Who controls the other??

[luke wilson]

So basically you don't want a friend that is a girl, you want a girlfriend. What's the main difference between the two? While there's much more to this, most people think sex first. So what you may want is sex and sex with no effort. Without having to really give anything back in return as you said. Unfortunately this stereotypes you. There are many people like this walking around. There is nothing special about it. Nothing that sets those people apart.

Perhaps you can try and view this from some girl's point of view. If the girl is used to being viewed as little more than an object to be used, don't you think that might make one wary of most people?

This sounds really bad. But the reason it might appear only as sex is because as I said. After years of dissapointment, I have removed the intellectual/emotional connection from the list. All that remain is the in-built almost genetic drive of physical desire. The most basic one. Cant remove that.

Under ideal conditions I'd like the whole thing. The whole relationship thing. I'd like to really know someone. To fall in love. To have someone fall in love with me. To share experiences with someone... Infact I'd give you an example. Acouple of weeks ago, I was at a social gathering at university and this girl I knew, not directly but she was a friend of a friend and she told me she liked me and I was are you joking? And she was, no, I am not joking. Problem is, I did not feel the same. Now, my friend was like, what does feelings have to do with anything luke? Use this opportunity as a chance to get some experience. Needless to say I did not, mainly because I was too terrified. Ok, see, clear example, not just sex eventhough it might appear so at first...

Mainly I am really after an emotional connection. Maybe even an intellectual one if that is at all possible. Atleast then one has firm foundations for something that is real. That's all.
Ok, I hesitate always because I do not think I deserve such, because I am not yet at an acceptable level. I am clearly broken. I wouldnt want to burden someone else with my broken-ness. First job, is to mend ones own machine or atleast come to understand it. Last thing I would want to do is end up in a feeding relationship.. The whole thing about talking to random girls at like a social gathering is abit like this, I have tried this acouple of times.

Ok, you are at a party. See a girl or group of girls. Go over and talk to them. Ok fine. Maybe one girl takes a particular interest in the discussion and the conversation continues. Ok, good. However, that is all it is. Just a conversation, I dont really know her. She doesnt really know me. After the conversation is done. Ok, that is it. I am not really into the whole dating thing. Most people at this time might ask for a number or something like that. I dont because people only date for one reason, and that is clearly sex so why cheat myself otherwise. Ok, I then think, hobbies, thing is, I am not really what can I say, a hobby oriented guy.... My hobby is pretty much doing whatever comes to mind aslong as it isnt like terrifying...

Ok, a clear problem presents itself given this scenario. Where do you meet girls and how do you generate an emotional/intellectual connection. Ok, the most ideal way is to get mega-lucky and meet someone that well you just function well together. Things just appear to work. You find each other interesting,maybe you have similar interests, maybe even similar goals etc. Ok, this is like winning the lottery... I am more likely to be hit by a meteorite than that scenario to occur. I am still waiting for the meteorite or the scenario...

 

[truth seeker]

. Acouple of weeks ago, I was at a social gathering at university and this girl I knew, not directly but she was a friend of a friend and she told me she liked me and I was are you joking? And she was, no, I am not joking. Problem is, I did not feel the same.

I don't really think that's a problem. If you're not interested, you're not interested. That's just the way it goes. There's nothing at all wrong with that.

Ok, you are at a party. See a girl or group of girls. Go over and talk to them. Ok fine. Maybe one girl takes a particular interest in the discussion and the conversation continues. Ok, good. However, that is all it is. Just a conversation, I dont really know her. She doesnt really know me. After the conversation is done. Ok, that is it. I am not really into the whole dating thing. Most people at this time might ask for a number or something like that.

Well, thinking about this again, perhaps parties aren't the best place to meet someone - friend or otherwise. :P

I guess the general idea is to get out a bit more. Not with the intention of meeting people, but rather just enjoying your life. Anything you can think of that you might be interested in. It doesn't have to be a hobby. Something like a music festival or street fair. If you can, don't take your friends. Get used to enjoying time spent with yourself. I wouldn't recommend approaching a group of girls, just if you happen to see one you might want to say hi to. If you don't feel like approaching anyone, don't. Just concentrate things you enjoy and let things unfold naturally.

 

[Menna]

Power is given...What I mean by this is if you go out wanting something from women, sex, attention, phone number what ever it is then yes they have more power because you want something from them you are giving them power. It is best to go out without expectation and wants and needs, go out with your friends have a good time experience and live in each moment of the night. By going out looking or wanting women that is a STS mentality. To go out and experience and feel each moment that is more STO.

For example I went out to a bar with a friend a few days ago my friend met up with one of his female friends and that female friend brought a friend. My friend and his friend went off somewhere to talk and me and the other female friend sat by the bar and talked for around an hour had a great conversation. At the end of the conversation it was around 1am and her friend and she had to get going. After she left I said to myself - wow that was a great conversation I had a great night. No sex, no phone number, no wanting. Just enjoying the moment - a conversation.

I believe most guys say if a girl was to go up to them and say do you want to have sex they would say yes, because of their ego they don’t want to say no because of the way they would be viewed by their friends and the public. Personally I believe an hour or two conversations with a women is more meaning full then a one night stand (10-20min of sex)

If a women that I never met came up to me I cant say I would say yes or no because I am not in the situation but to me sex means more and is more passionate if you know the person on a mental level and have a connection with that person. A one night stand to me would be more awkward then pleasurable
For example I was in Amsterdam a few months ago and walked through the red light district, looking at the women in the windows – very attractive by the way, I just couldn’t bring myself to walk in felt weird and awkward. But there were plenty of men who did walk in. I am not saying one way is right or wrong I am just pointing out that some men would say no to the sex question and some would say yes.

 

[Menna]

"Mainly I am really after an emotional connection. Maybe even an intellectual one if that is at all possible. At least then one has firm foundations for something that is real. That's all.
Ok, I hesitate always because I do not think I deserve such, because I am not yet at an acceptable level. I am clearly broken. I wouldn’t want to burden someone else with my broken-nests. First job is to mend ones own machine or at least come to understand it."

In a conversation with a women why don't you touch on this topic. You could say something like - "Yea a lot of people are together now but I feel like I have to work on myself/ know myself better to have a successful relationship not just a physical one." See how she response - she could open up as well. The best way to improve your machine is through experience IMO

"Ok, you are at a party. See a girl or group of girls. Go over and talk to them. Ok fine. Maybe one girl takes a particular interest in the discussion and the conversation continues. Ok, good. However, that is all it is. Just a conversation, I don’t really know her. She doesn’t really know me. After the conversation is done. Ok, that is it. I am not really into the whole dating thing. Most people at this time might ask for a number or something like that. I don’t because people only date for one reason, and that is clearly sex so why cheat myself otherwise."

If you don't want to ask for a number or continue the conversation then don't no one says you have to - but to generalize and say the one reason people date is to have sex is not correct. Don't generalize to defend yourself and your actions - I have and sometimes continue to do this as well - you are making up your own reason to defend your decision.

"Use this opportunity as a chance to get some experience."

lol - I hear this allot as well. The problem is in the first words USE and OPPORTUNITY - The opportunity is another human being and the world use means well to use. It is not the other personals fault that another feels like he needs experience. I believe that to use a relationship to gain experience is an STS way of living. This is just my opinion. In a successful relationship it wouldn't matter if one is experienced or not you would want to be with that person because of who she or he is.

Luke - You said you were at a party at a University so that means you are 18-23 years old maybe 25. Lets say you had 15 gfs and they didn't work out. Yes it sucks its disappointing feels like something is wrong with you bla bla bla...But that would mean that you went out with .00000000000000002% of the female population. Go out and meet more people. Everyone is different. I like the quote - "No man steps in the same river twice." This means you are always changing through experiences so now you are one man and two months from now you will be another. This doesn't just apply to you this applies to your previous girlfriends also. So those hypothetical 15 girlfriends have changed as well. Don't give up and don't generalize don’t let negative past experiences pollute the current and future experiences or else you will just keep on having negative experiences you will put yourself at a disadvantage each time. Remember the past but don't live in it.

 

[luke wilson]

Yes menna I read your post, sorry for not replying. I am under siege as you can see from other posts.

I like your idea of power is given. This makes so much sense now that I think of it. If you go wanting something from women then yes they have more power. This is kind of true aswell in other situations aswell. Looking at just normal social circles, nobody likes the person who is always trying to please or win over everyone. So yah, thanks for highlighting this. The power game!

I like this, "It is best to go out without expectation and wants and needs, go out with your friends have a good time experience and live in each moment of the night," is also not STS as you mention.

In a conversation with a women why don't you touch on this topic. You could say something like - "Yea a lot of people are together now but I feel like I have to work on myself/ know myself better to have a successful relationship not just a physical one." See how she response - she could open up as well. The best way to improve your machine is through experience IMO

I like this. Making honest conversation about something in your mind. Smoooooth.

Yah, I think I am going to try this from now on. Just make nice simple honest conversation. Atleast this way, you get some experience without expectation or anticipation to pollute it which could help improve ones machine.

It's amazing you had an hour long conversation with a stranger essentially. Wow never had a conversation last more than about 15 minutes before I felt the walls were closing in. I always get this claustrophobic feeling, like the walls are closing in or I am being watched by someone or I am under the microscope and I get all tense, my breath gets all heavy, my hands get all sweaty. It feels really really uncomfortable. It just comes on, I dont know why and usually what happens is that I just start talking and talking and talking and talking, it's a mechanical reaction and a friend of mine has tried helping me get it under control - see I am abit of a clown in real life, I am also developing a clown image here now and this is not a clown in a good way, more of an annoying clown.

I have tried improving my conversational skills but I just run out of ideas, I find it hard to talk to girls about anything. Even with guys, I am usually quiet to start of with and then after sometime of just being friends then I find it's easier to talk once I get an idea of who the other person is and you start feeling comfortable and secure around them to just talk about stuff. If this wasnt like an esoteric environment, you could say I was abit loserish but I am not entirely a loser. I am just abit loserish in this respect..

Luke - You said you were at a party at a University so that means you are 18-23 years old maybe 25. Lets say you had 15 gfs and they didn't work out. Yes it sucks its disappointing feels like something is wrong with you bla bla bla...But that would mean that you went out with .00000000000000002% of the female population. Go out and meet more people. Everyone is different. I like the quote - "No man steps in the same river twice." This means you are always changing through experiences so now you are one man and two months from now you will be another. This doesn't just apply to you this applies to your previous girlfriends also. So those hypothetical 15 girlfriends have changed as well. Don't give up and don't generalize don’t let negative past experiences pollute the current and future experiences or else you will just keep on having negative experiences you will put yourself at a disadvantage each time. Remember the past but don't live in it.

I am 22. I like the hypothetical 15 girlfriends but the true number is 0 for me. I figure since it's that day of just bashing the predators mind, I might aswell say it out loud. I HAVE NEVER HAD A GIRLFRIEND. Wow, that feels uhmm intense to just say it. EDIT: Wow, infact I'd like to add something else to the never having a girlfriend part, I HAVE NEVER KISSED A GIRL! Wow, again, therapeutic just saying it... Can you imagine that, 22, never had a girlfriend, never kissed a girl... it's quite something. It gets even better, I never had any girls who were just friends until about 2 years ago. And this wont be direct friendships, more friends by association ie, friends with me because they are friends of my friends. I have only 1 direct female friend and that is recent. This facts just blow my mind every time I think of them. I think a hampster would do better. Hell, even a piece of rock.

I like the bla bla bla... Seriously though, unlike me I assume you dont have girl problems. So yah, it's very hard to be 22, never have had a girlfriend in your life in todays society and not think something is not wrong with you. I dont know, wouldnt you think something was wrong? How would you handle it?
Would you try and get a girlfriend as quickly as possible? So far after basically letting this eat up at me for awhile I figured it's ok. It's ok to be single. Cant complain, it's the only thing I have ever known.

I also think this is quite important although easily forgotten "Don't give up and don't generalize don’t let negative past experiences pollute the current and future experiences or else you will just keep on having negative experiences you will put yourself at a disadvantage each time. Remember the past but don't live in it." Dont live in the past, wow, that is hard to do. It is hard for past experiences not to affect the present and the future.

Thanks for the advice. Alot to actually take in and actually let it transform ones way of doing things. That's the key though, transforming oneself.

 

[vinny]

I am 22. I like the hypothetical 15 girlfriends but the true number is 0 for me. I figure since it's that day of just bashing the predators mind, I might aswell say it out loud. I HAVE NEVER HAD A GIRLFRIEND. Wow, that feels uhmm intense to just say it. EDIT: Wow, infact I'd like to add something else to the never having a girlfriend part, I HAVE NEVER KISSED A GIRL! Wow, again, therapeutic just saying it... Can you imagine that, 22, never had a girlfriend, never kissed a girl... it's quite something. It gets even better, I never had any girls who were just friends until about 2 years ago. And this wont be direct friendships, more friends by association ie, friends with me because they are friends of my friends. I have only 1 direct female friend and that is recent. This facts just blow my mind every time I think of them. I think a hampster would do better. Hell, even a piece of rock.

I like the bla bla bla... Seriously though, unlike me I assume you dont have girl problems. So yah, it's very hard to be 22, never have had a girlfriend in your life in todays society and not think something is not wrong with you. I dont know, wouldnt you think something was wrong? How would you handle it?

If it helps get some perspective, maybe it's worth considering that although unusual, it's not necessarily as rare as you think.

Perhaps you need to stop thinking something is wrong with you because you don't match up to perceived social expectations, and instead get on with your life to make the most of what you can be. I would second truth seeker's advice: Get used to enjoying time spent with yourself. Just concentrate on things you enjoy and let things unfold naturally.

 

[theos]

I am 22. I like the hypothetical 15 girlfriends but the true number is 0 for me. I figure since it's that day of just bashing the predators mind, I might aswell say it out loud. I HAVE NEVER HAD A GIRLFRIEND. Wow, that feels uhmm intense to just say it. EDIT: Wow, infact I'd like to add something else to the never having a girlfriend part, I HAVE NEVER KISSED A GIRL! Wow, again, therapeutic just saying it... Can you imagine that, 22, never had a girlfriend, never kissed a girl... it's quite something. It gets even better, I never had any girls who were just friends until about 2 years ago. And this wont be direct friendships, more friends by association ie, friends with me because they are friends of my friends. I have only 1 direct female friend and that is recent. This facts just blow my mind every time I think of them. I think a hampster would do better. Hell, even a piece of rock.

Like Nomad said, this isn't as rare as you think. I was a virgin until I was 24 and really didn't start dating until I was 26 and for many, many years I considered myself abnormal by society's standards and felt embarrassed. However, at the same time I realized that I was spared loads of relationship drama that I saw the people around me going through. I also realized, after the fact, that this time of not having a relationship gave me a great opportunity to get to know myself and gave me many more opportunities to not be swayed by what others may have thought of me or even said about me.

Don't consume yourself with worry over your relationship status. It is a huge waste of time and a huge energy drain to boot. Get to know yourself, WORK on yourself and have fun doing the things you enjoy. Things will unfold as they are meant to unfold.

 

[John G]

I like the bla bla bla... Seriously though, unlike me I assume you dont have girl problems. So yah, it's very hard to be 22, never have had a girlfriend in your life in todays society and not think something is not wrong with you. I dont know, wouldnt you think something was wrong? How would you handle it? Would you try and get a girlfriend as quickly as possible? So far after basically letting this eat up at me for awhile I figured it's ok. It's ok to be single. Cant complain, it's the only thing I have ever known.

I also think this is quite important although easily forgotten "Don't give up and don't generalize don’t let negative past experiences pollute the current and future experiences or else you will just keep on having negative experiences you will put yourself at a disadvantage each time. Remember the past but don't live in it." Dont live in the past, wow, that is hard to do. It is hard for past experiences not to affect the present and the future.

Thanks for the advice. Alot to actually take in and actually let it transform ones way of doing things. That's the key though, transforming oneself.

I didn't kiss a girl until after I was 30, was still a virgin after my wedding night at age 35 (I seriously couldn't figure out how to do it!) My problem was I was either too scared or not willing to do anything unless I had that "being scared" feeling. It was like I couldn't go after anyone unless I was too scared to go after them (totally wrong approach). I had friends in a Catholic social group and my sister had friends and my parents even set me up with the only girl I ever dated (twice but no kissing cause of me being too scared to) before I found at 29 the internet (actually it was a pre-internet competitor of AOL in 1990).

I had actually tried to write to a girl in college and her friends pushed her into me in class but I of course did nothing but keep writing her occasionally even though she didn't write back. I only ever talked to her once in class about classwork; in hindsight, I suspect we both would have found it interesting to talk about more things. The difference with the internet, is people actually answer your written words cause its the normal way to communicate. I was no good with chat rooms, I also need that extra time to think of what to say, it's not only the "terrified" part.

Anyways I had a date set up with the very first girl I talked to online (helps a lot to be in some area where there's a shared interest). I sounded too serious so that first date got cancelled but I got better and dated someone a 100 miles away, then 1000 miles away then married someone 2000 miles away (I actually met my mother-in-law online before my wife).

 

[truth seeker]

I am under siege as you can see from other posts. Cry

I believe this is where the crux of the matter lies. You choose to see yourself as being the victim. What is really happening is that you are being given the opportunity to really see yourself. You are allowing your "enjoyment" of your own victimhood/suffering to get in the way of learning about the role you play in your life. It follows you from situation to situation.

You have never had a girlfriend (which is perfectly fine by the way). Yet you allow yourself to have illusions about women that support your feelings of being a victim. In short, you are sabotaging yourself. You have a certain set of ideas that you insist are correct. If you were to find a girlfriend today, you would most likely be on the lookout for her to express behaviors that prove you right. Eventually she would make a mistake (because she is human). At that point you might think "See, I knew all women were like that!". It's a no win situation.

Until you are willing to let go of your current thoughts - thinking what you think with the way you think. I don't think you will be able to get past this. It's up to you to decide that you are truly tired of living this way. Only then will things begin to change for you.

 

[Menna]

I like the bla bla bla... Seriously though, unlike me I ASSUME you don’t have girl problems. So yah, it's very hard to be 22, never have had a girlfriend in your life in today’s society and not think something is not wrong with you. I don’t know, wouldn’t you think something was wrong? How would you handle it?

Have you ever heard the expression when you ass-u-me you make an ASS out of U and ME. I just turned 25 and I am also still a virgin. I haven’t kissed a girl since 2007 going on three and a half years now and my longest relationship with a girl was a few weeks maybe a month an a half so no girlfriend either. I have thought something was wrong in the past, which caused me to have low self confidence and all that accompanies that. But like ODYSEE said in his post there is a lot of unnecessary relationship drama, it is easier to work on yourself when you are single. Would you rather have 7 failed relationships or 1 successful one? Think of being single and doing this work on yourself as setting yourself up for success - so that you feel that you are ready so that you can be confident when you are ready to meet the right one.

Would you rather make mistakes being single or make mistakes in a relationship affecting someone else’s life? Yes relationships are great you can learn from another human being but some aren’t in relationships for the right reasons some are in them because they feel like they have to be or to boost their ego. I use to walk around saying "Look at them they are together they must be happy I wish I had a gf." How would I know if they were happy? In my past I wasn’t ready to have a gf, I might not be ready right now but I can tell you what - I know that I am getting closer. That’s where the work comes in

There is a Topic called "Why are you single" It is probably on page 2 or 3 maybe 4 in this forum. Some good information on there

and I wouldn’t say that you are "Under fire" it might feel like that but when someone from this forum posts you have to step back take a few minutes or sometimes walk away from your computer think about the post and then respond. I do believe that everyone in this forum is here to help. Even though you might not like what you hear the truth hurts sometimes.

and the hypothetical 15 gf's was there to prove a point and you even made the point stronger by saying you havent had a gf yet. So you have gone out with 0% of the female population – This means all of your relationship knowledge is based on theory and hear say. Yes it is hard and scary to do something you have never done before. The hardest thing to do and the right thing are usually one and the same.

[mod: quote fixed]

 

[Menna]

I posted right when Truth Seeker posted - I agree with everything that was said - I can see your negative outlook starting to cloud your mind - hope you are able to stop it before its too late. If you think the work is hard now then don't make it harder on yourself by digging a whole of negativity

Also want to add - if you were in relationships and weren’t single the chances of you finding this forum would be less. Maybe if you had girlfriends in the past you would be too involved to have this OPPORTUNITY - being single might be your path right now to allow you to work on yourself and look objectively at what each one of us are saying. It says I have been logged in for 19 hours on this forum not even a whole day and I have already learned so much.

My advice to you is pick one of the books from the advised reading on this forum - read it from cover to cover - write down three questions that arise to you when you are reading if you can not answer these question by the end of the book then post them here we will most likely all learn from you doing this.

 

[Infiniteness]

I am 22. I like the hypothetical 15 girlfriends but the true number is 0 for me. I figure since it's that day of just bashing the predators mind, I might aswell say it out loud. I HAVE NEVER HAD A GIRLFRIEND. Wow, that feels uhmm intense to just say it. EDIT: Wow, infact I'd like to add something else to the never having a girlfriend part, I HAVE NEVER KISSED A GIRL! Wow, again, therapeutic just saying it... Can you imagine that, 22, never had a girlfriend, never kissed a girl... it's quite something. It gets even better, I never had any girls who were just friends until about 2 years ago. And this wont be direct friendships, more friends by association ie, friends with me because they are friends of my friends. I have only 1 direct female friend and that is recent. This facts just blow my mind every time I think of them. I think a hampster would do better. Hell, even a piece of rock.

Like Nomad said, this isn't as rare as you think. I was a virgin until I was 24 and really didn't start dating until I was 26 and for many, many years I considered myself abnormal by society's standards and felt embarrassed. However, at the same time I realized that I was spared loads of relationship drama that I saw the people around me going through. I also realized, after the fact, that this time of not having a relationship gave me a great opportunity to get to know myself and gave me many more opportunities to not be swayed by what others may have thought of me or even said about me.

Don't consume yourself with worry over your relationship status. It is a huge waste of time and a huge energy drain to boot. Get to know yourself, WORK on yourself and have fun doing the things you enjoy. Things will unfold as they are meant to unfold.

I also never had a girlfriend in my life and I am 20 years old. The thing is that the "official culture" makes it seem that not having a girlfriend is not normal, but I believe that its just fine to be single. I also let this worry or embarrassment get to me, but we need to work on accepting who we are and what we are not, at least for the moment. I also agree with what others have said, let things unfold naturally and do the things that interest you. This doesn't mean that you'll never meet that girl, but in the mean time you can also work on your social skills or least improve on them. Learn how to be more out going, learn how to mingle with others, and so on. Take a social communication class or speech class, these classes can give you the exposure you need to overcome your fears, at least some of it.

It just comes on, I dont know why and usually what happens is that I just start talking and talking and talking and talking, it's a mechanical reaction and a friend of mine has tried helping me get it under control

Listening is a very important part of communicating with one. Everybody wants to be heard, so I think that you might want to learn how to become a good listener. I am sure that you have heard this many times before, but try to observer yourself and learn from it. Hope this helps.

 

[luke wilson]

I am under siege as you can see from other posts. Cry

I believe this is where the crux of the matter lies. You choose to see yourself as being the victim. What is really happening is that you are being given the opportunity to really see yourself. You are allowing your "enjoyment" of your own victimhood/suffering to get in the way of learning about the role you play in your life. It follows you from situation to situation.

You have never had a girlfriend (which is perfectly fine by the way). Yet you allow yourself to have illusions about women that support your feelings of being a victim. In short, you are sabotaging yourself. You have a certain set of ideas that you insist are correct. If you were to find a girlfriend today, you would most likely be on the lookout for her to express behaviors that prove you right. Eventually she would make a mistake (because she is human). At that point you might think "See, I knew all women were like that!". It's a no win situation.

Until you are willing to let go of your current thoughts - thinking what you think with the way you think. I don't think you will be able to get past this. It's up to you to decide that you are truly tired of living this way. Only then will things begin to change for you.

You are right truth seeker. I'd like to post what I have done since I joined the forum so atleast I can show other forumites that I am not a brick wall, I do take and implement advice.

I have finished reading the wave plus countless threads here. I am a regular reader of SOTT. Now I am going to start on Active Side of Infinity.
I try and expand my own finding out things skills. For example ontop of sott I now watch democracynow every now and again and the keiser report just to get different angles from different sources on current issues.
I am not dependent on horoscopes anymore but I decided to have a look last night and it was interesting to see this in this week's review. I fell into this hole with regard to my 'musing of a worker bee' thread. If I knew about this beforehand, I'd have thought twice.
EDIT: "A lot of people are really bad at speaking up & voicing their true feelings... So the universe creates times like this that allow people to "vent" in a whining way that tends to be non-threatening & safe... (because others don't appear to be listening)... hehehe... It's the "putting it out there" that can lead to positive changes in the upcoming weeks... "
I am working on my trust issues, anticipation issues and judgement issues.


Ok, the things that I have to do now.

I have touched abit on dealing and releasing suppressed negative emotions in the hope of letting go of my current thoughts or transform them into something more productive.
I have to work on my diet and try and detox.
I have to start doing EE on a regular basis.

Yes I wont lie, it is hard reading some posts. I know people are trying to be as objective as they can be.

I would just like to thank everyone for taking there time and energy to do this.

 

[maryjk_99]

Luke, please listen to me as an older woman's point of view. I also had much the same experiences as you, and I ended marrying someone who is so diametrically diffferent from me to the point that I now cherish my lonliness, because being alone means having PEACE. At the time, I told myself that 'opposites attract' and I believed him when he said he loved me. I believed it because I wanted to believe that I was 'loveable'. I met him at 24 without ever having had a 'real' boyfriend- though not a virgin. I let myself get swept by 'everyone else is doing it so there must be something wrong with me'. I didn't like the bar or party scene, and I didn't like the effects of alchohol (I always got sick). So I had social problems. I let peer pressure and family pressure decide for me that marrying this man was what I should do. I also used him in that I wanted to get away from living with my parents, because they also wanted to control me, how I thought, how to dress, that a woman should have children (I come from a very conservative, Catholic, family. My parents were older, and grew up in Italy, so I was torn between values they tried to instill in me and pressures from what I considered the 'real world')

So now, 28 years later, knowing what I know now, I realize that I let society dictate how I lived my life. If I would have had more patience in finding the right person, then perhaps I would have had someone with whom I could feel comfortable with, someone who I can truly talk to and reveal my heart and mind to. This is a very angry man. And when he gets drunk he is capable of ANYTHING. So, since I feel victimized, I do not feel for him the way he thinks I should. Which of course causes more problems.

And now I am torn between doing what is right for my children, and letting him vent his anger and feeding off my response.

Please don't let the same things happen to you.

This quote from Plato's Republic speaks volumes to how I am now feeling. This is Socrates speaking with his friend:

I replied: There is nothing which for my part I like better, Cephalus, than conversing with aged men; for I regard them as travellers who have gone a journey which I too may have to go, and of whom I ought to enquire, whether the way is smooth and easy, or rugged and difficult. And this is a question which I should like to ask of you who have arrived at that time which the poets call the 'threshold of old age' --Is life harder towards the end, or what report do you give of it?

I will tell you, Socrates, he said, what my own feeling is. Men of my age flock together; we are birds of a feather, as the old proverb says; and at our meetings the tale of my acquaintance commonly is --I cannot eat, I cannot drink; the pleasures of youth and love are fled away: there was a good time once, but now that is gone, and life is no longer life. Some complain of the slights which are put upon them by relations, and they will tell you sadly of how many evils their old age is the cause. But to me, Socrates, these complainers seem to blame that which is not really in fault. For if old age were the cause, I too being old, and every other old man, would have felt as they do. But this is not my own experience, nor that of others whom I have known. How well I remember the aged poet Sophocles, when in answer to the question, How does love suit with age, Sophocles, --are you still the man you were? Peace, he replied; most gladly have I escaped the thing of which you speak; I feel as if I had escaped from a mad and furious master. His words have often occurred to my mind since, and they seem as good to me now as at the time when he uttered them. For certainly old age has a great sense of calm and freedom; when the passions relax their hold, then, as Sophocles says, we are freed from the grasp not of one mad master only, but of many. The truth is, Socrates, that these regrets, and also the complaints about relations, are to be attributed to the same cause, which is not old age, but men's characters and tempers; for he who is of a calm and happy nature will hardly feel the pressure of age, but to him who is of an opposite disposition youth and age are equally a burden.

So please don't let pressures you are now feeling overwhelm you and try to be someone you are not. Make peace with yourself and the Universe, and most of all, please trust your instincts. If something or someone is not right, then it is what it is, but don't think it's because you are doing something wrong. Don't worry about acting a certain way, or that you HAVE to talk to a girl. Having a calm and happy nature will do wonders for meeting the right person.

 

[luke wilson]

Thank you maryjk_99. Thank you for sharing your story with me and others so we may learn a lesson in return.

I am really really sorry that you had to learn this lesson the hard way and I hope one day, one time either in this life or another one you find what you truly want and you have a lifetime of happiness and completion instead of one with regret.

I am sorry I cant offer more.