*Edit, to add this : I am not sure it is worth discussing it, I am not sure it is really interesting to everybody to read it, but now that this discussion has started, I'll continue. If someone think it is unapropriate, let us know.*
history said:
Starshine said:
I never said it was a predatory act from you, and I do think it is a dynamic through us. Can you understand the difference ?
Yes I understand the difference but if you knew that from the first night we were together and you were the one doing the Work then, wasn't it YOUR response-ability to make sure we were both safe and stop any further involvement? And please don't attack me for asking because I really don't know the answer but when I hear you say you knew something was wrong from the beginning that makes me wonder why YOU proceeded. Can you understand the difference?
I stated that I've been lying to myself on certain things, but to be more precise, I was not listening to myself and I wanted to wait what was going to happen. Also, events bonded us. It just happened and seemed natural.
I still have a lot of things to learn, and before talking about
doing the Work, understanding what it really means to do it is is the first step. I'm still processing on self-observation, identifying Little I's, self-remembering, mastery of emotions, mind and and physical body.
What if I was not able to give this response-ability, because I was not really
seeing what was happening ? I think it is part of the lesson and if it happened to be that way, there's great lessons to learn from it. And I did/still do learn a lot of it.
It is an important experience.
history said:
Starshine said:
You've got (at the time) what you needed from the Swamp, so you wanted this thread to die by himself. I agreed and I thought you had some more perspective.
I do have more perspective and what has changed in YOU in a day is what really should be answered. Everything has been great since The Swamp thread and was even before you and I made peace right after The Swamp thread. I was finally free after The Swamp thread even without your participation. It was all good. And you wanted The Swamp thread to die as much as I did.
Not really, I felt that's what you wanted to, so I agreed we should let it die. Nothing changed in me in a day, nor in months about this specific issue. Apart that i was released you were finally moving on. Remember, the questions that have been asked to you about certains things were adressed to you specifically, but you had to have my approval, or you wanted to keep the contact. As I said in my previous post, I called you to know why you prefered to send me a lenghty email rather than asnwering here. Considering the lenght of it, you had time to do it.
history said:
Starshine said:
You left a message this morning, told me to call you back. I did, and told you to say what you had to say here, right. When I saw that you finally did not post to rather send me a lenghty mail, I called you back to say : where is your post ? Why did you answer privately ? And we ended up by you insulting me. Why do you even mention those things when you should guess I have some good memories about those facts ?
I did NOT leave you a message this morning, you answered right when I called, so your "good memories about those facts" are not to be trusted! It was not a great call but it lasted for an hour and it was okay and we said good-bye. I thought that was it. YOU called me back several hours later, maybe to ask about where my post was, but I was busy and couldn't get to it earlier today, so I told you that is why I hadn't posted it. I sent you a private mail because some things ARE private and I thought we were good and I didn't know I couldn't send you private mail. The second call started out well but after you admitted you were still in love with me, you got angry and I got angry, I said "blank you" and I hung up. Then, I came home and you're going off on me on the Forum. Understandable, I suppose.
That is true, I answered actually, apologies, the fact that I called you back brought me back to a previous situation. Still, I have some good memories.
And yes, you absolutely wanted to hear it, that I still "love" you. Are you released I said so ? What do I mean by that actually ? That I still care about you. Good Chemistry as you love to say. Isn't that pretty obvious ? And that is what makes me angry, to feel that you're stuck, whatever I could say. It's not the first time that you finish a "discussion" by blank you. And I think you don't realise, altough I told you a bunch of time, that the way you express yourself go really quickly loud, rough and angry.
history said:
Starshine said:
The last time I called you was after this Swamp session-you left me 5 vocal messages and 11 calls, it was really not the moment but I called you back-, and finally this time we ended up in a rather normal conversation. I thought something shifted. I really did.
Didn't I call you for obvious reasons, who left messages ? You wanted to come and see me in France.
The last times you called me was two nights in a row the weekend before this last one, which was after The Swamp and the multiple calls you are referring to and those calls were generated all on your own. I had finally let go but we talked for hours and it was almost like old times and I really thought we were good and we would remain good. I did ask if you wanted to see me because I was so near and you said that it wasn't that you didn't want to see me but it was probably best that we didn't. I was absolutely fine with not seeing you and I didn't call again until this morning. All has been good for me. I had an amazing time on my journey and I got everything I needed. I came home, got to work, posted about interesting things on the Forum and I really thought all was well.
Generated on my own ? If I was in a "row", maybe I was busy, and it was just not the moment ? I was with a bunch of people, including my mother and some friends, but after seeing your insistance, I decided to call you back. And they got worried about me again, because they fastly knew it was you on the other side. They can tell, for sure, considering my apparent concerns. Everybody around me think it's just too much now. I'll keep my words.
I was right, it was not the best thing to do.
history said:
Starshine said:
And I never said either that you are endlessly calling me. Don't twist things. Who is misleading who here ? If I really want to evolve, you really think I can carry on a mask here ? You under-estimate the capacity of analysis that is going on around here.
No, but anart implied I was trying to constantly force communication and that impression came from somewhere. There is no underestimation of anything, certainly not now, and how clever of you to play to that here. I have laid out much more than I ever intended to here and sucked up every harsh word and what a surprise- it was HELPFUL! And I thought you were genuinely happy that I was finally finding peace.
From somewhere ? I wonder where ? I am not playing at all. It was your will to talk here, on this specific forum. And I thought it helped you, it was a release. But considering what just happened, I really have no idea of what you consider as peace.
history said:
Starshine said:
I can see what is not friendship. And I told you we can't be friends. Where is the respect of my will here ? I can see you coming from far : What about your will, right ? It's all about me. Let's see what you have to say. Remember, I have memories and nothing to hide.
You're right. It's not a friendship because that does take two and you've never been able to be friends with anyone you once or still love. You've admitted that. I however, am friends with everyone I have ever loved/been in romantic relationship with (except for the psychopath) and I know it takes time to get there but there has to be a Will and you clearly don't have it, that is abundantly obvious, despite that you are still in love with me (whatever that means), as you said today. It's sad. This has all broken my heart. I admit it. But you are misleading here because I told you today before I hung up that I accepted that we won't be friends because that is what you wanted. And as far it being all about you, it has been A LOT about you Starshine, much more than you are currently able to see or truthfully express to the people here.
Everyone ? So what is friendship to you ? The key is possession.
It is not possible for us to be friends for obvious reasons.