Venezuela: Resistance or disintegration?

[jhonny]

When I lived in South America(10 years ago) I thought that Chaves wanted the best for Venezuela and I still think he wants the best for Venezuela and South America but a lot has happened...I really don't know what he wants for his people.
I know that most journalism is disinfo, but I have many friends who tell me that happens in venezuela.There is no food and everything will be state.
I have read in the forum but i don't have not found much about Chaves..

 

[Z...]

Re: Who's really Hugo Chaves

Have a look at this thread jhonny
http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=2662.0

Dunno if the link to this excellent documentary is lost forever or can be fixed.

In any case you can watch it here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ICTP_9l-4NM

 

[wanderer33]

Re: Who's really Hugo Chaves

Can you confirm that the problems in Venezuala such as no food are directly contributeable to Hugo Chaves? The US is not at all supportive of his regime. We know from experience that when the US is not supportive of a regime they implement sanctions which cripple countries..i.e. N.Korea, Iraq, Iran, Palestine. The US will also goad a neighbor to attack or cause trouble for a regime they are unfriendly with. Remember that the US goaded Iraq into attacking Iran.

I think you would need to look behind the journalism and research all the possibilities.

 

[Chu]

Re: Who's really Hugo Chaves

Hi jhonny,

I come from Argentina, and I constantly hear a lot of bad stuff about Chavez. But it doesn't make sense when you look at the evidence. From my experience, it is always the upper classes who complain about him and not the lower ones.

I lived in Venezuela for four years as a child. As little as I was, I remember how the country became much more divided and capilaltistic. A few years down the road, Carlos Andrés Perez became president of Venezuela (his second term). He almost destroyed Venezuela completely, stole the state money and put his country in a position where it was controlled by the IMF, as I understand it. Then came Chavez. And I think things have greatly improved since. In Argentina, a similar situation took place, but instead of getting someone like him in power, it has gotten to the point where it is ruled by pro-Zionists and degrading little by little.

There are a lot of articles about Chavez in our Spanish sott blog, if you are interested http://senalesdelostiempos.blogspot.com/(just do a search by "Chavez") and also on SOTT.

He has tried making health care and education available to everyone, and he is the main anti-capitalistic force in Latin America. If his measures sound a bit drastic, think about what other choices he has, when his government has been so viciously infiltrated by US agents, and he is in a constant state of uncertainty for his own life.

I say, see the fruits of his actions. And don't trust the media. Everything may not be perfect in Venezuela, but where else is it? Is it possible to achieve more when he's confronted to such a strong propaganda campaign?

Have a look at this thread jhonny
http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=2662.0

That thread is really thought provoking and contains a lot of information. For example, this post is what really led me to think differently about Chavez.

 

[cholas]

Re: Who's really Hugo Chaves

Here is another link to the very informative documentary. Well worth a gander, imo, jhonny.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5832390545689805144#

 

[Marcus-Aurelius]

Re: Who's really Hugo Chaves

That thread is really thought provoking and contains a lot of information. For example, this post is what really led me to think differently about Chavez.

This post describes exactly what I think of Chavez so far. I like the way he's giving the best of himself for the Venezuelan people and how he stands against capitalists, never missing any opportunity to denounce them loudly! And also his constant appeal for unity against these wolves.

 

[Joe]

What people forget, or deliberately ignore, about Chavez is that he has been under constant threat of a coup since he became President. In a normal world many of the policies he has enacted would not be necessary, but in the world we DO live in, they seem to be necessary if he is to continue to try to keep Venezuela's resources for Venezuelan people.

It's not easy trying to tell the truth (and have it believed) in a world where lies are disseminated and promoted by agents of a powerful global empire with designs on ALL of it.

 

[shijing]

What people forget, or deliberately ignore, about Chavez is that he has been under constant threat of a coup since he became President.

I think this is really true. I know Chavez isn't perfect, nor is the situation in Venezuela perfect either, but he's really in a position where he's damned if he does and damned if he doesn't. If Chavez were to relax some of the policies he is criticized for (the ones that haven't been misrepresented in the first place), he would have probably already been done away with, and his state infrastructure would have been dissected and parceled out to the umpteen multinational corporations who thrive on that kind of blood-sucking. There seems to be a very special kind of strategic enclosure required by heads of state if they are truly acting in favor of the people they represent, and a fine line that needs to be toed.

 

[Galaxia2002]

I live in Venezuela and it is quite true what you say, some things Chavez´s contradictory behavior can be explained by their constant struggle against the wolves, for which he has to use his own tactics to survive. He is also surrounded by his own wolves . As I said in another post I have relatives who have worked in government in places where important decisions are taken and unfortunately I have to say that much of the government is ponerized, and although I do not think Chavez is a psychopath, he has to manage to cover such "failures" of their comrades and that is why we seldom see a trial against a government functionary and there is a whole damage-control system for this.

I agree in part with the government to nationalize banks and industry to counter the advances of capitalism but not quite, because it is past experience that the government makes inefficient what before worked well.

One of the great (and structural) problem of government that can lead to the collapse is that it has replaced much of professional people in strategic parts and has placed people with great loyalty to the process but often they know nothing of his office and disastrous things happen as the national electricity problem through lack of investment and maintenance having so much money available and that was revealed at this time for the drought we are experiencing.

What I explained above is also a part of what has contributed to increasing food shortage problem, which is not Chavez's responsibility but the state. The government invested heavily in cooperatives to produce food domestically but gave no advice or follow up training and also facilitated the purchase of products to foreign governments related to the revolutionary process. Now Venezuela went from being a country that produced food to be one that is almost entirely imported. Also the delay in the allocation of dollars causes that food arrives late. Venezuela is not sanctioned by any country to import food and the goverment has not complained about that.

Something I have to admit is that I don´t like that part of the state is being taken over by foreigners with the chavez's consent. For example, there are cubans in the identification services and intelligence. Cubans also inspect the registry offices, and work in the direction of foreing affairs in the airport and also in the army with authority to command. One thing is a bilateral agreement and another to come to pass over Venezuelan officials.

I am a lower-middle class person and could say that since the beginning of the Chavez government until the year 2006 I saw an improvement in many things, but since there has been a dropping in quality of life and now ALL the problems are fault of imperialism. That has become the perfect excuse to justify any ineptitude. I know there is sabotage but if he were more balanced he would be more credible.

Changing focus, the question Who's Hugo Chavez really? makes me wonder about what could be his role in the process of earth changes. He is one of the few people with great power and voice in the world telling truths. To what extent is he helping with the butterfly flapping? Is he part of the another groups that C's have said are contributing to the changes? These would be good questions for the C's.

 

[Biomiast]

I am a lower-middle class person and could say that since the beginning of the Chavez government until the year 2006 I saw an improvement in many things, but since there has been a dropping in quality of life and now ALL the problems are fault of imperialism. That has become the perfect excuse to justify any ineptitude. I know there is sabotage but if he were more balanced he would be more credible.

I think this is the main problem with authoritarian governments. I see this in Turkey's foundation, Ataturk started pretty well, passing laws that improved the well-being of its people, at least from a certain point of view, then all of a sudden an assasination plan was revealed and he became brutal towards his friends, always suspcious of them. To maintain his power, he started to eliminate those who pose a danger to him. Tragically, in the end, he couldn't bare the things he have done and drink heavily. According to a recent documentary, he was aware that all those around him were bootlickers, yet he didn't do anything because doing otherwise would introduce new people with new dangers. He died at the age 57 as a lonely man. Turkey took up his legacy and in the following years use the motto: "Turk has no friend other than a Turk", and they became a paranoid nation.

And I think this is the case in Iran also. Yes, CIA may provoke the protests in there, yet constant fear of Westerners prevent the free speech in Iran. You may look at the arrest of Maziar Bahari which is totally riddiculous. And as Galaxia points out, this is probably what happens in the Venezuella also. It is scapegoating process. Blaming others for your mistakes so that you can shift the responsibility from you. I think an ideal government would do this: Even the situation is caused by Westerners, they might say "Alright there is a situation, it may or may not be our fault, but we take full responsibility to make the situation better instead of blaming others."

I know it is not reasonable to ask anybody to do that, as I said, it is an ideal government, not current ponerized governments. But if I had the governing power, I would do this. This is the way we Work and this is the way we improve our lives, so why not do it on a macro-scale?

Just my two cents, fwiw.

 

[jhonny]

Changing focus, the question Who's Hugo Chavez really? makes me wonder about what could be his role in the process of earth changes. He is one of the few people with great power and voice in the world telling truths. To what extent is he helping with the butterfly flapping? Is he part of the another groups that C's have said are contributing to the changes? These would be good questions for the C's.

.

I agree on this point because after having seen the videos for "the revolution will not be televised" and read many things in SOTT and forum, I think Chavez's role in all this change is very important, I had some doubts but I think he has to fight against many things (imperialism, the worst of all).
I still remember his program "Aló Presidente" and I knew that could not have changed. Perhaps it was best to have a view from within .... thanks Galaxia2002

 

[Eboard10]

IMO Hugo Chavez is just a really good actor, nothing more nothing less.

 

[knowledge_of_self]

IMO Hugo Chavez is just a really good actor, nothing more nothing less.

Well imo, Obama is more of an actor than Chavez. Looking at the big picture- is Venezuela better off since Chavez was elected as president? I'd say yes for at least 80 % of the population. 20 % being the super rich people, who aren't super rich anymore and are complaining that they're not super rich.

Then, let's look at Obama and his empty promises. He promised so much- and not only has he not come through with any of his promises he's deliberately gone against his own word. Case in point Guantanamo Bay.

Another person who is also more of an actor than Hugo is Ahmadinejad. He speaks out against Americans only to suit his own purpose. But doesn't care at all about the Iranian people. For instance, how he pushes this whole nuclear program, "it's Iran's right... " but he plays right into the hands of Americans and Israel.

In end you shall know them by the fruits of their actions.

 

[Vulcan59]

Here is a blog I found that seems to offer a different view of Chavez and Venezuela. Can anyone vouch for it's accuracy?

 

[Nienna]

Here is a blog I found that seems to offer a different view of Chavez and Venezuela. Can anyone vouch for it's accuracy?

I don't know, but I can't help but wonder just who are the people complaining about Chavez, the poor that he is supposedly helping or the rich who are being ousted from power in many ways. I am reminded of the Zionists and the Hasbara group that put up diisinfo.

It would be nice to know the truth of the matter, but until we get an objective view we won't know.