Was "Gallic wars" a text similar to the Odyssey - so, describing the Younger Dryas cataclysms?

[palestine]

Hello,

I've been trying to learn more about the Odyssey; it's a process I joined mid-stream. The forum had already uncovered a lot of information—and I hope you'll forgive my frequent posts in the "Troy" thread.

I'm creating a new thread here so I don't have to post in the other one anymore, and also to discuss a more general topic.

Thanks to the C's sessions, we've learned that the Odyssey, like some Indian texts, describes cataclysms—so these accounts need to be transposed.

Ultimately, the underlying story is the destruction of the Atlantis civilization, which occurred in three rows, at intervals of tens of thousands of years.

Indian texts speak of ancient destructions, and also of the last episode, while the Odyssey only recounts the last episode—what we know as the "Younger Dryas," a series of cataclysms that occurred around 10850 BC ("-10850" or "12800 BP").

During my research, I came across the following map:

It comes from the book "The cycle of cosmic catastrophes" by Richard Firestone. He describes the landing of comets from the Younger Dryas around the world. He explains that a large comet broke into several pieces, resulting in approximately five impacts (see the above picture - five main big impacts).

This is representative of the last row of the destruction of Atlantis.

Then, he presents an even more localized map:

I didn't quite understand if these were even smaller fragments, but that's what I assume. So, we would have here a map showing the distribution of comet impacts in Europe. The Scandinavian impact ("five big impacts") is located a bit off this map; this map shows a big one North of Germany (more or less).

While leafing through my copy of Caesar's Gallic Wars, I came across a map: the final battle in the Gallic Wars is Alesia, against the big boss—Vercingetorix



Here are various maps of the fortified city (Alesia) that Caesar besieged and then captured:

That's the very end of the book, "the big one".

When I read about the session of Caesar, I can't help but wonder why and how Caesar produced such a descriptive book about war machines. I mean, the entire book is a military treatise, recounting the advances and retreats of troops, with descriptions of military situations. The book is a long succession of this—and for a Christian, this can be surprising. If Christ/Caesar would leave us a trace about something, he surely wouldn't provide us with such a text!

So I noticed a similarity between R. Firestone's map and the final battle of the Gallic Wars (circle/impact and various external streams):

In addition, here are two maps showing various Gallic wars:

Comparison:

And then I thought: would Caesar recount episodes of comets, just like Homer, and the Indians ("Vedas", "Mahabharata", "Ramayana")? It would make sense, after all. Why would Christ bother to describe "the positioning of his troops", as well as "the sharpness of the barricades", throughout his book?

The hypothesis is that he is recounting cataclysmic events.

I looked in the Odyssey to see if there was any mention of "stones thrown at people." It's taking time, and I'm still at the beginning. I've gotten as far as the part where Odysseus goes to the land of the dead (Persephone). So far, I've found three instances of "stones":

HOMER - "The Odyssey"
the odyssey of homer : george herbert palmer, n.c wyeth : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

"...tearing off the top of a high hill, he flung it at us. It fell before the dark-bowed ship a little space, but failed to reach the rudder's tip. The sea surged underneath the stone as it came down, and swiftly toward the land the wash of water swept us, like a flood-tide from the deep, and forced us back to shore"

"...once more picking up a stone much larger than before, the Cyclops swung and sent it, putting forth stupendous power. It fell behind the dark-bowed ship a little space, but failed to reach the rudder's tip. The sea surged underneath the stone as it came down, but the wave swept us forward and forced us to the shore"

the mighty Laestrygonians gathered from here and there, seeming not men but giants. Then from the rocks they hurled down ponderous stones; and soon among the ships arose a dreadful din of dying men and crashing ships

The first two quotes are when Odysseus visits the Cyclops' island (point 4 on the following map - "At the cyclop Polyphemus"), and the second occurrence is a little later, when he finds himself among cannibals (point 6 - "At the cannibal giants"):

I had a look in the Gallic wars, to see if there were descriptions of stone throwings. I found five.

Caesar's Commentaries on the Gallic war : literally translated, with explanatory notes - Liceu Phelipense : Liceu Phelipense : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

BOOK 1.
Chap. XLVI

While these things are being transacted in the conference, it was announced to Cesar that the cavalry of Ariovistus were approaching nearer the mound, and were riding up to our men, and casting stones and weapons at them.

It's near Vesontio / Besançon (France)


BOOK 2.
Chap. VI

There was a town of the Remi, by name Bibrax,* eight miles distant from this camp. This the Belge on their march began to attack with great vigour. [The assault} was with difficulty sustained for that day. The Gauls’ mode of besieging is the same as that of the Belge: when after laving drawn a large number of men around the whole of the fortifications, stones have begun to be cast against the wall on all sides, and the wall has been stript of its defenders, [then |, forming a testudo, they advance to the gates and undermine the wall: which was easily effected on this occasion; for while so large a number were casting stones and darts, no one; was able to maintain his position upon the wall.

* Bibrax, Bièvre, a town of the Remi, on the Aisne, must net be confounded with Bibracte, one of the largest and richest towns of the Aedui.

So, Bibrax. Bibracte is another city, near Alesia. Bibrax is Northeast of Paris. I will show both on a map, right after.

BOOK 3
Chap. IV

A short time only having elapsed, so that time was scarcely given for arranging and executing those things which they had determined on, the enemy, upon the signal being given, rushed down [upon our men] from all parts, and discharged stones and darts upon our rampart. Our men at first, while their strength was fresh, resisted bravely, nor did they cast any weapon ineffectually from their higher station.

<> Octodure / Martigny (Switzerland)


BOOK 7
Chap. XXII

To the extraordinary valour of our soldiers, devices of every sort were opposed by the Gauls; since they are a nation of consummate ingenuity, and most skilful in imitating and making those things which are imparted by any one; for they turned aside the hooks* with nooses, and when they had caught hold of them firmly, drew them on by means of engines, and undermined the mound the more skilfully on this account, because there are in their territories extensive iron mines, and consequently every description of mining operations is known and practised by them. They had furnished, moreover, the whole wall on every side with turrets, and had covered them with skins. Besides, in their frequent sallies by day and night, they attempted either to set fire to the mound, or attack our soldiers when engaged in the works; and, moreover, by splicing the upright, timbers of their own towers, they equalled the height of ours, as fast as the mound had daily raised them, and countermined our mines, and impeded the working of them by stakes bent and sharpened at the ends, and boiling pitch, and stones of very great weight, and prevented them from approaching the walls.

<> Avaricum / Bourges ? (Not sure but I think this is it)

BOOK 7
Chap. LXXXI

The Gauls, after the interval of a day, and after making, during that time, an immense number of hurdles, scaling ladders, and iron hooks, silently went forth from the camp at midnight and approached tke fortifications in the plain. Raising a shout suddenly, that by this intimation those who were besieged in the town might learn their arrival, they began to cast down hurdles and dislodge our men from the rampart by slings, arrows, and stones, and executed the other movements which are requisite in storming. At the same time, Vercingetorix, having heard the shout, gives the signal to his troops by a trumpet, and leads them forth from the town. Our troops, as each man’s post had been assigned him some days before, man the fortifications ; they intimidate the Gauls by slings, large stones, stakes which they had placed along the works, and bullets.

The last one is at Alesia, the final battle.

This produces the following map:

From left to right:

• Bourges
• Bibrax
• Bibracte
• Alesia
• Besançon
• Martigny

We'll consider the above green dot (Bibrax), but I leave the second one (Bibracte) on the map.

Now let's have a look at the following map:

It is an illustration of Odysseus' travels.

Let's crop here:

Let's see if we can make it fit:

Four matching dots - that's quite interesting. And I did not arrange myself so as to absolutely produce this. Just put in on, adjusting the width. So, no trichery here!

The above picture is this (one mirror flip, then some rotation):

To show the reader what this is, here is another illustration:

So I just grabbed the locations from the Odyssey (Italy map), and tried to see if there was a match with Caesar (map of France).

dots on the Odyssey map	Odyssey' locations	Caesar locations
dot n°6 (above, it's on the right)	Cannibal giants	Martigny episode (book 3, chap. 4)
dot n°7	Circe the magician	Vesontio / Besançon (book 1 chap 46)
dot n°8	Sirens	Alesia (book 7 chapter 81)
dot n°9 (above, it's the left dot)	Carybde & Scylla	Avaricum / Bourges (book 7, chapter 22)

So, no cyclops (dot n°4).

I was happy to find the narrative of the Odyssey, with stones. I was telling myself: "if Caesar is a match, the cyclop will be a match". No luck on that one, it's the giants, Circe, the Sirens and another episode. Nevertheless, episodes of stones are still the glue here.

I did not make it that far, to the Sirens, and to Carybde & Scylla. I don't know if there are "stones". At Circe, I found nothing.

1. My initial approach was based on the idea that ancient texts could describe something other than what they initially appear to say.
2. From there, I thought, "Why not Caesar?"
3. I grabbed my "Gallic wars" book, went at the end and stared at the illustrations. I noticed that the map of Alesia was similar to the R. Firestone illustration of European cometary impacts.
4. And then, I noticed how basic and military "Gallic wars" was.

After this, it was a matter of crossing the references, keeping in mind the hypothesis that both authors (Homer, Sallust/Caesar) would be describing the same history.

That's the procedure I followed.

And, really, when I layered the dots of the Odyssey, to my amazement, it was matching the locations of Caesar.

Objectivity could be lost during the process - I fully accept it. I am sorry if this is the case. I don't want to "bet" on anything, here. It's just what I found out. If there is nothing, that's fine for me. I just wanted to keep track of this, because I am really not sure that there is nothing.

I hope I won't be put on a diet of baked noodles!

 

[palestine]

ENGLISH (French right after) / Anglais d'abord, version française plus bas!

---

I continued my research and here's what I found.

Around 10,850 BC, there was a cometary bombardment; it was called the Younger Dryas. It appears that a large comet broke into five pieces.

Here is researcher Richard Firestone, who identified the impacts as follows:

(from the book "The Cycle of Cosmic Catastrophes")

We can see an impact in Finland.

Richard Firestone also identified other impacts—perhaps from smaller comets. These may be fragments of the larger ones.

Here is an impact zone he identified:

We could speculate if this is the impact in Finland.

Later, to corroborate his hypotheses, Richard Firestone analyzed rocks found in these locations. He detected the presence of nanodiamonds. So this is a study on comet impacts, which create special diamonds.

Here is a map showing the excavation sites:

https://www.researchgate.net/public...tent_with_Major_Cosmic_Impact_at_12800_Cal_BP

I will be focusing on the European sites, as well as the Spanish and Syrian sites. I've created a more precise map with these locations:

17​	Watcombe Bottom, Isle of Wight​	United Kingdom​
18​	Lommel​	Belgium​
19​	Ommen​	Belgium (Netherlands?)​
20​	Lingen​	Germany​
21​	El Puig de Santa Maria​	Spain​
22​	Abu Hureyra​	Syria​
e​	Lommel​	Belgium​
f​	Aalsterhut​	Netherlands​

Here is the above map, more precise:

So we have a glimpse of comet impacts during the Younger Dryas in Europe. Let's look at a site in Spain, then another in Syria. This means that the comets that struck during the Younger Dryas period left traces in those locations. I understand that there were impacts in those places.

Homer's Odyssey

The C sessions indicated that the Odyssey, written by Homer, actually recounts this period of destruction. Odysseus is a fictional character – and it's difficult to determine the extent of the fiction in relation with the cataclysms.

The Odyssey tells the story of Odysseus's wanderings after a great war. He roams the seas, and here is a diagram illustrating his movements:

We can observe a concentration zone here:

I'm showing you this zone because it will be useful later—but the whole overview is also important.

Iman Wilken is an author who has studied the Iliad and the Odyssey. Before her, few researchers questioned this map of Odysseus's voyages. Until then, Troy was located in Turkey.

Iman Wilken studied many variables: plants, rivers, and others, present in Homer's stories. This allowed her to propose a different topology for Odysseus's voyages. Here is what she suggests:

It's quite similar to the blue map, picturing Odysseus' trips, but Iman Wilken has relocated the whole mapping (and more correctly).

It seems she has succeeded in showing that the starting point of Ulysses' adventures (so, "the comets") is located in southern Scandinavia. We have observed how the Scandinavian impact is situated, according to R. Firestone, in Finland.

Iman Wilken conducted several analyses to create her map. She explains, for example, that Homer's narrative mentions "eight rivers." Yet, she connects these eight rivers to England.

I found this:

"The eight river basin districts in Finland (including Åland)"
https://www.researchgate.net/figure...cts-in-Finland-including-Aland_fig1_263503812

I don't know, of course, if Homer was referring to Finland—the origin of the main impact—when he spoke of "eight rivers." I've done some superficial research, and Iman Wilken might be right. But why does she place Odysseus's starting point further south than it actually is? I don't know.

Thanks to the C's, we know that the Odyssey is a transcription of comet impacts (they said, "of cataclysms").

We can verify this by putting the maps together:

And then:

The voyages of Ulysses, which are concentrated in Italy, seem to correspond to the cometary impacts in Northern Europe.

We can also observe a correspondence with Spain and Syria.

I'm sorry, it's not easy to produce something clear. These maps would need to be redrawn.

Caesar

I found a similar phenomenon in Caesar's work, specifically in Suetonius's "Gallic Wars," which recounts Caesar's conquests in Gaul. The narrative describes frequent uprisings and Julius Caesar's subjugation of all of Europe. The story culminates with the last great insurrectionist—Vercingetorix—and the battle at Alesia.

If Homer's narrative is a transposition of comet episodes, there should be some clues. Indeed, there are episodes in which Odysseus is pelted with stones. The size of the stones varies! There's a Cyclops who tears off the top of a hill. There aren't that many such instances, and I noted a few in my previous post.

In Caesar's work, I found five instances of stone-throwing. There are occasional mentions of "walls made of large stones," etc., but I focused on the passages that referred to "stone-throwing." We therefore find battles, and I focused on those during which Caesar's soldiers were pelted with stones. This allowed me to create the following map:

From left to right:

Bourges (Avaricum) – Bibracte – Alesia – Besançon (Vesontio) – Martigny (Octodure)

We find a similar grouping to this one:

And if we superimpose them, here's what we get:

There seem to be some correspondences.

This map suggests that Suetonius's account could be descriptive of Odysseus's voyages.
<>
While Odysseus is representative of comet impacts, we could suggest that Caesar's battles are descriptions of comet impacts.

Note: Caesar's main battles are more numerous than these five blue dots, which represent the account that mentions "stone throwing." At yellow point #5, there is the town of Bibrax, which was a battleground during the Gallic Wars. I have not included it.

I tried to keep my presentation as simple as possible, and I hope you found it interesting (and that it's accurate!). Thank you for reading!

Note: It has been said by the C's that Indian texts also recount events of the Younger Dryas. I suppose that compiling episodes of stone-throwing, then creating a basic map based on their locations, could illustrate comet impacts. Perhaps for India—but not Europe.

All credit goes to the forum. I simply applied the methods and knowledge available here, discovered by others.

---

FRENCH - FRANCAIS

J’ai poursuivi les recherches et voici ce que j’ai trouvé.

Vers 10850 avant J.-C., il y a eu un bombardement cométaire ; cela a été appelé « le Younger Dryas ». Il semble qu’une grosse comète se soit fragmentée en cinq morceaux.

Voici le chercheur Richard Firestone qui identifie les impacts comme suit :

( livre « The cycle of cosmic catastrophes »)

Nous apercevons un impact en Finlande.

Richard Firestone a aussi identifié qu’il y a eu d’autres impacts – peut-être dus à des comètes moins grandes. Il se peut que cela soit des morceaux des grandes.

Voici une zone d’impact qu’il a identifié :

Nous pourrions spéculer si cela est l’impact de la Finlande.

Plus tard, pour corroborer ses hypothèses, Richard Firestone a effectué des analyses sur des roches présentes dans ces endroits. Il a relevé la présence de nanodiamants. C'est donc une étude sur les impacts de comètes, qui créent des diamants spéciaux.

Voici une carte qui montre les sites de fouilles :
https://www.researchgate.net/public...tent_with_Major_Cosmic_Impact_at_12800_Cal_BP

Je vais m’intéresser à l’Europe, mais aussi le site espagnol et syrien. J’ai refait une carte plus précise avec ces emplacements :

17​	Watcombe Bottom, Isle of Wight​	United Kingdom​
18​	Lommel​	Belgium​
19​	Ommen​	Belgium (Netherlands?)​
20​	Lingen​	Germany​
21​	El Puig de Santa Maria​	Spain​
22​	Abu Hureyra​	Syria​
e​	Lommel​	Belgium​
f​	Aalsterhut​	Netherlands​

Voici la carte ci-dessus, plus précise:

Nous avons donc un aperçu d’impacts de comètes durant le Younger Dryas en Europe. Observons un site en Espagne, puis un autre en Syrie. cela signifie que les comètes qui ont frappé durant le Younger Dryas - ont impacté laissé des traces à ces endroits-là. Je comprend qu'il y a eu des impacts à ces endroits.

Odyssée d’Homère

Les sessions des C ont indiqué que le récit de l’Odyssée, écrit par Homère, relatait en réalité cette période de destruction. Ulysse est un personnage fictif – et il est délicat d’identifier l’étendue de la fiction.

Le récit de l’Odyssée nous narre les errances d’Ulysse, après une grande guerre. Il erre sur les mers, et voici un schéma qui illustre ses déplacements :

Nous pouvons observer une zone de concentration ici :

Je vous montre cette zone parce que que cela me sera utile par la suite – mais le tout est aussi important.

Iman WILKEN est une auteure qui a étudié l’Illiade et l’Odyssée. Avant elle, il y avait peu de chercheurs qui remettaient en question cette carte des voyages d’Ulysse. Jusqu’à lors, Troie était en Turquie.

Iman WILKEN a étudié beaucoup de variables : les plantes, les rivières, et d’autres, présents dans les récits d’Homère. Cela lui a permis de se prononcer sur une topologie différente des voyages d’Ulysse. Voici ce qu’elle propose :

C’est assez similaire à la carte bleue, mais Iman WILKEN a relocalisé le tout.

Il semble qu’elle soit parvenue à montrer que le point de départ des aventures d’Ulysse (<> « des comètes ») se situe vers la sud de la Scandinavie. Nous avons observé combien l’impact scandinave se situati, d’après R. Firestone – en Finlande.

Iman WILKEN a procédé à plusieurs analyses pour constituer sa carte. Elle explique par exemple que le récit d’Homère parle de « huit rivières ». Pourtant, elle rattache les huit rivières à l’Angleterre.

J’ai trouvé cela :

"Les huits bassins de rivières de la Finlande »
https://www.researchgate.net/figure...cts-in-Finland-including-Aland_fig1_263503812

J’ignore bien sûr si Homère se référait à la Finlande – donc l’origine de l’impact principal – quand il parlait de « huit rivières ». J’ai effectué des recherches superficielles, et il se peut qu’Iman WILKEN ait raison. Mais pourquoi donc localise-t’elle le point de départ d’Ulysse plus bas que ce qui est ? Je l’ignore.

Grâce aux données des C, nous savons donc que l’Odyssée est une transcription d’impacts de comètes (ils ont dit, « de cataclysmes »).

Nous pouvons vérifier cela en rassemblant les cartes :

Et puis :

Les voyages d’Ulysse, qui ont une concentration en Italie, se retrouvent d’après les impacts cométaires du Nord de l’Europe.

On peut aussi constater une correspondance avec l’Espagne et la Syrie.

Je suis désolé, ce n’est pas facile de produire quelque chose de clair. Il faudrait refaire ces cartes.

César et la guerre des Gaules

J’ai trouvé un phénomène similaire chez César, soit dans le livre « la guerre des Gaules », écrit par Suétone et qui relate les conquêtes de César en Gaule. Le récit parle d’insurrections fréquentes, et de Jules César qui vient à bout de toute l’Europe. Le récit culmine avec le dernier grand insurrectioniste – Vercingétorix, et une bataille à Alésia.

Si le récit d’Homère est une translation d’épisodes de comètes, il devrait y avoir des indices. Il y a effectivement des épisodes durant lesquels Ulysse se fait jeter des pierres dessus. La taille varie ! Il y a un cyclope qui arrache le sommêt d’une colline. Il n’y en a pas tant que cela et j’ai relevé quelques occurrences dans mon post précédent.

Chez César, j’ai trouvé cinq occurrences de jets de pierre. Il y a parfois des mentions de « murailles faites de grosses pierres », etc, mais j’ai regardé les passages qui faisaient état de « jets de pierre ». On trouve donc des combats, et j’ai retenu ceux durant lesquels les soldats de César reçoivent des pierres. Cela m’a permis de constituer la carte suivante :

De gauche à droite :
Bourges (Avaricum) – Bibracte – Alésia – Besançon (Vesontio) – Martigny (Octodure)

On retrouve un rregroupement similaire à celui-ci :

Et si on les superpose voici ce que cela donne :

Il semble y avoir des correspondances.

Cette carte signifie que le récit de Suétone pourrait être descriptif des voyages d’Ulysse.

Alors que ce dernier est représentatif d’impacts de comètes – nous pourrions suggérer que les batailles de César sont des descriptions d’impacts de comètes.

Note: les batailles principales de César sont plus nombreuses que ces cinqpoints bleus, qui témoignent du récit qui fait mention de « jetsde pierre ». Au point jaune n°5, il y a la ville Bibrax, quiest un théâtre de bataille durant la guerre des Gaules. Je ne l’aipas inclus.

J'ai essayé de rester le plus simple possible dans ma présentation et j'espère que cela vous aura intéressé (et que c'est juste!). Merci de votre lecture!

Note: il a été dit, par les C's, que les textes indiens relataient aussi les évènements du Younger Dryas. Je suppose que rassembler les épisodes de jets de pierre, puis constituer une carte basique d'après la localisation de ces derniers, pourra illustrer des impacts de comètes. Peut-être pour l'Inde - et non l'Europe.

Tout le crédit revient au forum. J'ai simplement appliqué les méthodes et connaissances disponibles ici, découvertes par d'autres.

 

[palestine]

For the record, here is the picture which prompted me to suspect that the Gallic wars was a narrative about the Younger Dryas comets:

The Alesia battle - it looks like a cometary impact