What Mechanical things have you caught yourself out on?

[Tomiro]

Chris Moulin, of Leeds University, asked 92 volunteers to write out "door" 30 times in 60 seconds. At the International Conference on Memory in Sydney last week he reported that 68 per cent of his guinea pigs showed symptoms of jamais vu, such as beginning to doubt that "door" was a real word. Dr Moulin believes that a similar brain fatigue underlies a phenomenon observed in some schizophrenia patients: that a familiar person has been replaced by an impostor. Dr Moulin suggests they could be suffering from chronic jamais vu. [2]

I remember doing this (for some strange reason) as a kid. I kept repeating a familiar word over and over again in my head, until I lost all familiar associations with it, and it just felt like a strange combination of noise jumbled together. And isn't this a bit simular to repeating mantras over and over while say meditating. Are people just fooling themselves, or could something "good" actually result from this?

 

[Keit]

I remember doing this (for some strange reason) as a kid. I kept repeating a familiar word over and over again in my head, until I lost all familiar associations with it, and it just felt like a strange combination of noise jumbled together.

Me too! :) And not only during childhood, but even those days as a funny experiment to offer others.
I wonder what is the reason for this "fatigue". Probably "meaning" of the words is stored in some specific part of brain or even if scattered, still has some immediate connection, but after repetition - this connection is lost somehow. Or this is something else. Worth researching, I think.

 

[Pierre]

Maybe that the fact of repeating again and again the same (sequence of) words induces some hypnosis states. Buddhists repeating mantras might experience similar phenomenon.

 

[Keit]

I tried to do it again right now and noticed that for me this "fatigue" happens only with Russian words. If it's a "foreign" language like English or Hebrew, it has already some sort of "dissociation", so I think that it's connected somehow to making associations and focusing. For example, when we look on the picture, even if we focus on specific part of it, we still notice other parts surrounding it. But when we choose to focus our attention long enough on one pixel - soon enough other details will fade away. Maybe this is how it works with words - focus on pronunciation for a long period, and the meaning fades away. And maybe that's why real self observation should be somehow dissociated (to see itself from a side) - not to lose sense of meaning or connection with a big picture.

 

[Alana]

A bit off topic observation inspired by Keit's last post:

I have noticed that when i use words in any other language other than my mother tongue, i never mean them as much when i use them in greek. I can say for example "f***" and "s***t" but i never use the greek equivalents in verbal or written words. It's just too much swearing!!! kind of funny in a way :)

On topic (i think):

it happens most frequently nowadays (or i notice it more?) that while talking, or writing or thinking, my trail of thought abruptly stops and my mind becomes blank for a moment, which seems loooong, and anxiety sets in until i can recover my memory and continue where i was at. When writing it's not a problem i can read all i wrote that far and be back on track, but with thinking and talking it takes great effort and i try to find the starting thought again in respect to the people i talk to and the environment i am in, eg: we came here and ordered coffee, then talked about the waiter, which led to so and so, etc. It takes few moments really, the recovery, but whenever it happens it's like my whole system is going "what in the world was that?!"

Is that what happens when people say: i lost my trail of thought?

 

[Craig]

I remember a few times just passively listening to somebody speaking, either in daily life or on the television, and I'd start to think about something else which would take up my attention. Then it's as if I split off some of this attention to the noise of the conversation still going on, and I'd hear it as if it was a completely foreign language that I didn't understand; in fact, probably like how a non-English speaker would hear it.

So yeah, it's similiar to the word association thing but with whole sentences being free of any associations. There've also been times when I've looked at single words in this fashion - again, having the same impression as I would do when looking at a foreign language and thinking how funny certain letters are together.

 

[Ben]

I remember a few occasions where I was a child, I would look in the mirror and not feel identified in any way with the person I could see reflected. I would consider it strange that people call me 'Ben'. It reminds me of this 'Jamais vu' when reading a word (which I have often experienced) but applies to your whole identity and life. This would only last for a few moments and is very hard to describe, unfortunately it has not happened for many years.

 

[Beau]

I remember doing this (for some strange reason) as a kid. I kept repeating a familiar word over and over again in my head, until I lost all familiar associations with it, and it just felt like a strange combination of noise jumbled together.

I'll add a "me too" to this observation. Actually, this happens to me even now. I don't even have to spend too much time repeating the word(maybe just 3 or 4 times), it's just that all of a sudden a word will sound foreign to me and will lose any and all meaning. I kind of laugh when that happens cuz it makes me feel weird. You understand a word totally and then one second, it doesn't have a meaning anymore. Then maybe two minutes later the light will go on in my head and all understanding is back in order. Strange.

 

[Appollynon]

I often burn myself when reaching into the oven to retrieve food, usually because my concentration is elsewhere and I reach for the oven tray without thinking about it. I also do this when I remove a very hot oven tray/grill tray and leave it on the side, if something else momentarily takes away my concentration I will forget its very hot and just try to pick it up, Im getting better at not doing it tho as Ive had a few scars from the burns to remind me.

I also share the same thing that beau and Tomas have experienced with words, mostly when I was younger, but still occaisonaly to this day. I think it happens more with typing on the computer than when speaking, for example I'll be writing something and reading it through at the same time and every once in a while I'll write a word that looks so unfamiliar I'll forget what word I had meant to type or look at the spelling and convince myself it's wrong or doesnt look right. It usually takes a few seconds for my brain to re-boot and realise that I know what the word is or that the spelling was correct, I was just thinking about it too much.

I'm a smoker of rolling tobacco, and have become so used to rolling that I can do it whilst talking and concentrating on someone else, however I ususally put in a small roach (My definition of roach:-paper rolled up into a filter to keep it from closing at the smoking end) and sometimes Im so busy chatting I roll the ciggy, and start lighting it before I realise I left out the roach doh!

 

[vinny]

the 'jamais vu' thing - me too! when verbalising a word over and over - the sound pattern would dissociate from the meaning. I always thought I was the only one :)
now it seems like it happens to everyone! the 'synaptic-link fatigue' sounds plausible to me.

I also used to get a similar-ish thing to do with self body-awareness, where I would hold my hand up in front of me, and suddenly I would lose all sense of scale in the 'feel' of it - ie. my hand would 'feel' as though it were ultra (like 12inches) wide, though this would somehow still make perfect sense linked to the visual clues that it was only its normal size.

 

[Craig]

I've had an experience related to a loss of perception in scale. When I was younger, my television used to be right next to my bed, and one morning I was lying there just gazing at it. Slowly my impression of the distance between it and me began to change, and it was as if at that moment, an incredible expanse - you could even say infinite - seperated it and me, when really it was barely more than a meter. Strraaannngge!

 

[sHiZo963]

Didn't Gurdjieff talk about the "losing the bubble" phenomenon? I believe he said that when we find ourselves in situations for which our "machines" have no pre-set programs for, such as those talked about when one "loses the bubble," we, for a short time, actually ARE OURSELVES and that PANIC ensues because our "machine" feels "naked" without its programs. Such situations, then, would be the opposite of Mechanicalness, because they are when ONE truly feels aware of one's "emptiness." The Panic is there because these states come about as part of the Law of Accident and we don't "work" for them, and thus are un-prepared to receive them in the right way, leading to what may be a harmful instinctive reaction to the machine.

Just some thoughts :)

As for my mechanicalness, here's a few general "snap shots" of my machine-at-work that I took so far, off the top of my head:
- talking a certain way when in company of particular types of people
- behaviors linked to physical attraction towards the opposite sex, i.e. "checking out"
- hand movements when thinking about something
- making up lame (in hindsight, for some reason not at the time of making them) excuses against useful actions and FOR use-less, even harmful, actions, in terms of the Work i.e. saying to myself that I'm too tired/sleepy even though I may not be physically
- deliberately forgetting or putting off useful Work
- mildly expressing negative emotions in certain situations, but expressing them nonetheless
- reading mechanically and forgetting thereafter
- general sleep and in-ability to constantly remember myself, in effect having "spurts" of awareness surrounded by a "sea" of mechanical sleep

 

[CarpeDiem]

Usually I put the keys in the same place, but when I rush to do something and my mind is elsewhere I can easily mechanically put keys wherever I was at the moment and then trying to locate them… Usually that happens when we go for a walk and I ‘remember’ to take something from ‘mom’s bag’ I forgot.
I’m coming to hard realization of how totally mechanical i’m. I see it mostly when I’m alone in the kitchen, whole lot of things I do mechanically, especially when mind is elsewhere during conversation. When I’m in the kitchen alone, a lot of routine daily little things I do mechanically. I’m afraid to write here ‘almost all’. When I try to pay attention to what I’m doing at the moment, everything I do is much slower.
Then in transport or when walking in the city, mind is elsewhere and nowhere, (don’t remember when mind was several minutes or even instances before) I’m doing almost everything mechanically. It’s like series of black-outs and brief awakenings that I don’t remember where I was, where mind was.
There are also certain ‘trigger phrases’ and ‘trigger words that launch negative emotional reaction. Especially with my mom. I try to control them, and if not all the times my reaction is manifested externally, I have it internally, maybe not strong, but kind a disapproval of what she says. (among other things she advises not to read too much, but be focused exclusively in restoring health – diet, physical exercise). Sometimes some phrases trigger my negative reaction and I get a vapor out. And then it’s a shame to recognize it.
Then when conversation is not ‘interesting to me, especially some conversations on phone, when call caught me in the middle of doing something else (like call caught me in the bathroom doing son’s washing) I say mechanically ‘yea’, ‘yea’ not really listening and paying attention to what person is saying until shortly excusing myself and ending conversation. Sometimes exactly the same happens when i meet somebody and conversation isn’t ‘interesting’ to ‘me’ leading at the moment. It’s a shame, but I’m not listening, just saying couple of ‘connecting a dialogue’ phrases.
After some time spent on teading i'm reading mechanically, up to having a black-out, then resume reading from where i had lost attention. It happens when i'm reading at night or tired, or simply emotionally unfit for reading at the moment.

 

[Rich]

I'm finding this thread useful for self-recognising when my behavior is totally mechanical

especially some conversations on phone

Thanks to Skype I will telephone and surf the internet at the same time, sometimes I forget what i am reading AND that i am on the phone until I hear, "are you still there?"

i'm reading mechanically, up to having a black-out, then resume reading from where i had lost attention.

I will read a page and then some kind of internal dialogue takes over and i find as i continue reading I start creating different scenarios based on an event that just happend. I may go back and re read or stop completely.

Edit : and on the computer as well, It really has a mesmerizing effect on me sometimes

I will intentionally go to the computer for a particular reason eg to look up a topic of news and before I know it I have typed my username and password to log into my email. I may have even checked it 5 minutes before.

Riding elevators and getting off on the wrong floor.

I sometimes go into the lift and forget to press the where i'm going to button, then 'come to' either at the same floor having not moved at all or on the wrong floor guided by someone else.
It is frightening to think how much of my time is spent unproductively in dream like state.

I remember doing this (for some strange reason) as a kid. I kept repeating a familiar word over and over again in my head, until I lost all familiar associations with it, and it just felt like a strange combination of noise jumbled together.

I reach the same point of puzzlement when our 14month year old son starts to pick up sounds of words, I just start thinking, why these 26 shapes to form these letters? why 'cup'?
There is a great Alan partridge clip where he gets stuck on the word 'talking, talking, talking' and just repeats it again and again until you join him in disassociating with its meaning...Babel! will try to find it...
the film 'Weatherman' Nicolas Cage is a great example of how a mechanical automaton approach to life leads to total emotional emptiness