Suicide

[anart]

Clarekav, I do agree with you that it is up to the individual if that individual chooses to end his/her life, although, just think about it. Most of us have been depressed at some point in our lives, but most choose not to commit suicide. I have been depressed in my life too many times to count, and the reason why I did not want to kill myself is because I do not want to cut short my life here right now when obviously I have not finished my lessons here in 3D. If I knew of someone who wanted to end it all for good, I would not hesitate to help them through their pain, because that pain is only temporary. And temporary pain is not a good reason to die for.

I tend to agree with Clarekav and Nienna Eluch on this one. It can be very difficult to understand how one can take their own life unless you have felt such depths of despair yourself. If you haven't, it can seem like 'it is only temporary pain' and 'no reason to die for'. If a person is at the point where they have decided to take their own life, that pain is not 'only temporary'. It is an all-encompassing experience from which there is no relief, thus the 'exit'. I understand both points of view - the value of living the life through the pain, and the possible necessity of 'shutting off the noise'. I don't think this is a 'yes or no' or 'right or wrong' subject - it comes down to each individual, their lesson plans, their choices, and their pain. Just my take, though.

 

[Clarekav]

I tend to agree with Clarekav and Nienna Eluch on this one. It can be very difficult to understand how one can take their own life unless you have felt such depths of despair yourself. If you haven't, it can seem like 'it is only temporary pain' and 'no reason to die for'. If a person is at the point where they have decided to take their own life, that pain is not 'only temporary'. It is an all-encompassing experience from which there is no relief, thus the 'exit'. I understand both points of view - the value of living the life through the pain, and the possible necessity of 'shutting off the noise'. I don't think this is a 'yes or no' or 'right or wrong' subject - it comes down to each individual, their lesson plans, their choices, and their pain. Just my take, though.

Very true anart. It is the individual who knows if leaving or staying is right for them.

I understand what your saying Mona on the feelings of depression and not wanting to cut life short when there is so much to be learned.
I'm not saying leave a person in their pain when they are asking for help. If you can truly help them through those times that is wonderful but it comes from inside them,
they have to want to make it through. To come to their own understanding of life being lessions.
That does not mean to leave a person hanging if they reach out but it is understanding that it is their choice should they not reach out.

 

[aragorn]

I agree with anart, in the late 90's I was severely depressed and read quite a lot on the subject of suicide. From what I learned I realized that I was pretty close myself of falling into that dark abyss where from there's no return. I can't say for sure, but I think that what I felt then was close to how people who commit suicide feel. It's hard to describe in words the 'place' you're in when you want to end your life, but I remember feeling the following:

You're in a dark tunnel where there's hardly no light, you feel that the sky is falling - pressing you down, you see the world and the people around you through a dark veil, there's no joy in doing anything-actually you can't even think of doing ANYTHING because your heart and brain is so full of pain and negative thoughts. The only thing you can think of is: how and when can I end this? I can't stand living on one more minute! I remember how merely the thought of having to endure living on many years from that moment on knocked me down on the floor giving me the worst panic attack ever.

I was lucky to escape my 'dark tunnel', don't know exactly how I made it, but it feels like a miracle. When you're in that dark tunnel you are absolutely 100% certain that nothing cam make you feel better. I think that this is important to keep in mind when dealing with suicidal people; they see no way out and nothing you say or do can make them feel better, at least not immediately.

From this experience and having talked to people who have lost their friends and loved ones (because of suicide) I would say that when you are deep enough in that dark tunnel killing yourself feels like the most natural and logical solution, once you've 'discovered' this option you actually feel happy about it.

 

[Mona]

I agree with anart, in the late 90's I was severely depressed and read quite a lot on the subject of suicide. From what I learned I realized that I was pretty close myself of falling into that dark abyss where from there's no return. I can't say for sure, but I think that what I felt then was close to how people who commit suicide feel. It's hard to describe in words the 'place' you're in when you want to end your life, but I remember feeling the following:

You're in a dark tunnel where there's hardly no light, you feel that the sky is falling - pressing you down, you see the world and the people around you through a dark veil, there's no joy in doing anything-actually you can't even think of doing ANYTHING because your heart and brain is so full of pain and negative thoughts. The only thing you can think of is: how and when can I end this? I can't stand living on one more minute! I remember how merely the thought of having to endure living on many years from that moment on knocked me down on the floor giving me the worst panic attack ever.

I was lucky to escape my 'dark tunnel', don't know exactly how I made it, but it feels like a miracle. When you're in that dark tunnel you are absolutely 100% certain that nothing cam make you feel better. I think that this is important to keep in mind when dealing with suicidal people; they see no way out and nothing you say or do can make them feel better, at least not immediately.

From this experience and having talked to people who have lost their friends and loved ones (because of suicide) I would say that when you are deep enough in that dark tunnel killing yourself feels like the most natural and logical solution, once you've 'discovered' this option you actually feel happy about it.

I wonder how the dead people in 5D who commited suicide feel when they realize that the end is not exactly the end. And all that baggage they carried with them in 3D came along with them to 5D. I wonder if they were happy to end it all once they made it to 5D, or not.

I think we shold keep in mind that there are nasty 4D creatures attacking us, and not only that, there are also nasty 3D humans that are attacking us constantly, and once we do know that deep inside then the suicidal thoughts will not feel that natural anymore. Suicidal people are being attacked and made to feel like suicide is the end result of a happy life in the dead zone. I don't believe that for a second. But then that is my belief and I don't expect other to believe the same.

 

[anart]

I wonder how the dead people in 5D who commited suicide feel when they realize that the end is not exactly the end.

How do you know they didn't think that before they committed suicide?

And all that baggage they carried with them in 3D came along with them to 5D.

What if it doesn't? At least, not in the way you seem to be thinking? You seem to have some strong convictions about this topic and I think it might be worthwhile for you to challenge some of your assumptions. In other words, you can't know that what you think about this is how it actually 'is'.

I wonder if they were happy to end it all once they made it to 5D, or not.

I would imagine it depends on the person, and that some are quite relieved while others slap their forehead and go, Doh!

We are not our bodies, Mona - and there is no time - and all there is is lessons - soooo - wouldn't it naturally follow that the learning would continue? Such a decision might make the learning profile more difficult, or it might be a natural part of the lesson profile, depending on the person. Who is to say? Certainly it would make sense for each case to be different, depending on limitless factors, don't you think?

I think we shold keep in mind that there are nasty 4D creatures attacking us, and not only that, there are also nasty 3D humans that are attacking us constantly, and once we do know that deep inside then the suicidal thoughts will not feel that natural anymore.

I think you might not quite understand how it feels to be suicidal. That's understandable. I don't think it ever feels 'natural' to need to die - it just 'is' and there are few, to no, other considerations at that point and moment in time. I also don't think that anyone in this conversation has forgotten about 4D STS attack or nasty 3D STS humans - that is all part and parcel of this existence, as is death. Let me clarify that I'm not a proponent of suicide, I'm just attempting to help you understand that it is not a cut and dried 'right or wrong' situation - just like most things in this life.

Suicidal people are being attacked and made to feel like suicide is the end result of a happy life in the dead zone. I don't believe that for a second. But then that is my belief and I don't expect other to believe the same.

I'm not quite understanding the first sentence above. Are you saying that you think it has been stated here that suicide's end result is a 'happy life in the dead zone'? That hasn't been said or implied, to my understanding. What has been said is that suicide 'is' - it is a choice amid billions of other choices in a lifetime.

You also speak of 'belief' here which might explain your convictions and how you're thinking. Any idea where this belief came from?

 

[nwigal]

Maybe suicide is a lesson for certain individuals. Maybe some come back to become less, so others can become more.

 

[Ben]

Maybe suicide is a lesson for certain individuals. Maybe some come back to become less, so others can become more.

Not sure exactly what you are trying to say here nwigal. In what way would you suggest that somebody becomes 'less' as a result of the choice to commit suicide, and how exactly would you define or quantify this? If I have completely misunderstood you please clarify.

 

[Smallwood]

I was planning suicide before going under medication. In that pain you don't think about how your family might feel about your decision, and I think that the usual ways to talk someone out of it are pretty useless. I decided that I will try for two more years and then see if there is any chance for me. I will do my best for two years and see if the hope returns. After that I don't know what I'll do.

 

[ana]

I was planning suicide before going under medication. In that pain you don't think about how your family might feel about your decision, and I think that the usual ways to talk someone out of it are pretty useless. I decided that I will try for two more years and then see if there is any chance for me. I will do my best for two years and see if the hope returns. After that I don't know what I'll do.

Hi Smallwood :)

May i ask if even from time to time, you experience positive emotions.

 

[Ca.]

Quote from Ana: Today at 09:56:26 AM

May i ask if even from time to time, you experience positive emotions.

Hey Smallwood, Ana brings a very valid point, rather than thoughts of negativity, to redirect to entertaining positive thoughts. They can manifest as a breeding ground for being food for 4DSTS. So if these situations of entertaining negative thought patterns are practiced that they can be manipulated as well.

This provides a means to create blocks of escaping seemingly trivial event's, into more than they are for the purpose of ring out as much from the emotional instability, and maximum extraction of your negative feeling's which they will pump up if one lets them. So a little knowledge of this attempt can be minimised if one would practice a little self discipline and fight there attempts to make more of a situation then it is.

From session 941126

Q: (T) Who talks to me when I am having conversations with myself
in my head?
A: You.
Q: Am I talking to other beings?
A: Have.
Q: Do we all do this?
A: No.
Q: (T) Does Laura communicate like this.
A: Has.
Q: (T) Does F***?
A: Ditto.
Q: (T) Should I continue communicating with whoever it is?
A: Up to you.
Q: (T) Are they connected to you?
A: No.
Q: (T) Do you know who I am talking about?
A: Yes.
Q: (T) Can you tell me who they are?
A: Lizards.
Q: (T) Why are they talking to me?
A: Trying to convert you. Remember, T***, your chronic depression
represents a "battle" zone.
Q: (T) I no longer am depressed and they are talking to me more. (J)
They are trying to get you back into it. (T) but they are not doing
anything to convince me to be depressed.
A: Watch out!
Q: (T) Can I turn them off?
A: Yes.
Q: (T) Who is "Sing."
A: Leader of forces assigned to influence you.
Q: (T) Forces, as in many are assigned to me personally?
A: Yes.
Q: (T) How many are in this force?
A: Seven.
Q: (T) Do they do this because of the implants that are in me?
A: All part of process.
Q: (T) Do I have implants?
A: Yes.
Q: (T) These implants are what they use to control my emotions and
amplify them so that they can feed off of them?
A: Not control, influence.
Q: (T) No, not to control; influence. But when, say, I get angry, then
I'm angry for a short time but then I'm angry for a long time because
they have used this technology to amplify and extend this; is this
what they do?
A: Yes. Knowledge protects, ignorance endangers.
Q: (T) Can I feed back through their equipment what I choose?
A: Not necessary.
Q: (T) In other words, if I get angry and realize that I am being more
angry than I should be, and I change that to something positive, and
feed that back to them while they have their amplifiers wide open,
will that affect them? Sour their milk, so to speak?
A: Now you are "fighting fire with fire."
Q: (T) Well, is that something that we are supposed to be doing?
A: Open. But what does phrase imply?
Q: (L) If you feed it back at them, in other words, what they are
saying is, I think, when you feel yourself getting angry, the only way
to stop the whole thing is to stop being angry and be happy or at
peace. When you are happy and at peace there is not in you the
desire to send anything back.
A: Bingo.
Q: (J) Redirect the energy into something positive. (F) You can't fight
fire with fire. (LM) Well, actually you can in reality. (T) What I am
getting at is, is it possible to do that, to change the emotional state to
something more positive than what they are expecting and feed that
back to them. Is that a possibility?
A: Why.
Q: (T) Just to give them a taste of their own for a change. (J) Do you
want to antagonize them? You are still feeding them your energy. (L)
The only change you could really have would be the opposite
emotion which would be peace and if you are truly feeling peace...
A: 4th density STSers feed off negative energy.
Q: (J) So, give them nothing. (T) But what I am thinking about is the
energy... I have a natural... They are feeding off negative energy.
They put something in me, some technological thing, because they
come into 3rd density to mess with us...
A: Yes.
Q: (T) ...that will amplify this for them. Make it even stronger.
A: Analogy follows: How effective is a light socket without a plug in
it?
Q: (T) Well, how effective is a light socket without a socket in it... I'm
trying to learn here so you guys give me some latitude.
A: What?
Q: (T) If you take a light socket and pull the socket... pull the plug on
the light socket you no longer have light. (L) Well, the Lizzies are the
light bulb and you are the power source so you just pull out their
plug. (J) Unplug yourself. (T) Am I the socket?
A: How effective is a motor that is never turned on?
Q: (J) Do not be their source. If they feed off negative energy, starve
them.
A: Implants are ineffective if not used.
Q: (J) The power source has to be on for the implant to work for
them to get the juice and the power is negative thoughts and
emotions. (T) But I am still a 3rd density being. I have all the
emotions of a 3rd density being, the whole gamut, and that is part of
what makes me a 3rd density being. Therefore I can't turn one
emotion off without upsetting the balance of the other emotions,
emotions are almost an analogy to the light and the dark.
A: No.
Q: (T) I have positive emotions and I have negative emotions; they
both make up who I am.
A: If you choose, you may have only positive emotions.
Q: (T) Now, if I have only positive emotions, which is a nice thing to
have and I'd like to have that, what does that do to the sensor
equipment of the Lizzies?
A: Cancels them.
Q: (T) So they are tuned to negative frequencies?
A: Yes.
Q: (T) Having positive feelings cuts off the implants. If I cut off the
sensors by having positive feelings, what will the Lizards do?
A: Go elsewhere.
Q: (L) Am I correct in my thought that when you first start turning this
off that they may increase their efforts for a period and then finally
they realize that you are really in charge here and then they go
away?
A: Exactly.
Q: (L) So, when you first get a clue and you start getting a grip on
your emotions and dealing with everything that happens to you with
acceptance and knowledge that all is a manifestation of your own
creation and for your ultimate good, for a period of time they may try
ten times harder to get you back as a food source, but then once
they realize they can't, then they do finally let loose?
A: You and F*** are experiencing this right now.
Q: (L) This is true. (F) We have both been under massive attack.
Just doing this work has been a struggle to keep at it with everything
coming from every direction. (L) The hardest has been to stay in a
frame of mind to do it. (J) Am I under attack?
A: Not yet.
Q: (T) Is what I have been under the past few months the first
assault?
A: Yes.
Q: (T) Now they are trying to sweet talk me?
A: Only first assault.
Q: (T) So, the more positive I become, the more they are going to
continue trying, and I am assuming that because you said I have
seven beings of some kind assigned to me, that they find something
interesting in me that they want to keep?
A: Close.

 

[dannybananny]

I think what needs to be realized is that you can have a person that is in such terrible, terrible pain, such as people who are in extreme pain due to illnesses such as cancer, that they no longer see a reason to stay in this suffering and would rather pass on. There can also be extreme psychological pain that would push someone into wanting to exit their life. Until you are in their shoes, how do you know that they should not have done this?

I wasn't thinking about pain from illnesses, but in the case of cancer it's maybe better to not suffer more. I gave subjective view on suicide and I pardon for that, it's true you can't know how that person feels and it's true that everyone is different. I also experienced strong depression (and anger) when realizing in what world I live and everything then lost it's purpose and I wasn't afraid of everything, all masks were down, I was stolid, lot's of thoughts came so I can have a glimpse on it maybe. If all there is lessons and if we do it for eternity it doesn't really matter when you' ll learn, it's their free will to chose and we are conditioned to always think what is faster it's better, or have fear of dieing and we can't see the bigger picture.

 

[Smallwood]

Hi Smallwood :)

May i ask if even from time to time, you experience positive emotions.

Well, the emotions seem to be a big problem for me. I had to repress them in order to survive a hellish period when I was school bullied. After that I have wanted feel positive again and have (although the periods are becoming more rare and rare). But it's very rare.

Right now, it seems to me that my existence is still mere surviving (it's like the school bullying has never stopped in my mind). I don't feel fear, but I can see how it affects the choices I make (to trust a person or not to trust). There are times when I feel I can open up to people, but most of the time I'm very withdrawn to myself. It feels safe, but it ain't living.

A side-note: I was thinking today about how to feed my inner child, you know, trying to listen to it's needs. I was trying to do it in solitude and I wasn't going anywhere. But then a nurse came in my room and we talked by the side of this issue and it seems to me now that it's not the right approach to try to shut the world out when trying to interact with the inner child. You have to think in terms of what IN the world can bring it satisfaction. I hope that makes sense.

 

[ana]

Well, the emotions seem to be a big problem for me. I had to repress them in order to survive a hellish period when I was school bullied. After that I have wanted feel positive again and have (although the periods are becoming more rare and rare). But it's very rare.
Right now, it seems to me that my existence is still mere surviving (it's like the school bullying has never stopped in my mind).

That could be a pretty accurate analogy, if we see life as a school.

I don't feel fear, but I can see how it affects the choices I make (to trust a person or not to trust). There are times when I feel I can open up to people, but most of the time I'm very withdrawn to myself. It feels safe, but it ain't living.

you can also take a step by step approach putting to work your reading instrument, and letting the facts speak for themselves. :)

A side-note: I was thinking today about how to feed my inner child, you know, trying to listen to it's needs. I was trying to do it in solitude and I wasn't going anywhere. But then a nurse came in my room and we talked by the side of this issue and it seems to me now that it's not the right approach to try to shut the world out when trying to interact with the inner child. You have to think in terms of what IN the world can bring it satisfaction. I hope that makes sense.

Maybe you can try to change the old school/life view for a new one, take this forum for example a school where you decide, you give and you receive, you are free to move at your own pace and you are loved, a school/life you are part of.

 

[nwigal]

Maybe suicide is a lesson for certain individuals. Maybe some come back to become less, so others can become more.

Not sure exactly what you are trying to say here nwigal. In what way would you suggest that somebody becomes 'less' as a result of the choice to commit suicide, and how exactly would you define or quantify this? If I have completely misunderstood you please clarify.

Sorry for the noise. I was trying to say that suicide can be a kind of reboot of the system, creating a temporary positive disassociation from the mind of the predator, spirit attachments, and long running programs. This can make these influences become "less", so more free will is available, for the asking, to others, making them "more". I was thinking about what the C's said about Arafat, and others who chose to return from 5D, knowing that their destiny was not pleasant, ready to walk through the fire, having done so already.

 

[Smallwood]

Thanks for your response Ana.

It's not really easy to change one's view on life. Especially when one has to deal with weird and scary stuff that comes along with being psychotic (this disease is attacking everything that I hold dear). But I realize that it is important to think more positively once in a while because life is never one sided and seeing things through dark lense is often caused by linear thinking. If we always thought linearly, there would never be any chance of change. Atleast, that's what I'm thinking about it.