Tubal ligation - pros and cons

[anart]

Not an option in our case.

That's really unfortunate since your health is goign to be negatively affected by the course of action you appear to have to be taking, and, from what I understand, the risk of his health being affected is so miniscule as to be almost nonexistent.

 

[Mrs.Tigersoap]

If the vasectomy is an issue and the other methods discussed are apparently not safe, why not simply use condoms? They're 98% effective (just like the pill, apparently).

 

[Firefly]

Anart, Mrs. Tigersoap - thank you for suggestions and your comments! My husband's maleness is not an issue. I think I have not been able to explain my situation properly. Unlike the majority on this thread who are considering vasectomy and tubal ligation to avoid pregnancy, for us the ultimate goal would be to get pregnant. Unfortunately, the current state of my tubes will not allow for it to occur "the old fashion" way, so we are considering a natural cycle unmedicated IVF. In order for that to be successful and in order for me to avoid ectopic pregnancy, I have to have my tubes blocked. Or repaired. I would definitely prefer to have it repaired but I have not been successful in finding a lot of information on how to do it naturally, without any surgical intervention - I will not consider any surgical repair. That's why I was so interested in hearing opossum's story (thank you so much for sharing, opossum). If trying to get pregnant would not be a goal - my husband will absolutely go for a vasectomy.

 

[shijing]

Hi Firefly --

Thanks for clearing that up. I think that in the context of the thread, it had been assumed that you were trying to prevent pregnancy, which made it appear that your husband was not willing to go without sex but wasn't willing to make a sacrifice for both of you either:

For the reasons I prefer not to go into, vasectomy is not an option either. Abstinence is not either ;D.

Of course, if you are trying to conceive, that's a completely different situation! I understand that you don't want to go into the personal details (which is certainly your choice), but I'm glad you clarified this much of the situation since you will be able to get more appropriate feedback now that it's clear what your goal is.

 

[anart]

Yes, firefly, it would have been appreciated if you had been clear about that from the beginning. Actually knowing why you were asking would have saved a lot of energy.

 

[Firefly]

My apologies. Please understand that this is a rather sensitive subject for me and I do feel a little guarded about the subject. I am not used to talking about it with anyone other than my husband. Also, part of me wanted to get an unbiased opinion on the options without introducing concepts that can cause an emotional response (like having kids, IFV etc). I do understand now that in my trying to get an unbiased opinion without giving a background, I actually induced a cognitive bias, which was not my intention. I am grateful though for all the questions and comments they made me re-evaluate and have a close look at my potential choices.

 

[RedFox]

i would like to learn some more about how the proper diet can regenerate.

See "Life Without Bread" thread and/or you the book of the same name. A lot of people have reported some pretty amazing physical regeneration/recoveries from health problems on the paleo diet.

 

[Mrs.Tigersoap]

Thank you for your explanations, Firefly. It makes more sense, now. :)

 

[Alana]

My partner found this article on FB today and was telling me about it. It's supposed to be a safe, reliable birth-control for males. I don't know a lot about it though, anybody heard of this before? Can we dig some more info?

The Best Birth Control In The World Is For Men
http://techcitement.com/culture/the-best-birth-control-in-the-world-is-for-men/#.T6qUqcXdUzB

Posted by Jon Clinkenbeard. March 26, 2012, 11:25 AM CDT 7.8K

If I were going to describe the perfect contraceptive, it would go something like this: no babies, no latex, no daily pill to remember, no hormones to interfere with mood or sex drive, no negative health effects whatsoever, and 100 percent effectiveness. The funny thing is, something like that currently exists.

The procedure called RISUG in India (reversible inhibition of sperm under guidance) takes about 15 minutes with a doctor, is effective after about three days, and lasts for 10 or more years. A doctor applies some local anesthetic, makes a small pinhole in the base of the scrotum, reaches in with a pair of very thin forceps, and pulls out the small white vas deferens tube. Then, the doctor injects the polymer gel (called Vasalgel here in the US), pushes the vas deferens back inside, repeats the process for the other vas deferens, puts a Band-Aid over the small hole, and the man is on his way. If this all sounds incredibly simple and inexpensive, that’s because it is. The chemicals themselves cost less than the syringe used to administer them. But the science of what happens next is the really fascinating part.

The two common chemicals — styrene maleic anhydride and dimethyl sulfoxide — form a polymer that thickens over the next 72 hours, much like a pliable epoxy, but the purpose of these chemicals isn’t to harden and block the vas deferens. Instead, the polymer lines the wall of the vas deferens and allows sperm to flow freely down the middle (this prevents any pressure buildup), and because of the polymer’s pattern of negative/positive polarization, the sperm are torn apart through the polyelectrolytic effect. On a molecular level, it’s what supervillains envision will happen when they stick the good guy between two huge magnets and flip the switch.

With one little injection, this non-toxic jelly will sit there for 10+ years without you having to do anything else to not have babies. Set it and forget it. Oh, and when you do decide you want those babies, it only takes one other injection of water and baking soda to flush out the gel, and within two to three months, you’ve got all your healthy sperm again.

The trouble is, most people don’t even know this exists. And if men only need one super-cheap shot every 10 years or more, that’s not something that gets big pharmaceutical companies all fired up, because they’ll make zero money on it (even if it might have the side benefit of, you know, destroying HIV).

That "destroying HIV" comment caught my attention. It links to the Medical Hypothesis journal, an issue from March 2005, and the summary says:

RISUG™ (reversible inhibition of sperm under guidance) – An antimicrobial as male vas deferens implant for HIV free semen

Sujoy K. Guhaemail address

School of Medical Science and Technology, Indian Institute of Technology, Kharagpur 721 302, India

Received 3 December 2004; accepted 8 December 2004. published online 30 March 2005.

Summary

HIV transmission from the male to the female is a major health problem. A hypothesis proposing an intra vas deferens implant of an antimicrobial compound to prevent the infection spread is presented. Mechanisms of action for the inhibition could include inactivating HIV in sperms passing through the vas deferens; drug release from the implant to destroy HIV entering into semen from genital structures distal to the vas deferens; and sperm acrosome released hyaluronidase mediated reabsorption of HIV. A subcomponent of the implant flowing along sperm pathway may have a role in reducing the entry of HIV from a positive female into penile tissue. A new drug RISUG™ (reversible inhibition of sperm under guidance) presently undergoing clinical trials for its contraceptive effect in the male (because it disrupts the sperm acrosome by an electrical charge and pH lowering effects) has also antimicrobial action. The drug being a combination of styrene maleic anhydride (SMA) and dimethyl sulfoxide (DMSO) on being injected into the lumen of the vas deferens produces styrene maleic acid thereby lowering pH; induces electrochemical action leading to a stable electrical charge generation; releases mandelic acid; and induces acrosome reaction in sperms with consequent release of hyaluronidase and sperm inactivation. Moreover, one time administration into the lumen of the vas gives long term action. All these phenomena very well match with the needs for HIV clearance of semen and hence RISUG is here proposed as a possible candidate material for the HIV inhibiting vas deferens implant when delivered in below contraceptive threshold dosage.

For experimental validation, after obtaining data on the semen HIV load under control conditions in the HIV positive males inducted into the study, 30mg of SMA in 120μl of DMSO (contraceptive dose being 60mg SMA+120μl DMSO) is to be injected into vasa deferens bilaterally. Thereafter at intervals of one month the viral load needs to be determined in semen obtained either by masturbation or in lubricant free condom at intercourse – the method of collection remaining the same throughout for a particular subject. A significant reduction in the semen viral load following RISUG administration will validate the hypothesis. Speculated reduced female to male HIV transmission is more difficult to test. Nonspecific indications will come from a population study of the incidence of RISUG treated men becoming HIV positive as compared to that in the general population.

I don't understand exactly what the procedure is, or how toxic the injected substances are.

Wikipedia has an entry, too and it says among others:

Controversy

The thoroughness of carcinogenicity, teratogenicity, and toxicity testing in clinical trials has been questioned. In October 2002, India's Ministry of Health aborted the clinical trials due to reports of albumin in urine and scrotal swelling in Phase III trial participants.[8] The Indian Council for Medical Research noted that dimethyl sulfoxide used as a solvent for the injection is known to cause kidney damage.[9] Although the ICMR has reviewed and approved the toxicology data three times, WHO and Indian researchers say that the studies were not done according to recent international standards.[10]

RISUG does not provide protection against the spread of sexually transmitted diseases.

 

[Alana]

The first link above offers some more links for this procedure:

Finding low-cost solutions neglected by the pharmaceutical industry
http://www.parsemusfoundation.org/Parsemus/New_male_contraceptives.html

RISUG reversible male contraceptive almost ready for U.S. tests
http://digitaljournal.com/article/307482

And a long interesting article from Wire Magazine, with a short video of the procedure:

The Revolutionary New Birth Control Method for Men
http://www.wired.com/magazine/2011/04/ff_vasectomy/all/1

 

[skycsil]

So, hubby got his vasectomy done. We had to pay because it's not covered by social security but it's possible to have it free at piblic hospitals. It was fast and easy, hubby claims it hurt a bit but it's possible that it was because they didn't inject the painkillers on the scrotum but higher in the pelvis.

 

[Jacques]

Glad to know that he decided to have it done.

 

[skycsil]

Thanks, Gandalf =)
He was up to it since the moment I mentioned it, took us a little while to gather the money ;D

 

[leahsh]

Exercise after Tubal

I am 31, no kids, and recently had my tubes tied. 9 days ago to be exact. I was feeling like a champ and went back to work 2 days after the surgery, and started walking on the treadmill 3 days after. I'm normally super, SUPER active (run, bike, rock climb, etc) so the walking felt like no big deal. I did this for 2 days and it was fine and out of nowhere one of the 3 incision sites swelled up, hurt like hell, and I was limping just walking. I even made an appointment because I thought it was infected, which it is not. I rested, iced, and took a lot advil regularly for 48hrs and then tried to exercise again lightly. It went well for one day and now it is swollen and painful and I can even walk a mile again. The other incision cites feel GREAT.

Did anyone have problem with just one incision? How long did it take you to be able to exercise again? I'm feeling a lot of self hatred.

 

[Gawan]

Welcome leash to our forum, seeing as this is your first post on the forum, we would appreciate it if you would post a brief intro about yourself in the Newbies section, telling us how you found this forum, how long you've been reading it and/or the SOTT page, whether or not you've read any of Laura's books yet, etc.