Not having any general interests in exterior life

[Psalehesost]

I've realized recently that I don't have any general interests within ordinary life - there were specific, very specialized interests (obsessions, in truth), the things worked on for a hobby - and the general areas these fell into were confused for wider interests - mainly when it came to software development.

In truth, there is no area of the kind of things people do for a living that I'm interested in in general. None at all - there hasn't been, or if there ever were potential for such, that died back in 2005, back before finding this place, as a very deep and lasting disillusionment set in. The only thing there was afterward, was lies and identification - the false within "patching up" by clinging to its obsessions and developing them further.

The only wider, general interest that remains is comparatively new - Learning (with a big L) the lessons of this 'school' of life in this world (though in practice considerable and often as-yet insurmountable emotional resistance often enters) - struggling with myself to really Learn - and all manner of things that can be studied and genuinely learned relating to what is done here; the interests and subjects, these being of actual importance, of this community/project.

In respect of learning life lessons there is much to be done - I'm a relatively socially unskilled and inexperienced twenty-something who, and the sooner the better, will have to finally sort out the common issue of getting a job. So what now? A seemingly practical option would be to choose and "fake" an interest in some area and then work within it - anything I'd be relatively competent at would do, I'd guess, because in itself it'd be equally empty whatever it would be. The practical issue would be that I share the trait, mentioned by Gurdjieff, of a "sick man no. 2" of mainly knowing what I "do not like" rather than what I "do like" - so massive inner confrontation will necessarily enter into doing so whatever the particular choice, as it will very strongly not be liked - the practical issue is then simply whether there is sufficient strength to struggle with an issue of that size, which would remain to be seen.

Alternatively, perhaps I'm really "here" in this life after all to do something in particular in the world - if so, have not the foggiest idea, given not having any general interests whatsoever. (ones connected to the esoteric hardly count. and otherwise expecting to work for a living with something connected to or of interest in this network is hardly realistic - sure, there are E-E teachers, but they are more or less willing to and competent in dealing with people as their work, which is not the case for me)

It'd be good to figure out whether or not having an actual exterior-life 'mission' in life is the case, because the presence of such a possibility would be a large hindrance in terms of inner struggle as it relates to the "pick something and pretend to be interested" option.

 

[luke wilson]

Hi Psalehesost,

As a fellow 20 something looking for a job and meaning in exterior life, I can fully understand where you are coming from - quarter life crisis is in full swing, stuck in the gap between a child and an adult. Actually reading through the forum it appears this is somewhat familiar problem for those in our age group, I think HowToBe has started acouple of threads about this. I recently discovered this website in my meandering across the internet looking for meaning and if anything, atleast it kind of shows you that, you aren't alone and I find it kind of funny and humorous.

My personal thoughts are that exterior life does matter, after all that is how you express yourself, that is how you interact with the world out there, by the decisions and choices you make. I think a good place to start is to figure out what interests you. How do you spend your days? What do you do? What kind of stuff do you read or watch? what about the world out there captivates your mind, arouses interest? Then you can try and connect that with something out there that will give you an opportunity to potentially make a living along the same routes... I think it is atleast useful if you start engaging yourself in this way, at the very least you're bound to learn something new about yourself.

Just some thoughts I wanted to share, as someone in a similar situation, I look forward to reading what the matured folks have to say.

 

[Crystla24]

I don't know that I could really give much advice because I seem to struggle with the excact issues. I read through one of your other threads and there was a lot in common between you and I, from my perception. It started happening when I was still a teenager and had gone "beyond depressed". Like life finally did me in. To where, ultimately, I quit hurting and feeling sorry for myself, but I really could not feel any happiness or interests. For a long time I just considered myself a Nihilist- Wikipedia definition- a person who believes human existence has no objective meaning, purpose, or intrinsic value. I had pulled out of this at one point in time, but I find myself falling back to it from time to time.
When I was in high school and had been this way for quite some time, there was this school counselor, who notices that something was not quite right with me. She kept on wanting me to go to her office and talk with her sometime. After I ignored her invitation like 10 times (she was pretty annoying), she finally pulled me out of class one day where I could not really object in front of the class. She did this one a week and would pry into my past. For awhile I think I had her almost traumatized, but I would not show any emotion, because I had quit caring. Well one day she did it...she finally made me break down and start bawling my eyes out. I was so mad! I thought I had done a good job of not letting things get to me and it always pissed me off showing my weakness. After words, I felt alot better. In fact, at this same point in time I had started excercing and had ended up losing 45lbs. and I felt the happiest I had ever been. Her breaking me down started it initially. She told me that when one represses everything negative to the point where the negativity is nulled, the opposite happens and it also represses the ablity to feel happy and positive. Those weren't the excact words, but gets the point. Anyway, when I had started exercising, I ended up getting all of those feel good endorphins that you get from it and my life was very positive for quite a while.
I ended getting pregnant twice and gaining my weight back, and repressing stuff all over again and have for along time felt this way again. I no if I just get out and start jogging and stuff maybe I can pull back out of it, but it is hard to get the motivation when you don't care! :) My lifelessness gets so bad that even my voice turns completely monotone and people around me don't even care what I have to say. I also have lost interests in music that I have like, I have not had any cable or satellite TV in 6 years and I really don't care to get it. Really, I have the obsession of "what is this life about?". But also have no goals to the future. To find excitement I just try to keep a spontanious mindset of "go with the flow" and "whatever happens, happens". I am finding that I am getting quite a bit of joy of just wanting to be completely spontanious and ultimately free. When one has life goals, how do they know their life will take them to meet their ends, or will it just be another broken hope. Why not quit all the "wishful thinking" and just have fun in seeing where life takes you next. If it is not taking you anywhere, maybe a new environment could help.
Then again, I have been in a sort wishfully thinking all of this. I had a post in the swamp. I'm thinking/planning of just making an escape of some sort lol. Just to refresh my stale life and try to make new Choices with new Knowledge and quit as the C's said "wallowing in it". I hope any of this might help Psaleohost, if not, maybe you could have some reciprocate advice for me on the same topic ;) Good luck, I know this phase of maybe my and your life really sucks and hopefully something that can be broken free from.

 

[Al Today]

Studying and learning are important. Also important is application of said leaning. My thoughts for one is we are here to experience life. No matter what comes. To Live, Observe, make Choices, Experience, and Learn from the applied experiences. Both pain and joy are part of this duality.
Get outside. Do. Grow. Experience. We are not to be "monks". osit

I think roller coasters are fun too.
:) :) :)

By the way, I have a few late 20 something kids, and the economy does suck. IMO, The world does seem to be sliding down that slippery slope of disaster. This just ain't the same same frellin' BBM I grew up on. I feel for your age group!
And many of us are a few paychecks from being homeless.

Thought about deleting this, but what the heck, this may be of value.

 

[mcb]

In truth, there is no area of the kind of things people do for a living that I'm interested in in general. None at all - there hasn't been, or if there ever were potential for such, that died back in 2005, back before finding this place, as a very deep and lasting disillusionment set in. The only thing there was afterward, was lies and identification - the false within "patching up" by clinging to its obsessions and developing them further.

I am on a schedule so I will be brief. You might want to pay special attention to that "deep and lasting disillusionment." It could well work in your favor, and I don't know but once you SEE on an even larger scale, you may not feel that way any longer. In the mean time, unfailing perseverance can be helpful. It can help find a job, too.

 

[Al Today]

And BTW, Doing something fearful IS hard to overcome. This I have experienced. Start with planning, and baby steps if you must. Work yourself in confidence. With practice and experience, "it" will become easier and fear will fall to the wayside. This I also have experienced.

 

[RyanX]

It'd be good to figure out whether or not having an actual exterior-life 'mission' in life is the case, because the presence of such a possibility would be a large hindrance in terms of inner struggle as it relates to the "pick something and pretend to be interested" option.

Well, there are jobs/careers people take because they want to work up the ladder or hierarchy and then there are jobs people take because they may not be interested in a lot of work-related responsibilities and would rather have greater freedom to pursue their own interests. Financially, it can be a trade-off, but if you're content living a modest lifestyle and would rather have a greater range of freedom on the job, it might be worthwhile looking into a job that offers more of a range of freedoms. As far as "pretending to be interested" in a job, I don't know many co-workers that don't do this, aside from those who are pathologically driven in some way. :D

I remember up until I was 20, the only jobs I ever had were those that had very little freedom on the job. I worked at a greenhouse, a grocery store, a factor and then delivered pizzas for a year. I was constantly on the go and the culture at these places was such that if you were there, you had to work, there was no freedom to do anything else. Then I discovered the world of tech jobs when I got to college. I noticed that the work wasn't constant, that the other support techs would take time to eat, read, listen to music, etc. in between the times when they were helping people. Some times were extremely slow and so one get through most of a book just on a single shift. After seeing this kind of job, I realized that this was the sort of job that I wanted, it didn't matter what I was actually doing (within reason, of course), as long as I had the time and freedom to pursue my own interests.

I'm not sure if this helps you or not, but had I known that these jobs were out there, I probably would have worked harder to get into one from the beginning instead of wasting so much time doing jobs that required my full attention for the entire time at work. That might be something to consider in your job search. It's obviously something that is not discussed among employers, head-hunters, etc., but it can make a big difference in the life of an individual when working a job.

 

[Mrs. Peel]

As far as "pretending to be interested" in a job, I don't know many co-workers that don't do this, aside from those who are pathologically driven in some way. :D

Amen to that!! I still don't know what I want to be when I grow up. Seriously, I don't know a lot of people who really, really wanted to be what they are (career-wise). Most sort of fell into it, and adapted along the way. Being somewhat like yourself in nothing really interested me, I fell into administrative work, as it was one of the few career options for a woman back then if one didn't have a college degree and one was forced to bring home a paycheck to make ends meet. I've invested so much time here that I seem to be in it for the long haul now, but at least I can sneak a peak at the Forum here when the boss isn't looking.

The only wider, general interest that remains is comparatively new - Learning (with a big L) the lessons of this 'school' of life in this world (though in practice considerable and often as-yet insurmountable emotional resistance often enters) - struggling with myself to really Learn - and all manner of things that can be studied and genuinely learned relating to what is done here; the interests and subjects, these being of actual importance, of this community/project.

Seems to me like you've found a good "interest" there. Whatever you decide to "do" in life, there is the schoolyard for Learning. Why not devote yourself to doing that? Worrying about one's "mission" really doesn't accomplish anything. Providing you are open to the Universe, all that will sort itself out eventually. :)

 

[Palinurus]

there are jobs people take because they may not be interested in a lot of work-related responsibilities and would rather have greater freedom to pursue their own interests. Financially, it can be a trade-off, but if you're content living a modest lifestyle and would rather have a greater range of freedom on the job, it might be worthwhile looking into a job that offers more of a range of freedoms.

Hi Psalehesost,

I'm one of "...the matured folks..." as luke wilson put it and the above quote of RyanX sums up my life almost to a T. When I ended my university studies successfully I found out pretty quickly that there would be no way I ever was to be employed in my field of expertise - mainly due to my supposed extremely radical political views and my very limited interests outside my most wanted profession (university teaching and researching). After numerous failures applying for jobs whilst ever widening the range of possible employments I finally decided to cut my losses and change my perspective completely with the above cited outcome as the final result. I never looked back in anger or regretted my forced (it has to be said) decision.

Nevertheless, rather soon I found out how much ones social standing and societal involvement in general is inextricably linked to the job you cater for and the payment you receive for it. So the inevitable outcome was a gradually downgrading in status and a growing isolation socially just because I willy-nilly was blatantly different from my initial peergroup. I also found out pretty soon that one is discriminated against when you try to get another job coming from a lower ranked position or from a longer time jobless situation, just because there are insufficient references in your resume. It's almost as if you had been 'doing time' (in the slammer) if you know what I mean. So ultimately this strategy works against you socially in the long run, I've found. There is no turning back. You have to realise this up front. It also may hamper you considerably would you intend to get married.

The other side of the coin is the freedom you can enjoy.

In my case, for years I tried to write an elaborated thesis in order to improve on my possibilities ever getting a job in academia. Every now and then I'm still trying to complete it. I've learned a lot during the process, not least about myself and my core character. I'm a very disciplined person, so it's not for the lack of trying or keeping at it, that I didn't accomplish anything worthwile showing to others (i.e. publishing). I'm quite happy to occasionally be able to show bits and pieces of it here and there on the forum, when applicable. I just underestimated the complexities of what I was trying to achieve and my subjects and topics kept branching out into the extreme. That's all fine and dandy educationally speaking, but hardly practical in all other respects - but that's what happened. I wish I would have had the down to earth instincts that Laura has, but I'm too much of an impractical dreamer I suppose, to realise in time I wasn't getting anywhere with this endeavor of mine. And evidently in my situation there were no outside sources who could have timely intervened to correct all of this, as I was out on my own completely - apart from whether I would have accepted any intervention to begin with...

So, to conclude I would say you have to have a very strong character to 'go it alone' and accomplish anything worthwhile for others from a position on the fringe. At least, I couldn't pull it off - which doesn't have to signify anything about your predicament I wouldn't think.

Hope this helps a bit in finding a solution.

 

[Omega]

From what I understand though, its not the job finding part that seems to be the genuine problem, its more your lack of appetite for various day-to-day matter. Having gone through a lot of the work and learning in the past years, I think you are now seeing the outside world (meaning outside of your house) as futile.

However, the experiences are out there and people to network with also. Like Ryan said, you could find a job that would allow you to pursue your learning while filling the necessity to bring some money home.

 

[Mark7]

Here is an interesting section of an essay that speaks to some of the points in this post about school and work:

It's from: _http://www.wisdompage.com/SchumacherEssay.pdf

It is about the work of E. F. Schumacher, author of "Small is Beautiful" among other writings:

Excerpt:

For education to help us develop the greatest wisdom, Schumacher thought it had
to assist us in developing our values. “Education cannot help us as long as it accords no
place to metaphysics. Whether the subjects taught are subjects of science or of the
humanities, if the teaching does not lead to a clarification of metaphysics, that is to say,
of our fundamental convictions, it cannot educate a man and, consequently, cannot be of
real value to society.”

He continually emphasized the traditional values taught by the great world
religions, but also emphasized that these “values do not help us to pick our way through
life unless they have become our own, a part, so to say, of our mental make-up.” He
added that individuals had to interiorize what they were taught, they had to “sift it, sort it
out, keep the good and jettison the bad” in order to become inner directed. Education for
wisdom, however, still had to help an individual accomplish one more task—“dying to
oneself . . . to all one's egocentric preoccupations.” He went on to say that to be happy
and wise there were three things that people “most need to do and education ought to
prepare them for these things: To act as spiritual beings, that is to say, to act in
accordance with their moral impulses. . . . To act as neighbors, to render service . . . .
[and] to act as persons, as autonomous centers of power and responsibility, that is, to be
creatively engaged, using and developing the gifts that we have been blessed with.”

To Schumacher our values lie at the core of our being, affecting how we approach
all subjects. As he writes,

All subjects, no matter how specialised, are connected with a centre; they are like rays emanating
from a sun. The centre is constituted by our most basic convictions, by those ideas which really
have the power to move us. In other words, the centre consists of metaphysics and ethics, of ideas
that—whether we like it or not—transcend the world of facts. Because they transcend the world of
facts, they cannot be proved or disproved by ordinary scientific method. But that does not mean
that they are purely “subjective” or “relative” or mere arbitrary conventions. They must be true to
reality, although they transcend the world of facts. . . .
Education can help us only if it produces “whole men.” The truly educated man is not a
man who knows a bit of everything . . . but he will be truly in touch with the centre. He will not be
in doubt about his basic convictions, about his view on the meaning and purpose of his life. He may
not be able to explain these matters in words, but the conduct of his life will show a certain
sureness of touch which stems from his inner clarity.

and on work:

In his chapter on “Buddhist Economics” in Small Is Beautiful, he indicated that in
modern industrial societies employers attempted to reduce employment by labor-saving
devices, and workers at their unsatisfying jobs were happy to work less if it did not
reduce their income. But a Buddhist approach to work would be different. It would have
at least three aims:

To give a man a chance to utilise and develop his faculties; to enable him to overcome his
egocentredness by joining with other people in a common task; and to bring forth the goods and
services needed for a becoming existence. Again, the consequences that flow from this view are
endless. To organise work in such a manner that it becomes meaningless, boring, stultifying, or
nerve-racking for the worker would be little short of criminal; it would indicate a greater concern
with goods than with people, an evil lack of compassion and a soul-destroying degree of
attachment to the most primitive side of this worldly existence. . . .
. . . Buddhist economics must be very different from the economics of modem
materialism, since the Buddhist sees the essence of civilisation not in a multiplication of wants but
in the purification of human character. Character, at the same time, is formed primarily by a man's
work.

 

[Mark7]

further:

To Schumacher, as with the Buddhist perspective, work
should focus primarily on furthering one’s development and creativity and not on producing
a maximum number of consumer goods.
“While the materialist is mainly interested in goods, the Buddhist is
mainly interested in liberation. But Buddhism is 'The Middle Way' and therefore in no
way antagonistic to physical well-being. It is not wealth that stands in the way of
liberation but the attachment to wealth; not the enjoyment of pleasurable things but the
craving for them.” If humans desired less, they could work less, and “the less toil there is,
the more time and strength is left for artistic creativity.” The “toil” Schumacher wrote of ,
however, was not to be identified with “work” as it should be, because work ideally
should be more like that of a craftsman than that of an assembly-line worker. He
believed that “work and leisure are complementary parts of the same living process and
cannot be separated without destroying the joy of work and the bliss of leisure.”
143
In the modern technologically-driven world, however, Schumacher thought that
society made “immense claims on man's time and attention” and that this “must be
accounted its greatest evil.”

There is little craftsmanship in the world today it seems.

 

[paralleloscope]

From what I understand though, its not the job finding part that seems to be the genuine problem, its more your lack of appetite for various day-to-day matter. Having gone through a lot of the work and learning in the past years, I think you are now seeing the outside world (meaning outside of your house) as futile.

This is how I understood it also. Perhaps you could expand on the few bits that you know you do like, like a study of interest which could be translated with some correction to an everyday profession. So that your knowledge, continued search and wish to be expansive (if that is so) could be tuned into mundane life. I'll bet the mundane still hides rich gems for you if travelled with an interest of yours and you allow your eyes and ears to see and hear in that direction, which would probably mean to lay some prejudices to rest.

I share your phase of disillusionment and also secluded myself with disinterest in normal stuff and back in march I had no clue how to land a job as I could not get my ire up as it had to have some interest involved besides money. I was reading about the electric universe and was fascinated but didn't really understand electricity. Soon afterwards I found a school for electricians as a plan for a job and to get me out of hiding and up to speed with the basic physics I've been neglecting. Even though the practical stuff still does not interest me very much, the theory and feedback (as in 'your life is a reflection of you') and new social arena is very educational. Now, where the short schooling is almost finishing and we are to find the paid trainee positions, mundane reality is knocking and I have been depressed that now it is time to go install boring everyday stuff, but then I found a direction to go within this profession which involves working while learning electronics and programming which turned the heat back on; Yes! there is still much to learn about Energy and it's ways on BBM while I (eventually) get paid and I can pay back.

 

[Oxajil]

Hi Psalehesost,

I'd like to share some thoughts here based on my own experience in looking for a job.

The only wider, general interest that remains is comparatively new - Learning (with a big L) the lessons of this 'school' of life in this world (though in practice considerable and often as-yet insurmountable emotional resistance often enters) - struggling with myself to really Learn - and all manner of things that can be studied and genuinely learned relating to what is done here; the interests and subjects, these being of actual importance, of this community/project.

In respect of learning life lessons there is much to be done - I'm a relatively socially unskilled and inexperienced twenty-something who, and the sooner the better, will have to finally sort out the common issue of getting a job. So what now? A seemingly practical option would be to choose and "fake" an interest in some area and then work within it - anything I'd be relatively competent at would do, I'd guess, because in itself it'd be equally empty whatever it would be.

I think that this latter could be a form of anticipation? When you already anticipate in how it's going to be, then perhaps you're blocking yourself of opportunities in work environments to be beneficial to you. All of your likes/dislikes don't necessarily have to be Yours, perhaps they're (dis)likes based on programs, that of fear of interacting with others or something like that.

Perhaps the key is not to 'like' a job per se, not many people like their jobs, perhaps it's more about the things you can learn in your work environment and what you can learn from the interaction with different kinds of people. Learning how to listen, how to talk, how to act in certain situations. Observing yourself while doing your job etc.

Right now your basing your decisions on your likes and dislikes, which is okay, but if you would base them on your desire to learn too, then it won't be that hard anymore to find a job like-able. The school is out there, too, in the real world.

I, for example, wanted to work in a theatre or a museum, but it was really hard for me to get a job there. I tried many times and failed. In the end I found a job in the supermarket. Not what I had expected, but I learned to enjoy my job, because of the interactions I have with different people (which helped me with learning to interact with them) and the possibility that is there for me to observe myself in different situations. I think the Universe will help with showing you opportunities for getting a job if you show the effort of wanting to learn and of course the effort in looking for opportunities, and maybe you will find one that you will enjoy too. And who knows, perhaps the skills that you might develop in a job you don't really like, will help you in the future when you have found a job that you do like on all levels. There are so many possibilities.
But I think that non-anticipation in this is important.

Here's a quote from Don Juan that helped me:

For the average man, the world is weird because if he's not
bored with it, he's at odds with it. For a warrior, the world is
weird because it is stupendous, awesome, mysterious, unfathomable.

I could be wrong in this, so just fwiw.

 

[anart]

You know, I've worked since I was 14 (lied about my age) and I've never actually been 'interested' in my work - ever. I worked because I had to support myself, because it's what is necessary to live in this world and put a roof over my head (later, not at 14, things weren't that bad ;) ). I think it's fantastic when people work in areas that fulfill them in some way and I know that it's possible, it just hasn't been the case for me in this lifetime. I've worked so that I am able to have time and money to do what actually does interest me. Work is a means to an end - that's it - my Real life occurs in the time I have for myself, but even that would not be possible if I didn't work for it.

So, perhaps it's time to realize that work is usually a means to an end - it's not the goal and if you go through life expecting to be fulfilled by (or even interested in) every aspect of it, then you're not really giving yourself many opportunities to consciously suffer. Sometimes you just have to push yourself to do something in order to realize what action is and appreciate time at all. fwiw.