Mind Control

Anart, one thing I've had glimpses of seeing, is how deep this mechanicalness really goes.

At first we are shocked by realising that people are reactionary and find it hard to control theirselves, if you relate this to the analogy of a machine. Then you go deeper and realise that your very own thoughts are not really yours at all. Just reactions of your machine. So when you try to think with the way you think, you are just going round in circles thinking you are awake when you are still dreaming.

I've heard that so many times yet still don't grasp fully how true it Is. How deep does it go? Is there truly a part of me that is separate and not animal like? I sure like to think there Is!

It seems that you think you see the bigger picture and that Is a trap since there is an even bigger picture and so on and so forth. The mind sure boggles!
 
anart said:
You might want to re-read Strangers to Ourselves.
Thanks for the homework, as to this:
I think if you could actually laugh at how mechanical you are, as you described doing, you've not even come close to experiencing a true understanding of the horror of the situation.
While i am far from a true/complete understanding since understanding has various degrees, i have definitely experienced the terror of it all (maybe terror also has varying degrees), it's just that i have moved past it. Every once in a while i return to a state similar to it, take a dive into it, and return having gained deeper insight & understanding of myself, and thus reality.

Although it could be just another set of lies to myself, that i am progressing and all that jazz, that is definitely a very likely possibility, and it is always in the forefront of any analysis i conduct on my experiences.
 
Paragon said:
It seems that you think you see the bigger picture and that Is a trap since there is an even bigger picture and so on and so forth. The mind sure boggles!
BWAHAHA, you nailed it on the head Paragon, i came back after i had finished posting, and you just corroborated what i held as a very likely possibility. "Oh what a tangled web we weave, when we choose to deceive."

Learning is fun.
 
Paragon said:
Anart, one thing I've had glimpses of seeing, is how deep this mechanicalness really goes.

At first we are shocked by realising that people are reactionary and find it hard to control theirselves, if you relate this to the analogy of a machine. Then you go deeper and realise that your very own thoughts are not really yours at all. Just reactions of your machine. So when you try to think with the way you think, you are just going round in circles thinking you are awake when you are still dreaming.

I've heard that so many times yet still don't grasp fully how true it Is. How deep does it go? Is there truly a part of me that is separate and not animal like? I sure like to think there Is!

It seems that you think you see the bigger picture and that Is a trap since there is an even bigger picture and so on and so forth. The mind sure boggles!

Pretty much sums it up. Yes, I do think there is a part of us that is separate, (if only in potential) it's just that it's silent from a lifetime of non-use, a lifetime of being drowned out by the false personality, and as G says, it fades away at the slightest hint of a lie. Thus the mighty, and lifetime, struggle of removing the lies to the self and dismantling the false personality held firmly in place by those lies. They don't call it Work for nothing! But, the first step is getting a glimpse of the reality of it all - the true horror of the situation.
 
bngenoh said:
i have definitely experienced the terror of it all (maybe terror also has varying degrees), it's just that i have moved past it.

You never 'move past' a true understanding of the terror of the situation.

b said:
Although it could be just another set of lies to myself,

Yep.
 
Why I's it that I 'forget' the true nature of our reality? I look back on my own posts and see examples where I've went "wow that's so true, we ARE machines" but I'm not really fully intergrating that knowledge into my life. Maybe I need to repeatedly see different aspects of this truth many times before I 'want' to live it?

It seems that reality Is really so so much different than what we think it Is. It's like ever expanding bubbles of awareness that once you peer into the next one, you get only a glimpse of how all encompassing it is. I can't even begin to comprehend how far it goes. We shall never know as human beings but if doing the work is akin to evolution, then it I's only meant for those who are ready to WANT it.

Sorry for the wiseacring, just when I really tried to think about our mechanicalness versus what we think we know, it astounded me. The biggest lie ever Is the idea we are in control of ourselves. How sobering. Also Is that I know I will wake up tomorrow and forget all this. :rolleyes:
 
anart said:
You never 'move past' a true understanding of the terror of the situation.
:D :D Mirrors are amazing aren't they, this explains at least in part my state over these past few weeks. It will definitely take me a while to ponder & reflect upon your statement.

BTW, is it just me or do i come of as a haughty, precocious, and pretentious little bastard.
 
bngenoh said:
BTW, is it just me or do i come of as a haughty, precocious, and pretentious little bastard.
Actually, bngenoh, you come across as quite intelligent and highly inquisitive. Personally, I find your postings enlightening and usually very interesting. As well, you seem to be very insightful.
Anyhow, and fwiw, that is what I see.

Mod's note: Edited to fix the quotation
 
bngenoh I have never found you pretentious :) I myself have come off a bit snooty a few times but that's just stubbornness. I am a pagan in the truest sense of the word "unpolished" I'm read, but not well read, I am more comfortable with the low folks LOL. What coming to this place has proven to me is two things I knew from a young age. One, we are nothing but bio chemical machines. The second came to me when I was 17ish. The fact that we are all a part of a larger body or soul per say. I saw it or it was given to me. I just remember it hit me like a shot. It was like we were cells in a larger body. Really strange and there was an infinite part to the whole thing. The rest is coming to me more slowly but that's fine. I am getting more comfortable here, which is a good thing.
 
bngenoh said:
BTW, is it just me or do i come of as a haughty, precocious, and pretentious little bastard.

Only occasionally. ;)

Seriously, though, you only get in the weeds when you start wiseacring with all of your self. Usually, you only wiseacre with part of yourself, so it's not too bad. For the most part, when it's pointed out you pull yourself out of it - but you really like to do it, so it's a battle. Slowly but surely, it will dawn on you that all this wiseacring is a waste of energy because your understanding is changing so rapidly that you need only wait a few months to see things very differently than you do now (making previous wiseacring obsolete). At that point, perhaps you'll slow down the wiseacring a bit. We'll see!
 
Laura said:
http://www.mindcontrol.se/?page_id=6776&fb_source=message

Can some of ya'll who are interested take a look at this site and report back what it's about, whether it is interesting, what the deal is, etc???

My impression of the website is that it is somewhat hysterical in tone, and as noted by others here does not provide much in the way of source and reference. I think that the NSA could be involved in some of the things the site alleges, but that is from reading other material not referenced by the site.

I read James Bamford's Body of Secrets (2001) about the NSA. It is mostly history and is in my opinion apologist in its line of force. It is mostly a history of the NSA and frames its activities in terms of national defense and its ability to eavesdrop on and code-break 'enemy' communications. Having said that, however, two things do stand out in his book.

The first is the incredible secret culture of the NSA and the intensely insular world of its 38,000 employees. The second is that this agency has certainly been at the forefront of developing and using the most advanced computer technology anywhere. As such it would be high on the list of possible supercomputer 'beasts'.

Here are a few excerpts to illustrate. 'Crypto City' is the NSA headquarters in Maryland:

James Bamford's Body of Secrets (2001)

On the southbound lane of the Baltimore—Washington Parkway, near
the sleepy Maryland hamlet of Annapolis Junction, a restricted, specially
constructed exit ramp disappears quickly from view. Hidden by tall
earthen berms and thick trees, the ramp leads to a labyrinth of barbed-
wire fences, massive boulders placed close together, motion detectors,
hydraulic antitruck devices, and thick cement barriers. During alerts,
commandos dressed in black paramilitary uniforms, wearing special
headgear, and brandishing an assortment of weapons including Colt
9mm submachine guns, quickly respond. They are known as the "Men in
Black." Telephoto surveillance cameras peer down, armed police patrol
the boundaries, and bright yellow signs warn against taking any
photographs or making so much as a note or a simple sketch, under the
penalties of the Internal Security Act. What lies beyond is a strange and
invisible city unlike any other on earth. It contains what is probably the
largest body of secrets ever created.
.....
Nearby residents can only guess what lies beyond the forbidden exit
ramp. County officials say they have no idea how many people work
there, and no one will tell them. Traffic planners from the county
planning department, it is said, once put a rubber traffic-counting cord
across a road leading to the city, but armed guards came out and quickly
sliced it.
"For a long time we didn't tell anybody who we were," admitted
one agency official. "The focus was not on community activity. [It was]
like everyone outside the agency was the enemy."
In an effort to ease relations with its neighbors, officials from the city
gave Maryland's transportation secretary, James Lighthizer, a rare tour.
But the state official was less than overwhelmed. "I didn't get to see a
darn thing," he said.

At a nearby gas station, owner Clifford Roop says the people traveling
into and out of the city keep to themselves. "They say they work for the
DoD [Department of Defense]. They don't talk about their work at all."
Once, when a reporter happened into the station and began taking a few
notes, two police cruisers from the secret city rushed up to the office and
demanded an ID from the journalist. This was not an unusual response.
When a photographer hired by real estate developers started up a hill
near Crypto City to snap some shots of a future construction site, he was
soon surrounded by NSA security vehicles. "They picked him up and
hauled him in and asked what he was doing," said Robert R. Strott, a
senior vice president at Constellation Real Estate, which was a partner in
the project. During interrogation the photographer not only denied
attempting to take a shot of Crypto City, he said he had never even heard
of NSA. Worried that occupants of an eleven-story office building might
be able to look into the city, NSA leased the entire building before it was
completed.
.......

Crypto City's yearly consumption of electricity—409,005,840 kilowatt-
hours, carried over 662 miles of wires—equals that of Maryland's capital,
Annapolis. And with over six acres of computers, twenty-five tons of air-
conditioning equipment pumping out over 6 billion cubic feet of cool air a
year, and more than half a million lightbulbs to power, the city burns up
54 million watts of electricity a day. That leaves the secret city with a
shocking monthly electric bill of nearly $2 million, which makes it the
second largest user of electricity in the entire state. In 1992 Crypto City
consumed 3.5 trillion BTUs of oil, electricity, and gas—the equivalent of
33 million gallons of fuel oil.
.........

By 2001, the SRC had long since broken the teraflop barrier and was
approaching petaflop speeds—at which point time is measured in
femtoseconds, the shortest events known to science. With such
extraordinary speed, a machine would be capable of pounding a stream
of intercepted, enciphered text with a quadrillion—a million billion—
possible solutions in the time it takes to wink. Original estimates by
scientists were that the outside world would reach that point sometime
around 2010, but IBM intends to cut the wait in half with a mega-
supercomputer dubbed Blue Gene.

Over five years, between 2000 and 2005, the company plans to build
the fastest computer on earth—500 times faster than anything currently
in existence. "It will suck down every spare watt of electricity and throw
off so much heat that a gas turbine the size of a jet engine is required to
cool it off," said one report. According to the company, the computer
would be about forty times more powerful than the aggregate power of
the forty fastest supercomputers in the world today—or 2 million times
more powerful than the fastest desktop in existence.

The ultimate goal of Blue Gene is to solve a puzzle of a different sort
from those at NSA—although NSA may also secretly be a customer. Blue
Gene's singular objective is to try and model the way a human protein
folds into a particular shape. Because proteins are the molecular
workhorses of the human body, it is essential to discover their molecular
properties. In a sense, Blue Gene is like NSA's old RAMs, which were
designed to attack one specific encryption system.

When completed, Blue Gene will consist of sixty-four computing
towers standing six feet high and covering an area forty feet by forty feet.
Inside will be a mind-boggling one million processors. The target speed is
a petaflop.

When NSA crosses the petaflop threshold, if it hasn't already, it is
unlikely that the rest of the world will know. By 2005 the SRC, with
years of secret, highly specialized development accumulated, will likely
be working with computers operating at exaflop speeds—a quintillion
operations a second—and pushing for zettaflop and even yottaflop
machines, capable of a septillion (102*) operations every time a second
hand jumps. Beyond yottaflop, numbers have not yet been named. "It is
the greatest play box in the world," marveled one agency veteran of the
NSA's technology capability. "They've got one of everything."

Operating in the exaflop-and-above world will be almost
unimaginable. The key will be miniaturization, an area in which NSA has
been pushing the theoretical envelope. By the mid-1990s, NSA's Special
Processing Laboratory had reduced the size of a transistor so much that
seventy of them would fit on the cross section of a human hair. NSA is
also attempting to develop a new generation of computer chips by
bombarding light-sensitive material with ions to etch out microscopic
electronic circuit designs. Using ion beams instead of traditional light in
the process provides the potential for building far smaller, more complex,
more efficient chips.

In the late 1990s NSA reached a breakthrough when it was able to
shrink a supercomputer to the size of a home refrigerator-freezer
combination. Eventually the machine was pared down to the size of a
small suitcase, yet its speed was increased by 10 percent. In 1999, a
joint NSA and DARPA program demonstrated that portions of a
supercomputer could be engineered to fit into a cube six inches on a
side—small enough to fit into a coat pocket. The circuitry was made of
diamond-based multichip modules and cooled by aerosol spray to remove
the 2,500 watts of heat from the system.
.............

NSA has had a strong interest in quantum computing as far back as
1994, when Peter Shor, a mathematician at Bell Laboratories, which has
long had a close and secret relationship with the agency, discovered the
codebreaking advantages of the new science. Since then, NSA has spent
about $4 million a year to fund research at various universities, and put
additional money into studies at government laboratories.
Operated at top speed, a quantum computer could be used to uncover
pairs of enormously large prime numbers, which are the "passwords" for
many encryption systems. The largest number that ordinary
supercomputers have been able to factor is about 140 digits long. But
according to another Bell Labs scientist, Lov K. Grover, using quantum
computing, 140-digit-long numbers could be factored a billion times
faster than is currently possible. "On paper, at least," said Glover, "the
prospects are stunning: ... a search engine that could examine every
nook and cranny of the Internet in half an hour; a 'brute-force' decoder
that could unscramble a DES [Data Encryption Standard—the
encryption standard used by banks and most businesses] transmission
in five minutes."

A quantum computer could also be used to speed through
unfathomable numbers of intercepted communications—a "scan" in NSA-
speak—searching for a single keyword, a phrase, or even, with luck, a
"bust." Long the secret leading to many of NSA's past codebreaking
successes, a bust is an abnormality—sometimes very subtle—in a
target's cryptographic system. For example, it may be an error in a
Russian encryption program, or a faulty piece of hardware, or a sloppy
transmission procedure. Once such a hairline crack is discovered, NSA
code-breakers, using a massive amount of computer power in what is
known as a brute force attack, can sometimes chisel away enough of the
system to expose a golden vein of secret communications.
 
Or they just want us to believe in all that, in which case they wouldn't even need all those technology toys :)

BTW, is it just me or do i come of as a haughty, precocious, and pretentious little bastard.

bngenoh,

Not at all. At least to me, your post are intelligent and humorous. And the fact that you noticed that and ask it, proves that you are not, or at least even if you are you wouldn't be like that all your life :)
 
anart said:
Only occasionally. ;)
:lol: :lol:
Seriously, though, you only get in the weeds when you start wiseacring with all of your self. Usually, you only wiseacre with part of yourself, so it's not too bad. For the most part, when it's pointed out you pull yourself out of it - but you really like to do it, so it's a battle. Slowly but surely, it will dawn on you that all this wiseacring is a waste of energy because your understanding is changing so rapidly that you need only wait a few months to see things very differently than you do now (making previous wiseacring obsolete). At that point, perhaps you'll slow down the wiseacring a bit. We'll see!
Yes, guess i've got alot of subtle programs to look out for. Totally agree that the rate of obsolescence is quite astounding, that is why i am not tied down to any one line of thought. You are completely right anart.
Mr Meowgi said:
bngenoh I have never found you pretentious :) I myself have come off a bit snooty a few times but that's just stubbornness. I am a pagan in the truest sense of the word "unpolished" I'm read, but not well read, I am more comfortable with the low folks LOL.
"I" too have always liked to hang around with the so called "Low" folks, frankly because there is just less crap over all, than people of "high" standing, although not always.
Arbitrium Liberum said:
Not at all. At least to me, your post are intelligent and humorous. And the fact that you noticed that and ask it, proves that you are not, or at least even if you are you wouldn't be like that all your life :)
:D there is hope. :D :lol:
 
Thank you venusian for that insert above. It gave me some details I did not know. I just lump the alphabet soup together as part of "The Consortium" and look at it that way. I suppose you could call that "grouping" but if it looks like a duck.....quack quack!!
 
Mr Meowgi said:
Thank you venusian for that insert above. It gave me some details I did not know. I just lump the alphabet soup together as part of "The Consortium" and look at it that way. I suppose you could call that "grouping" but if it looks like a duck.....quack quack!!
Did a similar thing to you Mr Meowgi,

While traveling through that area a couple of times, it came to mind just how secure it is, at least from the perspective of traveling on public roads, there are only two traffic lanes in both directions, this happens after coming from 4 lane highways, so it forms a choke point, which makes it very difficult to get in or out without being noticed, although this is only if you use public roads. Consequently, traffic is very slow when you go past there.
 
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