question about 4D

[Avala]

But what "fragmented soul unit" (or group) means? Fragmented how? Where, who, are the other fragments? Is there fragments as in "parts" or fragmented in some other way? Only what is clear is that it is not soul unit as a "whole".

 

[Jacques]

But what "fragmented soul unit" (or group) means? Fragmented how? Where, who, are the other fragments? Is there fragments as in "parts" or fragmented in some other way? Only what is clear is that it is not soul unit as a "whole".

Here's what I found in the transcripts :

Q: They are down on the scale from whales. I think that whales are absolutely awesome. Are whale souls sort of like a composite soul - sort of like a bunch of dolphin souls make up a whale soul?
A: No.
Q: Is a whale soul always a whale soul from the beginning?
A: Whale is unified soul.
Q: Unified from what to what?
A: All whales share the same soul!
Q: Are human beings like that or moving in that direction, becoming unified soul?
A: Fragmented.
Q: Human beings are a fragmented soul. Were we once a unified soul?
A: Once and future.
Q: When one is a unified soul, then obviously all the experiences of the former fragments become everyone's experience, so to speak. Is that correct?
A: Close.

 

[agni]

Q: (L) Where did the souls come from that entered into the bodies on the planet earth? Were they in bodies on other planets before they came here?
A: Not this group.
Q: (L) Were they just floating around in the universe somewhere?
A: In union with the One. Have you heard the Super ancient legend of Lucifer, the Fallen Angel?
Q: (L) Who is Lucifer?
A: You. The human race.
Q: (L) Are the souls of individual humans the parts of a larger soul?
A: Yes. Close. The One. All who have fallen must learn "the hard way."
Q: (L) Are you saying that the act of wanting to experience physical reality is the act of falling?
A: You are members of a fragmented soul unit.
Q: (L) What is it about wanting to be physical is a "fall"?
A: Pleasure for the self.

I would not say ALL-EVERYONE but rather all the members of this fragmented soul group have never been in 4D. I think we reincarnate here because we are part of that fragmented soul group. If my memory is ok, and as a working hypothesis, we fell 309 000 years ago and right now we are at the end of this big cycle.

How could it be that the members of this fragmented soul group never been 4D ? This is purely logical thinking, but don't you first have to be somewhere "higher" to fall from, or fall C's talking about is a flat-ground fall from STO to STS ?

My current understanding, is that larger Soul Group is a being(?) of density above 3D that shattered in fragmented pieces after the fall, becoming 3D. (this is pure speculation)

 

[Bo]

This is purely logical thinking, but don't you first have to be somewhere "higher" to fall from

a fine warrior in the 3D realm on his quest for knowledge can be at some point be defeated and ''fall'' and go back to sleep, this means that he wasn't necessary higher, he was still in the same 3D realm. It's only that his perception about reality was different than the average man.

Perhaps the same applies to us? We were 3D STO and we fell due to a choice we made as a group.

 

[Gonzo]

I think some of the drive to want to understand or make tangible the concept of higher densities relates to programming of a heaven concept as a destination and goal.

This is an easy trap to fall in. We have been told that a "better place awaits us", that all suffering ends when we get to heaven.

But along with that set up comes the clincher: you can't get to heaven unless you follow certain rules. So, we have the carrot in the heaven concept and the stick in the following of specific rules, created by those who wish to control their food supply.

Contemplating 4-d may very well be trying to adjust one's programmed thinking to find the worthy substitute to heaven.

Heaven, however, should not be the goal. Rather, learning and growing is the goal. The destination is where you are as appropriate for your level of awareness. It is neither a reward not should it be a goal. It merely is.

Therefore, focussing on trying to imagine 4-D is akin to trying to fathom the unknown. There would be now way of verifying and, ultimately, one would have to question the purpose behind such contemplation.

Why do you want to know what 4-D is?

There will lay the clue and partial answer, revealing how such contemplation is a distraction from the Work.

My $0.02,
Gonzo

 

[Buddy]

I cannot explain but I "feel" they DO communicate with each other. For some time, I've been wondering if I've been going off the edge here, but since this has been mentioned, I am prompted to say these things... What this means, I just dunno... No matter how crazy this sounds, I'm hitting the Post key...

I don't think it's 'crazy' at all. Why would it be? If you think of 3D as a certain denseness, or subset of energy frequencies 'next' to each other, then data being transferred between clouds for some purpose that serves a larger purpose, is no different from data being exchanged between forum members for a purpose that serves a larger purpose and the chemical information being stepped up/down and exchanged between the systems in the human body - exchanges that also serve a specific purpose serving a larger purpose (survival of the organism), OSIT.

Could you not "be" a cloud if the information in the system (GAIA) indicated there was a need for one at your location? If not, why not? :D

 

[Al Today]

Heaven, however, should not be the goal. Rather, learning and growing is the goal. The destination is where you are as appropriate for your level of awareness. It is neither a reward not should it be a goal. It merely is.

Yep, Some programs gotta be rewritten or deleted to alter a lifetime of behavior modification. This "dream" of winning a ticket to heaven can be embedded deep enough to where the drive to reach that better place can permeate ones dreams. To shoot that sacred cow, a lifetime of behavior modification needs to be overcome. This can be no easy task. Having no anticipation of a better place to go after death (to me) borders on having no belief of an afterlife. Having almost the mindset of an atheist. That's a toughie to overcome. This is why the Work continues every day. This is why we gotta network because I think that few, if any, can overcome that anticipation of a better life after death alone.

Hmm... A better life after death... That's hard not to anticipate...


Thank you for your support Bud.
I guess they say if you think your going crazy, chances are you are not going crazy.

 

[Buddy]

Personally, after the July session, I feel we're in a time frame where 4D overlaps with 3D (at least in some sense) as the tide slowly moves in. I think the signs of it are the increased sufferings people are experiencing, which may also be looked at as the pressure to 'change'.

To shoot that sacred cow, a lifetime of behavior modification needs to be overcome.

Yep and since some of us may not have a "lifetime" to change, a good shock might do the trick. For example, what if a 'desire' or 'anticipation' for 4D (or 'Heaven') is nothing but a buffer against realizing that one is really rejecting the suffering in 3D; suffering that needs to be understood, utilized and mastered in some way?

I don't know, I'm just asking, because I've found it to be fruitful to ask "what am I running away from?" anytime I experience the kinds of 'feelings' associated with 'looking for greener pastures'. :)



Edit: Corrections for accuracy, as I misunderstood something.

 

[iloveyoghurt]

I guess they say if you think your going crazy, chances are you are not going crazy.

If you not going crazy maybe you not paying attention ;)

 

[iloveyoghurt]

Hi iloveyoghurt,

It may do well to keep in mind that STS is in 4D.

Hi Jerry, still pondering your meaning - you mean also? As in STS is also in 4D? If so, this is definitely worth always keeping in mind.

It reminded me of the times when I think of 4D STO: maybe STO 4D is like a giant Lifeline call center, just waiting around to answer calls for help from 3D.

Minus the Tim Tams :(

On the other hand, this could be plain silly

 

[iloveyoghurt]

I believe this to be possible because, after all, we have been in 4D before so we might actually remember something somewhere in our psyche. This remembering may be more possible too with the reconnecting/reforming of our DNA that is supposedly occurring at this time. This remembering, or these "impressions" may well be more available to us equally so with the approaching wave and our (possible) merging with 4D.

I don't see that there was any misunderstanding of Gurdjieff's ideas but whatever.

If you wanna think about 4D and reach for the possible impressions of what it would be like - go for it I say!

But you know, that's just my ideas on it.

To my knowledgae, we have never been in 4D before. We were 3D STO before the fall.

Hi Gandalf, thanks for the pick up -

sorry, sorry, yes my mistake - it was 3D STO before yes. Sorry.. So no remembering, just impressions.

Also, I see that my question to Jerry had already been asked and answered, quadruple sorry..

 

[Al Today]

I guess they say if you think your going crazy, chances are you are not going crazy.

If you not going crazy maybe you not paying attention ;)

I'm completely lost on what you're saying about not paying attention. Could you please explain what you're pointing out?
THANKS

 

[JGeropoulas]

I think some of the drive to want to understand or make tangible the concept of higher densities relates to programming of a heaven concept as a destination and goal.

This is an easy trap to fall in. We have been told that a "better place awaits us", that all suffering ends when we get to heaven.

But along with that set up comes the clincher: you can't get to heaven unless you follow certain rules. So, we have the carrot in the heaven concept and the stick in the following of specific rules, created by those who wish to control their food supply.

Contemplating 4-d may very well be trying to adjust one's programmed thinking to find the worthy substitute to heaven.

Heaven, however, should not be the goal. Rather, learning and growing is the goal. The destination is where you are as appropriate for your level of awareness. It is neither a reward not should it be a goal. It merely is.

My $0.02,
Gonzo

Several comments attributed to Jesus sum up well what Gonzo has said:

The truth will set you free
You must be born from above (Greek work anōthen, commonly translated "born again")
The road to life is narrow and few will find it
Seek and you will find
The kingdom of heaven is within you

And some comments attributed to "Saint" Paul also seem good advice pertaining to the "The Work":

Continually work to bring your healing to fruition, with reverent awe, and awareness of your weaknesses
(commonly translated, "Work out your salvation with fear and trembling")
Be transformed by the renewing of your mind

 

[JGeropoulas]

Personally, after the July session, I feel we're in a time frame where 4D overlaps with 3D (at least in some sense) as the tide slowly moves in. I think the signs of it are the increased sufferings people are experiencing, which may also be looked at as the pressure to 'change'.

To shoot that sacred cow, a lifetime of behavior modification needs to be overcome.

Yep and since some of us may not have a "lifetime" to change, a good shock might do the trick. For example, what if a 'desire' or 'anticipation' for 4D (or 'Heaven') is nothing but a buffer against realizing that one is really rejecting the suffering in 3D; suffering that needs to be understood, utilized and mastered in some way?

I don't know, I'm just asking, because I've found it to be fruitful to ask "what am I running away from?" anytime I experience the kinds of 'feelings' associated with 'looking for greener pastures'. :)

Edit: Corrections for accuracy, as I misunderstood something.

And all of these discussions of an afterlife and heaven are based upon possibly yet another programmed belief: that we "die." Obviously, bodies die (at least, appear to), but do we ever "die." Years ago, while talking with an electrical engineer, I was impressed by his declaration that though he was an atheist, he firmly believed in eternal life because, he explained, "life is energy, and energy can never cease to exist--it can only change forms".

Instead of an abrupt, rigid line of demarcation, the process we call "dying" is likely experienced as seamless a transition as that of the shift of wave lengths of light we perceive as blue into violet; or a shift in theta brain waves (at the last stage of what we call "sleep") into alpha waves (of what we call "awake").

Therefore wondering what 4D will be like compared to 3D might be akin to wondering what how one feels on their 4th birthday compared to the day before when they were 3.

Just some thoughts, in my ongoing quest to identify and examine--with a willingness to relinquish--my presuppositions (i.e. those "most cherished beliefs" targeted by Socrates).

 

[iloveyoghurt]

I guess they say if you think your going crazy, chances are you are not going crazy.

If you not going crazy maybe you not paying attention ;)

I'm completely lost on what you're saying about not paying attention. Could you please explain what you're pointing out?
THANKS

Hi Al Today,

I was having a joke... I was playing on the expression doing the rounds lately, which says something to the like of:

"If you're not outraged you're not paying attention"

I tweaked it slightly saying that, if a person is actually paying attention, it would be no surprise if they were to go mad - meaning it's a crazy world out there, and it will drive you crazy!!

But it was just a little joke, no matter.