More animal cruelty

[Guardian]

Good point, although it's not a myth if the person doesn't know how to use proxies, or doesn't bother, or maybe simply forgets. I'm betting that the psychopaths in question will sometimes slip up for one of those 3 reasons - after all, psychopaths aren't known for being terribly intelligent or having too much foresight or long-term thinking. Their absolute certainty in getting away with it and arrogance makes them not take all the precautions they otherwise would. That whole wishful thinking thing, you know..

Most of these pervs are professional porn makers/distributors, CV's are not the only fetish they film. ...and they don't slip up very often. The ONLY way I can see to curtail (it will never stop) crush is to make it cost more to distribute than it earns.

US officials like bribes too!

Very true... the ACLU is supporting Crush Vids as "Free Speech" and they have quite a few "Liberal" politicians behind them. Exact same arguments being used now as were invoked when the first anti child porn legislation was introduced.

I was thinking every country would use its own local law enforcement to do their own infiltration,

Ohhhh, you were counting on law enforcement actually doing something without massive public pressure?

 

[Seamus]

The videos mostly depict women -- with their faces unseen -- stomping helpless animals such as rabbits to death with spiked-heel shoes or with their bare feet. The videos apparently satisfy a sexual fetish for those who produce and watch them, said animal rights activists who supported the new bill.

The perversion and depravity involved in such a video is mind-boggling to anyone with an ounce of empathy for living creatures. It makes me sick to my stomach to know that there are people who produce and enjoy such cruelty. Positively sickening...to say the least.

I was unaware that this sort of thing was made as well. I'm speechless.

Who in the world could even think up such a thing!

Well I'm feeling like an idiot right about now... I should have posted this link months ago. I'm sorry ...sometimes it's hard to keep track of who's involved in what.

http://www.stopcrush.org/

Please don't feel like an idiot! As far as I can tell Guardian, you seem to be doing a great deal to right the wrongs you see in this world, and that's a real inspiration for me. I spend too much time "feeling bad" about awful things like this, but not really doing anything about it.

Thank you for the link. I couldn't find any information on that site about the actual legislation, so I looked it up. Here is a summary from www.govtrack.us:

7/21/2010--Passed House amended. Prevention of Interstate Commerce in Animal Crush Videos Act of 2010 - Amends the federal criminal code to revise provisions prohibiting knowingly creating, selling, or possessing a depiction of animal cruelty to prohibit knowingly and for the purpose of commercial advantage or private financial gain selling or distributing an animal crush video in interstate or foreign commerce. States that such prohibition does not prohibit the sale or distribution of any visual depiction of hunting, trapping, fishing, or customary and normal veterinary or agricultural husbandry practices. Defines "animal crush video" as any obscene photograph, motion-picture film, video recording, or electronic image that depicts actual conduct in which one or more living animals is intentionally crushed, burned, drowned, suffocated, or impaled in a manner that would violate a criminal prohibition on cruelty to animals in the federal or state jurisdiction in which the depiction is created, sold, distributed, or offered for sale or distribution. Provides for compliance of the budgetary effects of this Act with the Statutory Pay-As-You-Go Act of 2010.

As far as I can tell from the main page tracking this bill, it passed the house in June, recently passed the Senate, and has now come back to the house. Is this correct?

I am planning to call my one state Rep, and my two state Senators to voice my support for this bill. Does it make sense to call them right away, or closer to when the bill is going to come up for a vote again? Or should I call them now to encourage them to pass it quickly and then call again when its coming up for a vote? There is a post on stopcrush.org asking people to contact Congressman Bobby C. Scott. Who else can I call or write to?

Thanks for bringing this up, although I feel physically ill when I read the descriptions on the stopcrush.org website, I would rather know about it and try to do something to stop it than have something like this continue.

 

[realitybugll]

this reminds me... My 6 year old neighbor just brought home large sized hamster which he and his mom "adopted" from pet co. knowing the mom and the boy I automatically felt ill at ease when he showed it to me in the small glass cage. the was saying "look at my hamster" and he was grinning, and his mom was smiling in the background, and I had to fake a smile. I felt acute empathy/sadness and thought " I have to save it" but of course that is unrealistic and there are millions more suffering animals. I consciously dissociated, just let it be, and I was able to calm down. he named the hamster "squishy" I thought this was a funny name...well in light of this thread...not so funny now...

I'm giving it (he/she) two weeks to live. before it either dies or escapes. I may be wrong. I don't trust him around my bunnies.

the reason I bring this up is because while knowing these crush videos are horrible, I couldn't get a sadness / disgusted reaction out of myself. I realized a week ago was the last time i had a reaction over this topic. so it is possible for me. maybe I just can't picture it very well and would have to see it happening to get a reaction. I thought this was strange because everyone else seems to have some sort of emotional reaction to this. One time--reading a pig cruelty article, I think linked here somewhere--I consciously worked myself up to tears with a bit of effort and "thinking" just so I knew I could.

 

[Guardian]

Please don't feel like an idiot! As far as I can tell Guardian, you seem to be doing a great deal to right the wrongs you see in this world, and that's a real inspiration for me. I spend too much time "feeling bad" about awful things like this, but not really doing anything about it.

I think we all feel bad about horrible things like this hon...doing something, even little things like making phone calls, websites, etc. is the only thing that makes me feel better. It's very STS in a way..if I don't do something, I feel like crap on a cracker.

As far as I can tell from the main page tracking this bill, it passed the house in June, recently passed the Senate, and has now come back to the house. Is this correct?

Close..it's now passed both the House and the Senate (day before yesterday) so now it goes back into committee where selected members of both the House and the Senate will argue over who picked the best wording. It really doesn't matter whose version they pick at this point, either will do...they just have to run their yaps some more to look important, get a bit more press, etc.

I am planning to call my one state Rep, and my two state Senators to voice my support for this bill. Does it make sense to call them right away, or closer to when the bill is going to come up for a vote again? Or should I call them now to encourage them to pass it quickly and then call again when its coming up for a vote? There is a post on stopcrush.org asking people to contact Congressman Bobby C. Scott. Who else can I call or write to?

At this point it would be helpful for folks in the US to call their specific Representatives and Senators and ask them to push it through committee as fast as possible. The Senate bill passed wayyyyyy easier than anyone thought it would. It was starting to look like a few political pervs were going to bring up the "Free Speech" issue, right up until some stills from actual crush videos with "Senator (insert name here) says this as "Free Speech" So what's the message?" started circulating anonymously. Evidently they changed their minds, and the bill sailed through

Lots of animal rights activists thought this was a done deal 10 YEARS ago...then the thrice damned Supreme Court weighed in and we had to start all over. As you can see, neither version is "overly broad" ...both are in fact specific enough to make the average person want to hurl. This new law (either version) uses the same mechanisms as anti child porn laws, which have been upheld by the "High Court"

That's such a perfect name for them 'cause when you read some of their decisions, you know they had to be high on something.

 

[Guardian]

I'm giving it (he/she) two weeks to live. before it either dies or escapes. I may be wrong. I don't trust him around my bunnies.

the reason I bring this up is because while knowing these crush videos are horrible, I couldn't get a sadness / disgusted reaction out of myself. I realized a week ago was the last time i had a reaction over this topic. so it is possible for me. maybe I just can't picture it very well and would have to see it happening to get a reaction. I thought this was strange because everyone else seems to have some sort of emotional reaction to this. One time--reading a pig cruelty article, I think linked here somewhere--I consciously worked myself up to tears with a bit of effort and "thinking" just so I knew I could.

You have pet bunnies, but the thought of small animals being slowly crushed to death by whores in high heels doesn't bother you?

This seems to be one of those RARE occasions where I'm at a loss for words.

 

[Guardian]

Today the US, tomorrow the world ...beware the evil monkey in the closet!

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=478357&id=123901460968753

 

[Turgon]

:O That's friggin' messed up! Doing that to animals for fun!? I go out of my way to make sure I don't hit small animals and rabbits when driving, but if I saw one of those people I might accidentally step on the pedal.

the reason I bring this up is because while knowing these crush videos are horrible, I couldn't get a sadness / disgusted reaction out of myself. I realized a week ago was the last time i had a reaction over this topic. so it is possible for me. maybe I just can't picture it very well and would have to see it happening to get a reaction. I thought this was strange because everyone else seems to have some sort of emotional reaction to this. One time--reading a pig cruelty article, I think linked here somewhere--I consciously worked myself up to tears with a bit of effort and "thinking" just so I knew I could.

Sometimes you have to see it for yourself to really feel why there's anger to events like this. I knew a guy as a teen who would use sticks to beat dead animals for kicks. Do all sorts of things to them. I remember it clearly and an incredible urge to pick up a rock and hit him in the head with it. I didn't, obviously.

But if you ever watch the documentary Earthlings, they show clips of factory farm and circus workers beating animals unnecessarily. You'd be hard pressed not to at least once want to stick your hand through the screen and grab their necks. It really is evil because its done out of sick pleasure.

 

[Turgon]

On top of that, the guy that used to do that to the dead animals ended up being part of a gang of people that went to my school and beat another teen in the park to death. He ended up selling the rest of the gang up the river for immunity and testified against them so he could get off scott free. I saw media clips of him at the trial with a big smirk on his face knowing he wasn't going to prison.

He really is a psychopath.

 

[realitybugll]

You'd be hard pressed not to at least once want to stick your hand through the screen and grab their necks.

your right. that is probably true. I'm cringing. I'm thinking about poor cows being dragged by ropes which I saw in the news recently :( :( :(

I just feel very emotionally repressed. I cry over my own suffering sometimes not about others though. I want to really see this and just acknowledge it and cry for very long time.

 

[Gonzo]

Of course, one has to wonder about ulterior motives. Could the same law not be used against undercover videotaping of animal cruelty at slaughter facilities?

This could be a method of stopping the reporting of animal cruelty by animal rights groups and alternative media under the guise of protecting animals.

Until animals are considered under the law to be more than mere possessions, perpetrators in many countries would get a small fine and possibly a lifetime ban on owning animals. If the judge is really angry.

Now, if cruelty happens to livestock in a federally-registered facility like a slaughterhouse processing for export, then the fines could actually amount to tens and possibly hundreds of thousands of dollars, depending on the country. But not for pets and not for farm animals on private property...yet.

Incidentally, there's a huge market for animal/human (beastiality) porn as well, which I find equally disgusting and abusive.

Regarding comets, I was hoping to see what happens when more people awaken to the sick realities around them. Will we see some form of cleansing in the form of street justice instead?

Gonzo

 

[Turgon]

You'd be hard pressed not to at least once want to stick your hand through the screen and grab their necks.

your right. that is probably true. I'm cringing. I'm thinking about poor cows being dragged by ropes which I saw in the news recently :( :( :(

I just feel very emotionally repressed. I cry over my own suffering sometimes not about others though. I want to really see this and just acknowledge it and cry for very long time.

Here is the link to the thread on Earthlings if you are interested Earthlings

We've all been affected by the pathological society we're in which robs us of a connection to ourselves, which also means a connection and understanding of others. In time, with work on your part, meditating, reading, dieting, getting to know yourself more, the ability to express emotions will become more natural. Unless I'm misunderstanding you though, I don't think it's healthy to think about tortured animals specifically for the purpose of trying to get an emotional reaction out of yourself.

You may want some type of emotional release sooner rather than later, but don't force it out in contrived situations. It's a waste of your emotional and intellectual energy.

 

[Seamus]

Please don't feel like an idiot! As far as I can tell Guardian, you seem to be doing a great deal to right the wrongs you see in this world, and that's a real inspiration for me. I spend too much time "feeling bad" about awful things like this, but not really doing anything about it.

I think we all feel bad about horrible things like this hon...doing something, even little things like making phone calls, websites, etc. is the only thing that makes me feel better. It's very STS in a way..if I don't do something, I feel like crap on a cracker.

As far as I can tell from the main page tracking this bill, it passed the house in June, recently passed the Senate, and has now come back to the house. Is this correct?

Close..it's now passed both the House and the Senate (day before yesterday) so now it goes back into committee where selected members of both the House and the Senate will argue over who picked the best wording. It really doesn't matter whose version they pick at this point, either will do...they just have to run their yaps some more to look important, get a bit more press, etc.

I am planning to call my one state Rep, and my two state Senators to voice my support for this bill. Does it make sense to call them right away, or closer to when the bill is going to come up for a vote again? Or should I call them now to encourage them to pass it quickly and then call again when its coming up for a vote? There is a post on stopcrush.org asking people to contact Congressman Bobby C. Scott. Who else can I call or write to?

At this point it would be helpful for folks in the US to call their specific Representatives and Senators and ask them to push it through committee as fast as possible. The Senate bill passed wayyyyyy easier than anyone thought it would. It was starting to look like a few political pervs were going to bring up the "Free Speech" issue, right up until some stills from actual crush videos with "Senator (insert name here) says this as "Free Speech" So what's the message?" started circulating anonymously. Evidently they changed their minds, and the bill sailed through

Lots of animal rights activists thought this was a done deal 10 YEARS ago...then the thrice damned Supreme Court weighed in and we had to start all over. As you can see, neither version is "overly broad" ...both are in fact specific enough to make the average person want to hurl. This new law (either version) uses the same mechanisms as anti child porn laws, which have been upheld by the "High Court"

That's such a perfect name for them 'cause when you read some of their decisions, you know they had to be high on something.

Hi Guardian, thanks for your response. I will call my Rep and Senators first thing next week.

 

[Guardian]

Of course, one has to wonder about ulterior motives. Could the same law not be used against undercover videotaping of animal cruelty at slaughter facilities?

No

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=h111-5566

‘(1) IN GENERAL- This section shall not apply with regard to any visual depiction of--

‘(A) customary and normal veterinary or agricultural husbandry practices;

‘(B) the slaughter of animals for food; or

‘(C) hunting, trapping, or fishing.

‘(2) GOOD-FAITH DISTRIBUTION- This section shall not apply to the good-faith distribution of an animal crush video to--

‘(A) a law enforcement agency; or

‘(B) a third party for the sole purpose of analysis to determine if referral to a law enforcement agency is appropriate.


Edited to add: some form of "and/or the cleaning and dressing out of a kill" will be added to section (C) next week

 

[Guardian]

Incidentally, there's a huge market for animal/human (beastiality) porn as well, which I find equally disgusting and abusive.

Fortunately Zoophilia porn is still considered "sexually obscene" in the United States, and as such is illegal to possess and sell. Of course it's still available, but pervs get busted for it quite often.

Since there is no direct sexual act in crush, the same laws could not be applied

The point is, law enforcement and animal rights activists have a tool to use against zoophiles ...at least until the Supreme Court sticks their nose in on behalf of the psychopaths.

 

[Guardian]

Hi Guardian, thanks for your response. I will call my Rep and Senators first thing next week.

THANKS!!! Due to the "Free Speech" issue, the majority of the support for this legislation has been Republican....Burr being the biggest sleazeball in the bucket. Every time I shake his hand, I have to resist the urge to chew mine off at the wrist ...but they're what we had. It was a bunch of horrified senior citizens who turned this one around!