Personal environments; stuff, clutter, negative energies and Feng Shui

[A Jay]

I agree with that things with emotional value are good to keep,

I would agree, but it depends on the emotional response or state that a particular item can bring up. As Alada wrote:

So if there’s a choice a to whether to keep or give away a certain album, it’s maybe a good idea to reflect on why we’re keeping it, is it for the music or for the time or state it represents.

If I think back, many albums represent a state or emotional world that I no longer wish to inhabit, times of self-pity and to be honest an unhealthy 'enjoyment' of negative emotions. Though you don’t see it that way at the time. Usually it’s the lyrical content and it’s meaning, or what you ascribe to it that pulls you in and will prolong and keep you stuck in that state, rather than there being a pure musical enjoyment to it.

So with some things, even though they may mean a lot, and represent important moments, letting them go is symbolic of the wish to move on at a deeper level. Having said that, there is still this to consider from earlier in the thread:

A: We have more in mind. Take care with interacting with negative energies.

Q: (L) Well that’s kinda like creating your own reality, isn’t it?

A: Not what we mean… Keep your guard up and do not allow negative energies to slip by… such as believing lies… listening to negative music while thinking it is positive…watching negative movies and thinking it is negligible. It is extremely important to not lie to the self. One can listen or watch many things as long as the truth of the orientation is known, acknowledged, and understood. Clear?

Q: (L) So, in other words: awareness. Calling a spade a spade and not allowing something negative to enter you and believing it is positive. You can see it, perceive it and acknowledge it but not allow it to influence you. Because obviously, you cannot shut off your perceptions of the world, but you can control how it affects you. So, don’t let it inside, thinking it’s something that it’s not.

(Belibaste) So, see it as it is. If it is negative, see it as negative.

(L) Yeah, and they’re saying to focus on truth in order for changes to manifest in you that are positive. That is, “positive” can mean acknowledging that something is negative because it is truth.

Q: (Galatea) Choose the seeds you wish to water.

(L) Is that basically what we’re talking about here?

A: Yes

If were keeping music without having considered the back story of why we have it and what we used it for, then it’s easy for that to still be in the "negative music" category. Negative because it can pull us into a state while our awareness is absent. If In Search of the Miraculous had been written in recent times, maybe we might have read something like this:

In the West where people listen to Radiohead, it often happens that a man becomes so identified with their music that he begins to consider he is Thom Yorke himself. This is not a joke but a fact. He actually becomes Thom Yorke. This is identifying. [...] Identifying is the chief obstacle to self-remembering.

I used to listen to the Pyramid Song for example because I told myself that liked the piano chords and rhythm of it. But play it now and you can feel it draw you towards a certain state, and not a healthy one at that. I think that’s what the Cs were referring to above, so as well as the identification aspect in terms of loosing awareness, there’s also the energy drain implication to consider.

Choose the seeds you wish to water.

So when going through our homes, keeping a good orderliness, and clearing out the clutter we can pay attention to our emotional responses to different things. When we come across an item that we are particularly 'attached' to we can to pay attention to what the nature of that attachment is and then decide if that is something we wish to nurture or prune away.

I've kept many items from my childhood, and some of these items I have a very strong emotional connection to. For instance, a stuffed animal that I've had since before I can remember anything and some of my earliest memories include this animal. It was my security blanket, and I took it with me everywhere. But as I look at it and hold it now I feel like I'm that same scared child using this inanimate object to feel the security and love that was lacking in my relationship with my parents. My father in particular. But as I was journaling about these feelings I realized that I don't have to hang on to it anymore because I have real security and love in my relationships with my friends and fellow forum members. The same goes for many other 'sentimental' tokens from my past, and first thing in the morning they're going out the door never to return because I'm ready to move on to bigger and better things and holding on to all that emotional baggage has just been slowing me down.

After this the next step for me will be to find some ways help nurture a more positive and creative energy within my home (such as nice poster art or other positive symbols).

{An aside that is tangentially connected, last night I dreamed that I was in a house that was supposed to be my home, which was in a rather poor state, and came across an intruder that somehow found his way in. He was a very creepy and deformed child that I had to carry out of the house, and holding him was very unpleasant and what made it worse was that he laughed at me for carrying him out. After removing him from the premises I went into a closet and put things in the drawers of a dresser, and after the last drawer was shut suddenly a whole new room was opened up to me like a secret compartment switch has been activated. I'd gained access to a whole new room/part of the house that I'd never seen before. It was incredibly beautiful, and I felt a sense of awe and wonder at this room that I'd been given access to.}

 

[zak]

To be able to clean up your home, we must understand that we must first clean up your own mind.

It's a nice theory, and it could be argued for, but I don't know that there's any evidence that this idea is a good starting place. I think if we decided that we needed to sort out our inner world before we could sort out our outer world, we'd be buried under piles of junk in filthy homes.

If you do not have a clear mind, we can not even see the problem with collecting things, or cleanliness of your living space, the other people we have to point out.
Practice and repetition of an action, we can make changes in your life, I mean the cleaning. Everyone needs a quiet time for contemplation and reflection or other positive practices such as prayer, meditation, yoga or reading a positive and inspiring reading. This will help you clear your mind and open your subconscious mind positive possibilities. I think that all this can not be done if you are surrounded by clutter.

Paraphrasing Gurdjieff:

IN RIGHT KNOWLEDGE the cleaning of "our own mind" must proceed on parallel lines with the cleaning of the house, and the cleaning of the house must run parallel with the cleaning of our mind. Laws are everywhere the same, in the house as well as in our mind. Having mastered the principles of any one law we must look for its manifestation in the house and in our mind simultaneously.… This parallel study of the house and of our mind shows the student the fundamental unity of everything and helps him to find analogies in phenomena of different orders.

I don't know if it's such a good analogy, maybe something to keep in memory doing "the housework"! :)

A Jay, your dream remind me this quote of G:

Certain teachings compare man to a house of four rooms.
Man lives in one room, the smallest and poorest of all, and until he is told of it, he does not suspect the existence of the other rooms which are full of treasures.
When he does learn of this he begins to seek the keys to these rooms and especially the fourth, the most important, room.
And when a man has found his way into this room he really becomes the master of his house, for only then does the house belong to him wholly and forever.

 

[Phill4]

IN RIGHT KNOWLEDGE the cleaning of "our own mind" must proceed on parallel lines with the cleaning of the house, and the cleaning of the house must run parallel with the cleaning of our mind. Laws are everywhere the same, in the house as well as in our mind. Having mastered the principles of any one law we must look for its manifestation in the house and in our mind simultaneously.… This parallel study of the house and of our mind shows the student the fundamental unity of everything and helps him to find analogies in phenomena of different orders.

Thanks for this quote zak, it expreses the principle of inner/outter balance in this regard. It is a refreshing quote.

To add, you have the person who is spottless but his family life is a mess or his/her inner life is stressfull and hard to manage. And the person who is contemplation the universe while everything falls appart arround him/her. Actively looking to realize this law in practice is a good method of work..



A jay,it is very well elaborated thanks, and it is insightful what you mentioned about the stuffed animal.
When i went back to my home country after 8 years, i noticed several objects that served as helpers to aid my memory. It was a very inportant recapitulative monent for me, that conbined with the places i used to often.

When i was little like 5-6 i found a black rock, i brought it home from school as a tool to cut "panela", panela is a hard block byproduct of brown sugar to make hot berverages and kids eat as candy and to cut it you need a hard object, i never thought this rock would suvive, but i remember i felt accomplished for bringing the rock home to cut such sweet treat and everyone accepted the rock as "member of the family" no one threw it out, i remember the corner in which it was sitting,
I think you are right, i felt very accomplished at the time and seeing the rock still there actually was a good moment that conected me to the past.
The rock is still around..



Thinking about it further... the rock represented a sense of self-identity, i am the youngest of my mom's sons, and having a place in her mind as a kid was important , through the rock that 'I' brought home made everyone remember the person who brought the rock home to cut the sweet treat. It gave weight to my existence or sense of I.

I guess people need to have objects around that makes us feel a certain way to sustain deeper enotional pillars of the personality and memory.

 

[dantem]

Just recollected from the past my repulsion for the 'perfect' house super-clean and with shiny surfaces... they meant NO FUN at all when I was a baby! Moreover, that House in particular, in this case the house of my Mom's parents, where my grandpa lived with his second wife that looked so cold to me, was a little 50's sub-urban apartment, and so it was a double-no-fun-at-all.

Then, more stories and more 'shiny houses' plus cold hosts encounters while growing up, increased my hostility vs. this kind of synthetic order not matched with politeness and warm places, warm behavior of their hosts.

My hoarder case is limited to a small drawer filled up with things from the past mixed with a bunch of papers, payments, expired cards; then my PC desk is quite messy comparing it to politely clean standards.
Bit by bit, day by day, thinking about where to move this or that thing and free some space up, for the first time maybe I found that liberating and something that gives a sense of order also internally. And now every time I look around the impression is that there's still so much work to do! Never really felt it before.

 

[Voyageur]

Just recollected from the past my repulsion for the 'perfect' house super-clean and with shiny surfaces... they meant NO FUN at all when I was a baby! Moreover, that House in particular, in this case the house of my Mom's parents, where my grandpa lived with his second wife that looked so cold to me, was a little 50's sub-urban apartment, and so it was a double-no-fun-at-all.

Then, more stories and more 'shiny houses' plus cold hosts encounters while growing up, increased my hostility vs. this kind of synthetic order not matched with politeness and warm places, warm behavior of their hosts.

My hoarder case is limited to a small drawer filled up with things from the past mixed with a bunch of papers, payments, expired cards; then my PC desk is quite messy comparing it to politely clean standards.
Bit by bit, day by day, thinking about where to move this or that thing and free some space up, for the first time maybe I found that liberating and something that gives a sense of order also internally. And now every time I look around the impression is that there's still so much work to do! Never really felt it before.

Ditto the bolded.

What you describe of the "perfect house" was something juxtaposed in youth from family to family, from relative to relative, and like you said, some were no fun - cold. If memory serves, there were even people who were so obsessive that their couch was covered in those form-fitted plastic coverings that spoke of 'don't sit here' or, for adults only, kids should only be seen and not heard.

I'm still taking stock between taking things from their place to fix and repair, and putting them away. Like you describe, every time and almost everywhere I look, there is work to be done. What is amazing is noticing what sits in some place that really should not be there; store it or get rid of it, is a decision still to be made.

There are those practical matters that can sit for months with nothing done, like the old diesel tractor that stopped working in May. I did not need it, or just shoveled by hand and wheelbarrow instead, yet I knew it had to be attended to, as well as the area that it sat upon. Finally ordered a few parts, did some diagnostics, took apart the fuel pump, replaced it and some other components and now it is working and moved. Fixed up the area of ground underneath and seeded it. There is a wood pile that awaits, a roof that needs some tending and on it goes. These are immediate things that come to my attention and then there are the nooks and crannies that I can't not now notice, so step by step...

 

[3DStudent]

I have been cleaning and purging some things, but it kind of fell by the wayside. I have two medium sized boxes I plan to take to a thrift store. I think I could fill an equal amount or more, including unwanted books.

A bit of my hoarding comes from OCD, fear of losing things or needing them in the future. I also developed a strong sense of attachment to items from some animated movie as a kid. Basically some personified animal cartoon characters were stripped of their clothing and it was like they had lost their (personified) humanness. So I've had instances in the past where I felt that disrespecting the item of someone was like harming the person their self. But this has waned to near non-existence, though the hoarding remains.

I don't like to throw away things either. It seems wasteful. But I suppose in a few billion years the sun will explode and burn up and recycle all of the matter on the planet? So I'd rather give away things. I have a hard time thinking things will be useful in a SHTF scenario. I was collecting pill and supplement bottles, but recycled them recently. It's hard to determine what is really useful and what is just obsessive for me.

I do not like "crowded" in my apartment, so I do not mind to give up items that pack the my living space, I feel in such a place as to not breathe, feel the dust.

Maybe I have the reverse problem, time will tell.

If you can breathe in your space and don't feel lacking things, I'd say it's not a problem, but a blessing!

Basically, if we want to change, our environment needs to change as well. Most of these excuses just make us cling to parts of our false self that we identify with and should get rid off. I think a good rule of thumb would be 'when in doubt, get rid of it'. It's also important to start small if we can't muster the strength to do a thorough clean-up - whenever we feel a little energy, we should use it to clean up/de-clutter

Good points. "As within, so without." When I'm in doubt and don't have much willpower, the anxiety of possibly needing it takes over and I keep it.

Odyssey pointed out the three month rule. But you can do six months, 1 year or two years. It's not hard to find things years old to toss out. And some things may be relatively new, but you practically won't use them for 6 months or years, so they can be rid of. Of course it's good to keep winter clothes and prep items too.

For DVDs you could toss all of the cases and buy one of those CD/DVD holders that's the size of one disc and you zip it closed. It has many sleeves that you put all of the discs in. For CDs you could put them all on an mp3 player. And then buy one of those USB solar chargers. Maybe wrap it in foil if concerned of an EMP? For individual songs, I think for some you would have gravitated away after you've processed and grown and feel, "This song does nothing for me." Those songs/CDs you toss.

3rd density is a material one and men have to find their way dealing with material if they want to improve and understand a part of what they are and what they have to become...

That makes sense and highlights the importance of this thread. This physical density is what we have to work with, and naturally, the ordering and choice to retain certain physical objects is a large part of our lives. It's like things can sometimes be extensions of our physical bodies. And of course, there's the energetic and non-physical parts that lie beyond this physical aspect.

With OCD, I have this fantastic ideal of minimalism. But it never plays out and instead accumulation is what happens in reality. I get stuck thinking, "This could be useful." A Jay, you mentioned emotional aspects. I think I get stuck on this too, unprocessed things from the past. For me there is not much that I don't remember where and/or when I got it. It's hard to find an item and think, "Where/when did this come from!?" It's like being stuck in the past and not moving forward in that sense.

There's also digital clutter on the computer and hard drives. Old texts, notes, pictures, downloads, etc. I have a habit of writing notes on my home and work PCs, and it's hard to keep up with them when time passes and the things are no longer relevant. Living in a digital age with so much to attend to, the Law of 7 really can come down hard. So many plates to spin, balls to juggle, you have to pick a certain few things and tend only to them, it seems. Thanks for the great thread!

 

[RedFox]

I have been cleaning and purging some things, but it kind of fell by the wayside. I have two medium sized boxes I plan to take to a thrift store. I think I could fill an equal amount or more, including unwanted books.

A bit of my hoarding comes from OCD, fear of losing things or needing them in the future. I also developed a strong sense of attachment to items from some animated movie as a kid. Basically some personified animal cartoon characters were stripped of their clothing and it was like they had lost their (personified) humanness. So I've had instances in the past where I felt that disrespecting the item of someone was like harming the person their self. But this has waned to near non-existence, though the hoarding remains.

I don't like to throw away things either. It seems wasteful. But I suppose in a few billion years the sun will explode and burn up and recycle all of the matter on the planet? So I'd rather give away things. I have a hard time thinking things will be useful in a SHTF scenario. I was collecting pill and supplement bottles, but recycled them recently. It's hard to determine what is really useful and what is just obsessive for me.
[..]

With OCD, I have this fantastic ideal of minimalism. But it never plays out and instead accumulation is what happens in reality. I get stuck thinking, "This could be useful." A Jay, you mentioned emotional aspects. I think I get stuck on this too, unprocessed things from the past. For me there is not much that I don't remember where and/or when I got it. It's hard to find an item and think, "Where/when did this come from!?" It's like being stuck in the past and not moving forward in that sense.

There's also digital clutter on the computer and hard drives. Old texts, notes, pictures, downloads, etc. I have a habit of writing notes on my home and work PCs, and it's hard to keep up with them when time passes and the things are no longer relevant. Living in a digital age with so much to attend to, the Law of 7 really can come down hard. So many plates to spin, balls to juggle, you have to pick a certain few things and tend only to them, it seems. Thanks for the great thread!

Thanks for sharing 3D Student. As an (hopefully now ex) hoarder, there are a few things I noticed that match with me. The projection/attachment to items and the over thinking.
Perhaps a good measure would be to ask how much time you spend physically doing things vs how much time you spend imagining physically doing things?
Imagination seems to be the problem for me, as I could walk through a room full of junk and be totally blind to it. I'd look at it and instantly jump to 'this is not so bad' or 'I'll do it later' or 'lets go do something enjoyable' - all so I could stay blind to it, not face the anxiety or uncomfortable feelings.

If you grasp the bull by the horns though, things change. The fear and anxiety can be overwhelming before acting. If you just get on and do it, they soon fade. It just needs lots of action combined with minimal 'thinking'! It can be very useful to self observe at these moments too.
Setting a time limit of say 45 minutes or an hour to just clean one corner can be of help.

If you stay firmly in the 'thinking'/imagining whilst trying to do physically, the negative emotions will linger.
It's the clash of reality vs imagination that's painful - but only if you try and hold onto the imagined.

Having a 3 month rule can be very useful, but only if you are not in the middle of hording. At this point stripping everything down to what you used in the last two weeks, or what is of long term importance (i.e. legal documents, stores of food, working tools, seasonal clothes, sentimental items) is the key here.
But only if it's combined with action and not imagination.

Knowing hoarders brains registers everything as 'vitally important' when it comes to throwing them out, but at the same time has already 'thrown them out' by continually ignoring them in day to day life. And that the brain is registers imagined doing as real as actual doing, the framework of this particular trap becomes a bit clearer.
The 'vital importance' is based in imagination and not tested against reality.

I've had many moments of running into the 'I got rid of that thing I now need!' which although initially is infuriating, was still based in imagination. Now it just makes me laugh.
What again helped here was assessing and then acting, not getting stuck imagining what it's be like if I'd kept it
Most of the things I 'need' revolve around repairing other things, so I've tried to take a different approach and assess if the thing I could fix is worth my time and effort.
Most of the time the answer is no, better to use something else or buy something that does the job better.

This world is entropic, and hording is trying to hold onto things that will fade. A static position rather than one of growth.
Or to put it another way, how much entropy are you holding onto and disguising/colouring/covering with imagination and emotional projection?

 

[A Jay]

I was watching one of Joe's interviews on Youtube, and noticed a picture of Gurdjieff hanging on the wall behind him. I really liked the picture and was inspired to make something similar for myself and wanted to share the pictures in case anyone else may like a picture of G in their home. I had them printed as 8x10" photos, and they came out looking really nice. The second photo isn't as good a quality as the first, but from across the room it still makes for an attractive photo of G. So for anyone interested, enjoy!

 

[Voyageur]

As they say, time fly's, and lists grow and a post here is due (looked at the last entry date above).

Here are a couple of self-observations as evidence by my list and the ignoring of same. I noticed that when I get the chance to take time off of work (and I'm going to be around home), I mock up all the things that can get done on the list; some are high priorities. However, when taking time off work I'll procrastinate on DOing, or at least DOing the big ones.

Shop (even though I had done some cleaning it was just cosmetic)

It was such a situation at the beginning of September and the self inflicted weight of chains of my shop that has collected everything imaginable over the years. It was used as projects and nothing cleaned up well and put away - how to even put things away required a whole new look. I wanted to justify this non-activity with it not being just me, yet that is a self-lie, it was my responsibility and it was all out of site clutter while knowing it was a massive job. As the rooms in the house got better, some things were just relocated to the shop and therein lay in wait for more work. How to start?

When completing a series of extended NO neural-feedback treatments, this out-of sight out-of-mind work could no longer be ignored and so rather than DOing it when I had time off, which would make sense, started in on it once back at work in the evenings. Hours and hours night after night was spent cleaning, sorting and throwing out - a week went by and still there was more more. Much of this was moving things from piles - to keep or not and where to even put it. If to keep, why? Then there was the process of trying to use imagination to envision using something (in the 'keep' pile for a purpose of its intended making, and when would that come up, or a purpose not in the things making e.g. this thing could be modified to do something not of its making etc.).

Every jar of screws, nuts and bolts was empties and reorganized or tossed - even bits and pieces I've not seen in a decade somehow spilled out and were rediscovered (embarrassingly).

One thing that was done was to buy or build new racks, boxes and containers and stratify the space to what it would be used for and what is needed to do the work. Nothing more was to be included.

At the time of this writing, although I'm close to being done and it is like a whole new place, it is not completely done, and with that I've some work to finish...

House

There has been some 'jobs' to do with carpentry, so picked away at a few of those that have been hiding down my list. Storage rooms were cleared out, and this is kind of an ongoing process. The food cupboards and drawers is another, clothing another.

Books

Had a big interaction with books awhile ago. Came across a great book shelf and relocated by subject order most of my books - boxed others up - pruned heavily. Even found a copy of Al Gores 'An Inconvenient Truth' in a box (someone had given it to me as a gift) - of course, it should have been tossed out and thought it had been, but I'll keep it for fire starter just in case the need arises. ;)

 

[iamthatis]

I just picked up a book on feng shui, The Essence of Feng Shui by Ami Lin. She apparently learned her system from Lin Yun, a feng shui grand master, who also has a book on the subject. However, she also does some mix and match between feng shuii, chakras, Tarot, Kabbalah, etc.

The author maps the rooms of the house onto the chakras of the body in a way that I found to be quite simple but profound.

She also maps the Tree of Life from Kabbalah in there as well. I didn't pay much attention to it, as it isn't the inverted Tree of Life one in The Wave, so maybe not as accurate.

Anyways, a lot of us are familiar with the seven chakras, or energy centres in the body. The author talks about the bagua of feng shui in a similar way. 'Gua' is a term that denotes the energy centre (or chakra) in one's home. Areas of the house collect/disprese/represent certain types of Chi, similar to our bodily energy centres.

Here's the basic idea:

And here's her mapping of the bagua and the chakras.

The root chakra corresponds to the career area of your house, which is bottom centre.
The sex chakra corresponds to the marriage/relationship area, top right.
The solar plexus chakra corresponds to the wealth/will area, top left.
The heart chakra covers three areas, all across the middle of the house - family, tai chi (which is your centre of centres), and children/creativity.
The throat chakra corresponds to the travel/helpful people area of the house, bottom right.
The third eye chakra corresponds to the knowledge/self development area, bottom left.
The crown chakra corresponds to the fame/destiny area, top centre.

And then each room itself can be divided into a further map of the nine gua/chakras as well, fractal style.

It was quite a trip walking through my place, looking at the rooms using this lens.

For instance, my 'family' area was an unfinished room with no windows, torn plastic, lots of dust, exposed insulation, holes in the drywall, and contained the industrial base of the house - the hot water heater, the furnace, and a freezer.

My 'wealth/will' room is a spare guest room that is still crammed full of the landlord's extra furniture, appliances, old photos, and Christmas decorations.

My 'children/creativity' room is blocked a permanently closed door that has a large sign saying 'NO ADMITTANCE', the room itself being my landlord's office! I'm dooooomed! Just kidding, she has a way of dealing with what happens if a room is missing. You just feng shui the empty space outside the house where the room should be, or on the wall, etc.

Anyways, there was a very compelling correspondence with some issues in my life, especially after taking her 'chakra survey', which gives a basic indication as to which of my chakras are low in energy.

She has a very practical way of approaching treatment of these energetic issues. There's the usual stuff of being ruthless with clutter, bringing order to your space, bringing beauty to it as well - open windows, vacuum, sweep, mop, scrub, polish.

But she also gets into the meeting point of the material and the energetic. All materials are a manifestation of energy at a slow state of vibration. Colours and scents are also manifestations of energy.

In feng shui, the five elements of metal, wood, fire, earth, and water correspond to energies or principles.

Metal - abundance, riches
Wood - growth, beginnings, freshness, nurturing
Fire - action, activity, motivation
Earth - stability, grounding, security
Water - flow, clarity, sensitivity, emotions

Although I note that there are also negatives to each of these manifestations that she only barely touches on. Each element has its associated colours. When we perceive colours, materials, and scents, it produces a change in our internal Chi.

When I first bought the book, I was kinda disappointed as she talks a lot about aromatherapy. I wanted esoteric Chinese house-tetris strategies! But I got over myself a bit and now find her work quite intriguing, as each gua can be associated with certain aromas. It makes sense - it feels better to be in the company of pleasing colours, scents, and also objects that have meaning, arranged in a harmonious way.

Her basic program recommends thinking carefully about our lives, envisioning how we would like each of the 9 aspects of our life to be, creating an aim or intent, and making use of the elements and colours and materials and scents in service of that intent.

Maybe it's a ceramic statue of a protective angel in one's family/heart area, or a picture of Caesar in the knowledge/third eye centre, etc. Then, she recommends spritzing a specific essential oil in the area, saying one's intent out loud to permeate the gua with our voice, maybe spraying the angel or Caesar, too, whatever placement feels right, and the scent locks the intent into memory and our nervous system, and connects to our chakras.

I found it all to be pretty neat.