Who's asking? (how to be an STO candidate)

[Ben]

Hi, just to clarify some of the comments on my original post. I put a :D next to 'convert' because I was joking, what I meant was that I sparked their interest in becoming a reader of this site. Like I said, my perspective has matured and I am not desiring to change anyone. I am desiring to be responsible with this knowledge and ensure that I recognise all opportunities to mention it to those who ask. That was what I intended this thread to be about - who's asking? Believe me, I live with two christians who are absolutely not going to consider this information valid, I can live with that!

Anart - I should have also been clearer in that the focus of my post was not esoteric knowledge but more focused towards politics. I understand the possibility of preincarnative factors and 'soul configurations', the very nature of 'esoteric' knowledge is somewhat exclusive in what it requires from the 'student'.

Edit - I've also noticed, Anart, that you left out crucial sections of my original post which I put to clarify that I was not intending to change anyone or anything but myself. I think it loses some context presented in the way you quoted it.

 

[Guest]

The way I see it people get together and talk about what interests them. When I'm in a group it's usually obvious what the "vibe" of the group is and what topics are most acceptable. Sometimes people hang out and get into talking about the "strange". Sharing information in a social context is just part of being human, and offering an opinion especially if one believes it is useful and worthwhile is something that occurs spontaneously in conversation even when one is not formally asked.

In that context, it is social bias against "unacceptable" political, social and esoteric (taboo) topics that generates the need for caution. This bias, especially prevalent in our times often results in stale conversations steeped in "correctness". To me being mired in this correctness is not a good thing, and either one needs to converse with more openminded people or challenge the status quo now and then.

On the other hand nobody likes a zealot, even though religious fundamentalism is one form of zealotry that is condoned rather annoyingly in many current societies. I also took it that this thread was not about zealotry, but about exploring possibilities of expression of topics challenging to many people in the context of healthy socialization, as shared information, not pressure to accept the "truth". I can understand, however, how there is a fine line between discussing controversial topics and trying to convert someone, especially when there is a lot of conditioned resistence and bias regarding those topics.

 

[Alana]

I enjoyed reading this thread, as i contemplated on these things myself. Just like to add something from my own experience:

When i first begun to read the Wave and the SOTT pages, i wanted to go around and tell everyone! Thank goodness, soon i realized that it was completely counter productive both for them and for myself. I was considered nuts to say the least. And of course non of the people i shared with ever became interested. I knew then that everything i learned was for my own puzzle i was putting together trying to understand myself, the world i live in, living itself. and in fact, the more i shared these things with people that did not understand, the less powerful they became within me. After all, i am still far from saying that i really GET IT. All the knowledge i collect is still floading around, waiting for the ground within me to become suitable for the knoledge to be planted, become crystalized. Even if somebody asks, how can i share if it's not mine yet? I'll point them to the SOTT pages ;)

The truth is though, that whether people ask or not, in a way we share everything we learn here with everyone we interact with by the way we interact with them.
Or so i think...

 

[Ben]

The truth is though, that whether people ask or not, in a way we share everything we learn here with everyone we interact with by the way we interact with them.
Or so i think...

Indeed, I think EsoQuest may have been making a similar point when he wrote

"I guess one has to be really aware of each and every situation, and to stay on the safe side to consider dissemination of the "truth" as secondary to living it. That is where things change around you without you even making a conscious effort in that direction."

And this could relate nicely to the idea of FRV and how 'the whole populace plays a role' according to their individual state. The fact is that even when people are feeling isolated and unable to share this knowledge with others, if only for the sake of their own mental health, they may be benefiting the whole system simply by gathering the knowledge (and acting upon it) for themselves.

(and when I say "benefiting", just to be absolutely clear on this, I of course mean from the subjective perception of the benefits of polarising the 'Earth-system' towards STO)

 

[anart]

Hi, just to clarify some of the comments on my original post. I put a :D next to 'convert' because I was joking, what I meant was that I sparked their interest in becoming a reader of this site. Like I said, my perspective has matured and I am not desiring to change anyone. I am desiring to be responsible with this knowledge and ensure that I recognise all opportunities to mention it to those who ask. That was what I intended this thread to be about - who's asking? Believe me, I live with two christians who are absolutely not going to consider this information valid, I can live with that!

Anart - I should have also been clearer in that the focus of my post was not esoteric knowledge but more focused towards politics. I understand the possibility of preincarnative factors and 'soul configurations', the very nature of 'esoteric' knowledge is somewhat exclusive in what it requires from the 'student'.

Edit - I've also noticed, Anart, that you left out crucial sections of my original post which I put to clarify that I was not intending to change anyone or anything but myself. I think it loses some context presented in the way you quoted it.

Hi Ben, that makes sense how you've explained it - I was just looking for clarification, which you've provided, so, thanks. Also, I did snip several sections of your post, but not in an effort to make you look guilty of anything, just in an effort to shorten my post and focus on the phrasing that brought up my own personal red flags. Just because those flags popped up for me doesn't mean that they would pop up for anyone else. It has always seemed that you have a solid grasp on what's going on, and I apologize if my questions made it seem otherwise. =)

 

[Ben]

I'm glad you brought it up, just highlights the problems with written communication which this forum has explored briefly before. Go team network! we are good networking here

 

[John Chang]

There's a law I've observed over the years. Sort of a natural law, but you can't really write an equation to describe it. It's this: people find each other. The Law of Mutual Attraction.

That works for both good and bad. It's sorta like karma - it's fundamentally neutral. Good people tend to find other good people. Bad people tend to find other bad people. People who think a certain way will find others who think like them. Whole cities have a certain group character. San Franciscans are not like New Yorkers who are in turn not like Chicagoans. There are dog people and there are cat people. So on and so forth.

So, I suppose if you're STO, you'll find other people who are STO and you'll feel more comfortable hanging around other STO people. And if you're STS, you'll feel more comfortable hanging out with other STS people. Which is why you don't find the Dalai Lama in the trading pits at the CBOT, for instance. Or why you won't find a CBOT floor trader in a Buddhist monastery in Dharamsala. Because they just wouldn't fit in.

I suppose there's some sort of osmosis that goes on - if you choose to hang out with mostly STO people, you'll eventually pick up the vibe, I guess. And vice versa. I guess the old saying about knowing a person based on his associates, and choosing who you hang out with apply here.

There's another law that I've observed too: whatever you're preparing for, never happens to you. I like to call it the Law of Irony.

 

[Ruth]

There's a law I've observed over the years. Sort of a natural law, but you can't really write an equation to describe it. It's this: people find each other. The Law of Mutual Attraction.

I'd really like this one to work (and a lot more quicker with a lot less complications), but because we are living in an STS world which characterises itself by 'unbalancing' any equation it gets its hand on, I've obsered the following:
Good people find bad people; bad people find more bad people and good people are prevented from finding other good people.

This had led me to believe that STS has a 'law of putting a spanner in the works' and this may be an important part of the short wave cycle.

 

[anart]

It has been my experience that, for the most part, you're right, Ruth. There seems to be an active element at work to keep 'good' people and 'bad' people in contact with each other - to the exclusion of 'like attracting like' in any meaningful way - at least in most day to day situations. Perhaps that is why the searching for, and the finding of, real like minded individuals can result in exponential growth - after all those years of being drained and feeling alone - it all comes together - but only with a lot of work.

 

[Guest]

There's a law I've observed over the years. Sort of a natural law, but you can't really write an equation to describe it. It's this: people find each other. The Law of Mutual Attraction.

Sounds like the basic law. The way it SHOULD be: (THESIS)

Good people find bad people; bad people find more bad people and good people are prevented from finding other good people.

Sounds like a law from the Murphy legal code: (ANTITHESIS)

Perhaps that is why the searching for, and the finding of, real like minded individuals can result in exponential growth - after all those years of being drained and feeling alone - it all comes together - but only with a lot of work.

Sounds like free will plays a role here and we are not just lead by the nose by laws, but need to work within contradictions to find a higher balance: (SYNTHESIS).

In short: Good attracts good and bad stands in the way. Bad attracts bad, but good does not stand in the way (not in good's nature to do so). Bad prevents good, but good does not prevent bad. It overcomes it. To do this it must confront it. Then it can find the good that seeks it. In all of this free will has quite a bit to work with actually.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[placematt]

Hope I'm not being a pest by bringing up an old thread but i found it a very valuable and insightful read. I too have had issues with trying to compensate for having very few people in my life to talk to about this stuff. Especially when it comes to my parents. But i do also think the fact that they don't want to engage with me about esoterica makes me more motivated to learn for myself.

I have at time steered conversations to include some of these topics but i also put that down to people talk about whats important to them in life. This sort of work takes are a great deal of my thinking so therefore i do talk about it. I think i will relax a little more now after reading this thread. It seems there is great value in the ability to not feel obliged to "save/ help people", unless asked of course.

I found this forum on my own after reading so much other material. Acting on my curiosity aided in my finding of this place and Sott after 24 years. I suppose there is great value in finding this type of community in ones own time. It reduces cognitive dissonance.

I received an email from a friend in switzerland recently. She talked about her difficulty in resuming ordary life. Feeling trapped like a wounded animal, I felt a very strong connection with a place I had been years ago. I felt in that instance it would be appropriate to send her the link to cassiopaea. Maybe i was wrong to do so, maybe not but i do think that if i had known of this forum years ago i would be further down the path. But again, this is an anticipating attitude which isn't the STO way.


I will curb such desires in the future and will reduce any desire i have to enlighten others. I at times think i am some higher being because i see through the veil but i know that this is a trap of ego. I will endeavour to work on this.

Awesome thread!!

 

[Menna]

We want to respect the free will of our friends and family but we feel an obligation to tell them the truth, to give them the choice and mostly we don't want them manipulated, confused and basically, food. So there's my thoughts on this, what about you?

We don't you do...That's STS IMO you are trying to fill your need.

Telling someone the truth in every situation is not the best way to communicate IMO. Using external consideration self rembering before you answer or say a statement is important. Look at how the C's communicate they don't always tell the "absolute truth" Telling someone the truth can serve as more confusion for someone who is not ready for it. The truth can be in your actions and behaviors without spoken words if someone is ready they will recognize the truth. We are all food no matter how advanced we are we are all STS even if you have reduced your feeling of jealousy to about 4 seconds before you conceptualize the emotion and let it pass you are food for those 4 seconds. I would be more focused concerned on learning about self objectively and life and less about trying to see where the truth best fits into someone's life. Intentions don't always matter someone with good intentions can have bad results and vice versa. Have you done everything possible to improve yourself and learn about life

 

[placematt]

We want to respect the free will of our friends and family but we feel an obligation to tell them the truth, to give them the choice and mostly we don't want them manipulated, confused and basically, food. So there's my thoughts on this, what about you?

We don't you do...That's STS IMO you are trying to fill your need.

Telling someone the truth in every situation is not the best way to communicate IMO. Using external consideration self rembering before you answer or say a statement is important. Look at how the C's communicate they don't always tell the "absolute truth" Telling someone the truth can serve as more confusion for someone who is not ready for it. The truth can be in your actions and behaviors without spoken words if someone is ready they will recognize the truth. We are all food no matter how advanced we are we are all STS even if you have reduced your feeling of jealousy to about 4 seconds before you conceptualize the emotion and let it pass you are food for those 4 seconds. I would be more focused concerned on learning about self objectively and life and less about trying to see where the truth best fits into someone's life. Intentions don't always matter someone with good intentions can have bad results and vice versa. Have you done everything possible to improve yourself and learn about life

Definatly not!! I have a long way to go to reach anywhere. And judging other peoples lives is very STS. I do realise now that I need to think before i speak more than ever. I need to work on myself ultimately and learn to be objective and understanding.

 

[Alada]

We want to respect the free will of our friends and family but we feel an obligation to tell them the truth, to give them the choice and mostly we don't want them manipulated, confused and basically, food. So there's my thoughts on this, what about you?

We don't you do...That's STS IMO you are trying to fill your need.

Well, we’re all STS here but we do our best with what we’ve got. I think wand3rer may have been using the word ‘obligation’ in a general ‘figure of speech’ way, well isn’t that true of all of us generally speaking, we want the best for our family, which feels like an obligation.

There can be all sorts of reasons why we open our mouths and share when it’s probably not the ideal option, very hard to keep quiet in fact so we shouldn’t hold that against anybody while they’re practicing and working coming to grips with the concept of ‘strategic enclosure’, I’ve sure opened my mouth a time or two when it would have been better not to. But maybe we need those few experiences of things coming back to bite us later, in order to finally get it?

 

[Menna]

I agree I learn best from mistakes. We are all STS however I took away from the post that "we feel obligated" was meant as a duty a good thing to do a justification and I just wanted to make clear that's an STS example and that some people know to let that obligated feeling pass and look at the specific person and situation before anything. I don't hold anything against anyone here as I've never met 95% of the members and most post with questions or insight for the intent to learn/grow