United D.Js (Disc Jockeys)as Wizard of Oz's helpers.

[caballero reyes]

« Reply of #3 of Perceval on: November 24, 2012, 11:48:52 PM »

In what way do you see it as mass manipulation?

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Hi, Perceval. this Arnhem Holland's concert reminded me the first half hour of the film "The triumph of the will" (1935) of fascist director Leni Riefenstahl (cronicles of the 1934 nazi party congress in Nuremberg); of course that everything is relative but I made this association and this massive reunion of people seems to be better a essay of "The Atrophied will".
In the middle of the stage we see the scandinavian widened cross of St. George emanating snap-shot swasticas, this kind of symbols are not needed in this parafernalia concerts, but they put them there with a definite purpose.

 

[loreta]

Everything related to the masses is scary. And manipulative. And false. People are like zombies, in this genre of meetings. The world of music is a a false world, a world of manipulation, money, drugs, fashion, fans, idolatry. Nothing to do with the art of music or the therapy of music and dance, or creativity or art. To see 10 thousand people in front of a stage is a little disturbing and yes, we can think about the meetings of the Nazis who were fascinated by the "show", participating in a sort of trance in a sort of theater. What is behind all this sort of spectacles is big corporations, is business. And if you talk about music versus business versus big corporations you have drugs, naturally.

This is my two cents, as you used to say. ;)

 

[neema]

Also its refreshing to see no one drunk or on drugs.

Really?

Maybe not refreshing as in interesting to see them high of music than recreational drugs or alcohol.

I think the question is why do you think they're not on drugs or alcohol? The usual culture surrounding this type of music is filled with drugs.

Well you guys are right I can't know for sure, and for all I know majority of the people there might be on drugs or drunk. I'm assuming, based on other videos and events I've seen, it just didn't look as bad as some of the other ones, to me anyway.

Personally, I find this type of "music" to be very annoying, and not really music at all - it's so mechanical and it's hypnotic and "entrancing" and I don't think that's a positive thing - at least from my perspective. But, just my two cents.

You're right that this isn't really “music”, but the masses do get attracted to it. Is it simply because of its entrancing nature? No question, but can it be used positively or am I “dancing with the devil” on this one?

I also agree that you really can't listen to trance for a long time, even the “best” variety. I admit that I did stop the video after 5 min of watching.

Maybe the masses of people are attracted to “silly stuff” purely because more and more humans are giving up their knowledge retention and forgoing a chance at prime knowledge, as we get closer to the re-“cycling” event. If I'm not mistaken, I believe it was Gurdjieff that stated something along those lines.

And of course I shouldn’t forget that the majority of people simply want to “sleep” and not want to face reality. Therefor they gravitate towards such “silly”and “entrancing” forms of “art”.

 

[loreta]

There is a very interesting movie by Peter Watkins that talks about how people are manipulated concerning the spectacle media: Privilege.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Privilege_(film)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1HCHJwmnxMI

It is a very serious movie about the manipulation of the masses made as a documentary, as all the movies by Peter Watkins. He is one of the best directors of Britain who is able to analyse with intelligence our society.

 

[melatonin]

I really dislike this type of music. Its totally unemotional and ego based, even robotic-like.

 

[Chu]

Well you guys are right I can't know for sure, and for all I know majority of the people there might be on drugs or drunk. I'm assuming, based on other videos and events I've seen, it just didn't look as bad as some of the other ones, to me anyway.

Well, I doubt there is any of this type of concert that doesn't involve lots of drugs and alcohol. Remember that it's a video, probaby made by a fan, or someone amongst the organizers, so they wouldn't necessarily show people going into a coma or being sick now, would they? I know a famous DJ, and he says that techno without drugs is simply not "catchy", and concerts are a failure if people are clean. He should know!

You're right that this isn't really “music”, but the masses do get attracted to it. Is it simply because of its entrancing nature? No question, but can it be used positively or am I “dancing with the devil” on this one?

I think that everything has the potential to be used positively, but do you see it happening with this type of events?

Maybe the masses of people are attracted to “silly stuff” purely because more and more humans are giving up their knowledge retention and forgoing a chance at prime knowledge, as we get closer to the re-“cycling” event. If I'm not mistaken, I believe it was Gurdjieff that stated something along those lines.

Maybe these are sounds (sorry, I can't call it "music") that resonate with something in them, with their frequency. Maybe it's an escape for some to, and it is achieved through this "trance".

And of course I shouldn’t forget that the majority of people simply want to “sleep” and not want to face reality. Therefor they gravitate towards such “silly”and “entrancing” forms of “art”.

Yeps. I think that music, art, fashion and movies today are mostly a product of what is inside humanity in general, and it ain't very deep!

I remember having an argument once with a modern art fan. He was telling me how "deep" a meaning a particular picture had. It was litterally a white board, with a black dot in the middle. He started saying that the richness of it was in the fact that people could reflect upon reality by looking at it, and imagine, for example, that the black dot was a person with a hat, feeling lonely in the world. Weeell, sure, one could find meaning in everything, but the fact was that it remained a simple black dot, that anyone could have painted, and that, it required that amount of mental gymnastics to cover up for the FACT that it was just a dot. It's the same with music. People talk about rythmn and melody. But I'm sorry, the only thing I hear is a monotonous "bum, bum". Maybe I lack imagination. ;)

 

[Joe]

I think the question is why do you think they're not on drugs or alcohol? The usual culture surrounding this type of music is filled with drugs.

Yeah, that was the question.

 

[grini]

Urgh, personally I think this is electronic music at its worst (and I am open to a wide range of different styles).
No way you can stand that for hours, unless you're under the influence, or just dead inside.

I completely agree. I do enjoy electronic music, in its better moments, but this is truly the worst of the worst.

I agree too.
I was listening trance music with my brother when we were 12-13 years old, at that time trance was very popular in Europe. But in that old trance they were actually singing and it didn't sound agressive like this.
It was more like this, very popular song from 2002.:
_http://youtu.be/tmPws7eXcVk

In electronic music I find dubstep to be quite disturbing, to be more precise brostep, Americanised dubstep. It gives me chills and it sounds like some alien is speaking/screaming
Skrillex is the best example and his song First of the Year. Video is... hmm... disturbing Negative music at its best, at least for me.
_http://youtu.be/2cXDgFwE13g

 

[theos]

Well, I doubt there is any of this type of concert that doesn't involve lots of drugs and alcohol. Remember that it's a video, probaby made by a fan, or someone amongst the organizers, so they wouldn't necessarily show people going into a coma or being sick now, would they? I know a famous DJ, and he says that techno without drugs is simply not "catchy", and concerts are a failure if people are clean. He should know!

Eeek! You'd have to be under the influence of some serious drugs to enjoy this mess (_http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YwIXh44GGI.) Contemporary music has taken a nose dive in terms of creativity. I can't stand all of that robotic sounding drivel that's being pumped out these days. I just have to laugh looking at the DJ's all amped up and acting like they're doing something really speshul.

 

[irjO]

In electronic music I find dubstep to be quite disturbing, to be more precise brostep, Americanised dubstep. It gives me chills and it sounds like some alien is speaking/screaming
Skrillex is the best example and his song First of the Year. Video is... hmm... disturbing Negative music at its best, at least for me.
_http://youtu.be/2cXDgFwE13g

Bhahaha i hate dubstep.. Nothing like a good disco house or deep house :)

 

[neema]

Well, I doubt there is any of this type of concert that doesn't involve lots of drugs and alcohol. Remember that it's a video, probaby made by a fan, or someone amongst the organizers, so they wouldn't necessarily show people going into a coma or being sick now, would they? I know a famous DJ, and he says that techno without drugs is simply not "catchy", and concerts are a failure if people are clean. He should know!

You have a very good point. I was definitely taken by the slick camera work.

I think that everything has the potential to be used positively, but do you see it happening with this type of events?

No, when I really think about it I don't see that happening, not this way anyway.

Maybe these are sounds (sorry, I can't call it "music") that resonate with something in them, with their frequency. Maybe it's an escape for some to, and it is achieved through this "trance".

Indeed, and gives me pause about what part inside me still resonates to such things. Perhaps nostalgic programing about my youth.

Yeps. I think that music, art, fashion and movies today are mostly a product of what is inside humanity in general, and it ain't very deep!

I remember having an argument once with a modern art fan. He was telling me how "deep" a meaning a particular picture had. It was litterally a white board, with a black dot in the middle. He started saying that the richness of it was in the fact that people could reflect upon reality by looking at it, and imagine, for example, that the black dot was a person with a hat, feeling lonely in the world. Weeell, sure, one could find meaning in everything, but the fact was that it remained a simple black dot, that anyone could have painted, and that, it required that amount of mental gymnastics to cover up for the FACT that it was just a dot. It's the same with music. People talk about rythmn and melody. But I'm sorry, the only thing I hear is a monotonous "bum, bum". Maybe I lack imagination. ;)

No you do not lack imagination. You have common sense.

And I know exactly what you're talking about. I constantly argue with abstract “artists” about the definition of art. They are so annoying and aggressive. Very good analogy to the whole music or noise argument.

I don’t even consider myself a true artist anymore. Imo, when I stopped really painting on a canvas and stopped life drawing, I ceased being a true artist. As I tell many of my colleagues in the industry (3d-animation), we are all art technicians and not really artists anymore. Although the conceptual artists I work with are really talented. Funny thing is they can't stand the digital canvas.

This whole idea of popular art has reminded me of what one of my art teachers told me once. “You have to ask yourself, do you want to create art that is popular, or do you want to create art that is meaningful? Because you can only achieve one.”

I told her I want both, but after all these years I'm starting to see she was right. In fact, if you make really good objective art it would be “hated” by the majority of a subjective society.

 

[Paragon]

This music makes me feel 'tribal' and animalistic, to the point of wanting to bang my head against a rock and not even care that I am doing so. In my imagination, it seems to conjure up images of fighting, having casual sex and general entropy. I remember back in my first year of high school in the UK, 2001 odds, this type of music was popular and all the powerful and popular kids used to listen to it.

It seems to be a 'good' musical expression of STS energy. OSIT.

 

[caballero reyes]

Here is the Beginning of tecno pop, electroacustic, house, trance, etc.. All started with french musicians: Pierre Henry (9 December 1927) and Paul Schaeffer (14 august 1910--19 august 1995).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qssa6ec7faQ

 

[grini]

Here is the Beginning of tecno pop, electroacustic, house, trance, etc.. All started with french musicians: Pierre Henry (9 December 1927) and Paul Schaeffer (14 august 1910--19 august 1995).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qssa6ec7faQ

For the first 40 seconds I thought I was listening to Ennio Morricone, after that it was like I was listening to Fatboy Slim. I think this is remix.
This sounds more like the original: http://youtu.be/jZPDrNAFo1U

 

[caballero reyes]

« Reply #27 on: Yesterday at 05:44:12 AM »

Here is the Beginning of tecno pop, electroacustic, house, trance, etc.. All started with french musicians: Pierre Henry (9 December 1927) and Paul Schaeffer (14 august 1910--19 august 1995).

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CORRECTION: The name of musician schaeffer is Pierre Henri Marie Schaeffer.

ELECTRONIC ROCK: The Green Queen (La Reine Verte)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=22Rqk2dAYLo