly positive, keeping the "dark nights of the soul" to a minimum. If the personal accounts of friends who have lived abroad and returned are anything to go by (homesickness), then I'm afraid it would take a hell of a lot more for me to ever leave. I think it's a curse to love this place. I sometimes think I shouldn't only focus on the crime and grime on this forum, because it just paints such a dark and gloomy picture of South Africa. It really is a breathtakingy beautiful country.

Bedower, I just read Breytenbach's "letter", and his despondency with the current state of affairs is well relayed in the letter. Breytenbach is very well known to South Africans, he was a big anti-apartheid activist, and he is an exceptional writer. I understand why he says "if you can handle the loss" (of leaving), it's this place, these people, must be very difficult to part with. Breytenbach's despondency is joined by other anti-apartheid activists. Max du Preez is another one.

Did we forget what life could be like behind our seven foot walls, electric fences, thermal imaging cameras, armed response and our guns. Sure we have. It feels like a lifetime away when we didn't even lock our doors at night. Let's hope we are not the next failed African state. I still like to think our situation is somewhat unique. Lot's of similarities to other failed states after independence, but lot's of differences as well.

Thank you for your post, bedower.